Most of us are older, how many BJs can we receive
Quoted from Skyemont:I called 5 times today. Can’t reach Barry. Probably told not to answer the damn phone.
Barry's a good dude. Honestly his hair was probably on fire before this playfield stuff exploded. He had plenty of time to chat at length while at AP. I'm sure JJP workday jacked to 11 was a shock.
Quoted from Skyemont:I called 5 times today. Can’t reach Barry. Probably told not to answer the damn phone.
So much of this hobby feels like such an amatuer backyard operation sometimes. The irony is that the real amatuer backyard elements of it are usually more professional than the big "professional" players.
Quoted from PinMonk:Barry's a good dude. Honestly his hair was probably on fire before this playfield stuff exploded. He had plenty of time to chat at length while at AP. I'm sure JJP workday jacked to 11 was a shock.
Barry had taken care of me 2-3 times when he was at AP w/my Houdini, and I always enjoyed talking to him at a few shows I attended - always personable and was an asset to AP.
I'd hate to be in his shoes now, can't imagine the crap he has to put up with daily. And I no doubt his hands are tied w/respect to the PF issues. A 'no win' for him.
Quoted from mbwalker:Barry had taken care of me 2-3 times when he was at AP w/my Houdini, and I always enjoyed talking to him at a few shows I attended - always personable and was an asset to AP.
I'd hate to be in his shoes now, can't imagine the crap he has to put up with daily. And I no doubt his hands are tied w/respect to the PF issues. A 'no win' for him.
Yep, Barry's a cool dude. Cares about pinball. None of this is his fault. If you must blame, blame JJPs current Dread Pirate Roberts. THAT is where this idiotic policy change is coming from.
Quoted from PinMonk:Barry's a good dude. Honestly his hair was probably on fire before this playfield stuff exploded. He had plenty of time to chat at length while at AP. I'm sure JJP workday jacked to 11 was a shock.
Yeah, people need to be careful about blaming the employees who are stuck in the middle. I worked in quality for a while.... when there are problems it is the worst job in the world. I would get screamed at by customers over things that were 100% outside of my sphere of influence *and* I would have upper management screaming at me *not to tell the customer anything* It sucked... and yes.. I eventually found a new job, but it's not so easy to just up and quit when you are in highly trained in a relatively small industry.
So maybe Barry is the ringleader of all of this, but more than likely, he is just the guy who is taking a large brunt of the anger and nothing would make him happier than to find an answer that makes the customers happy.
I think it's someone named Marcy @JJP that could help, not the infantry. That's what someone told me.
Quoted from zr11990:Most of us are older, how many BJs can we receive
Even a bad blow job is a good one. Really can’t lose here
JJP will not return my emails about pooling on my GnR CE. My distributor reached to them and they are not willing to do anything. So I offered to buy another playfield so I could get it cleared myself. They will not even sell me a playfield. I can not believe this is happening.
Quoted from thechakapakuni:Even a bad blow job is a good one. Really can’t lose here
Unless it raises a blister...
Quoted from Jecco74:JJP will not return my emails about pooling on my GnR CE. My distributor reached to them and they are not willing to do anything. So I offered to buy another playfield so I could get it cleared myself. They will not even sell me a playfield. I can not believe this is happening.
Hard to believe they won't even sell a playfield. I guess if everyone wants to buy a backup they won't have enough to build new games... Or they're concerned the one they sell you will be garbage as well.
Is Ken Cromwell still in a marketing/social media/communications role at JJP? Not suggesting he be inundated with calls or messages, but he seems pretty uniquely positioned as a “hobbyist turned employee” who not only understands the community sentiment here but also has a professional role to play in helping JJP manage this PR/QC nightmare.
You’d hope JJP leadership would take someone like Ken more seriously than say, a project manager or procurement person whose job role is more bottom-line focused.
Just thoughts, probably repeats of someone from before though.
