I dunno, if you're trying to reduce BOM you don't replace wire guides with laser etched metal. That's an entirely avoidable expense to save some money per game. Nobody would ever know they weren't there.

I think with GF you're just not seeing where some of the money went as easily. That laser etching isn't really visible in a playfield photo. All those diverter mechs are a cost you don't see. They made a decision to invest in things a certain way that's hidden.

I don't really disagree with the crowd that says "more toys!". Diverters might be mechanical but if they're hidden and not really player controlled it's not as satisfying as interacting with something out in the open.

Mind you I don't think *any* pinball is worth twelve thousand dollars. So I'm not defending their pricing, just saying that the costs on this one are maybe not as obvious.

I played it on location and I have to say.. super fun!! Smooth flow, great, satisfying shots that kept me guessing where the heck they were going to pop back out of (if you've played it you will know what I'm talking about). The playfield just looks so rich, like an old Bally/Williams game, I played a few Sterns and while fun they don't have the luxurious look and feel the JJP's have. And to be clear, I'm a Stern and JJP fan, regardless of anything I feel about prices (that's a whole other subject).

I'm very happy that I got my Godfather on order early!! Definitely no regrets! Will be nice to have this at home where I can hear all the call outs!

I think this game will make most people happy (considering that no machine ever seems to).

Will be curious to hear everyone elses reviews as they get to play this.

$12k Canadian is only ~$8700 USD. Where's our Canadian pinball company?

Let me introduce you to Punny Factory

I knew this was coming. Does not count.

Just, no.

100% agree.

I played an LE on location at Reboot Dunedin (FL) today, and really enjoyed it!! Wish I would have brought my headphones so I could hear it better as I think that makes a difference in overall enjoyment of a game (and one of the reasons I hate on-location sometimes). But I could hear things sometimes.

Stepping up to it at first I was blown away after seeing all the pics and gameplay videos.. I feel the game presents better in person than it does in pictures/videos. It certainly looks and feels more premium than Sterns, gameplay and code aside (my opinion ). I loved the gameplay and flow, was super satisfying to play in person no doubt. I own a GNR, and the multiballs are NOT as prevalent in Godfather.. sure you still get them, but to me it's not the same as the (relatively speaking) constant surprise multiballs of GNR.

The multi-pluge skill shots may be one of the best plunges in recent times.. the second skill shot is the toughest and very satisfying to me.

The diverters really keep you on your toes, it was hard to tell where the ball was going to pop out next because it's constantly changing.. I found that engaging. The full plunge that brings the ball around to the third flipper and any balls traveling that specific path (past the third flipper and down) led to 90% SDTM drains which was beyond frustrating. If you didn't pay close attention during multiballs the balls would launch straight around and right down the middle between the flippers, so holding the right flipper and/or keeping an eye on it was prudent. On top of that, with the changing diverters you never knew if it was going to be coming back down that path (to the SDTM) or somewhere else. Overall it wasn't a big issue, but I would hope to fix this on my machine via leveling or other means.

I found the compound lock to be a tougher shot to hit, but once in my collection or with some practice I think it will be a satisfying and easier shot to hit. Speaking of the compound lock, we did have several hangups in the compound lock and had to get a tech to bend the front target back so the balls would release... hopefully this doesn't become a problem for on-location machines (see video). I also thought the third flipper was underpowered in the games I played, but that will be an easy fix in the menu.

I have an LE on order and am happy with my decision so far. I think the code is deep enough for a new release machine and it will be fun to work my way through it.

Here's the video of the compound ball failure..

What does the life meter on the bottom left do?

You have Bond too?

You're also telling this to a man that had the gaul to refer to the the landing area as a toy.

Spot on my man. Literal cornucopia of selection right now. Best time I’ve ever seen in pinball. I’ve never gotten to be so choosy or excited (or deflated!) on so many nib selections.

Got a chance to play at the Reboot Arcade in Dunedin.

I really was not expecting much and it didn't seem that exciting from photos. But Wow. This game was super fun!

Yes, It's multiball heavy ~ I would say 80% of gametime was in a multiball for the beginning half of games ~ but it shot very well.

Shots were decently tight but pretty easy to hit once dialed in but what had me the most excited was never knowing where the ball was going to come from.

I could hit the same ramp or shot 3 times and have no clue where the ball would pop out next. And often it would come barreling down the middle or screaming down the ramp and bounced quickly over the flipper. You need to be ready to guard that middle or you'll drain quick. Outlanes were easy to save.

The flippers! Idk if this location beefed up the flippers or if they came stock like this but they were the snappiest JJP flippers I've ever seen. Made the game play fast and exciting.

