(Topic ID: 92226)

Gottlieb System 3 Fan Club: Haters need not apply ;)


By Gov

6 years ago



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There are 764 posts in this topic. You are on page 11 of 16.
#501 1 year ago
Quoted from HHaase:

Sorry it took so long to get this to market, but I just released my new style A-26 tournament boards for general sale.
http://www.siegecraft.us/presta/index.php?id_product=72&controller=product&id_lang=1

Nice job Hans, these kick ass!! I suggest you Gottlieb lovers grab one, nice to have as a spare too..

2 weeks later
#502 1 year ago

Hello ... I am looking for an new or NOS Gottlieb/Premier Sys3 lockbar for my Mario Bros pinball. Unfortunately, this is nowhere available in the shops I know. Maybe someone can hero? Thank you

2 weeks later
#503 1 year ago

Okay, seems there are no lockbars for Sys3 out there.

I'am also searching for a Lift-Channel/Trim ... Gottlieb Part-No 24964 ...

Hope anyone can help.

Thank you!

1 week later
#504 1 year ago

I have a MARIO Andretti pin where the center post isn’t going down during gameplay but tests fine during test mode. Does anyone have either:

1. a pic of this mechanism on the underside of the play field so I can make sure it is actually assembled correctly?

And/Or

2. Any idea why this is happening? The coil is obviously working, as is the mosfet driver or it wouldn’t work at all correct?!

Added 18 months ago:

SOLVED

3 weeks later
#505 1 year ago

haha, I didn't realize there was a club for the sys3 and posted in general. Hopefully you experts know the answer!

This seems like a dumb question but I am trying to figure out how to check voltages on my R911.

The manual (and pinwiki http://www.pinrepair.com/sys3/#fuses) says what the voltages should be at the various fuses. However, since the voltages are AC, I can't connect the other side of the DMM to ground, I should check against the AC neutral side.

However, the power wires go deep into the transformer shielding and I can't get to any bare wires there, I could start cutting the AC wire running in from the wall but there has to be an easy way to check the voltages. Any of you guys know where to put the DMM probes?

IMG_0100 (resized).JPG
#506 1 year ago
Quoted from mark532011:

haha, I didn't realize there was a club for the sys3 and posted in general. Hopefully you experts know the answer!
This seems like a dumb question but I am trying to figure out how to check voltages on my R911.
The manual (and pinwiki http://www.pinrepair.com/sys3/#fuses) says what the voltages should be at the various fuses. However, since the voltages are AC, I can't connect the other side of the DMM to ground, I should check against the AC neutral side.
However, the power wires go deep into the transformer shielding and I can't get to any bare wires there, I could start cutting the AC wire running in from the wall but there has to be an easy way to check the voltages. Any of you guys know where to put the DMM probes?
[quoted image]

There are a whole bunch of different secondaries on these transformers. For example, the first secondary winding at the top can be checked for 58VAC across the secondary at the points indicated in red: F4 and pin 10 of A12P3. Note there are two center tapped secondary windings as well, you should be able to figure out the others, but if you get stuck let me know.
Untitled (resized).png

#507 1 year ago
Quoted from wayout440:

There are a whole bunch of different secondaries on these transformers. For example, the first secondary winding at the top can be checked for 58VAC across the secondary at the points indicated in red: F4 and pin 10 of A12P3. Note there are two center tapped secondary windings as well, you should be able to figure out the others, but if you get stuck let me know.
[quoted image]

thanks for the info, I had just assumed there was a test point somewhere.

I pulled the appropriate plugs and started testing. Got good voltages on most of them but there are a couple of issues I am hoping you have the answer to!

I am wondering how often these connectors go bad....

In checking "red" on the schematic (A12P3-1 to A12P3-2) I should have gotten 6VAC but I got nothing. I verified by checking A12P3-1 to both F8 and F9 rather than using the pin on A12P3, and I got 6VAC to both.

I then checked A12P3-1 to "green" (A12P1-3) and got 6VAC - so that looks good,

but when I checked A12P3-1 to "blue" (A12P1-4) I got nothing.

Is it possible both pin 2 on A12P2 and pin 4 on A12P1 are bad? or am I looking at it wrong?