There are 1000s, maybe 10000s posts on pinball issues. What I don’t see is the lack of just plain old CS from these companies. Stuff happens, things are built incorrectly. But if I have an issue why do I have to wait 4 months for a replacement part..which I will pay for. JJP- hobbit 4 months to get parts, I paid for. Stern- 2 months for a board that failed.
I had new kitchen appliances, dented fridge door, called them up and someone actually asnwred, problem solved. I have a plumbing issue someone answers, yea may be a waiting period, but at least someone gave me a time frame. I’m sad to say I lost all interest in pinball. I don’t care if I have to wait 2 months for a part, but be up front and tell me that. Communication is key.
Quoted from Jecco74:JJP will not return my emails about pooling on my GnR CE. My distributor reached to them and they are not willing to do anything. So I offered to buy another playfield so I could get it cleared myself. They will not even sell me a playfield. I can not believe this is happening.
First, I’m sorry for the situation you are in, there is no excuse for this. Please see my above comment. You offered to purchase the playfield, correct? So they could charge you a price to where they are making a profit, again. They profited off your original purchase. And can once again profit off a playfield purchase. You’re not even asking for a free replacement.
I’ve had a lot of problems with stern and JJP and a hobby I once loved I now have zero interest in. I never thought I’d get out, but I’m there.
Quoted from Breger1:There are 1000s, maybe 10000s posts on pinball issues. What I don’t see is the lack of just plain old CS from these companies. Stuff happens, things are built incorrectly. But if I have an issue why do I have to wait 4 months for a replacement part..which I will pay for. JJP- hobbit 4 months to get parts, I paid for. Stern- 2 months for a board that failed.
I had new kitchen appliances, dented fridge door, called them up and someone actually asnwred, problem solved. I have a plumbing issue someone answers, yea may be a waiting period, but at least someone gave me a time frame. I’m sad to say I lost all interest in pinball. I don’t care if I have to wait 2 months for a part, but be up front and tell me that. Communication is key.
The problem is that these companies are more concerned with new sales than fixing existing sales. It's hard to return a pinball machine, and for an in-demand title the buyer is unlikely to want to return it even when there are problems. Stern is really bad with this as well. When you have a playfield issue with Stern, if they are willing to do anything, they make you wait months, or even over a year, to get it sorted out. What are they doing in all that time? Building machines for new orders. That's their first priority, and fixing their problems is a distant second. At some point you would think treating their paying customers so poorly would catch up to them, but most people who say they won't buy another NIB game give in when something they want comes out. These companies know their customers are full of empty threats, so they don't take them seriously.
Do you think JJP is reading these forums and sweating bullets? I doubt it. I think they're probably laughing. They probably listen to kaneda complain about playfields while saying he will never return his game and realize they really don't have a problem. Customers have a problem. JJP does not. Until customers actually take the refund and give up the games, JJP is A-OK. Sure...you say you won't buy the next game, but then you'll see it revealed and order it before it sells out or the line gets too long. You'll trust that they must have figured out the playfield issues by now and it's going to be OK. Perhaps it's the customer base that is defective.
I totally agree with you. But, I’m happy, and actually relieved at this point to say I am finished. I love Star Wars, but have zero interest in buying mando. Too much else out there in the world that can excite me and more reliable
Quoted from Breger1:I had new kitchen appliances, dented fridge door, called them up and someone actually asnwred, problem solved. I have a plumbing issue someone answers, yea may be a waiting period, but at least someone gave me a time frame.
I have wondered this for a while now. How can these machines have such a non existent support and warranty in the year of our Lord 2021. They are selling these to private homes. Compare this to any other device you can buy today.
Quoted from Jecco74:JJP will not return my emails about pooling on my GnR CE. My distributor reached to them and they are not willing to do anything. So I offered to buy another playfield so I could get it cleared myself. They will not even sell me a playfield. I can not believe this is happening.
I was told they will sell playfields after the run is compete....but...I would not buy one until we have some clear direction on what the solve was here so it's clear the one you buy as a backup is not going to have issues.
Even a raw playfield with no clear is worthless (other than wall art) if it's an art adhesion issue. I don't think they have a solution yet. Maybe they redesign to remove art from post areas, maybe they source someone other than Mirco, I would want to know what's changed before throwing good money after bad.
