(Topic ID: 286877)

Gottlieb Monte Carlo Club - both High and Low rollers welcome.

By Robotworkshop

3 years ago


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  • 188 posts
  • 28 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 33 hours ago by ACDNate
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There are 188 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 4.
#1 3 years ago

There has been a lot of posts about the Monte Carlo game by Gottlieb but I couldn't find a club thread with everything in a central location. I guess it's time to start one!

Recently picked up a project game and want to get it going and restore it. I've fixed boards for these before but never played or owned one of these games. Looking forward to it since I've heard it plays well.

This thread can be a great place to share information about unique features like the roulette wheel, troubleshooting, sharing known issues, and anything specific to this game. I saw one other thread that new ramps are available. If you know of any other threads referencing this game please post them here.

#2 3 years ago

Some questions for existing Monte Carlo owners past or present:

- How many balls is the game supposed to have for the main playfield? I believe 3 but would like to confirm.

- For the roulette wheel is that a standard size pinball or a smaller one?

- Mine was missing the screws for the round window and that window fell off when moving (It's all ok though). I've heard that it used 4 machine screws and two wood screws. Can someone confirm that and the sizes? I'd like to get the correct replacements.

- Probably will have more questions as I work on it!

#3 3 years ago

Checking in! I’ve had a Monte Carlo since this past summer. Great game. Not sure if it’s a keeper yet, but I like it a lot. I’ll probably have to disable the 10 million switch for tournaments, but No big deal.

#4 3 years ago

3 balls main playfield.

Smaller pinball for the roulette

The screws in the roulette window are all machine with t nuts on the other end.

#5 3 years ago

Last night I had a little time to work on it. Had a large ball sitting in the roulette wheel. Two large balls and the small were sitting in the trough. That is why it wouldn’t start a game!

It needs a good cleaning, new rings, balls and shop job but should clean up well. Someone put grease on the flipper mechs so those will need to be totally disassembled and cleaned.

All six screws are missing on the routlette cover so I’ll see if I can get those at the hardware store.

Luckily the original Nicad didn’t leak on the MPU so no battery damage. Going to pull that off along with the 5101 and install NVRAM.

#6 3 years ago

Took mine to patz a few years ago and sold it now I'm sad all over again
But my brother in law has one so there's still one in the family

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#7 3 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

Last night I had a little time to work on it

make sure your 5 volt supply is solid ...my sound would quit and score would blank out usually during multi-ball , thought it was a daughter board problem and damn near wiped out the mpu board trying to fix it .....turned out it was the 5 volt supply so I would definitely suggest reflowing all the solder joints on the supply , cleaning and replacing the heat sink compound on the transistor and cleaning the adjustment pot with contact cleaner ...also on every system 80B system I have .....I have had to replace the 470uf and the 10uf caps on the display board

#8 3 years ago

I also have a night moves with a similar supply. Changed out the adjustment pot on the power board with a precision 10-turn version. Will probably do the same on this game too.

The game plays solid and the displays are all ok. No reset issues. I still have another MPU that I fixed for a friend out of another Monte Carlo and tried that in there today. Same thing.

I get background music and some sounds. Plan on comparing to you tube videos to see what I’m not hearing. I know the coin drop sound is missing. Going to look over the schematics to follow the sound signals.

#9 3 years ago

Does anyone have a spare topper for sale? It would be good to get reference photos of the topper on both the outside and inside showing the wiring.

#10 3 years ago

What is the latest ROM version for Monte Carlo?

#11 3 years ago

From the pinmame source it looks like their could be three versions for Monte Carlo. The plain 708, 708/1, and 708/2

Found a list of checksums on flippers.com and that appears to show there are two versions they know about. No checksums listed for the /2 ROMS.

Does anyone have the /2 version? Anyone know what was fixed or changed in each version?