80a93bf79dbcab9a4500fc6eeca1eaf535690fd1 (resized).png
#508 1 year ago
Quoted from mark532011:

In checking "red" on the schematic (A12P3-1 to A12P3-2) I should have gotten 6VAC but I got nothing. I verified by checking A12P3-1 to both F8 and F9 rather than using the pin on A12P3, and I got 6VAC to both.
I then checked A12P3-1 to "green" (A12P1-3) and got 6VAC - so that looks good,
but when I checked A12P3-1 to "blue" (A12P1-4) I got nothing.
Is it possible both pin 2 on A12P2 and pin 4 on A12P1 are bad? or am I looking at it wrong?
[quoted image]

From your measurements:
Common wire is good from transformer to A12P3-1
6VAC is good from transformer to A12P1-3
6VAC is not good from transformer to either pin A12P2-2 or A12P1-4. If you have checked the common to each side of F9 and have the 6VAC present on both sides of F9 fuse holder (proving the fuse to be good itself) then you have a break somewhere between the fuse holder and those two connector pins, most likely something on the main wire between the fuse holder and the two pins. You can verify this with a continuity check between the fuse holder and the each of the two connnector points. If the voltage is present on the fuse holder contacts but not making it to the connectors, there could be a break in the wire where it attaches to the fuse holder, an internal break in the wire, or some other open up to where the wire "Y"s off to each of the connectors. I doubt you have two separate problems, although it is possible. It's just more likely that you have one problem on the main wire before the branch off to the two connectors.

#509 1 year ago

if anyone needs a fully working clean original CPU for a system 3 message me. i have it listed in market place.

#510 1 year ago

thanks so much for the assistance. Somewhere along the line F9 blew. I've checked it all out and have proper voltages at the appropriate pins. Putting it all back together, for the first time I have a partial display!

It looks like the game is trying to start, something wrong with a solenoid or switch is preventing it, so I will have to look into that. but my question is about the display. The attached video shows what its doing. It appears to be working but not showing the full display. Is this symptomatic of poor connections from the display board or an actual problem with the display itself. The display is $200 so I want to be sure thats the problem before ordering a new one.

#511 1 year ago

I am working on my silver slugger I picked up a while back. The 3rd player runs display is missing a few segments. I measured all the resistors and they test good. Is there a way to determine whether it’s a chip or the display itself?

I know PBR sells a replacement board but I’d like to try and see if I can get it fixed first.

620D9EBB-3DB5-4922-A2C6-3A9A268DA41C (resized).jpegC5D73693-86B0-43B3-8669-D3914BCCE0AF (resized).jpeg

#512 1 year ago
Quoted from BenB:

I am working on my silver slugger I picked up a while back. The 3rd player runs display is missing a few segments. I measured all the resistors and they test good. Is there a way to determine whether it’s a chip or the display itself?
I know PBR sells a replacement board but I’d like to try and see if I can get it fixed first.
[quoted image][quoted image]

You should be able to use a multimeter to test these 7 segment displays, but you'll probably have to remove them first. If not, you can simply swap the display pair between a known working pair on the board. If the problem stays in the same place, its not the displays - if the problem moves after the swap, the displays have failed.
https://learningmsp430.wordpress.com/2013/10/12/testing-individual-segments-of-a-7-segment-display/

#513 1 year ago

Worst case scenario the board is unfixable after my attempt and I order a replacement. Thanks wayout440 I’ll give that a try.

#514 1 year ago

Hopefully this is an easy one. On my Rescue 911, the self-test runs and test-3 (cpu-controlled lamp test) works perfectly. Test-4 (solenoid test) runs but not a single solenoid works.

The manual says that if none of them work the problem is fuse F7 but I've double-checked the fuse and the correct voltage is going through it. Since the A3 driver board controls both lamps and the solenoids and the lamps portion seems to work correctly, I'm not sure where to look.

My 2 go-to sites don't really have much in the way of driver board debugging (if the board is even the problem)
http://www.pinrepair.com/sys3
http://pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Gottlieb_System_3

Anyone have any ideas?

