(Topic ID: 62108)

GORGAR CLUB: Members Only! *THE EVIL PINBALL THAT EATS SOULS*

By Jared

10 years ago


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You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider schwaggs.
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#352 7 years ago

Welcome to the club! Yes, most of the the Gorgar solenoids are on one fuse and most likely your problem. While you are at it, you should pull each fuse and check the correct type (fast blow versus slow blow) and value is installed in each location. You can verify the values that are supposed to be in each spot by looking at the cards in the backbox or by downloading the manual on IPDB http://www.ipdb.org/machine.cgi?id=1062

While you are checking fuses, check the main fuse that is along the left side of the inside cabinet. Make sure the machine is unplugged when checking this one as some power cords are wired up incorrectly and can result in live 120V being present at this fuse, even if the machine is turned off.

It is possible the the slow blow fuse for the solenoids was weak and blew, it is also possible that a problem caused one of the solenoids to lock on. Once you replace the fuse, pay careful attention to the machine when you first turn it on.

Fuses can be found at your local Radio Shack if you still have them. Also some auto parts stores should have them. There are several online retailers that we can point you to if you can't find something.

The reason your machine is starting with 1496 is that the battery backup for the memory is not working. This can be caused by missing batteries, defective/corroded battery holder or less likely a bad memory chip or associated circuitry. In any event, you should install a remote battery holder to protect your boards from battery acid damage in the future. If the existing battery socket is ok, you can get plug in remote battery holders. If your existing battery holder is missing or in rough shape, you can solder one in if you are comfortable soldering.

#353 7 years ago

Anyone know where to get replacement flipper bats for the stock mechanism? None of the usual vendors have them.

Alternatively, anyone know how to retrofit the flipper mech (without replacing the whole thing with a modern flipper mech) to use standard flipper bats? I wonder if you can replace the crank with one of the modern cranks that clamps down on the flipper bat shaft instead of the stock one with the set screws.

1 week later
#355 7 years ago

Does anyone have scans of the Gorgar drop target decals they can send me? If so, please PM me.

I know I can buy them but I have access to high quality decal printer and would rather make my own.

2 months later
#369 7 years ago
Quoted from Travish:

Jason
Hey I got my new Mayfair back glass in and the light board adjusted. My "old" back glass is much better than yours. If you want my old one you can have it.

Mayfair has original or repro backglass? I believe the ones PPS sells are repros but would like an original for mine if they are available.

3 weeks later
#392 7 years ago

I use 91% Isopropal alcohol with magic eraser, works great and hasn't stained anything on the several playfields I have done. Cleaning is key, make sure you are constantly cleaning away the residue and do not let it dry or you will have to hit it again with the magic eraser to loosen the residue. Agree with the others that you need to be careful or you will "erase" through the paint. It is likely you will not be able to get all the ball swirls out of those legs and yellow areas before cutting too deep into the paint.

After ME, I polish with Novus 2 then wax.

I would be concerned the water in glass cleaner could contribute to planking. This is why 91% isopropal is suggested by people.

2 weeks later
#423 7 years ago
Quoted from meSz:

Looking at a Gorgar for someone and notice the Pit is lit up all the time! Can someone explain as to how the Pit area works? Should all the lights behind the Pit be lit up?

Are you talking about the 2 lights behind the pit magnet area or the green playfield inserts leading up to the pit?

If its the lights behind the pit that flash when you hit the pit, those are 89 flashers. They are triggered by a solenoid transistor. If someone installed LED flashers, they will stay lit all the time unless you remove or disconnect the warming resistor (what nocreditdot pointed out). If there are standard bulbs in the sockets, you may have a wiring problem or a shorted driver transistor or pre-driver.

#426 7 years ago
Quoted from meSz:

Can you tell me what driver transistor is used (don't have a manual) as after looking at it I noticed the transistor is broken on the one end right at the transistor but someone attempted to put a glob of solder to make a connection!

Certainly - The pit lights are Solenoid 6 which is driven by transistor Q25.

