(Topic ID: 205852)

Gottlieb system 1 Z 22

By Doggy

6 years ago


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  • Latest reply 4 years ago by Sheprd
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    #3 6 years ago

    Hi and Merry Christmas,

    The Gottlieb SYSTEM 1 board has been originally designed to use a P5101L-3 RAM as Z22. This chip was made by Intel.

    The inscriptions on the circuits can be misleading, but we manage to decode them quite easily:
    - the prefix (letters before the numbers) indicate the manufacturer (PCD for Philips, MWS for Intersil, MCM for Motorola, I or P (or nothing) for Intel.
    - the suffix (letters after the numbers) indicates the sub-type (version), and the type of package.
    A "P" in the suffix indicate a plastic package, a "D" indicate a ceramic package.

    On Intersil, the "A" indicate an improved version (TTL compatible). The "L" was used by Intel, to indicate a version with improved retention performances (low current). But this is only specific to Intel, some other manufacturer (like Intersil) use the 51L01 designation. The model 5101L-3 has a special feature using the E2 pin to turn it into "sleep" mode, reducing the current consumption. This feature has been installed on the GTB SYSTEM 1 (section using the SCL4081).

    So it is recommended to use a true 5101L RAM (or a model having the "sleep" function, selected by E2 pin).
    If you found a 5101P, it's quite sure that it's a basic 5101, not a 5101L.

    #11 6 years ago

    I am less system-1 specialist than system-80 and I have a little doubt about the full compatibility of the 5101.

    On the system-80, no problem, I use Philips PCD5101 without worries for many years.
    On system-1, I will tend to say that it should be the same. But, I would not be so affirmative

    Why ?
    Indeed, all memories produced by Philips, Motorola or Intersil have stand-by mode and should be suitable. They all can operate at low voltage (the retention is ensured at 2 volts). I'm quite sure that, only the very old and first ones made by Intel should not work (and that's why also, they produce an "L" version).
    As long as to replace this RAM, it is also advised to better use a NVRAM (and thus, eliminate the battery).
    These modules use F-RAM technology (Ferroelectric RAM) from Ramtron, or from Cypress, and of course, the operational voltage is standard (no need of battery), access time is fast enough.

    BUT...
    The Pinitech's announcement says : "This adapter does not work with Gottlieb System 1 games."
    Is this the same case for the Nvram.weeby.com module ? As they use the same component (but from Ramtron instead of Cypress), it should also have the same issue ?
    Why can't FRAM replace the 5101 RAM on a system-1 ?

    This announce look strange, but I suppose they have tested it. For me, it should work, unless there is a technical peculiarity that escaped me. But what ? may be this explain why some 5101 doesn't fit to system-1 ?

    #14 6 years ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    http://pinitech.com/products/5101_nvram.php
    These 5101 NVRAM modules ARE NOT COMPATIBLE with Gottlieb System 1 pinball machines since the circuit utilized separate data inputs and outputs of the 5101.
    On nvram.weebly.com:
    5101 DUAL CE Battery Eliminating NVRAM
    for Bally -17/-35, Stern M-100/M-200, Gottlieb System 80/A/B, Williams 3-7, Omega Race, Defender & more
    System 1 isn't on the list either.

    Thanks for the clarification. I never noticed that SYS-1 use separate data-In/Out buses.
    Sure that this require a component with this specification and not all Static RAM/F-RAM can replace the 5101.
    So... all common 5101 (PCD5101, MCS5101...) should works in System-1.

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