#515 1 year ago
Quoted from mark532011:

Hopefully this is an easy one. On my Rescue 911, the self-test runs and test-3 (cpu-controlled lamp test) works perfectly. Test-4 (solenoid test) runs but not a single solenoid works.
The manual says that if none of them work the problem is fuse F7 but I've double-checked the fuse and the correct voltage is going through it. Since the A3 driver board controls both lamps and the solenoids and the lamps portion seems to work correctly, I'm not sure where to look.
My 2 go-to sites don't really have much in the way of driver board debugging (if the board is even the problem)
http://www.pinrepair.com/sys3
http://pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Gottlieb_System_3
Anyone have any ideas?

Check a couple of coils and see if you have any DC voltage at any of them.

Have you performed the ground mods?

#516 1 year ago

update - sorry, I didn't notice that you have to push the start button to activate the coil in the test. I've got some working and some not, so now to dig in and see if I can find a pattern!

#517 1 year ago
Quoted from mark532011:

update - sorry, I didn't notice that you have to push the start button to activate the coil in the test. I've got some working and some not, so now to dig in and see if I can find a pattern!

Rather than trying to find a pattern, pick one problem and troubleshoot it to fix it. If others are related, they will resolve themselves when you fix the one. A lot of times when a game is purchased broken, there is more than one problem.

#518 1 year ago

Ive been cleaning up a cactus jacks and have a low battery issue. The MPU has a new battery holder and a new CR2032 battery. The board is clean with no alkaline damage.

If the game has been plugged in for length of time, 24hrs for example, the game powers up with the "Low battery. Check U3 or U6 error". However if I leave the game unplugged and plug it in when I want to play, the game powers up just fine with no error. I have tried several different batteries and the replacement battery holder checks out.

Everything I am reading regarding the low battery error refers to just replacing the battery. Is this an actual issue with U3 or U6?

#519 1 year ago
Quoted from grbgemen:

Ive been cleaning up a cactus jacks and have a low battery issue. The MPU has a new battery holder and a new CR2032 battery. The board is clean with no alkaline damage.
If the game has been plugged in for length of time, 24hrs for example, the game powers up with the "Low battery. Check U3 or U6 error". However if I leave the game unplugged and plug it in when I want to play, the game powers up just fine with no error. I have tried several different batteries and the replacement battery holder checks out.
Everything I am reading regarding the low battery error refers to just replacing the battery. Is this an actual issue with U3 or U6?

Check Vcc DC voltage at pin 26 of U3 with the power off.

#520 1 year ago
Quoted from wayout440:

Check Vcc DC voltage at pin 26 of U3 with the power off.

At U3, the IC is a 24 pin 6516. Looks like the board can hold a 28 pin IC.

Pin 26 of U3(which is the top right pin of the 6516) is showing 3v.

3EDA0F46-93E3-42D1-9405-D0C9756D53A6 (resized).jpeg
#521 1 year ago

Can someone shed some light on the power supply 5v trim pot on the power supply. My cue ball wizard manual list the trim pot as a 500 ohm 1W. When looking for a replacement, I am mostly seeing 1/2 Watt pots. Would a 1/2 watt trimmer be ok?

#522 1 year ago
Quoted from grbgemen:

At U3, the IC is a 24 pin 6516. Looks like the board can hold a 28 pin IC.
Pin 26 of U3(which is the top right pin of the 6516) is showing 3v. [quoted image]

Yeah, ok. I re-read your earlier description. You had the game off and then no error on restart later, and the voltage is ok. This doesn't appear to be a standby battery power problem. Did you do the ground mods? I can't guarantee that would solve it, but the ground mods alleviate a lot of problems. The only other thing I see now is the socketed IC with the tape on it in your picture is suspicious. Perhaps try replacing that. This is a curious problem.

#523 1 year ago

I don't think I ever posted about this here, but I have NVRAM (battery eliminator) for Gottlieb Sys3 available now.