#12 3 years ago

I think I have everything sorted out! I had two MPU boards each running different versions and each one had a bad ROM. One had the original 708 version. That one had a PROM2 that the checksum didn’t match. Displaying the contents showed a lot of FF which is what the cells default to when erased. Replaced it and all ok with that board. The other board had version 708/1 and the chips verified ok in the programmer but failed the PROM check in the board. Just went with the free play set of 708/2 and that’s good too.

This is the 2nd time I’ve had an EPROM read ok in the programmer yet fail in the board.

#13 3 years ago

I'm in the club!! what are the changes for the 708/2 roms? anyone know besides free play, which is awesome. This may not be a super fast game but it is a great challenging shooters game. if you want to slow down and hone in on your shooting skills, this is a great game for it.

#14 3 years ago
Quoted from Bax1:

I'm in the club!! what are the changes for the 708/2 roms? anyone know besides free play, which is awesome. This may not be a super fast game but it is a great challenging shooters game. if you want to slow down and hone in on your shooting skills, this is a great game for it.

I don't think "free play" is in the official 708/2 ROM's as those were tweaks done by flip projects.

Hopefully someone will have some old notes from Gottlieb that mention what was fixed in each version.

#15 3 years ago

Is the 10 million point shot fixed in any of them? Haha. My only beef with the game.

#16 3 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Is the 10 million point shot fixed in any of them? Haha. My only beef with the game.

What is the issue with that shot? In the manual it shows that it lights up every 40 switch closures or at random depending on how a DIP switch is set.

#17 3 years ago

It’s worth 10 million points. Way too much for what the rest of the game gives away in terms of points. It should only be worth 1 million points.

#18 3 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

It’s worth 10 million points. Way too much for what the rest of the game gives away in terms of points. It should only be worth 1 million points.

Got it! Actually that probably wouldn't be all that bad to patch. Just need to isolate that part of the code to change the value added and the probably recalculate the ROM checksum. Unless the checksum is disabled in the free play versions.

#19 3 years ago

I think you should leave it on for tournaments. Luck does come into play with pinball. it is excessive but if you play the game right that is kind of like a jackpot right?

#20 3 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

It’s worth 10 million points. Way too much for what the rest of the game gives away in terms of points. It should only be worth 1 million points.

That's the beauty of a Gottlieb quirky shit

#21 3 years ago
Quoted from Bax1:

I think you should leave it on for tournaments. Luck does come into play with pinball. it is excessive but if you play the game right that is kind of like a jackpot right?

Right. It’s just too valuable. Would it be fair if the jackpot on funhouse was 30 million instead of three million? Yeah, everyone has the same
Opportunity to get it, but it makes the entire game about one shot.

Also the 40 switch count carries player to player which is lame.

#22 3 years ago
Quoted from dhard:

That's the beauty of a Gottlieb quirky shit

Quirky is good. Dumb is not. Haha. Look at genesis. 99x multiplier Mac is possible. But it works.

Having one shot give you 10 million points when that score is literally impossible without making that shot is too unbalanced.

#23 3 years ago

Hey @robotworkshop, what do you want a topper for?

#24 3 years ago
Quoted from Friengineer:

Hey robotworkshop, what do you want a topper for?

My game is missing the topper. Normally I wouldn't worry about the topper but where I have it setup there is room to put it up and the topper for this is pretty cool the way it all lights up. I like to try and keep the games as complete as I can. Maybe there is another one out there.

#25 3 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Right. It’s just too valuable. Would it be fair if the jackpot on funhouse was 30 million instead of three million? Yeah, everyone has the same
Opportunity to get it, but it makes the entire game about one shot.
Also the 40 switch count carries player to player which is lame.

Wasn’t aware the switch count carries over. It’s a pretty quick timer on that shot though. Been playing it for over a year and have only hit it a couple times. Granted I’m a mediocre player so may be an advantage to better players.