You can download the manuals from IPDB - http://www.ipdb.org/machine.cgi?id=1062

Some great docs on this site of the System 6 board set that will make it easy to find Q25. These docs were made for Firepower but the boards are the same (except ROM and jumper information): http://www.firepowerpinball.com/

1 month later
#439 6 years ago
Quoted from dsuperbee:

Need some help here! Working on a buddy's gorgar that fried the eject coil. Diode on the coil is bad, and would like to test the assoc. transistors of course, but I don't have a manual, and can't seem to read the location of Q17 on the board. Hoping someone can point me in the right direction!
Fried coil for fun:

Firepowerpinball.com has some great documents for System 6 games, one of which is a rendering of the boards with all their component locations. Not much changed on the driver board over the years so these docs can be used for most Williams games of that era. Here is a link to the driver board doc http://www.firepowerpinball.com/downloads/DriverBoard.pdf

Q17 is the second from the edge below the flipper relay.

1 week later
#443 6 years ago
Quoted from metalkatt:

Can someone tell me what size diode is used on both coils that pop up the drop down targets? Mine are barely readable and I want to replace them. Thank you for your help.

You can use a 1N4004. If you need to buy some, I would get the 1N4007 since it handles much higher voltage and usually costs the same as the 1N4004.

4 weeks later
#454 6 years ago
Quoted from metalkatt:

Yeah, I'm thinking about picking up a pair of those myself.
Anyone with a Rottendog MPU experience two player start sometimes when you press the start button, once? I'm curious why this is and if there is a solution to the "issue"?

This can happen with stock boards too. Fix for me was to clean the contact points and gap the start button switch fairly close (like 1/16").

3 weeks later
#459 6 years ago
Quoted from Enaud:

Gorgar beat me! I'm playing along and noticed that one of the switches isn't registering. So, I go into test mode to test all the playfield switches and I've found that the switch matrix row 8 is out. I've tested at the board and confirmed that all switches are registering except for row 8. I touched pins on 2J2 and 2J3 to eliminate the playfield as being the problem. Definitely at the board.
I've tested R77-R91 and they're good. Also, R196-R210 test good. I reseated socketed chips IC15 and IC17. Still switch matrix row 8 is out. Where do I go from there? I hope someone can guide me in the direction to travel next.
Thanks!

Best way to isolate something like this is with a logic probe. Do you have one?

Since IC15 and IC16 are socketed, try swapping them to see if the problem row moves. If Row 4 (I believe) is now not working, replace the bad 14049. If Row 8 is still out, suspect the socket (carefully inspect pins 9 and 10 on IC 16). If that looks good, suspect the PIA IC11.

#461 6 years ago
Quoted from Enaud:

Bummer. My IC15 is socketed, but not IC16. So, the swap, although would be a good test, isn't going to be possible.
I have an old logic probe, but don't know how to use it. Will have to do some research on it.

Set your logic probe to CMOS, connect it to the 5V supply (can use test points on the CPU and driver board) and probe Row 8 components. Start with IC16 pin 9 and 10. These are the input and output of the Row 8 buffer/inverter. Probe them with a row 8 switch closed. Compare to the signal you see when a switch is not closed. You should see a signal on the input (pin 9) and the opposite signal on the output (pin 10). If you have nothing on the input, you have a wiring problem. If you see nothing on the output, IC16 is bad. If you have signal on the output (pin 10), IC11 is bad.

#463 6 years ago
Quoted from Enaud:

Thanks for the help, Schwaggs! It isn't nearly as intimidating as I thought it would be to test this out. Now I feel better about using the logic probe. I verified the IC16 pin 9 is getting strobed on matrix row 8 switch closures. Pin 10 as well. Followed that on to the input leg on IC11. It's good there as well. So, I'm thinking IC11 is bad. Do you agree with that diagnosis? Also, I tested some other switch rows to verify my readings were consistent.

Sound reasonable to me! Can you replace IC11 yourself? Don't forget to install a socket to make replacing IC11 easier for the next guy.

#465 6 years ago

Well, if you are coming to the northern Atlanta area anytime soon, you are welcome to stop by and I can replace it for you!

3 months later
#480 6 years ago
Quoted from Travish:

No that's normal.

+1 Agreed - Normal

1 month later
#553 6 years ago

Mine was very easy to get to register with solid hits or barely glancing blows.

I don't remember there being a capacitor on the pit switch on mine. I thought it was simply a switch in the switch matrix.

Thorough cleaning of the switch contacts, adjusting it really tight and cleaning/polishing the plunger mechanism is all it should take. The plunger needs to move effortlessly without binding.