Quoted from thechakapakuni:Is this the worst playfield QC of all time? I’m not remembering a playfield with more issues
Lol basically every stern made for like two years had pooling and chipping
Is there a variable at play here regarding consumer vs. commercial product classification? By that I mean are there different requirements that drive the extent of what a company is willing to do (get away with) for a commercial product vs. consumer? I've no skin in this... that thought crossed my mind as I was pouring over this topic, apologies if it has already been considered/discussed or if it I'm in left field here.
Quoted from Ricochet:Is there a variable at play here regarding consumer vs. commercial product classification? By that I mean are there different requirements that drive the extent of what a company is willing to do (get away with) for a commercial product vs. consumer? I've no skin in this... that thought crossed my mind as I was pouring over this topic, apologies if it has already been considered/discussed or if it I'm in left field here.
There is an element of that. Pinball was a strictly commercial product for 80 years or so until very recently. In truth, neither the pinball companies nor the consumer was adequately prepared for this sudden shift into making it a home consumer product. Manufacturers suddenly could no longer “get away” with stuff their buyer base probably would have let slide before, while at the same time the buyers suddenly became a lot more demanding.
That being said, I don’t think we’ve ever seen anything like this. Even the crusty old ops of ages past would probably take notice and issue with the current crop of playfield issues.
If we could take the time to train the workers on the line
I could rest my head just knowin' that you weren't blind
All blind
So if you want to love me then Jersey' don't refrain
Or I'll just end up placing washers in the cold November rain
Do you need to clear on your own?
Do you need Mirco to hit the road?
Ooh, Jersey needs to clear these fields on their own
Your mother works at Mirco
Now that Churchill's not around
We used to love her playfields
But now they've gone to ground!
So you open up your tickets
cause complainin's always free
you'll get lots of different washers
and a case of insanity!
Quoted from thechakapakuni:I might let JJP slide if the BJs were included every multiball. Everyone has a price point, mine just happens to begin with BJs
Now we have a solution, BJs for all
Quoted from CrazyLevi:There is an element of that. Pinball was a strictly commercial product for 80 years or so until very recently. In truth, neither the pinball companies nor the consumer was adequately prepared for this sudden shift into making it a home consumer product. Manufacturers suddenly could no longer “get away” with stuff their buyer base probably would have let slide before, while at the same time the buyers suddenly became a lot more demanding.
That being said, I don’t think we’ve ever seen anything like this. Even the crusty old ops of ages past would probably take notice and issue with the current crop of playfield issues.
Nice to see that CrazyLevi is still capable of a level-headed, snark-free post.
Quoted from JStoltz:Is Ken Cromwell still in a marketing/social media/communications role at JJP? Not suggesting he be inundated with calls or messages, but he seems pretty uniquely positioned as a “hobbyist turned employee” who not only understands the community sentiment here but also has a professional role to play in helping JJP manage this PR/QC nightmare.
You’d hope JJP leadership would take someone like Ken more seriously than say, a project manager or procurement person whose job role is more bottom-line focused.
Just thoughts, probably repeats of someone from before though.
Ken has zero influence.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Your mother works at Mirco
Now that Churchill's not around
We used to love her playfields
But now they've gone to ground!
So you open up your tickets
cause complainin's always free
you'll get lots of different washers
and a case of insanity!
Hahahaha god dammit man.
Quoted from Phbooms:Start bombing Slash's facebook, instagram, or anything he might look at with pictures of playfields falling apart demanding he do something for his fans and pinball in general.. He was SOO important during the build and proud of the machine that he should feel ashamed of being part of this debacle at this point. He called Mcartney now he needs to call JJP and tell them to fix the issues or pull his name and all assets off any games moving forward. Bet that would give alittle extra umph to the call to arms over this bullshit if he actually took notice and cares enough to speak up since his name, music, hat, band, face, voice and supposedly some design went into this game.
Would be funny if he saw the pictures then looked at his game and found that it has the exact same problems.
