(Topic ID: 184178)

Gorgar Solenoid Fuse Burning Out - All Solenoids checked and working


By njpinballfan

2 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 21 posts
  • 8 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by mof
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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#1 2 years ago

I've owned my Gorgar for over 15 years with no problems. About 3 months ago each time we turn the game on the solenoid 2.5 fuse burns out within seconds. I've checked every solenoid and they are working. What should I be looking at now?

#2 2 years ago

Remove the connector for solenoids from the power supply board and see if it still blows. Then you know board issues or out in the game issue.

LTG : )

#3 2 years ago

I would start with a new fuse, verify rating. Install fuse and power up game for no longer than *2 seconds*. Watch and listen for a solenoid firing. Don't forget the outhole and knocker and coin lockout.

#4 2 years ago

LTG - I pulled the connector 2J9 that covers solenoids 9-16, put a new fuse in and turned on the machine and the fuse blew about 20 seconds after which is slower than when its in. I then put 2J9 back in and pulled out 2J11 and the fuse burned out faster. Now I have 2J9 and 2J11 pulled out and the fuse has not burned, but that just shows its a solenoid problem, or is it? Has anyone else had this problem?
Thanks in advance.

#5 2 years ago

Cody, the fuse blows seconds after the game is turned on, usually right when the knocker hits. I checked that solenoid with my OHM meter and it is working.

#6 2 years ago

Disco the knocker and see what happens

#7 2 years ago

Knocker shouldn't be firing on startup.

#8 2 years ago

Cody, you are right about that. If I cut the wires to the knocker will that effect the rest of the solenoids? I'm concerned, this solenoid has two reds attached as well as the blue brown wire.

#9 2 years ago
Quoted from njpinballfan:

Cody, you are right about that. If I cut the wires to the knocker will that effect the rest of the solenoids? I'm concerned, this solenoid has two reds attached as well as the blue brown wire.

Keep any wires that are tied together on the lugs of the coil tied together (i.e. red & red)

#10 2 years ago

Leave the red ones, that's the solenoid buss that is daisy-ed coil to coil. Cut the brown wire and put a wire nut on it until you fix the issue with the driver.

#11 2 years ago

Thanks all, I'll try tonight after work. Can I leave the reds on the solenoid or should I cut them off and tie together?

#12 2 years ago
Quoted from njpinballfan:

Cody, the fuse blows seconds after the game is turned on, usually right when the knocker hits. I checked that solenoid with my OHM meter and it is working.

Based off of this is why I recommended you disco the knocker. I agree the game shouldn't knock at start up, but if you know that knocking is blowing the fuse disco it and see if the fuse doesn't blow? Then you will know what ckt to trace and trouble shoot.

Good luck sounds like you maybe getting closer.

#13 2 years ago

I cut the blue brown wire from the knocker and kept the two reds attached to the coil. It didn't work, burned through the fuse immediately. Should i have disconnected the two reds from the coil? I don't think its the knocker that goes off when I start the machine, its the ball release. I don't think I am tech savoy enough to get this working. One thing that is also happening when the fuse burns is half the display numbers go out. I've attached some pictures of the mechanics of the machine.

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#14 2 years ago

It is kind of hard to tell from the picture, but it sure looks like your driver board is some burnt parts. You have the usual 27 ohm resistors that are burnt, but those only control the featured lamps. I'm concerned about the burn mark under one of the 6821s and it looks like is also torched part of the 40 pin interconnector.

#15 2 years ago

Check this resource.

http://pinballrehab.com/1-articles/solid-state-repair/ss-repair-guides/114-troubleshooting-blown-fuses

1. Make a 2amp fuse breaker
2. Buy a solenoid saver board.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/special-solenoid-saver-board-for-wms-3-7

Now only the fuse will blow for the component that has the issue (all other solenoids will keep working), and the fuse breaker will save you $ on fuses while you solve this.

Mof

#16 2 years ago

Thanks Mof, I ordered the solenoid saver board, its scheduled to arrive on Friday. I'll let you know if it works.

#17 2 years ago

If you have solenoids firing at startup, you may have a problem with the blanking circuit. It disables the solenoids when a game is not started. Try re-seating the 40 pin interboard connector to see if that changes things.

