(Topic ID: 152470)

GoT Pre: damaged Playfield, what to do?

By Luckydogg420

8 years ago


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  • 139 posts
  • 64 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 years ago by Pin_Guy
  • Topic is favorited by 7 Pinsiders

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There are 139 posts in this topic. You are on page 3 of 3.
10
#101 8 years ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Thanks for sharing, good info. Is there any advantage to using one type of wood over the other for a playfield?

Because Europe does not have the ideal climate for mass syrup production, Maple wood is more of a North American product.

Maple is a short lived tree (usually less than 100 years), so when a stand of trees becomes too old to be useful to the syrup industry, it is cut down for lumber. It then becomes Baseball Bats, Guitar Necks, Bowling Ally Lanes and of course pinball playfields. Most syrup farms rotate between 4 stands of trees, so they always have the proper age trees available.

Of course, you can't buy good Maple plywood at Home Depot. The "Maple Ply" at Depot has a core of soft pine with a paper thin veneer of maple applied on the faces.

Pinball playfields are made of "Lumber Core" Maple plywood. That means that the outer and inner plys are all made of Maple. The outer face plys are thick slabs of Maple, allowing the inserts to be sanded flush with the surface of the plywood; without the worry of sanding through to the next ply.

=

In Europe, the Baltic region has an abundance of Birch trees, so you often hear the terms Russian Birch or Baltic Birch.

Baltic Birch is made up of many thin layers of Birch. That is why you can always tell which kind of plywood was used by looking at the shooter lane layers. If the shooter lane has many thin layers, you know it was made from Baltic Birch plywood.

Because the face plys of Baltic Birch are thin, the gluing and sanding of the playfield inserts must be much more precise; or you can sand right through to the underlying layer.

-

Maple is a little bit harder than Birch, but either wood can be used to make a quality playfield.

#102 8 years ago
Quoted from Joker2Wild:

So one piece would go in shooter lane as well as up top of the left and right side correct? For the remove, you would have to do the upside down can of air to freeze the glue and get it off correct?
Thanks!
J

I put one piece that fits the width left & right side of the shooter lane. I put it over any Cliffys so I can remove it if necessary in one piece without taking off Cliffys. The light adhesive Mylar I have used just comes up by pulling at it and your good. Now if you put that over inserts you can easily mess up the inserts. In the shooter lane area I've never had an issue with simply pulling it up carefully.

#103 8 years ago

i have a little piece of mylar over that area until cliffy comes up with a new version, we need those badly cliff.

#104 8 years ago

thanks for the info... I'll be adding some mylar today.

#105 8 years ago

My ~2wk old GoT Premium (111 plays) shows a similar divot in the shooter lane, though not quite as prominent as un-luckydog or ninja's!. Will get a bit of mylar on that asap, then will look to cliffy for a more permanent solution.

#106 8 years ago

I wonder if it's the angle/force of the ball going into the shooter lane that is the primary factor here ... may have been mentioned earlier, but my TZ for example shows no wear after 20 years of play -- however, the ball comes dribbling out and usually hits the rubber and then rolls down the diverter into the lane.

#107 8 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Because Europe does not have the ideal climate for mass syrup production, Maple wood is more of a North American product.
Maple is a short lived tree (usually less than 100 years), so when a stand of trees becomes too old to be useful to the syrup industry, it is cut down for lumber. It then becomes Baseball Bats, Guitar Necks, Bowling Ally Lanes and of course pinball playfields. Most syrup farms rotate between 4 stands of trees, so they always have the proper age trees available.
Of course, you can't buy good Maple plywood at Home Depot. The "Maple Ply" at Depot has a core of soft pine with a paper thin veneer of maple applied on the faces.
Pinball playfields are made of "Lumber Core" Maple plywood. That means that the outer and inner plys are all made of Maple. The outer face plys are thick Maple, allowing the inserts to be sanded flush with the surface of the plywood; without the worry of sanding through to the next ply.
=
In Europe, the Baltic region has an abundance of Birch trees, so you often hear the terms Russian Birch or Baltic Birch.
Baltic Birch is made up of many thin layers of Birch. That is why you can always tell which kind of plywood was used by looking at the shooter lane layers. If the shooter lane has many thin layers, you know it was made from Baltic Birch plywood.
Because the face plys of Baltic Birch are thin, the gluing and sanding of the playfield inserts must be much more precise; or you can sand right through to the underlying layer.
-
Maple is a little bit harder than Birch, but either wood can be used to make a quality playfield.

