(Topic ID: 245198)

Gottlieb Duotron Weak Flipper

By Knxwledge

4 years ago


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Topic Stats

  • 20 posts
  • 12 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by Knxwledge
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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#1 4 years ago

The left flipper on my Duotron is quite weak. It cant even hit the ball halfway up the table. Heres what Ive tried so far:
-Adjusting the spring. At the springs current position, its weak, and it gets stuck once it stops flipping upward. At this position there is a little bit of looseness when pulling up and down on the flipper from the playfield side. Moving the spring over to the next position helps with the sticking, but its still weak and it is quite tight.
-Cleaning the coil, coil sleeve and plunger. This did not help.

What should I try next? Im thinking a rebuild, but from what I understand that should be a last resort option. Any help appreciated

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#3 4 years ago

Your last photo there, looks like that flipper EOS switch is open. That means no power to the coil’s main winding. It should be adjusted so it is closed at rest position and opens only when the coil pulls in.

#4 4 years ago

Good call on the eos, and when
It is adjusted it should only open at the very last of the flipper travel.

#5 4 years ago
Quoted from frenchmarky:

Your last photo there, looks like that flipper EOS switch is open. That means no power to the coil’s main winding. It should be adjusted so it is closed at rest position and opens only when the coil pulls in.

Quoted from DCRand:

Good call on the eos, and when
It is adjusted it should only open at the very last of the flipper travel.

YUP! Great job on the photos too! This made troubleshooting very simple. That EOS switch should be clean and tightly closed until the last bit of the flipper stroke. When it opens, it should open about 1/8 inch.

#6 4 years ago

It almost looks like the contact on the longer blade of the EOS switch is pretty worn down (or even missing?).
Might want to consider replacing the entire EOS switch.

#7 4 years ago

It looks like there may be wear around the plunger end on the flipper link. If there is it too will contribute (to a smaller degree than the EOS swtich) to a weak or sloppy flipper. Here's a clearer picture of what I'm referring to:
Worn flipper link 1 (resized).jpgWorn flipper link 1 (resized).jpg
This is a clue that the holes in the flipper link have become elongated and may need replacing.
Worn flipper link 2 (resized).jpgWorn flipper link 2 (resized).jpg
Elongated holes in the flipper link mean that the plunger has to travel farther before the flipper will start moving. Any wasted movement like this is energy that doesn't get transferred from the plunger through the flipper to the pinball.

/Mark

#8 4 years ago

Thanks everybody for the feedback, but the problem persists. I think my problem is that there's a deadzone where the coil plunger doesn't return to its starting position, which I believe is caused by the spring. The other flipper (the working one) also feels a lot more responsive when manually pulling back. I adjusted the EOS switch stack to its proper position and the flipper link feels as tight as the one that's working, so I've ruled those out.

Here's a replacement I found for the spring: https://www.pinballspareparts.com.au/a-3329.html

but this is out of Australia and I'm in the US so shipping would take a long time and be way more expensive. Anybody got a lead on where I can buy a replacement from a shop within the US?

EDIT: found one here ( https://www.flippers.com/catalog/product_info.php/left-flipper-spring-p-1527 ). I'm gonna replace the spring and see if that fixes it.

#9 4 years ago

You could try swapping the two coils to see if the problem moves to the other flipper. That would let you know if there is something wrong with the coil itself.

#10 4 years ago

I would say it is doubtful that type of spring has gone "bad".

Either it doesn't have enough tension (due to the anchor point being mis-adjusted) to return the mechanism to rest position, or there is a mechanical hangup with the plunger/sleeve, bushing, or other, that is causing excess friction.

From the initial description, it sounded classically like the EOS switch was malfunctioning and failing to shunt current around the high resistance part of the winding. Are you confident you have a low resistance path through the terminals of the EOS switch?

#11 4 years ago

You just need to rebuild the flipper. It's not the last resort. It's a must for just about any game i do.

Check the resistance of both coils. That will tell you what you need to know there. You have to open the EOS to check the hold winding.

Most assuredly the spring is not causing a weak flipper situation.

I concur with Lee that not only is the EOS open it appears to be missing a contact.

#13 4 years ago
Quoted from Knxwledge:

I adjusted the EOS switch stack to its proper position and the flipper link feels as tight as the one that's working, so I've ruled those out.

Maybe you would like to show us a photo of your "after" work?

Also, did you clean those EOS contacts? A dremel with a wire-brush attachement works well for this.

In Vid's guide, he goes over flipper rebuilds for Williams, but the same rules apply. Also, new style EOS switches have a 3rd "tension" leaf for holding the switch closed tightly when at rest

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-upgradingrebuilding-flippers#post-284658

That EOS needs to be tightly closed until the flipper is at the end of it's stroke (hence, the name), then only open about 1/8".
EOS copy (resized).jpgEOS copy (resized).jpg

Perhaps you can show pics both at rest and full plunge?

2 weeks later
#14 4 years ago

Bumping this thread back up again. So I went to install the spring and they sent me the wrong one :/. Heres pics with the the original spring in all the different positions.

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1 week later
#15 4 years ago

Bump, can anybody help me out?

#16 4 years ago

Did you do a flipper rebuild or just replacing the spring? Get a flipper rebuild kit from pbresource like EMsKC stated in previous post.

#17 4 years ago

The contact faces on the EOS look awful. Replace the entire EOS switch.

1 week later
#18 4 years ago
Quoted from Runbikeskilee:

The contact faces on the EOS look awful. Replace the entire EOS switch.

I agree with this. The flipper coil cant get all the power it needs when the EOS switch contacts are pitted like that. It may not be the only problem, but definitely something that needs attention for long term operation.

#19 4 years ago

Replace the coil, could be a broken wire on the high power side.
You can check this by closing the eos that it won't open on the last bit of the stroke.
If it stays weak check the cables on the eos switch and on the coil.

1 week later
#20 4 years ago
Quoted from Pafasa:

I agree with this. The flipper coil cant get all the power it needs when the EOS switch contacts are pitted like that. It may not be the only problem, but definitely something that needs attention for long term operation.

Thanks, I ended up buying a rebuild kit from Steve Young, and this fixed it.

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