#26 3 years ago
Quoted from Bax1:

Wasn’t aware the switch count carries over. It’s a pretty quick timer on that shot though. Been playing it for over a year and have only hit it a couple times. Granted I’m a mediocre player so may be an advantage to better players.

My best is three in one game. Just shatz the inlanes back and forth and hit the ramp when lit.

#27 3 years ago

i love the 10 million shot, my switches are closing often and at random for whatever reason so the 10 million light comes at shorter intervals, lol

#28 3 years ago

Today is a good day! Just received my new ramp for Monte Carlo. I asked if it could be made in green right as Ramp-o-Matic was about to make a new batch. This will look really good on the game. Thicker than original and should hold up well.

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#29 3 years ago

That looks good. Please post pics after it’s in

#30 3 years ago

FYI, I can do these in green as a special order only right now. I do not get this material in often, so I ran them all in clear initially. I do not want to get stuck with a pile of green ones until I know the demand. I have had blue Tx Sector ramps that nobody actually wanted in my stock for close to a year now, haha.

#31 3 years ago
Quoted from JodyG:

FYI, I can do these in green as a special order only right now. I do not get this material in often, so I ran them all in clear initially. I do not want to get stuck with a pile of green ones until I know the demand. I have had blue Tx Sector ramps that nobody actually wanted in my stock for close to a year now, haha.

That's understandable. how much does the green one run?

2 weeks later
#32 3 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Is the 10 million point shot fixed in any of them? Haha. My only beef with the game.

Hello guys!
Good news: it's coming soon

I am currently working on reverse engineering for the 80Bs and someone asked me if it would not be possible to reduce the score from 10,000,000 to a lower value. And apparently, this is a recurring request from owners of Monte Carlo.

After some testing, I can answer YES (it already works - I don't have the pinball machine, but I am experimenting with VpinMame). I will therefore prepare a new version (in fact three, for English, French and German) which will also include Freeplay.

When it's ready, the binaries will be available for free download from our site. I can already warn you that it will be necessary to reprogram the two EPROMs (2764 + 2716), because this time the modification will impact both chips (unlike Freeplay which only modifies the 2764).

But, I have a question to the community: What value do you want to replace the 10,000,000 ?
- 1,000,000 --> This one is my first intention
- 2,000,000
- or another value ?

1,000,000 look good, but as I don't have too much experience with this game, may be this is not enough ? Quite all values are possible (internally, the pinball make a loop of scoring 100 x 100,000 points). We must keep the 100x loop, but the granularity can be 10,000 - 15,000 - 20,000 - no problem for me to encode that.

Tell me what is your prefered replacement value, and be prepared to redraw the 10,000,000 sign

#33 3 years ago

1,000,000 is perfect imo. Basically getting 2-3 million outside of hitting the ramp is an incredible score.

I would say make the ramp 1,000,000 max.

#34 3 years ago
Quoted from noflip95:

I am currently working on reverse engineering for the 80Bs

I agree it would be better to change it to 1 million also I have an eprom burner and both types of chips if you need a beta tester

#35 3 years ago

And I honestly wouldn’t change anything else about the game. It’s pretty well balanced with good rules outside of that one shot. Pretty great job by Gottlieb on this one.

#36 3 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

1,000,000 is perfect imo. Basically getting 2-3 million outside of hitting the ramp is an incredible score.
I would say make the ramp 1,000,000 max.

I could agree on that. And agree on a good score of 2-3 mill without the ramp

#37 3 years ago

Any way to assign a dip switch to that score, so you could actually have two options?

#38 3 years ago
Quoted from JodyG:

Any way to assign a dip switch to that score, so you could actually have two options?

That would be the best of both worlds!

#39 3 years ago
Quoted from JodyG:

Any way to assign a dip switch to that score, so you could actually have two options?

It's a good idea and for me it's technically doable. There is some room available in the EPROM to encode this and I know the memory addresses of the DIPs.