Very interesting, thanks for the knowledge!

#108 8 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Because Europe does not have the ideal climate for mass syrup production, Maple wood is more of a North American product.
Maple is a short lived tree (usually less than 100 years), so when a stand of trees becomes too old to be useful to the syrup industry, it is cut down for lumber. It then becomes Baseball Bats, Guitar Necks, Bowling Ally Lanes and of course pinball playfields. Most syrup farms rotate between 4 stands of trees, so they always have the proper age trees available.
Of course, you can't buy good Maple plywood at Home Depot. The "Maple Ply" at Depot has a core of soft pine with a paper thin veneer of maple applied on the faces.
Pinball playfields are made of "Lumber Core" Maple plywood. That means that the outer and inner plys are all made of Maple. The outer face plys are thick Maple, allowing the inserts to be sanded flush with the surface of the plywood; without the worry of sanding through to the next ply.
=
In Europe, the Baltic region has an abundance of Birch trees, so you often hear the terms Russian Birch or Baltic Birch.
Baltic Birch is made up of many thin layers of Birch. That is why you can always tell which kind of plywood was used by looking at the shooter lane layers. If the shooter lane has many thin layers, you know it was made from Baltic Birch plywood.
Because the face plys of Baltic Birch are thin, the gluing and sanding of the playfield inserts must be much more precise; or you can sand right through to the underlying layer.
-
Maple is a little bit harder than Birch, but either wood can be used to make a quality playfield.

Wow, that is very informative. Thank you!

15
#109 8 years ago

I have to be honest....I barely care at all about "shooter lanes". That being said I agree (to a degree) with the OP....this shouldn't be happening on a new game so quickly.

In fact the ONLY reason I do care about shooter lanes at all is because of all of you anal "collectors" who judge a game's resale value by the condition of the shooter lane! The shooter lane could be blown out for all I care. As long as it functions as intended and as long as the playfield itself is in great condition I'm happy. They could not put any clear at all on the shooter lane and I'd be fine with that.

But.....thanks to most of you I have to protect the stupid shooter lane so I don't get jacked when I sell/trade a game......thanks for that.

#110 8 years ago
Quoted from Astropin:

I have to be honest....I barely care at all about "shooter lanes". .....thanks to most of you I have to protect the stupid shooter lane so I don't get jacked when I sell/trade a game......thanks for that.

+2373238783562108515

#111 8 years ago

I like a nicely protected SL, just makes for an easier sale when it's time to move it out.

Edit----obviously doesn't matter as far as gameplay, but some people like it pretty

#112 8 years ago
Quoted from centerflank:

I like a nicely protected SL, just makes for an easier sale when it's time to move it out.

Now that I'm going to be buying/selling with new releases...Shit I thin kI might have to actually go home and blow a protective load all over my shooter lane. Jesus is this true...has it come to this for me? Maybe so, but I sill won't take pics of the shooter lane on sale.

frikkin millennials that aren't even millennials

#113 8 years ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

Now that I'm going to be buying/selling with new releases...Shit I thin kI might have to actually go home and blow a protective load all over my shooter lane. Jesus is this true...has it come to this for me? Maybe so, but I sill won't take pics of the shooter lane on sale.
frikkin millennials that aren't even millennials

We have to keep Cliffy busy, he is awesome! Shooter lane protection is probably a huge chunk of what he sells.

Edit----and btw, I love pretty stuff

Re-edit-----even just some Mylar over a waxed SL makes a big diff, Stern games seem to eject the ball out the trough with way more power than all the B/W games

#114 8 years ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Interesting. If true I wonder if Churchhill changed their process in someway to make it faster / cheaper. Who knows if they are the only ones to blame though as Stern could be putting pressure on them to crank out playfields more quickly.
Either way haste makes waste.

This is a stupid ass guess... It is probably because of some poison chemical they used to use that they were forced to stop using due to government regulations.

No, I'm not a "tinfoil hat" kind of guy. I just know that my houses association can't get stain that sticks to the deck for over a year since all the reformulations that were better for the environment.

#115 8 years ago
Quoted from DaveH:

I just know that my houses association can't get stain that sticks to the deck for over a year since all the reformulations that were better for the environment.

That's ironic since all the soil under a deck becomes a toxic waste dump anyway from the chemicals they use in pressure treating the lumber. (unless you are wealthy and can afford a Cedar or Teak deck).

Don't let your kids make a fort under your deck.....