#556 6 years ago
Quoted from subruckus:

travish just received the capacitor, thanks a bunch!
Couldn't send this picture in the PM's - just wanted to make sure its going to replace the light blue one seen in my Gorgar now.
Due to my inexperience just thought I should double-check to avoid frying anything thanks!

Those are resistors in that picture. They are the warming resistors for the flash lamps. FYI, if you ever want to install a LED flasher in the pit, you need to remove the "light blue", larger resistor or else the LED will stay lit all the time.

#559 6 years ago
Quoted from subruckus:

Ah okay. Where is the capacitor for the snake pit magnet located? That's what I'm trying to replace. Thanks!

You will have to let Travish or someone else point it out to you. Mine didn't have a capacitor on the pit switch.

Remove the plastic above the pit area and look at the switch that is behind the pit switch above the playfield.

#561 6 years ago
Quoted from Mank:

That's so funny. I just talked to a friend about this very thing this morning. My larger resistor is fried. The incandescent flasher still works in the Pit which I was a little surprised. I got a replacement resistor but put LEDs in the playfield and GI. I just got LED flashers, and remembered something about having to disconnect that resistor to allow the LED Pit flasher to work. I guess I won't solder in the resistor after all...just swap out the incandescent flasher for the LED flasher and I should be good. Fingers crossed.

Cool! The warming resistor is there to warm up the incandescent filament to make the bulb flash brighter and last longer. It will still flash without it. As you said, no need to replace it if you are installing LED flashers!

#562 6 years ago
Quoted from subruckus:

Ok odd mine doesn't have one behind the switch either...

Well, since you have it apart, clean the contacts on the switch, clean the plunger and mounting bracket to ensure it operates smoothly and adjust the contact points so the leaf closest to the plunger is just touching the plunger and the other contact is gaped really tight (1/16 of an inch or so).

#564 6 years ago

I think it is just a natural part of the game and the technology used in that era. My game did the same, fast hits sometimes escaped the magnet. Since they used the switch matrix for the Pit switch, the CPU has to recognize the hit, then turn on the solenoid. It seems this takes too long for fast hits in this situation.

It is also why the slings and pops don't work the same way. The switches directly (not in the switch matrix) turn on the solenoid transistor on those eliminating the relatively long switch matrix/CPU processing time. This also nessecitates dual switches on those items, one to activate them (not in the switch matrix) and one to score the hit (this one is in the switch matrix).

#568 6 years ago
Quoted from subruckus:

My issues with Gorgar continue... My sound had been off and on for a while, then after resoldering the cabinet pot it was working fine until a few days ago. So I bought a replacement pot, and just put that in. Unforunately that's not the culprit - the speaker hum gets softer/louder so I know the new pot is in and working fine.
I've attached some pictures of the sound board, where should I look for issues? The red and black audio wires seem to be seated fine. Any input would be great,
Thanks in advance!

Couple things:

Reflow solder on the sound board header pins (all of them).

Check the balance pot on the voice card. Move it from limit to limit several times and settle it somewhere in the middle.

#571 6 years ago
Quoted from subruckus:

Messing with the voice card pot helped. Now works 80% of the time. As I have no clue how to reflow solder I might just settle for this or ask a friend to do it. Thanks for the advice.

If you can solder a new volume pot in, you can reflow solder on the header pins. All you do is heat up each pin and add a little fresh solder. I usually try and make sure the header pin is hot enough to melt solder by putting the new solder on the header pin.

#582 6 years ago
Quoted from subruckus:

Thanks for the advice y'all! Had a minor heart attack the whole time I was soldering, but the sound's been working for the last hour with no fail! Stoked! Appreciate the advice on where to look.

Awesome! Congrats on the fix!

2 months later
#683 6 years ago
Quoted from sparksterz:

I don't even know if I can handle one! This will be my first playfield swap when I get to it. My machine could really use it though...keep finding more issues with mine. Got Cliffy's new flipper guides and got my flippers aligned; only to find out that the holes in my playfield won't hold the rails in place securely and after a game or two of bliss the rail has loosened from where it should be

Jam a toothpick with some wood glue into the PF hole and break it off flush with the PF, reinstall the screw. This should tighten it up.

2 months later
#708 5 years ago
Quoted from pinballcorpse:

What suddenly failed?

Sound board CPU or ROM sockets.

Cold solder joint on sound card or driver board.