6264se_nvram.jpg

NVRAM for Gottlieb Sys3
https://www.pinitech.com/products/gottlieb_sys3_nvram.php

Please note that this upgrade requires modifications to the MPU to be made as noted on the website. The original RAM is soldered to the board & the included IC socket needs to be installed. You then need to remove the Dallas DS1210 chip and make a single wire jumper on the board. It may also be necessary to make an additional jumper change depending if your board was originally using 6116 RAM (24-pin) or 6264 RAM (28-pin).

Also would advise caution as Gottlieb Sys3 MPU boards have fairly thin traces on them, so if you've never done desoldering / soldering before it would be best to send the board out to someone that does nvram upgrades or go the normal route of lithium coin cell in these games. The NVRAM upgrade is just an option for people that want to put NVRAM in more of their games.

And again, many thanks to the efforts of MarAlb on this one!

---
http://www.pinitech.com - "Pinball Inspired Technology"
NVRAM, Bally/Stern LED Displays & Mods for pinball machines

#524 1 year ago

Any stargate owner who could help with a photo from center kicker target wire connection under pf?

#525 1 year ago
Quoted from wayout440:

You should be able to use a multimeter to test these 7 segment displays, but you'll probably have to remove them first. If not, you can simply swap the display pair between a known working pair on the board. If the problem stays in the same place, its not the displays - if the problem moves after the swap, the displays have failed.
https://learningmsp430.wordpress.com/2013/10/12/testing-individual-segments-of-a-7-segment-display/

I located some replacement MAN8610 7-segment displays on eBay. Replacing the Player 3’s Runs displays took care of my issue. It indeed ended up being burnt segments in the old display. Thanks @wayout440 !!
If anybody has a similar issue, hit me up as I’ve got some spare MAN8610’s I can send your way.

A266492A-1FBC-4524-BB31-1A4F5B6A7286 (resized).jpegE03822C2-E82A-455D-941A-3CFB7A2C32EC (resized).jpeg
#526 1 year ago
Quoted from BenB:

I located some replacement MAN8610 7-segment displays on eBay. Replacing the Player 3’s Runs displays took care of my issue. It indeed ended up being burnt segments in the old display. Thanks @wayout440 !!
If anybody has a similar issue, hit me up as I’ve got some spare MAN8610’s I can send your way.
[quoted image][quoted image]

I've never played that game and it looks really cool. Glad it is fixed!

#527 1 year ago
Quoted from wayout440:

Yeah, ok. I re-read your earlier description. You had the game off and then no error on restart later, and the voltage is ok. This doesn't appear to be a standby battery power problem. Did you do the ground mods? I can't guarantee that would solve it, but the ground mods alleviate a lot of problems. The only other thing I see now is the socketed IC with the tape on it in your picture is suspicious. Perhaps try replacing that. This is a curious problem.

Thanks. I have not done any ground mods yet. The IC at U2 is the game eprom and the blue tape is just covering the window.

2 weeks later
#528 1 year ago

Just joined the club with a Wipeout yesterday. Really enjoying this machine. It’s my third pin and first DMD. That Rip the Crud shot sure is hard! I’ve gotten it a few times but if it’s not absolutely perfect it comes right back. Trying to get to the triple diamond run AND completing it seems like it will be a good challenge as long as you are not just timing out the modes. The modes seem to be worth a good amount of points so I would think it would be wise to play them anyway. Hotdoggin can Double your score so strategically it looks like you want to get into multiball or hit the pump shot till it’s maxed out before you start that round. My daughters are really digging the theme too, we have been doing a lot of sledding so I’m sure that helps.

Edit: rip the crud shot isn’t as hard as I thought. After a few more plays I noticed the ball was coming back at the flippers way faster than normal, I at first thought this was just the way a Gottlieb plays, I think this is the first Gottlieb I have played. Then I decided to check the pitch. Apparently my basement is leveled way different than the guy I bought it from. I had leveled it right to left when I got home, but that’s it. The pitch was 9 degrees. When I adjusted it to 6.5 I can now make the rip the crud shot when I hit it good and the ball is returning to the flippers from the playfield much more like what I am used too.

#529 1 year ago
Quoted from acebathound:

I don't think I ever posted about this here, but I have NVRAM (battery eliminator) for Gottlieb Sys3 available now.