Super impressed

CFCC0999-BE78-4262-BD0A-105359EC7AE5 (resized).jpeg

Hey, I was here earlier today as well! Probably around the same time haha

Great write up. And yeah, the mirad ball paths was so much more baffling in person. It's hard to conceptualize that many different paths until you actually play it and have no clue where the ball will go next.

Is there a headphone jack on the front of this game? If so, next time I play on location I will bring some headphones so I can hear it.

I just find it interesting that JJP is bricking a feature that is fun and works like Scorbit but then continues to use a product that fail like Mirco playfields

I'm very curious to see how this gimmick ages. It sounds like once you're used to it you can use the lighting to see the path, but that's not going to be a lot of advance notice.

I think the question is will there be a point where you can start to control/predict it, or will it feel essentially random most of the time?

Comment deleted. I just read the Scorbit announcement

Scorbit announcement?

Think the TS4 PFs have been solid?

My GNRCE and WonkaCE PFs have not experienced any issues.

I get why people would be pissed if they did though.

I still remember the GB pf fiasco from Stern. Have some minor ghosting on two small inserts, no big deal. Others had major chipping.

My GNRCE had the worst blistering of any pin.
Wonka CE has a small amount but I've got a backup playfield/plastics/mylars. It's manageable.

My Lebowski has it too, one post so far which I did the iron/mylar fix on.

I am growing very tired of Mirco playfields.

Good point.

I agree that there is probably more hidden expenses in this game compared to others, it still seems a little light if I compare it to WOZ, POTC and GNR.
Doesn't mean it's not super fun.

Yeah, I probably should have compared pricing of the GF LE to the FF LE to be more apples to apples but wanted to be more conservative and go with the highest offering and the full featured lower range from each company.

Email Rick@PPS as he’s taking pics and responses for Mirco from another thread.

Like with any game, I'm sure you'll get to know what causes all the shots to go where. But the sheer number of different options from each "Starting point" will force you to be on your toes even if you have them all memorized. So many game are "I hit the right ramo so I know it'll feed left flipper and I just hold it up to bump to right flipper" rinse and repeat ad infinitum.

With this game Especially, because some of the options whip the ball straight to the middle if you don't react in time (The ramp to r flipper and inner loop especially (Both easy to avoid the sdtm path by holding left or right flipper respectively)) you have to both know the shot and react quickly enough to which route the ball with take. I have a feeling it will keep the player engaged... or else. haha

This shit will break you eventually. I love the look and play of Godfather. The CE looks amazeballs.Unfortunately for us I do not care how good anything Mirco is, we are out. Distros need to address that pooling and chipping garbage and put the pressure back on Mirco to supply replacement playfields.

Yes, but unlike WoZ and Hobbit, Lawlor decided putting it at your knees was a good idea. It's been there ever since. Look in the lower left of the cabinet if you're wired. If you're BT wireless headphones and NOT Apple airpods (don't work prior to GF, not sure if they do now) you can use the flipper buttons (hold) to access the pairing menu.

I get the idea, but it doesn't work because JJP's highest offering is way above Stern's highest offering. So you have to go on comparable features for a matchup level, and even then JJP is way above Stern for BoM and features.

This concerns me a little but I can't imagine it would have made it into the design like that. I'm optimistic that the games might just need a level or some kind of other minor adjustment. I even drew a pic with a line coming down that metal ball guide and flush with the flipper rubber to show the expected ball path and it looks like it's supposed to land on the left flipper to me.
GF_CE_playfield-STDM (resized).jpg

If you look at the line drawn there is a flipper on the left side. The angle of this flipper resting seems to divert the ball's path sdtm BUT Flipping to hit either right path or just holding this upper flipper up would prevent the stdm - The trick is being ready for it or reacting quickly enough.

Same for the quick bounce back that happens coming down the right wireform to right flipper (Comes down and bounces off the multiplier target remarkably fast). It's as simple as holding up the flipper or being ready to react quickly but if you aren't paying attention it's drained before you know it.

Yep, I agree with you there, and I'll likely be trying to work that upper left flipper as much as possible. But for times when that upper flipper is not used to manipulate a ball path, I'm certainly expecting it to land on that lower left flipper. If it doesn't, I'll be making some adjustments.

I really like how that's implemented into the game. I think it should feel like you're dodging bullets and fighting for your life when playing this game.

Hmmmm this may have made my night.