#116 8 years ago
Quoted from Astropin:

I have to be honest....I barely care at all about "shooter lanes". That being said I agree (to a degree) with the OP....this shouldn't be happening on a new game so quickly.
In fact the ONLY reason I do care about shooter lanes at all is because of all of you anal "collectors" who judge a game's resale value by the condition of the shooter lane! The shooter lane could be blown out for all I care. As long as it functions as intended and as long as the playfield itself is in great condition I'm happy. They could not put any clear at all on the shooter lane and I'd be fine with that.
But.....thanks to most of you I have to protect the stupid shooter lane so I don't get jacked when I sell/trade a game......thanks for that.

I agree with this so much. I'm not bothered by this damage, but I don't think it should have happened so quickly. I know I will have to repair it so that I don't get burned on resale.

#117 8 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

That's ironic since all the soil under a deck becomes a toxic waste dump anyway from the chemicals they use in pressure treating the lumber. (unless you are wealthy and can afford a Cedar or Teak deck).

I have a cedar deck and I stain it with all sorts of non-friendly oil stains! Woohoo!

#118 8 years ago

Mylar is a good solution.
I had Cliffys Shooterlane-Kit in my MET and kicked it out after a while, balls get stuck on multiball
with the protectors. Mylar works for me.

#119 8 years ago
Quoted from centerflank:

Nail hardener, it's a nice product, you can brush some on scoop edges too if you don't want to Cliffy it

What kind of prep work if you were gonna do this ?

#120 8 years ago
Quoted from Astropin:

I have to be honest....I barely care at all about "shooter lanes". That being said I agree (to a degree) with the OP....this shouldn't be happening on a new game so quickly.
In fact the ONLY reason I do care about shooter lanes at all is because of all of you anal "collectors" who judge a game's resale value by the condition of the shooter lane! The shooter lane could be blown out for all I care. As long as it functions as intended and as long as the playfield itself is in great condition I'm happy. They could not put any clear at all on the shooter lane and I'd be fine with that.
But.....thanks to most of you I have to protect the stupid shooter lane so I don't get jacked when I sell/trade a game......thanks for that.

I don't sell games too often, but when I do, there will be many his res pictures close up, none of which will be of the shooter lane.

#121 8 years ago

I heard HEP quit redoing the shooter lanes because they are irrelevant and actually started clearing over the ground in dirt to add character.

#122 8 years ago
Quoted from tp:

What kind of prep work if you were gonna do this ?

If you are going over a damaged area like the shooter lane just hit it with some fine grit and wipe down with naphtha, let it dry, put a few coats of it on.

If over a nice new scoop, naphtha or alcohol swab and brush it on nicely over the clear.

Easy peazy

#123 8 years ago

yes, it seems people are concerned with the wrong aspects of a game when buying. Shooter lane wasn't even a second thought from the veteran group of collectors. We were more concerned by the GI plug condition and board issues. Shooter lanes get dirty and filthy. Nothing you can do about it. these games are ment to be played. Not museum pieces. If you think they should stay museum pieces, you need a different hobby.

But Stern games do kick the ball out with a lot more force than B/W games did. B/W use the up and under method to pop the ball up and roll into the shooter lane. Where Stern/sega fire it up a cannon into the shooter lane. Hence why we see a lot more wear and tear. But the clear should be able to handle more than 100 or so games. Like I said I have at least 1000 on my LOTR if not more, and shows no sign of wear.

#124 8 years ago
Quoted from inhomearcades:

Normal wear and tear. These are pinball machines not collector items. All pinball machines will eventually show wear, some soon, some later. This is normal.

Both my HUO Sterns show this wear. My IJ4 and my 06 run LOTR. both my machines have well under 1000 plays. Like the quote text says they are machines that will wear. Asking for warranty on this would be like asking for warranty on your tires wearing because they made contact with the road. Just my .02

#125 8 years ago

My TSPP shoots that ball out like it's trying to blow a hole through the side of the cabinet.

The whole game is pretty much worthless now.

7a02d2d3961bd3014c956c2f1d2ffa76883f49c3_(resized).jpg7a02d2d3961bd3014c956c2f1d2ffa76883f49c3_(resized).jpg

#126 8 years ago

yes, what a piece of garbage. I'll gladly take it off your hands for 2k.

#127 8 years ago

I put a cliffy on it so the price went up 4k.

#128 8 years ago
Quoted from catboxer:

My TSPP shoots that ball out like it's trying to blow a hole through the side of the cabinet.
The whole game is pretty much worthless now.

7a02d2d3961bd3014c956c2f1d2ffa76883f49c3_(resized).jpg


Burn it!

