(Topic ID: 293976)

GNRCE Playfield issues!

By Skyemont

2 years ago


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  • 878 posts
  • 203 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by leonml
  • Topic is favorited by 36 Pinsiders

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    Topic poll

    “GNRCE Playfield issues!”

    • No issues 34 votes
      30%
    • A few issues but I can deal with it 15 votes
      13%
    • I need a new playfield 63 votes
      56%

    (112 votes)

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    Topic index (key posts)

    6 key posts have been marked in this topic

    Display key post list sorted by: Post date | Keypost summary | User name

    Post #5 HEP identifies the issue immediatly. Posted by High_End_Pins (2 years ago)

    Post #96 Myth about outlawed chemicals Posted by High_End_Pins (2 years ago)

    Post #173 Mirco clearcoat & post tests Posted by High_End_Pins (2 years ago)

    Post #726 HEP comment on the two easy to see direct issues. Posted by High_End_Pins (2 years ago)

    Post #807 Reminder of thread purpose. Posted by Skyemont (2 years ago)


    Topic indices are generated from key posts and maintained by Pinside Editors. For more information, or to become an editor yourself read this post!

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    #47 2 years ago
    Quoted from extraballingtmc:

    This is some bs right here. Months ago the word was the ce was going to have different play fields that were better, even the newest run of les supposed to be better. Sadly it appears they are worse than ever.
    Unfortunately with people paying 20-35k for faulty pirates and 20k for gnrce jjp has little to no motivation to do anything about it. What happens when a group of investors runs a pinball company

    I think the problem is, if you listened to Mirco he changed his clearcoat process. Blaming the clearcoat was and for some reason continues to be what many people blame for this problem, but I think its the digital printing. People who know way more than me and I have a lot of respect for seem to think the same thing. So Mirco could be using the worlds strongest and most durable clearcoat but that just is not going to matter when the material the clearcoat is bonded to (the printed ink) is lifting off the wood. Early Jurassic parks were having this problem and so were past spooky games. They removed the art around the posts and the problem is mostly solved.

    Quoted from ThePinballCo-op:

    OP, is it because their assembly line workers are clamping down too hard on the playfield?

    I see this tossed around a lot too. If OP's washer picture is to be believed they certainly are going WAAAY harder than they should. However, I still don't believe this is the main issue. It is, however, AN issue. It would absolutely blow my mind to learn that JJP is not using tools calibrated to only go to certain peak torque levels when they are assembling these games, but then again they are continuing to do a lot of things that blow my mind, so I guess I shouldn't be shocked.

    #59 2 years ago
    Quoted from Dr-pin:

    The printing not adhering to the pf cant explain why the clearcoating is soft as peanutbutter.

    Can you give me some examples of this "soft as peanut butter" clearcoat? I have yet to see that particular issue.

    #159 2 years ago
    Quoted from Dr-pin:

    On most photos you can see the clear rising above the post and/or washer. = soft.
    Btw i have clearcoat in my garage, where i park cars with spiked tires in the winter. Not a mark.
    If it was mirco clearcoat, i would have clearcoat slimes all the way to the motorway.

    This is incorrect and exactly what I was talking about in my original post. To use your garage floor example, (thats probably an epoxy btw) picture if you had paint on your garage floor that wasn't adhered to the concrete well. Then you put your garage coating over that paint. The epoxy coating is going to lift up and bubble because its only adhered to the paint substrate which itself is not adhered well to the concrete. Another example is if you've ever seen a car that had a flaw or rust under the paint. You'll see those little bubbles start to form under the paint and the clearcoat. The clear is still hard.

    The main problem here is not "soft clearcoat" and that myth really needs to go away.

    #279 2 years ago
    Quoted from Asael:

    That makes it all even worse. If there was testing, they should have found that there is a problem. There is chipping after just a few games on some machines. To ignore it and to lie about it is committing a knowledgeable fraud.

    Actually Mirco is pretty well known for doing exactly that when any of his playfields have problems. There is a thread dedicated to this on the forum.

    Quoted from Asael:

    That would be really interesting to see.
    Mirco demonstrated in the 2020 Expo stream how his playfields would hold up when you over-thighten a playfield post on his playfields. And after seeing this I was convinced that he has solved the problems, he said in this stream that every playfield that he delivered to pinball factories would hold up in this quality.

