Kevin from Rock Island IL?

New to the hobby and already at 10 games nice! Sorry for your issue however, I most certainly do not think you should just "let it go". Fry the bastard!!!

Seems like the seller should chime in here, if there is another side to this.

PM sent

It's good to hear that you are in the financial position to absorb the hit, but letting everyone know about this might help prevent someone else from being defrauded who doesn't have the funds to spare...

I have been warned by no less than 3 people in Iowa about him. I am sure he is on here and is always on Craigslist and Ebay. We can maybe help you with the tech stuff going wrong with the pin but thats about it. Gotta ask around before dealing with people even if they are in the community.

Feel free to PM me the scumbags name so I can put him on my list of people to avoid.....I'd fry him if it happened to me.

Sorry that happened to you. That is total misrepresentation BS. What a jerk. What is his Pinside username?

This is the reason I won't buy games from anyone sight-unseen unless I either know them, or know their reputation. Scumbags are the minority in pinball, but they're out there.

If this really went down the way you say it did, please let the rest of us know about him so we can steer clear of him. That is really the best thing you can do for everyone here.

2 things will happen:
1. No sign of seller
2. Seller will come in, guns a blazin and try to blame the buyer. Seller will protest "he's lying" or "buyer is new and doesn't know any better." How often do you see a buyer come into a "bad deals" thread and say sorry? They are safe behind the internet connection, no need to apologize.

Sad but unless you ask fellow members, you may not know if they are good people or not.

Was it the one from "old________er". Not posting the full name in case I'm wrong. I found an old add in archive for a WW that looks like what you described and in the same city. Was a bit more than $4500 though.

PM sent with the add. I would post it here but, again, if I'm wrong, I'd hate to rub someones name in the mud. It has there phone number in it too.

Sorry to hear but I love how we now use Choggared as an adverb. That made my day!

The verb is Choggard, past tense Choggarded. I prefer the old-fashioned words and phrases because they are more descriptive: screwed, defrauded, lied to...

I don't understand why people have games shipped from sellers with no reputation (or a bad reputation). I've never done this, and I never will. People are too trusting IMO.

You are correct, it is a verb. I started typing adjective and changed it. Guess I wasn't paying enough attention to get it completely erased. Ended up as another part of speech!

Was the tape on the right of the ramp leading to Bigfoot? In pic 2 it looks like its black?

Yep, thats the guy. Craigslist spammer that just flips pins. Does little to nothing with them, slaps on a few grand and resells. Wish you would have asked us here.

How did you pay him?

Sorry this happened to you, I know exactly how you feel other than the money part. I got choggarded by Choggard. I'm still finding shit wrong with this pin that I'm pretty sure he did, like plastics installed wrong, posts in the wrong places etc. little things really, but every time it just brings it all up again, I can't wait to totally redo the pin to get all the choggard out.

Pins or not, I just don't understand how someone can flat out lie about the condition of things just so they can rip someone off. I know it happens all the time, but I really couldn't ever picture myself being able to do it.

Once this guy bought a dune buggy off me, sight unseen except for a few pictures. I was so concerned about him feeling like he got ripped off that I spent an entire week every night after work fixing all the little things, touching up scratches on the frame, tuning the engine, replacing the clutch and throttle cable. He was real happy with the car when he came to get it, and I was happy he felt like he got a fair deal. I couldn't live with myself if I knowingly ripped someone off, I just can't even comprehend it.

If you paid through paypal you have some recourse as long as you didn't pay as a gift. If you used a credit card, you can dispute the charges as fraudulent, your bank can let you know what the criteria is.

Pinside really needs a seller feedback area, for both negative and positive feedback.

Must be him here on cl chicagochicago.craigslist.org link

Why don't you want to live in Moline?

You can smell Rock Island from there.

(local area joke, that I always appreciated)

Dude that sucks. Totally shout that guy's name from the rooftops around here. Save somebody else from suffering the same issue from the same jerk.