#129 8 years ago
Quoted from CaptainNeo:

yes, it seems people are concerned with the wrong aspects of a game when buying. Shooter lane wasn't even a second thought from the veteran group of collectors. We were more concerned by the GI plug condition and board issues. Shooter lanes get dirty and filthy. Nothing you can do about it. these games are ment to be played. Not museum pieces. If you think they should stay museum pieces, you need a different hobby.
But Stern games do kick the ball out with a lot more force than B/W games did. B/W use the up and under method to pop the ball up and roll into the shooter lane. Where Stern/sega fire it up a cannon into the shooter lane. Hence why we see a lot more wear and tear. But the clear should be able to handle more than 100 or so games. Like I said I have at least 1000 on my LOTR if not more, and shows no sign of wear.

Ironically you bring this up, I have a GoTLE and it is showing signs of this in the shooter lane after under 75 plays. Coil kickout is strong.
Also own WOZ, this game kicks out to the shooter lane rather soft and sometimes takes a 2nd try or 3rd to get it there. In the menu the coils are changeable in strength. 1-32 ?? No shooter lane issue in WOZ.

1 month later
#130 8 years ago

Any update on this topic? Has cliffy developed the new protector yet? I have similar wear after about 70 plays on my pro.

Also, thoughts on the ball eject cliffy (left side)? I was going to get one but have heard from a few friends that they get hang ups using that protector. Thanks!

#131 8 years ago
Quoted from catboxer:

My TSPP shoots that ball out like it's trying to blow a hole through the side of the cabinet.

I had the same issue with mine, However before it got bad I lowered the coil strength in settings. You may want to as well.

#132 8 years ago
Quoted from twisty4678:

Any update on this topic? Has cliffy developed the new protector yet? I have similar wear after about 70 plays on my pro.
Also, thoughts on the ball eject cliffy (left side)? I was going to get one but have heard from a few friends that they get hang ups using that protector. Thanks!

Yes, I bought one ~2+ months ago~......No wear on my SL. Mylar under Cliffy's

IMG_1331_(resized).jpgIMG_1331_(resized).jpg

#133 8 years ago
Quoted from centerflank:

Yes, I bought one ~2+ months ago~......No wear on my SL. Mylar under Cliffy's
IMG_1331_(resized).jpg

Is that the standard spike protector on the left? Any hangups with it?

#134 8 years ago
Quoted from centerflank:

Yes, I bought one ~2+ months ago~......No wear on my SL. Mylar under Cliffy's
IMG_1331_(resized).jpg

Yep. I just went the Mylar route and mine looks fine too. Pushing 1,500 plays.

#135 8 years ago
Quoted from twisty4678:

Is that the standard spike protector on the left? Any hangups with it?

No hang ups, I like the new trough design around the eject area, so much more beefy on the eject hood.

Quoted from chuckwurt:

Yep. I just went the Mylar route and mine looks fine too. Pushing 1,500 plays.

When I get my Spidey Vault I'm just gonna roll with mylar and see how it goes....

2 weeks later
#136 7 years ago

I don't have Cliffys on mine yet, but did do Mylar day one, and noticing a bit of wear under the Mylar. Ball coming out too hard and instead of hitting the black rail and settling, it hits the edge of the rounded out ball guide in the lane (whatever it's called). I ordered some Cliffys but not sure it will help...

#137 7 years ago
Quoted from bhwolf:

I don't have Cliffys on mine yet, but did do Mylar day one, and noticing a bit of wear under the Mylar. Ball coming out too hard and instead of hitting the black rail and settling, it hits the edge of the rounded out ball guide in the lane (whatever it's called). I ordered some Cliffys but not sure it will help...

I put the metal guard on the black rail to protect that wood where the ball ejects and hits so I think that also helps with the ball not directly hitting the edge of the groove in the shooter lane.

#138 7 years ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

I put the metal guard on the black rail to protect that wood where the ball ejects and hits so I think that also helps with the ball not directly hitting the edge of the groove in the shooter lane.

Hmmm -- on mine, the ball doesn't hit the black rail. I wish it did, as the cliffy there could prevent damage and the ball will cradle softer.

#139 7 years ago
Quoted from Shapeshifter:

I just don't think QC is as good now.
Never would have seen this issue on a LOTR or TSPP after 700 plays.

This is not entirely true, my LOTR has right at 500 plays and has noticeable wear in this area ... granted, with all the locks and multi-ball modes, 500 plays on a LOTR is a significant amount of balls entering the shooter lane.

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