Bad wiring connector on sound card or driver board.

2 months later
#744 5 years ago
Quoted from statictrance:

ok - so I'm starting to tear into this Gorgar and I have a question on the Flash Lamp circuit...
I see there's a 2 Watt 330 Ohm resistor and a 1/2 Watt 1 Ohm Resistor. Can anyone advise which is the must have and which is the cut to enable LED lamps? I'm gonna stick green flashers in there, but right now Incandescent or LED aren't working. I opened it up and found the 2 watt one totally torched in half - but the board looks clean, no damage, and transistor measures correctly.
I want to confirm i'm doing the under the hood right first before I start screwing with the driver board since other than this and the knocker - everything else has been totally clean.

The 330 ohm is whats called the warming resistor - it keeps the bulb element warm so it flashes sharper and the element lasts longer.

The smaller resistor is in series with the lamp to limit the current through the bulb.

Both lamp sockets are in series too. Meaning you need to populate both sockets and they both need to make good connection with the lamps or nothing will work.

With the warming resistor in place, the LED should be lit all the time (assuming the sockets are wired up properly). Since they don't light all the time with the warming resistor in place, look at your sockets and wiring.

Once you get that resolved, cut the larger resistor out to get the LEDs to turn off and light only when the solenoid fires.

#746 5 years ago
Quoted from sparksterz:

Hmm, I was just playing my Gorgar earlier today and was having a frankly bad game, only for it to become a bit worse...I played my first 2 balls poorly, but when the pinball hit the drain, my ball never kicked back out, all the displays went out simultaneously, but the heart beat was still playing.
I assume it's probably time to rebuild the power supply board, but figured I'd check in first. I didn't see any burnt components or blown fuses, so it would seem to me some things are getting power and others aren't. I turn the machine off and on again and I have some lights on the back box and play field, but starting or coining up don't do a damn thing.

Hard to say what the real issue is but I can tell you the reason the sound kept playing is the sound board has it's own power supply.

#750 5 years ago
Quoted from statictrance:

Any idea if I need to worry about Polarization with these Sys 6 lamp sockets?

With LEDs, polarization is important. Some sockets on these older games have been know to be wired backwards. Doesn't matter for incandescent bulbs but does for LEDs.

Positive side of the circuit needs to be wired to the tip of the socket, negative side wired to the outer part of the socket. For the wire between the sockets, one end will be wired to the tip and the other end to the outer part.

3 weeks later
#788 5 years ago
Quoted from WinstonH:

Okay, so brief history: I bought my machine and it didn't work. It had what I heard was a ram error msg (1496 1)on the player one display with 04/00 on the plays and match display. We removed the AA battery unit and put in a non-mounted one. We also took the left ram chop and switched it with the right and Gorgar would introduce himself and the flippers would work, some playfield lights would turn on, displays would reset. Once, the ball even loaded too but the bumpers weren't responsive and everything was dead otherwise. So I ordered new RAM and installed the chips and I ended up back to square one with the original error msg. After trying to turn on/off quickly a few times with coin door open, the error msg disappeared, displays are blank, playfield lights stopped lighting, and Gorgar lost his voice. I removed the 2boards thinking I would get them rebuilt/replaced but thought I'd ask you folks if that was a sound plan or should I try something else first? Also, I'm a total, non computer/electronics nerd and so I'm trying to learn but Im not at all familiar with stuff. I'm including a pic of the boards because I think the Ram slot might be installed upside down but not sure if that would make a difference. Any advice?
[quoted image][quoted image]

The RAM chips you removed are for the CPU to run the program, NOT where the settings are stored. Those RAMs are 6810 RAM and not the cause of the 1496 message which is not really an error message, it is the game number (tells you what ROMS are running on the CPU) and indicate that the settings and audits have been lost. This usually happens when the batteries die or in rare instances, when the CMOS RAM chip has gone bad.

The RAM that stores the settings and audits is the 5101 chip directly to the right of the RAM chips your removed and socketed. Since you replaced the battery holder, make sure that is all working by measuring the battery voltage at pin 22 on the 5101 with the game off. You should see around 4 volts there. If you don't, check your battery holder connections. Make sure the wires go through the board at the pads where you soldered the remote battery holder wires to the board. If there isn't connectivity through the board at those places, you can run into problems like you are seeing.

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