Usually, unused DIPs can be used for this, like DIP6, 7, 8 or DIP 31, 32 which are generally used for LIBERAL / CONSERVATIVE modes and to adjust the difficulty of the game. But on the Monte Carlo, all the DIPs are already in use and I don't really see which one we could use to activate / deactivate this option.

#40 3 years ago

Just pick one that is a completely useless setting and replace it?

#41 3 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Just pick one that is a completely useless setting and replace it

You could reprogram the credit selection dips. Free play anyways.

#42 3 years ago
Quoted from Friengineer:

You could reprogram the credit selection dips. Free play anyways.

No, I don't want to make a change that's too invasive and try to keep as much of the original configuration as possible. This is also what is already done for Freeplay which uses an unused coin mechanism configuration.

But I think I found: the DIP-8
This one is already used for the 10,000,000 points and is used to configure its LIBERAL or CONSERVATIVE mode.

When the DIP-8 is ON, we are in LIBERAL (easy) mode and the ramp lamp is activated (flashes) regularly every 40 switch closures.
When it is OFF, it is in CONSERVATIVE (difficult) mode and the ramp lamp is activated (flashes) more randomly.

We can therefore keep the count of 10,000,000 points when we are in LIBERAL mode, and reduce to 1,000,000 points when we are in CONSERVATIVE mode. It is coherent and ultimately very logical.

#44 3 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

From the pinmame source it looks like their could be three versions for Monte Carlo. The plain 708, 708/1, and 708/2
Found a list of checksums on flippers.com and that appears to show there are two versions they know about. No checksums listed for the /2 ROMS.
Does anyone have the /2 version? Anyone know what was fixed or changed in each version?

The three versions 708, 708/1 and 708/2 are available, with freeplay modification, at our website: https://www.flipprojets.fr
Two additionnal export versions also exist: 708X for French and 708Y for German.

To my knowledge, I have never seen any mention (except for the James Bond "timed" SYS-80) of the fixes made in the ROMs. In any case, that did not appear in the Gottlieb technical bulletins.

For the Monte Carlo, I made an intensive investigation in the game ROMs:
- The initial version is the 708.
- A first fix was made with the 708/1, which also served as the basis for the 708X and 708Y.
- A second fix has been made with the 708/2, but it seems that it has not been done on the export versions X and Y.

It is therefore advisable to use version 708/2, and useful to know that a small bug still remain in versions 708X and 708Y.

◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃

At first glance when we look at the contents of the memories, there are enormous binary differences. But in fact, no.
PROM1 contains a lot of function and table calls to PROM2. After intensive analysis, it appears that finally, all the PROM1 708, 701/1 and 708/2 are structurally identical. The difference is that in the PROM2, modifications were made at the very beginning, which leads to changes of addresses everywhere!

Apart from addressing, the PROM1s have not undergone any modification between versions 708, 708/1 and 708/2.

► From what I understand, patch 708/1 is in the "endgame" section. We can see it easily, because there is the end-of-game sound (0A sound). There is also a fix in a call right after, but I think it's related.

I don't know exactly what the correction is, but it's probably something that was forgotten at the end of the game. For example, a bad count of bonuses, or a reset of the target banks that does not take place, or even a ball remaining stuck in the holes. In any case, it is certainly remarkable at the end of the game.

► Patch 708/2 is much lighter. A table entry has been deleted (but I'm not sure it serves) and a variable reset has been added. Still in the "end of game" section.

Maybe a reset of a forgotten multiplier, or something like that. But which should not be noticed too much, perhaps only in certain rarer conditions (multiballs).

◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃▹◃

And for those who would like to check, I did a side-by-side comparison of the three versions:

Side by side comparison PROM2 - 708 - 708/1 - 708/2Side by side comparison PROM2 - 708 - 708/1 - 708/2

◈ For the modification of the "million", I will do it only from the 708/2 and the 708X, 708Y. This is unnecessary for the 708 and 708/1 which are older versions.