I unexpectedly got a chance to play GF LE this evening. It's an interesting game and most of the secrets are out, but I'll still give my two cents. The flippers are better than my GNR LE, it's great eye candy, the multiballs are a little bit less annoying but not by a lot from my brief experience, and the diverters truly keep you guessing. I rarely knew where the ball was coming from or what locked a ball until near the end of my play. That said, I didn't feel like I was playing a God Father game. It felt very mafia generic, and I was so concentrating on the playfield that I couldn't watch the screen to see what was showing until my final drain where I saw tons of God Father graphics on the display. The back machine gun wielding sculpt that many have complained about doesn't bother me at all, in fact, I think he's kind of cool. The game I played was shockingly fast, particularly the right inlane which gets some sort of Rocket Racoon boost to rush past flippers before you can react, to keep you on your toes. So, I'm torn on the game experience. I built up my expectations so that I expected more, but I can't fault it for the way they had to make it and I do like it more than most games. I just don't think it's worth the price. Maybe if it were available at Scooby prices, maybe. Should the prices catastrophically drop in a year or so, and yes, I think they will drop a lot, kind of like GNR, I think I might reach out for the gold CE model to put next to my bar, just to shockingly bling it out.

Now, if I could only figure out how to give my GNR LE snappy flippers like on GF, I'd be very happy.

No doubt JJP games have the bling and eye candy. I first saw GNR- thought that was the ultimate game, which it is esthetically. Both my son and I own one (LE). He has also has WW and DI at his house and I have his TS4 at my house. I also have many Stern Spike 2 machines, Spookies, American pinballs, and an Alien.

The biggest BOM unfortunately does not make the best games. Wish that was so- I would buy all and only JJP games.

Currently I prefer almost all of my other games to GNR. That game is amazing and beautiful, but the code is rather linear (for high score) and becomes monotonous. Lastability is not a strong suit. Many LE versions are for sale at a 10% loss or so. I’m still keeping my game- still intrigues me and is different from the rest. The other JJP games are good (really like Wonka), but do not get the amount of play of the Sterns and others.

Godfather? Looks gorgeous. I watched Karl D work his magic- some tough shots. After 10 minutes of watching I tired of the music. Animations were great. The shots were fine.

So no FOMO here- I will wait for a year or two to get some time on this with game play and then make my decision for purchase. 1000 CE’s and (?) 5000 LE’s- should be able to find one.

I am also pissed at JJ for dumping Scorbit. Internet connection is vital for pinball future.

Oh well- congrats to you all that have already ordered your GF games. You will probably really enjoy them which is what it is all about.

I'm not advocating for JJP over Stern (or CGC, or AP, etc). I'm merely trying to keep the feature comparisons to the same levels.

GnR still does it for me because I have limited time to play for fun and I can walk up and have a great 30 minutes listening to music I like with fantastic light shows and OCCASIONALLY get a great jackpot I actually collect. It's enough for me. Literally every other pin has gone and GnR still stands.

The only reason GnR prices are down is because JJP hasn't finished the game and it still has bugs and balance issues. When the new code finally, eventually shows up, I expect that will correct itself. jjPotC have been going for 2x their initial price, so pointing to GnR as a "JJP lose value" is not really accurate. Some lose, some gain, some stay about the same. They hold their value way better than, say, Spooky by far.

I've brought in every cornerstone Stern for the past 8 years (and one SLE) except the 60th cash grab, and every JJP ever, so there's no purchase bias here.

That may be part of it, but I think sloppy flippers and unrelenting multiballs are also a part of it. I still own mine, but the spongy flippers and constant multiballs keep me from ever getting far enough to worry about bugs and balance issues. Otherwise, I agree that it's a magnificent game.

Both these GnR complaints are fixable right now.

Flippers feel fine once they're cooled and the power bumped up a couple notches.
Unrelenting multiballs (and other complaints) are addressed by making the menu changes in Eskaybee's post. Fixes it almost completely and makes the game more enjoyable overall.

I just played my first game at the IO Arcade Bar in Madison, Wi and I got the SDTM shots along with the others that played with me. We had 4 players and all SDTM shots. It must have been set up in tournament mode cause no matter how quick it went down the middle it was the end of the ball... We all walked away from it bummed after one game and didn't go back.

I'm going to go back and play a couple games by myself tomorrow and see if I can change my opinion or talk to someone who could make sure the set up is correct.

I hear the new American pin is built like a tank.

They just need to activate a ball save if the ball goes STDM with no switch hit after a feed to the upper left flipper. Hope they do this before too many people give up on the game.

That and stdm from caporegime - the pre-spin before dropping the smart drop doesn't always work.

Being a double game owner of JJP'S, I was pretty irked to read about Scorbit being removed today.