I've installed one of these in my Street Fighter - I can vouch for it working no issue and being IMO pretty easy to install (if you're familiar with board work, at least). System 3s are usually a lot more stable regarding battery life (hell my SF was still running the original battery just a few months ago without issue... I installed it as a test for future tech jobs), but if you're experiencing booting issues due to low battery, I'd recommend it.

#530 1 year ago

While I'm here - anyone have a playfield scan of Rescue 911? I recently added one that was operated for awhile then left to sit and was filthy. It cleaned up very nicely as most System 3s do - but unfortunately there was wear in the inlanes and the operator put a really crappy Mylar down that took all the paint from it. It's playable, but I was considering a quick decal and mylar (after wax this time!).

Thanks in advance!

Rescue911 (resized).jpg
#531 1 year ago
Quoted from statictrance:

While I'm here - anyone have a playfield scan of Rescue 911? I recently added one that was operated for awhile then left to sit and was filthy. It cleaned up very nicely as most System 3s do - but unfortunately there was wear in the inlanes and the operator put a really crappy Mylar down that took all the paint from it. It's playable, but I was considering a quick decal and mylar (after wax this time!).
Thanks in advance!
[quoted image]

I too could use it, my Rescue 911 has some serious wear and I would like to try restoring it

#532 1 year ago

Question about the schematic on the Rescue 911. I am trying to understand what it is telling me.
The Outhole and Trough switches are not registering even though the switches are good. I'm trying to trace some wires to see if there is a break.

Looking at the "trough" the 444 wire (yellow,yellow,yellow) wire goes to a connector labeled "2" but all the connectors are labels like "A17P1" or "A12P9" so I don't know what it is telling me. It then seems to go to a diode labeled 14 but the "left kicking rubber" is also diode 14 so I am struggling to figure out how to trace these wires without tearing apart the whole bundle.

R911-Sch (resized).jpg
#533 1 year ago

A#J# means it's going to that related connector. Gottlieb 3s had a lot of connectors under the playfield and they would be elsewhere in the manual, but long story short - it'll trace to a plastic minifit Jr connector.

Since you have two not working on the same column - I'd figure out which color that is and trace that wire to A9J1 - though if your left kicker is still fine, you likely only need to trace it out a shorter distance than that.

#534 1 year ago

Random question, guys.
Something I suddenly wondered about when I was fixing a voltage issue earlier this year:

Say I come across a wire that has Red, Blue, Yellow stripes.

Looking in the manual, how do I know if that wire is:
Red, Blue, Yellow, or
Blue, Yellow, Red, or
Yellow, Blue, Red?

#535 1 year ago

The first number is always the solid color (cause over half the manual is 0##).

For the others, I think you get religious and hope they didn't put a Red/Blue and a Blue/Red running right next to each other?

#536 1 year ago
Quoted from statictrance:

The first number is always the solid color (cause over half the manual is 0##).
For the others, I think you get religious and hope they didn't put a Red/Blue and a Blue/Red running right next to each other?

That's what i was worried about. Heh. Fair enough then.

#537 1 year ago
Quoted from statictrance:

While I'm here - anyone have a playfield scan of Rescue 911? I recently added one that was operated for awhile then left to sit and was filthy. It cleaned up very nicely as most System 3s do - but unfortunately there was wear in the inlanes and the operator put a really crappy Mylar down that took all the paint from it. It's playable, but I was considering a quick decal and mylar (after wax this time!).
Thanks in advance!
[quoted image]

Here you go, there should be plenty of resources in my OneDrive to use to make frisket, decal, etc....

https://1drv.ms/f/s!Akk53b-cuRJ0iQFSxyWEzYvv3zaB

This(onedrive) is all my work from my Rescue 911 megaproject....
https://wisconsinpinball.com/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=791

#538 1 year ago
Quoted from statictrance:

A#J# means it's going to that related connector. Gottlieb 3s had a lot of connectors under the playfield and they would be elsewhere in the manual, but long story short - it'll trace to a plastic minifit Jr connector.
Since you have two not working on the same column - I'd figure out which color that is and trace that wire to A9J1 - though if your left kicker is still fine, you likely only need to trace it out a shorter distance than that.

thanks!
tracing wires around, I checked the 633 (common) wire but it was fine, then started going the other way. Since they were on separate rows it didn't seem to be a match but it turns out those are the only 2 rows that use A17J2, all the rest use A17J1. Checking, I found A17J2 was loose and that solved it.