#45 3 years ago

Awesome! Thanks for your work and posting what was done on the ROM's. I recently had to repair a couple MPU's for these machines and your existing freeplay code works great. Will need to make one of these sets to try.

#46 3 years ago

Hi everyone. I'm the person that first contacted noflip95 asking if he could reduce the scoring for the 10 Million point shot.

I agree that having DIP 8 control liberal/conservative for both the scoring and how often the shot lights up makes sense, but I think that having a 1 Million point shot light up every 40 switch hits would be a fun scoring mode.

I play with it set to conservative now, because when set the liberal the whole game becomes about getting 40 switch hits and then getting 10 Million points, and all the other scoring stops mattering. Playing on the conservative "random" setting though, the ramp very rarely lights up. I have a lot of balls where it doesn't light up at all.

I think that having a 1 Million shot light up every 40 hits might keep that shot important without making the entire game focus on it.

Whatever you decide to do noflip95, thanks for improving this game with your custom ROMs.

#47 3 years ago
Quoted from noflip95:

No, I don't want to make a change that's too invasive and try to keep as much of the original configuration as possible. This is also what is already done for Freeplay which uses an unused coin mechanism configuration.
But I think I found: the DIP-8
This one is already used for the 10,000,000 points and is used to configure its LIBERAL or CONSERVATIVE mode.
When the DIP-8 is ON, we are in LIBERAL (easy) mode and the ramp lamp is activated (flashes) regularly every 40 switch closures.
When it is OFF, it is in CONSERVATIVE (difficult) mode and the ramp lamp is activated (flashes) more randomly.
We can therefore keep the count of 10,000,000 points when we are in LIBERAL mode, and reduce to 1,000,000 points when we are in CONSERVATIVE mode. It is coherent and ultimately very logical.

I agree, that sounds like an awesome idea!

#48 3 years ago
Quoted from opensourcepirate:

Hi everyone. I'm the person that first contacted noflip95 asking if he could reduce the scoring for the 10 Million point shot.
I agree that having DIP 8 control liberal/conservative for both the scoring and how often the shot lights up makes sense, but I think that having a 1 Million point shot light up every 40 switch hits would be a fun scoring mode.
I play with it set to conservative now, because when set the liberal the whole game becomes about getting 40 switch hits and then getting 10 Million points, and all the other scoring stops mattering. Playing on the conservative "random" setting though, the ramp very rarely lights up. I have a lot of balls where it doesn't light up at all.
I think that having a 1 Million shot light up every 40 hits might keep that shot important without making the entire game focus on it.
Whatever you decide to do noflip95, thanks for improving this game with your custom ROMs.

Finally, you are right, the 10,000,000 are of no use except to "kill" the game. Keeping this value does not make sense, and at worst, whoever wanted to could always put the normal EPROMs back in place.

The DIP-8 has also finally, no relation with the difficulty (LIBERAL / CONSERVATIVE) since this one is regulated by other DIPs, and the DIP-8 is in the end, totally independent of the remaining.

In this case, we can simply define the DIP-8 as being a "MILLION MODE", and configure it as follows:
- ON : light the flashing every 40 switch closures and earn 1.000.000 points
- OFF : light the flashing randomly and earn 2.000.000 points

This way, we can define the behavior: Either it appears regular and frequently, and gives a million. Either it acts more randomly and rarely, but in this case it gives you double.

#49 3 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

It’s worth 10 million points. Way too much for what the rest of the game gives away in terms of points. It should only be worth 1 million points.

haha, in the high scores if its past 10 million you know someone hit the 10 mill shot, otherwise the scoes are around 3 million. I love the game, need to shop mine out and get it looking better.

#50 3 years ago

It’s fun to see how many you can get in one game though and it’s easy to tell from the high scores. I haven’t gotten 3 yet, but I’ve gotten 2 multiple times.

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