Quoted from alveolus:Nice to see that CrazyLevi is still capable of a level-headed, snark-free post.
Well, it is a JJP thread.
Quoted from alveolus:Nice to see that CrazyLevi is still capable of a level-headed, snark-free post.
Maybe he is sick
I had no idea this was gonna turn into another Crazy Levi fan club thread!!
Don’t worry gang your membership packets are in the mail. Please remember to send me your t shirt sizes!
Quoted from CrazyLevi:I had no idea this was gonna turn into another Crazy Levi fan club thread!!
Don’t worry gang your membership packets are in the mail. Please remember to send me your t shirt sizes!
Come on man, if we cant mess with you what good is pinside?
Quoted from CrazyLevi:I had no idea this was gonna turn into another Crazy Levi fan club thread!!
Don’t worry gang your membership packets are in the mail. Please remember to send me your t shirt sizes!
Love this idea,
People attending pinball shows should just wear a T-shirt around with something like “Another owner of a bad JJP playfield “
Over in the NIB warranty discussion thread someone posted a link to the "original" GnR warranty, which is dated 9/20 (though the filename suggests it was still in place as of Nov. 2020): http://marketing.jerseyjackpinball.com/gnr/GNR_Manual_Nov2020.pdf
It's hard to see how playfields wouldn't be covered for 90 days under this "Bumper to Post" version of the warranty.
The current GnR warranty (dated this March, 3/21) is much less expansive and essentially mirrors the Stern approach of no written coverage for playfields.
For people that had their GnR playfield claims denied, were you discussing the "Bumper to Post" warranty with your distributor and JJP, or this new, more limited warranty? And have you considered which version of the warranty should apply if you made your deposit before the warranty terms were revised? Or if you took delivery of your machine before the warranty terms were revised?
Quoted from fosaisu:For people that had their GnR playfield claims denied, were you discussing the "Bumper to Post" warranty with your distributor and JJP, or this new, more limited warranty? And has anyone considered which version of the warranty would apply if you made your deposit before the warranty terms were revised? Or if you took delivery of your machine before the warranty terms were revised?
Since the terms were changed after most deposits were taken, you should be able to get your "non-refundable" deposit back - the seller changed the terms of the original agreement.
Quoted from nicoy3k:Lol basically every stern made for like two years had pooling and chipping
Wrong. Most of ours were fine and the ones that were not, Stern made good. Hopefully JJP do the same.
Quoted from DerGoetz:JJP
Just Junk Playfields
Slogan for the back
How about just ...Jersey Junk Playfields
Quoted from smalltownguy2:Ken has zero influence.
Makes sense, guess that was a little naïve of me. Their loss... kind of blows my mind having a resource like that (a pretty universally likable community voice, imo) on your payroll and underutilizing them.
Guess it beats them using him as a PR meat shield though, that’d be even more disappointing.
Quoted from wcbrandes:How about just ...Jersey Junk Playfields
or Jersey Jacked Playfields !
Quoted from CrazyLevi:I had no idea this was gonna turn into another Crazy Levi fan club thread!!
Don’t worry gang your membership packets are in the mail. Please remember to send me your t shirt sizes!
I’d legit purchase one. Only if it’s autographed though.
Quoted from thechakapakuni:Is this the worst playfield QC of all time? I’m not remembering a playfield with more issues
Not even close
woz losing art by the silver dollar size..
star trek looking like the lunar surface..
etc
Quoted from Breger1:Please see my above comment. You offered to purchase the playfield, correct? So they could charge you a price to where they are making a profit, again. They profited off your original purchase. And can once again profit off a playfield purchase. You’re not even asking for a free replacement.
It's not a problem of profiting or not - it's parts availability. There isn't excess stock sitting around and playfields require to be bought in bulk and have a very long lead time. On top of that, why sell him something that will perform exactly the same? Now they have two transactions tied up in the liability...
Quoted from pinballaddicted:Wrong. Most of ours were fine and the ones that were not, Stern made good. Hopefully JJP do the same.
Not wrong
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