Quoted from njpinballfan:

LTG - I pulled the connector 2J9 that covers solenoids 9-16, put a new fuse in and turned on the machine and the fuse blew about 20 seconds after which is slower than when its in. I then put 2J9 back in and pulled out 2J11 and the fuse burned out faster. Now I have 2J9 and 2J11 pulled out and the fuse has not burned, but that just shows its a solenoid problem, or is it? Has anyone else had this problem?
Thanks in advance.

This just proves it is not a short on the board itself. The problem still could be a shorted transistor on the driver board that leaves one of the solenoids enabled. Do you know how to test transistors? If you do, test all the solenoid transistors with a meter with the board removed or at least the solenoid connectors removed. This will tell you if you have a transistor that has failed ON (shorted).

Also, you can leave the 2 red wires on the knocker coil. With the other coil lead disconnected, the connected red wires should not cause the issue you are seeing.

I would cut the corroded battery socket off your CPU board and check the board to battery acid damage. Install a remote battery holder or NVRAM.

#18 2 years ago

Help!!!!

I received the solenoid saver bridge one day early and installed it, the 2.5sb solenoid fuse still blew, but the fuses on the bridge were fine. My son and I went through everything again and when we disconnect the 2J9 connector the 2.5sb fuse blows. When we disconnected the 2J11 connector (with the 2J9 back in place) the fuse does not blow. I thought the other night it blew under this condition, but it didn't tonight and we left it on. I tested all the solenoids on 2J11 except the magnet relay. That would be both sets of drop targets, the eject hole and ball eject. They all were reading about 4.5 ohms. I do not know how to test the magnet. For one its so far back and the wire connections are facing away I cannot get the multimeter leads to touch. The only other "solenoid" listed on 2J11 is the magnet lamps. How do I test the magnet and/or the magnet lamps to see if there is a short there?

Also, I have a really stupid question (hopefully I don't get a stupid response). Can I use the solenoid saver on 2J11? I wish I could, it seems that would solve the problem. The 2J11 connector doesn't have the same wire lineup as the special solenoid connector.

Any replies tonight would be greatly appreciated!

Schwaggs, thanks for the reply, after I can confirm that its not a solenoid on 2J11 I try your steps, but I don't know how to test transistors. Do I use a multimeter?

Thanks in advance to all.

#19 2 years ago

Can't help you with the Solenoid Saver question, I have never used one.

Good that you figured out which connector was causing the issue! This makes finding the issue easier. You can try this WITH THE POWER OFF! Put one meter lead on the Solenoid power fuse (with a good fuse in place) and measure the resistance to each pin in J11 connector with the connector removed from the board. You are measuring to the pins on the connector, NOT the driver board. This effectively measures the resistance of each solenoid or magnet or flash lamp and all the wiring. If they all measure some resistance above say 4 ohms, I would consider them good.

To test the transistors, you can try this shortcut (not really testing the transistors but it will tell us what we need to know). Again WITH THE POWER OFF. Measure the resistance between ground and each pin on the J11 DRIVER BOARD connector. If any measure close to zero ohms, you found the bad transistor.

#20 2 years ago
Quoted from Schwaggs:

If you have solenoids firing at startup, you may have a problem with the blanking circuit. It disables the solenoids when a game is not started. Try re-seating the 40 pin interboard connector to see if that changes things.

I would cut the corroded battery socket off your CPU board and check the board to battery acid damage. Install a remote battery holder or NVRAM.

UPDATE!

Schwaggs, last night I took off the driver board and re-seated the 40 pin connector and it WORKED!!! I was able to inspect and clean the whole board, something I would never have tried before. No more battery acid anywhere. My next project will be replacing the battery holder, I always wanted to do that an even purchased a new battery holder a couple of years ago. Thank you so much for the info!

GORGAR HURT NO MORE

#21 2 years ago

Hold on a sec -- did you already rebuild the 40-pin? If not, do not pass go, do not collect $100 -- be sure and invest 1-2 hours of your life to getting that done -- it will make everything better.

-mof

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