(Topic ID: 200232)

Gottlieb Jungle Not Keeping Score

By TaterTot

6 years ago


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#1 6 years ago

I am brand new to Pinball (especially new to EM) and I just got a Gottlieb Jungle (and a High Hand).

When it is plugged in, the Player 1 score just clicks & clicks and will not reset to 0. It seems to be stuck 1/2 way between 9 & 0. I could not play it because it will just continue to try to reset the score.

However, I was able to give the reel a little "help" and it reset to all Zeros and I finally got a game started, but now it will not keep score or ball count. Just to be clear, the ball kicks out and everything on the play field seems to work BUT there is no score and ENDLESS balls...

I understand I might need to clean/go through the score reels, but why is it not keeping score?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

#2 6 years ago

It sounds like your score reel units need to be disassembled and cleaned. For the endless balls, does the machine go through the ball in play numbers on the backglass? This could be another cleaning issue where the player unit needs to be cleaned. Manually advance the player unit to see if it will rotate smoothly... Also, you can unplug the Jones plugs in the backbox to see if they need cleaning...

#3 6 years ago

No, the ball count does not change at all and it would not advance to the next player UNTIL I accidentally "tilted" the machine. After that, it would go through the players and keep up with the balls perfectly (still with no score on any reels).

When I unplugged the machine and started over, I had the same problem with no scoring and not keeping up with ball count (endless balls).

Anyway, so you suggest cleaning the "player unit" and checking the plugs?

#4 6 years ago

Once you're satisfied that the Player unit is working mechanically, here's the circuit that advances it during a 1 player game.

Pinball (resized).pngPinball (resized).png

#5 6 years ago

Thanks for the diagram!

I am trying to learn/understand as much as I can here...

Is the "Player Unit" responsible for keeping up with the Ball Count? Is it also responsible for keeping up with the Scores?

If not, then is there something else I should look at after I clean it?

#6 6 years ago

PU does do that stuff, TT. Make sure all the rivets are shiny clean and that those springy little connectors are making good contact. The switches in the back of it that are referred to in Howard's diagram are a pita to clean and adjust because they've got lateral connections soldered in, but you have to make do. While you're at it, take a good look at the switches on each score reel for cleanliness and good contact. Hopefully you don't need to get into the motor switches, but if the above doesn't work you will have to check them out.

#7 6 years ago

Regarding the scoring issue...do the L,M or N relays operate when you activate a scoring playfield switch?

#8 6 years ago
Quoted from woz:

Regarding the scoring issue...do the L,M or N relays operate when you activate a scoring playfield switch?

Not exactly sure which relays those are, but I will look and see if there are labeled in the machine & see what they are doing. Thanks for the help!

#9 6 years ago
Quoted from TaterTot:

Not exactly sure which relays those are, but I will look and see if there are labeled in the machine & see what they are doing. Thanks for the help!

L,M,N are in the head (1000, 100 and 10 point relays)

#10 6 years ago

Well there was a Jones plug in the head that needed to be "reseated" and that got the scoring working and all the chimes making noise. Still have a problem with the scoring wheels not resetting to 0 (needs a helping push), but I will take them apart and clean them. Next problem is that it advances to a random player after a ball drain (even if you are only playing 1 player). It does not do it every time, but it is annoying

#11 6 years ago

Hi TaterTot
faults of the kind "not every time" are specially annoying - tricky to detect. The stepping through players / balls in a Gottlieb pin is complicated - the mechanism must cover "ONE-Player-Game" - the next game might be a "THREE-Player-Game" - then an 1- or -4 or -2 or -3 Game. The mechanism must handle every kind of a game. The simplest form is an FOUR-Player-Game.

Please play many FOUR-Player-Games - big question: DOES Your "sometimes" fault show up ? Write about.
IF (if, if) "NEVER shows up in a FOUR-Player-Game": Play many THREE-Player-Games - big question: DOES Your "sometimes" fault show up ? Write about.
IF (if, if) "NEVER shows up in a THREE-Player-Game": Play many TWO-Player-Games - big question: DOES Your "sometimes" fault show up ? Write about.
IF (if, if) "NEVER shows up in a TWO-Player-Game": Play many ONE-Player-Games and write about.

Theory to come - but it helps me "writing" when I know about the "written above". Greetings Rolf

#12 6 years ago

Hi TaterTot
why did I ask You "please play many FOUR-Player-Games ..." (see post-11) ? I took HowardR 's picture from post-4 and added some drawings - see the JPG - when we start for the second Player: The PB2-Relay (for second player) sitting in the Control-Bank plunges and stays (through the hole game) plunged --- switch (lightblue-3*) "PB2" will be open through the hole game.
When we start for the third Player: The PB3-Relay (for third player) sitting in the Control-Bank plunges and stays (through the hole game) plunged --- switch (darkblue-4*) "PB3" will be open through the hole game.
When we start for the fourth Player: The PB4-Relay (for fourth player) sitting in the Control-Bank plunges and stays (through the hole game) plunged --- switch (brown-5*) "PB4" will be open through the hole game.
Therefore: In a running "Jungle" NEVER current can flow through "lightblue / darkblue / brown" wires.
IF (if, if) You play many FOUR-Player-Games and the pin sometimes makes more than one step: Fault must be on the "lightblue-3*, dark-blue-4*, brown-5*" switches.
IF (if, if) You play many FOUR-Player-Games and the pin sometimes does not step: Fault must be in the wiring and switches along "red - orange - red" wiring (do not forget to make some points on every ball).

SteveFury made an excellent topic - https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/em-pinball-circuits-basics-to-not-so-basic --- look at the first animated GIF in post-54 - a four-player-game --- ALWAYS just one step (along my (JPG) "red - orange - red" wiring).

In SteveFury's topic, post-54 the second animated GIF shows the stepping in a ONE-Player-Game --- his switches below the words "CAM 1, CAM 2, CAM 3, CAM 4" act synchronous with (my JPG) "not shown in the snippet - lightblue-3% - darkblue-4%, brown-5%" Switches. Greetings Rolf

P.S.: The "written above" is stepping in a FOUR-Player GOTTLIEB pin --- Williams and Bally 4-player-pins have an completely different way to step through the players / balls.

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