#539 1 year ago

Ralphwiggum As a guy who bought a jacked up Pinball Pool on the cheap to learn touch ups and clear with - then found out my baby on the way was actually 2 babies on the way - it's cool to see I'm not the only one with projects that extend into years! (currently sitting on the rotisserie with 2 layers of clear waiting on decals and paint... ha)

Thank you again for posting these scans! I'm almost back up and running, so once Pinball Pool finishes, this Rescue will be next on my list. Other than the two inlanes and the pops area having significant damage, it's in great shape. Now I just need the stupid heli motor sleeve from PBR to show up...

#540 1 year ago
Quoted from ralphwiggum:

Here you go, there should be plenty of resources in my OneDrive to use to make frisket, decal, etc....

Thank you so much!

Is that a custom topper? Mine has the red dome light

#541 1 year ago
Quoted from mark532011:

Thank you so much!
Is that a custom topper? Mine has the red dome light

Yep, I wired in an Emergency Responder LED light and took the dome light out. There is a video in that OneDrive folder that shows it in action. It is beyond obnoxious.....I love it...lol

2 weeks later
#542 1 year ago

Got a question about the Rescue 911 front door. Mine has the plastic front missing on the coin slots. I thought that would be an easy replacement but looking at the plates, I don't think a quarter could fit through it. It looks like all the mechs are in the back of the door and they push in like you would to get your coin back.

It seems weird, Is that some kind of special plate someone put in?

IMG_4010 (resized).jpg
#543 1 year ago
Quoted from mark532011:

Got a question about the Rescue 911 front door. Mine has the plastic front missing on the coin slots. I thought that would be an easy replacement but looking at the plates, I don't think a quarter could fit through it. It looks like all the mechs are in the back of the door and they push in like you would to get your coin back.
It seems weird, Is that some kind of special plate someone put in?
[quoted image]

That's a custom token entry plate. Not sure if hand-made or one of the 'standard' designs out there. The most common one here in the eastern US at least was tokens that had two scores on the same side. This is different, but.. not unheard of..!
If they are custom made, it's possible the plastic overlays were removed to be replaced by these...

1 week later
#544 1 year ago

Just picked up my project Gladiators!
It'll be an undertaking for sure.
Cabinet needs purple paint if anyone knows the color?

#545 1 year ago

First thing done to Gladiators!

20190401_105339 (resized).jpg20190401_105347 (resized).jpg
#546 1 year ago

So these sick Titan rings fit another spot!

20190401_114814 (resized).jpg20190401_114807 (resized).jpg
#547 1 year ago

Quick question about my Rescue 911. According to the db it should have stainless side rails. However, they sure don';t look stainless, they look like the coating is worn off and they are rusty.

Is there a fix for something like this? seems like silver paint would not last long but replacements are over $100

IMG_4040 (resized).jpg
#548 1 year ago
Quoted from mark532011:

Quick question about my Rescue 911. According to the db it should have stainless side rails. However, they sure don';t look stainless, they look like the coating is worn off and they are rusty.
Is there a fix for something like this? seems like silver paint would not last long but replacements are over $100[quoted image]

Those are pretty bad. You could go the powdercoat route, but honestly, I would look at getting an industrial rattle can black enamel. Black rails on this game will blend nicely.

#549 1 year ago
Quoted from Edenecho:

I think it is more in dire need of some NOVUS!

Its not dirt its wear...

#550 1 year ago
Quoted from mark532011:

Quick question about my Rescue 911. According to the db it should have stainless side rails. However, they sure don';t look stainless, they look like the coating is worn off and they are rusty.
Is there a fix for something like this? seems like silver paint would not last long but replacements are over $100[quoted image]

Forget about paint. It's a lot of work and it won't last long. Every bit of underlying corrosion has to be removed. Replacement is the only way to get them how you want them. You could have them professionally finished with a powdercoat, but that is still going to cost at least the same.

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