(Topic ID: 287178)

GnR price increased by $1k?!?

By pinpin8990

3 years ago


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  • Latest reply 2 years ago by screaminr
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    #462 3 years ago

    Definitely odd to see a price increase midstream, but considering how long it takes them to build these machines, I can understand why the planning might fall on release boundaries.

    The company has long struggled to be profitable, so I don't know why this is such a big deal. Without the angel investor, JJP would likely be out of business by now and GNR2 wouldn't exist. My loaded R&M weighed in @ $9,500 and it has a lot less "stuff" than GNR2. I don't think JJP is being unreasonable, despite the odd timing of the increase.

    #566 3 years ago
    Quoted from Nevus:

    I appreciate your point of view. I see it a little differently.
    The majority owner of a corporation being wealthy does not make it profitable or solvent. The owner is not the same entity as the JJP corporation. If anything, the owner saved the company by investing a few years back.
    I totally understand that a lot of people are upset about the increased pricing. It’s literally “10K by Christmas”.
    I don’t think we, as customers, have any real knowledge of the financial status of the company. It’s really none of our business.

    Smart. JJP is clearly not a wildly profitable business (independent of size) and I'm sure any investor would like to see them be more self sufficient and profitable. My loaded R&M was $9,500 MSRP, and GNR2LE has a much more expensive BOM.

    #603 3 years ago
    Quoted from rotordave:

    Yes - that is a comparison.
    But I made the other one just to clarify the RRP on R&M as several posters had mentioned it.
    rd

    The point of my post wasn't to do an A/B comparison (which is impossible given the different companies configure the games).

    The point was I just bought a loaded R&M for "x", which isn't that from from a GNR2LE in terms of price.

    #609 3 years ago

    Nothing like a price increase to bring out the class warfare and throw stones @ great people (like Lloyd).

    Hopefully this pathetic thread will be shut down soon.

    #727 3 years ago
    Quoted from Yelobird:

    Think you kind of proved my point with this story. I am sure we ALL wish we or our parents started a rocket company, operating system, book store, or made wise investments but we Didn't! We decide where we go and what we achieve and thats called America!! As hard as I work there are many Really awesome things I would like to have but they just don't fit our budget or means. Doesn't mean I hate Elon Musk for it nor am I expecting him to send me a free car just because I deserve it for working hard. Completely understood if you Hate this suggestion but consider taking that 10.5 pinball savings and take some night classes to pursue the carrier and pay scale you Want and Deserve! Pinball will be here for a Long time and after you earn your dream job you can buy them all and send us hand outs for all your success. Pinball is Not an investment, but YOU are. Invest in yourself and find Happiness.

    Love this post. Living within your means...what a concept! The problem with our society is we are encouraged to live above our means. I went to a modest college because it's all my parents (and I) could afford. Never held me back! Just meant my school loan was paid back almost immediately.

    10
    #753 3 years ago
    Quoted from wesman:

    What amazes me less is it being unfortunate that a billionaire was necessary to save it.

    Unfortunate? Hmm. Did you ever consider that Jack & company weren't actually running the company well? I've worked for several tech startups and one of them needed to be "saved" just like JJP. It needed to be saved because the management sucked and made many bad decisions.

    It's just shocking to me that you have the nerve to disparage someone that helped Jack continue producing games.

    #775 3 years ago
    Quoted from Tranquilize:

    Sad part in the steep increase in pricing is that a lot of middle class people that would normally get into this hobby won't be able to. I know it's always been a semi-rich guy's hobby, but even used prices are getting crazy. It's truly becoming a hobby for the wealthy and the grandfathered, like real estate in dense cities like New York.
    I make good money, but I wouldn't have joined the party at these prices. Pinball is fun, but it's not THAT fun.

    I've been in this "hobby" for 17 years. In that period of time, inflation in so many essential areas has out paced pinball (like food, real estate, health care). Since a majority of these games hold their value, the financial risk is extremely low. All about priorities...I know MANY "middle class" folk who prioritize pinball and make it work financially.

    #784 3 years ago
    Quoted from pinmister:

    What is everyone's true opinion on true valuation of GNR and others?
    For me GNR SE is a $5500 machine
    the CE is a $8400 machine
    The Big Lebowski is a $9000 machine
    Rick and Morty is a $6000 machine
    Rick and Morty BS is a $6800 machine
    MMR Royal is a $9000 machine
    Supreme turd is worth $3000
    The list goes on....
    I tend to set my own price points for games. Sometimes they align with reality and sometimes they do not. Are some of these games worth nearly what people are asking nowadays-hell no.

    Meh. Games are about fun and you and I don't get to set prices. My son is visiting and I surprised him with R&M and we are loving it. Paid 1k over MSRP to land mine NIB locally. Compared with your pricing, I got ripped off. Of course, this isn't the case. In fact, with only 750 worldwide and HBO picking up the series, I have no doubt that this game will easily hold it's value (which again, is much higher than your "opinion").

    No matter what the product, getting a hot item NOW with high demand and low supply means paying "up". I'm picking up 2021 Corvette tomorrow morning...had to "pay up" because it's a hot car. If I wait another year or so, I'm sure I could save some $$. I think it's important to live life while you can. I have an awesome neighbor/pilot who retired very recently (@ 65) and is now fighting for his life (freak accident where he fell and hit his head). Poor guy had been looking forward to retirement and now this happens. Just awful.

    1 week later
    #1018 3 years ago

    Let me ask an obvious question. Sorry if it's been covered already.

