(Topic ID: 173767)

Gorgar Speech, Coil and Heartbeat Repair Help Needed!

By Trainman15148

7 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 19 posts
  • 2 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 years ago by Schwaggs
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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#1 7 years ago

I have a semi working Gorgar to go with my semi pinball repair capability. It is my only system 6 game and I'm not overly familiar with it. I have three issues: 1) it does not talk during gameplay. 2) there is no heartbeat and 3) the right slingshot coil stay on.

I have done the following: confirmed that the speech does work (it passes the diagnostic - I get eight sounds and all of the speech). I confirmed that the dip switchis set correctly and that the dip switch is passing current as it should (2 is set to on). With respect to the coil issue, it came with a wire cut to the coil. I reattached it and know know why it was cut. The switches seem to be okay. I have read that a blown transistor could be the cause but I am not sure which one or how to test it.

I really have no idea what to do next on any of these issues and any advice would be greatly appreciated!

#2 7 years ago

The right sling is Q10

The CPU tells the sound board the sounds to play through Driver Board connector J9 (bottom Left) and into the sound board on J3 (upper Right). Make sure these connectors are properly seated. Reseat them to see if there is any change.

#3 7 years ago

The speech and heartbeat returned then went away. I checked q10 and the circuit seems to be doing what it is supposed to do but I'm not 100 percent sure on that. The transistors appear to check out with my multimeter. I disconnected J13 to make sure the driver board was the issue and the right sling is still stuck on, so I am deducing that the playfield mechanics are okay and the signal to fire is being generated on the driver board. Not sure if one of the ICs is the culprit or not. IC9 seems to be the controlling factor here but all of the solenoid a work except for the right sling and IC9 operates two coils. I think the other one is the top pop bumper but is works fine. It doesn't seem logical that I could blow half a chip. I will play with the connector on J9 tomorrow and see if the speech comes back. It had come back on its own and when I took the driver board out to check the transistors, it stopped working again. It seems to play sounds instead of the speech. I didn't touch the sound board itself and it still passes the sound self test so I'm guessing the gremlin is the connector. Still need help on troubleshooting the right sling coil issue. Thanks so much for the assistance!

#4 7 years ago

If the sound is coming and going, you probably have bad connectors at the driver board (J9) or at the sound board (J3) or both.

Since you checked the solenoid with J13 disconnected, I agree with you that we can rule out the playfield switches and wiring.

When does the coil lock on, at power up or when you start a game?

If locks when you start a game, I would NOT suspect IC9. That gate disables the solenoids when not in an active game. If the solenoid is disabled when not in a game, IC9 and the transistors are working and I would suspect IC7 or C5 (very unlikely).

If the solenoid locks on when you power up the game, I would suspect a shorted Q10 (by far the most likely), Q9, IC9, IC7, C5 (very unlikely) in that order.

Do you have a logic probe? We can pinpoint the problem if you do.

#5 7 years ago

Unfortunately, I don't have a logic probe - just a digital MM. I used to have one but cannot find it. The heartbeat and the speech are missing. The other sounds seem to work and the odd thing is that the game chirps on startup instead of saying "Gorgar Speaks". It's like it's playing the wrong sounds or something. When I first got it, I had this issue, then it started working and now it's back to not working. I have wiggled each wire on both ends (driver and sound board) to no avail. Concerning the coil, it only locks up when a game is started. Otherwise it's fine. It would seem that when a new game is started, some malfunction on the driver board is causing the driver logic to receive a closed switch signal. Perplexing and frustrating. I feel like I'm close to a solution but just can't get there yet. Many thanks for your continued assistance! I'll have to investigate getting a logic probe if that's what I need to do.

#6 7 years ago

I might have the heartbeat and speech issue resolved. It turns out that Q39 was loose on the driver board and the base and its associated connector didn't have good continuity. I wiggled Q39 and it started working again. I'll need to resolder the connection and I think I might be good to go. Still need to figure out the coil issue. I also have one digit (second from left) on the player one display that is unreadable (excessively bright). Any thoughts on that would be appreciated as well!

#7 7 years ago

Well, if it locks on when the game is started, but not when in attract, that proves the transistors are good. With J13 disconnected, a game started, measure the voltage at IC7 pins 11, 12 and 13.

11 is the AND gate output. 12 and 13 are the inputs.

BELOW IS EDITED Normal with game started and J13 disconnected should be pin 12 high, pin 13 high (close to 5V) and pin 11 high.

#8 7 years ago

Pin 11 tests out at 0.11V, pin 12 is 5.09 and pin 13 is 0.79 with the game started and J13 disconnected. Was really hoping for a different result!

#9 7 years ago

I misspoke on the correct behavior of that gate (I edited my earlier post). With J13 disconnected, pin 12 will get pulled up to 5V (high), which is what you are seeing.

The part that doesn't look right is pin 13 being low.

Can you check the left sling gate under the same test scenario? It is IC6 (different chip). Inputs on pins 4 and 5. Output on pin 6

I'm guessing you will see both inputs high and the output high.

#10 7 years ago

For IC 6:

Pin 4: 5.06V
Pin 5: 5.09V
Pin 6: 4.50V

In re-confirmed the IC7 voltages listed above and they are correct readings. Many thanks again for your help!

#11 7 years ago

Well that gate looks right. Now we need to figure out why IC7 pin 13 is low. I looked at the schematics yesterday and couldn't figure out where that pin goes. Now that we know it's your problem, I'll take a closer look.

#12 7 years ago

I think it goes to pin 39 on IC 5 (solenoid PIA). Hoping it don't have to replace it because that will be a pain. Not sure what the input logic is on that chip. Everything else seems to work except for this stinking coil!

#13 7 years ago

PIA output makes sense. All the other ST signals for the special solenoids come from various PIAs. It's possible that single output failed. I would plan on replacing it or having someone you know replace it for you.

If you don't want to do it yourself or can't find anyone local, I'll remove and install a socket and PIA for the cost of parts and shipping it back to you. Should only be about $4 for parts plus the shipping charges.

#14 7 years ago

Hmmm. Since ST6 is not used, I wonder if I could reroute the trigger and the output from ST5 through ST6? It would definitely prove the issue while I wait for the parts. I think I could just make the swap at the Molex connectors. Basically swapping 10 with 9, 16 with 15 and 22 with 23 on 8J3. Assuming drive 6 works, the right sling should start behaving properly. Am I missing something?

#15 7 years ago

I don't see why that wouldn't work however, I don't follow your pin numbers....

Shouldn't it be:

J13-8 moved to J13-9

J12-8 moved to J13-9

#16 7 years ago

I got the pin numbers from the solenoid schematic in the back of the manual. I was thinking about making the changes in the Molex interconnect between the playfield and the driver board but it may not matter as long as the pins I need to use on the driver board aren't keyed. In any event I think there should be three changes but maybe I'm wrong. Was just hoping I could get this thing working over the weekend. Again, many thanks for your help!

#17 7 years ago

Thinking 2J11 pins 2 and 3 should be swapped.

#18 7 years ago

So I swapped pins 8 and 9 on J12 and J13 and the right sling started working so I'm pretty happy. I couldn't rationalize changing pins 2 and 3 on J11 so I let them be. In any event, my wife can now play Gorgar today and that's what matters. Thank you very much for all of your help. I couldn't have gotten this done without your kind assistance.

#19 7 years ago

Awesome!! Glad you got it working! You might want to put a tag on that connector so that you remember what you changed!

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