No announcement from JJP today, but Scorbit made an announcement. (Side note, did JJP even officially send off Pat Lawlor?)

This stood out to me regarding GF.

https://scorbit.io/service-interruption-to-jersey-jack-customers/

Q: What drove this decision by Jersey Jack to abandon Scorbit?

A: It’s not entirely clear. We know that in our conversations with JJP up until the launch of The Godfather, we had support from within the game design team. Scorbit was included in the marketing documentation for The Godfather. We were surprised when we were told by the leadership they did not value Scorbit features or connected pinball in early March.

I realize there's two sides to every story, and I'd love to hear JJP's, (Which I'd be surprised if that occurred.) but after how they fired Butch in a disrespectful way, let go of LTG, this situation now, among other things.....just WTF JJP???

How a company is managed means just as much on the inside closed doors as it does publicly. Decisions made have a way of trickling down to street level. Seems personal or ‘off the cuff’ decisions are in affect up top regardless of long term viability or customer input?

Who in the pinball world with even a passing knowledge of pinball thought the answer to increasing excitement is constant, meaningless multiballs? Someone mentioned it above (probably many people did), when I started playing pinball, TAF had just come out. Locking balls, watching Thing take them, and then shooting that electric chair scoop was a big deal. You got a little breather while the lightning storm started, the music intensified, and then…SHOWTIME! I remember actually feeling proud, like other people nearby knew you had just done something big on TAF. Getting more than one ball should be a game/pace changing reward. It shouldn’t be a sure thing every game, and certainly not every ball. Pinbot and Dr. Who have two locks up the middle to complete. TOTAN has 3 lock lanes to stack 2 balls before you shoot the genie and whoosh! Down goes your ball! TZ has huge jackpots for multiball and Powerball multiball. Fish Tales has a dramatic lightning storm on the lake, with a frenetic multiball challenge to re-lock balls for big jackpots. The Shadow grabs your ball and throws it back into a lock, with dramatic animation for mb. BSD has 3 distinct multiball modes, each adding to the value of the other. Who can forget midnight on Funhouse? Put Rudy to sleep, and shoot the ball into his sleeping mouth, gulp! Blahhh! Multiball! Hell, even Junkyard has a cool animation to start multiball in dramatic fashion. It’s been a major goal and tool to achieve jackpots for decades. But pinball bigwigs decided what we really want is simply 6 balls in play most of the time, hitting random targets all over the playfield until we get back down to one ball. Maybe that’s the new thinking, how to escape multiball and keep just one ball in play and under control, before chaos resumes? I agree with the others on this one, too much of anything is too much.

What you call a gimmick , I call brilliant design .

At some point, achieving multiball changed from being the main goal in the game to being a means of advancing in the game. Using multiball to destroy saucers in AFM comes to mind. Though I suspect just achieving multiball on AFM might feel like an accomplishment to a novice.

It seems like prioritizing the strategic use of multiball and stacking for advanced players while still giving the excitement of multball to beginners is the goal of game designers these days.
My wife says she didn't like multiball when she first started because it was too chaotic. Now she likes it even though she doesn't use it strategically.

My only JJP I’ve had was a Dialed In and it definitely wasn’t multiball heavy (though it had some of the best multiballs ever imo). I also get multiballs more often on my JP than I did on DI. Can’t comment on the other jjp’s but I’m totally in for a GF LE and lol @ the haters… can totally see this game flying to the #1 spot. Total disrupter pin.

I’m in on TG LE. I owned DILE twice and love that game. WOZ was my first ever. GNR was notably very heavy on multiballs, and many people complained of feeling like you are always in multiball. Some early reports of TG above sound similar. I have Godzilla too, and I personally find it too heavy on multiball modes, with several starting in a single game. I’m hoping TG code is thoughtful and the mb modes aren’t so frequent as to minimize the excitement. Like all things pinball, some people may enjoy frequent multiball modes. I tend to gravitate toward the WPC era, when achieving mb was itself a big deal. I got my final invoice balance due notice, so my TG should arrive in a couple weeks or less, hopefully!

Guess it’s up to Steve Richie to save JJP.

All these JJP pins have left to separate themselves is the bigger screen. There is no longer a playfield difference. Why spend more for a machine that does not have more? Godfather is a lessor theme, again, and with less in it, again. A real shame to see JJP go down like this. Games like WOZ, POTC, Wonka. I thought their go to market was to be the best? Instead, they now make middle of the road themes with much less included, lower build quality and lessor support for 12k. Chicago gaming pin with way better quality for 8k or 9k? Or a stern with insider connected and still cheaper? And now Scorbid going away at JJP.