    If I purchase a GNRLE directly from JJP @ 10.5k today, wouldn't they be motivated to fulfill my order before all the orders that are queued up with distributors? I have no clue what JJP margins are, but 1k is likely a very healthy boost to their existing margins.

    I also think it's unfortunate that the 1k deposit is non-refundable. From my perspective, it needs to have a time out. If I don't receive a game in 90 days, I am entitled to get my deposit back.

    #1024 3 years ago
    Quoted from PtownPin:

    My guess is they would never admit it, but theres a chance they would fulfill quicker I totally agree that deposits should be refundable if they don't deliver in a reasonable timeframe...I still think its BS that JJP refuses to provide estimated delivery dates.

    As much as I'd like a GNRLE, I just don't feel like "bending over" yet again. The business model sucks. Non-refundable deposits make 0 sense given their modest build capabilities. GNR is hot for the foreseeable future and it makes no sense if someone is "done" waiting, why they can't get their money back. With games changing hands between collectors, the chance of getting a game before yours is built likely.

    #1182 3 years ago
    Quoted from DrJoe:

    The same as all JJP games. A lot of people like the feel. I've never gotten used to them. The CGC remakes feel the same way.

    And Rick and Morty. The B/W flipper mechs when married with P-ROC or other systems just don't feel right.

    I love my R&M and the flippers aren't AWFUL, but they are not great (for several reasons). Fortunately, Spooky is working on it and I'm pretty certain they will figure it out.

    You'd think that in 2021, pinball companies would be able to nail the flippers...arguably the most important aspect of a pinball machine! Sigh.

    #1217 3 years ago
    Quoted from 27dnast:

    Obviously JJP wasn’t prepared for the order onslaught that occurred and I have zero knowledge of how many CE’s were over sold, nor do I know what kind of capacity they have in-house individually call customers. Typically dealers/distributors are in place to be an outreach arm to deal direct with the consumer.
    I don’t think JJP is nefarious, nor do I think they had an internal meeting pre-sales and plotted to screw over distributors. For all we know, they plan on giving distributors full access to CE’s on the next go around... or perhaps they are actively planning on how to assign. Allotments to distributors (which they haven’t done, nor have they needed to do).
    I suspect that most everyone upset about the price increase is really just disappointed in the elevated prices across the board. We all long fir the good old days. But, just like collectors raise and lower prices on the used market, JJP should do the same on the new. They’re a manufacturer, not a charity.
    Vote with your wallet. If the market agrees, en mass, then you’ll either see pricing drop or that manufacturer will fold. It’s one or the other. If the market disagrees with you, then you’ll have to re-evaluate your position or stick to your guns.

    I agree with all your posts on this topic, btw. Kind of odd how much life this thread has.

    Could you imagine if the pinball distributors did what car dealers do? (when a car is hot?). The dealer bribe to get a 2021 Corvette is $10,000-$20,000 over MSRP across the country! You can get a dealer to sell you one at MSRP, but you will wait for over a year.

    So at least we have something to be thankful for...for now, at least The real trick for these pinball manufacturers is to get better at building these games so they can truly scale up. Chevy built 20k Corvettes in the year of COVID, half the number they planned to build. 20k is still a very large number.

    #1224 3 years ago
    Quoted from TigerLaw:

    Their theme selection was downright shockingly bad. They got unlucky with the Hobbit trilogy being so poor, but all other theme selections were self inflicted wounds. I think it’s safe to say that now JJP as a company understands that having mature themes for a mature audience is important...

    As a theme, WOZ is pretty classic/retro/mature...no? Never owned it because I didn't dig the gameplay, but the license wasn't a huge turnoff for me.

    Funny, the best theme grab of recent memory was Rick and Morty (and I was previously unaware of the show...my 25 yr.old son turned me onto it after I told him Spooky got the license). Smart of so many levels.

    #1239 3 years ago
    Quoted from Yelobird:

    Wasn't arguing the merits of GnR. All have their own personal interest (its a hobby). Was just saying JJP is surviving on more then loyalty or interest in their company. If they (or anyone) build a great game I don't care if they don't want to be my BFF or share their feelings. I just want a good game.

    Which is why Stern continues to thrive despite having really spotty support (to be polite. More build issues, less timely support, yet people buy their games (including me

    JJP has struggled financially for years. Unlike Stern, they haven't figured out how to be a manufacturing powerhouse. If you can't build more (and/or do it more efficiently), the obvious solution is to raise prices on your big hits. Makes total sense, though it would be better for everyone involved to see them be more proficient at pinball manufacturing.

    #1268 3 years ago
    Quoted from PinHigh1:

    So why did they increase the price by $1k?

    Because they have a hot product in a market with lots of disposable income. Even with the increase, I'm sure their margins aren't that impressive.

    #1275 3 years ago

    $13.50-$14.00 per hour...wtf? $0.50 spread? I guess any warm body gets $13.50 and someone with prior pinball building experience gets $14.00?

    How idiotic can companies possibly be?

    #1310 3 years ago

    When the robots take over, all the low paid folks will be clamoring for these not-so-great-paying jobs. Not saying it's "right", but it's inevitable. Self driving cars/trucks will hurt good paying trucker gigs.

    Apple could EASILY build iPhones largely with robots. Instead, they decided to do it with hoards of Chinese workers (who could then aspire to purchase their products).

    #1340 3 years ago
    Quoted from screaminr:

    24k for Tron le

    This sold on Pinside? I love my TRON LE, but I have another insanely modded TRON that is really just as nice.

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