    Yes the GNR PF's are using this new Clearcoat but if the clear isn't really the problem then it doesn't matter how good it is.

    Quoted from cooked71:

    I thought JJP made a big deal early on in GNR production that Mirco had fixed the playfield problems going forward and to prove the point, Mirco had installed a special "test point" to verify quality of individual playfields.
    I know the test point is there. Is it not being used?
    Was there any change to the Mirco process at all?
    The whole thing just sounds like it was BS - Mirco put in the test point to make everyone happy, but did f*ck all to fix the underlying problems.

    Its being used but its on an area without art I believe. The effected areas all have printing underneath.

    Quoted from Chisox:

    Yeah the Spooky playfields really have me scratching my head because, even though I remember a couple of hiccups during TNA (that’s what she said?), their playfields are sooo much better than every other I’ve had. My ACNC and R&M have like 4 dimples combined after hundreds of play each.

    JJP used the same company to make the first run of WOZ playfields and they had major issues. Must have burned that bridge, which is too bad because they seem to have gotten it right now.

    #292 2 years ago
    Quoted from ShrimpPimp:

    We were lucky enough to secure a G&R CE with a serial number in the 90's range. We took delivery the last week of February and as of today have nearly 2,000 games played. It is one of our favorite games to play, and it probably helps that my wife and I are big G&R fans.
    I've followed this thread and the other G&R threads to learn about tweaks and issues. I removed my glass this morning and went over the playfield with a flash light. The ONLY blemish I could find regarding pooling, lifting or chipping was around this post to the left of the scoop. I already have the 3/4" clear washers mentioned above and I'm hoping that installing one will prevent further chipping as the arrows point out.
    I guess I should feel lucky that there is not more damage with so many hours on the game. Maybe it's possible that some of the pooling issues and worse seen by others won't creep up in my machine?
    My wife and I are fairly new to the hobby but we play every night and enjoy our games. Just like the hot rodded 48' Chevy in my profile pic that gets driven everywhere. We're both nearly 50 and while I love having nice shiny toys, I know that with use you will get some minor dings and bump ups here and there. I have friends with hot rods they never drive and guys who have guns which are "safe queens" and never get shot. These friends who never really utilize or enjoy their possessions puzzle me. That would be similar to me telling friends not to play my G&R because "I wanna keep total plays low for possible future re-sale value." For me unless I hate the game, if I buy a pin and love it I will probably keep it forever and put it in my will.
    So if there are documented issues with the manufacturing process as pointed out it seems the entire playfield could be compromised. However in MY case is it possible that what you see in the photo is normal wear and tear from 2,000 plays? Could it be similar to dings in your paint from driving your car normally?
    I'm hoping it's attributed to normal wear and tear because I would hate to think that over the next couple years every high impact post will start to look like this one. People have a right to be frustrated and upset for the amount of money we spend on these games. I totally get it. In my case though I will play the game until the legs fall off because the overall experience for me exceeds the worry of a couple clear disks on the playfield that you don't see with the light shows going full blast.
    I've been a lurker for months but just wanted to post my SN range and pics so the OP can cross reference his experiences with one more.
    [quoted image][quoted image]

    I'm with you man, I think toys should be enjoyed! The pinball machine won't be pristine forever, but that is not normal wear and tear. That looks like a nice paint job on your hot rod. If it started flaking off after 10,000 miles would you consider that normal wear and tear? I think most of us have somewhat realistic expectations with our games, giant chunks of playfield chipping off is not one of them.

    #342 2 years ago

    Pretty sure in one of the other bad PF threads at least one person did agree to the buyback but JJP never followed through. Its all a rouse by them. Its a bullshit solution anyway.

    #435 2 years ago
    Quoted from JodyG:

    Maybe JJP should consider undermounting that post through a close fitting hole in the PF. Here is what I am thinking-
    This does not fix the crappy clear issue, but its one of the most beat up posts in a game, and would make long term sense to look into doing something differently. [quoted image]

    Even if this idea worked, sometimes theres just simply not room to mount it under the playfield. You might have parts for a light, a mech, another post, ect potentially in the way. You might be able to do it in some areas, but sometimes you just need a post and something else in the same area and the under playfield real estate is just not available.

    #492 2 years ago

    I think you should be more worried/mad about deeproot. Also their games are showing pooling in the pictures too.

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