(I grew up in that area. But yeah... that's my home for ya. In retrospect it's highly implausible that someone in Rock Island has nice condition classic pinball machines. I kid... I kid... no... not really )

sorry to hear, the bad news is its rougher then thought.

good news. you actually have the machine in hand and were not totally scammed left completely empty handed. I bet you will restore that thing nicely. looks like a good start.

sorry to hear about overpaying but you did end up with a good title and something physical to work with.

I wish you would have posted before you purchased. I know Kevin and could have looked at it for you. I always thought he was high priced but not deceitful. He may be at expo. If so maybe I can talk to him. I'm here Thursday only.

Sorry about the experience....on a side note you have built a fantastic collection in a short time, congrats

I used to be the same way, it's how we learn. I'm glad you brought the seller to other buyers' attention - I wish more people did that.

Some amount of trust is needed in any pin transaction, but our goal as buyers is to minimize it. "Trust but verify", as an old Hollywood actor once said. I agree that 90% of sellers are good people, but I've learned to inspect games closely even when buying from friends. And unfortunately you can't really do that with pictures. I definitely steer clear of people who ignore my requests for better pics. If they're good sellers, they won't mind.

If the seller sent you pics of a different game, you should go legal on him. But if he just failed to mention all of the problems, you'll probably have to suck it up. I hate when it goes that way, but fortunately most problems can be fixed with time, and you'll learn in the process. Good luck!

great attitude! and agreed on a superb collection. ps is that a custom sf2 topper? looks cool and never seen one before.

If it makes you feel better, I was totally screwed on my second game (Space Station), and now it's the gem of my collection. It took a lot of work to get it there, but every time I found another problem I added to my mental list of things I'd always check out in the future.

Sorry to hear you got screwed. I once bought an Austin Powers on Ebay and had it shipped NAVL from Arizona to Alabama. Never again. I saw pictures, I talked to the guy on the phone more than once. It took me about a month to get it working correctly and when I sold it I had to take several hundred less than I paid for it. Good luck with your Wh2o and try to enjoy the process of fixing it up.

Welcome to pinball 2014, since it has become popular these snaprag junk flippers have come out of the woodwork.
People that actually put time and money into these games can't pay what these guys can pay for base games, parts are expensive and Pledge is cheap.

I love that phrase (SRJF), but it actually goes back to the 90's. There have always been assholes.

that sucks. hope you get it up to your liking without spending too much

Sorry to hear you got ripped off. I think you should have your lawyer send him a letter threatening a lawsuit unless he returns your money. He clearly misrepresented the item he sold you and no statements regarding "as is condition" nor "no returns". That's what I would do. $4000 not a lot of money to you ???? Send me a couple thousand then money bags. I'll buy an Elvira or Creature From the Black Lagoon. Furthermore, I would hope you shop around a little more for good prices in the future. That is part of the fun of the hobby, the hunt for the machine and then haggling for a good deal. The price you agreed upon for the machine was about $1000 too high unless it was collector quality. BTW as others have said I too admire your collection.

He ruined a Nascar too.

https://pinside.com/pinball/market/ad/14719

Will it really cost $1000 to fix it up? Roll up your sleeves and get your hands dirty, it's good for the soul.

Like Mike Wolfe says " sometimes you have to pay for your education". But your loss and posting will save others a lot of money. I for one will keep note of his name and avoid. Probably no constilation to you but by sharing you have helped many.

Obviously you have never restored a WH2O, a grand will get you started.

Since you've already checked into lawyer/legal options, what about him potentially being charged for fraud? If it's a bank transfer, I believe misrepresentation can bring for higher penalties, I could be wrong, but something to check into.

Tim

Actually I did restore a WH2O, so maybe you don't know so much. I paid $1800 for a disassembled game. I added new mountains and new ramps for about $500, and eventually sold it for what I had in it (no charge for my labor).

The question here is: what will it take to get the OP's game from its current condition to the condition he expected? I'm sure he didn't expect new ramps and mountains for $4250. And yes, I was an idiot to sell mine for $2300 - rub it in if you like.

"LEDED AND HIGH MODED" = suckers please line up.