(Topic ID: 287178)

GnR price increased by $1k?!?

By pinpin8990

11 months ago


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    There are 1,507 posts in this topic. You are on page 17 of 31.
    #801 11 months ago
    Quoted from pinmister:

    The whole POTC is super fishy to me. Started with turmoil over three disk vs two disc change. Then tons of production issues(I believe JJP was losing their ass) and then sudden stop in production because of parts, etc? Now people selling for $20k+ has me laughing. It has some serious draw to it, and some of my personal friends have gotten bit by the lure of this game. The modes are over the top with 20+ characters and it is what I call a hoge poge game. I love the POTC theme and thought I would love the game, but fortunately it was not fun for me. The more these games climb in pricing because of rarity the more it makes me distance myself even further. Would I rather have a 20K box of lights or 5 used HUO Sterns?

    I really don't think those paying up to $20000 rell

    Quoted from Darth_Chris:

    Years ago when JJP and other cies started to come into the hobby I thought competition would be good for business. Forcing the only existing cie to produce better pinball at a fair price to make sure they keep their segment of the pie. Boy, it's the complete opposite. Since other cies joined prices keep rising and quality is dropping. It defied all logic....why ? I think because pinball is not a logical market. People buy with their heart, not their brains and logic. It's okay but don't expect to see any logic from a market full of passionate people who buy with their heart.
    Pinball is an awesome hobby but it is for people with more and more money to buy the new toys, and even if they flip it after a guy with money will want to minimise his loss to buy the new big game. So used market will go up like we have been seeing for years.
    As long they keep selling and attracting deeper pockets prices will go up. I think honestly at $15 000 all the CE would have sold anyway. The more pinball cies are aware of that the more you will see move like this : jacking a price up during a release.
    Just my opinion

    I actually think the opposite. Competition has brought us better games for the most part. Better displays, better themes, deeper rules, better art, better light shows, etc. Quality has always been hit and miss. Prices have always been too much. Bubbles are always about to pop. Hobby has never been about logic and 100% passion. Themes sell. Raising prices brings some heat but things just go right back to "gotta have it" when next game is announced.

    #802 11 months ago
    Quoted from javagrind888:

    If the value of any of them used still only drops by a grand, then it's not really money spent right? Just set aside until you sell? That's been my only rationality for being in this hobby as a collector anyway. If I lose a grand a pin on average, it's acceptable for the fun we've had.

    That is the way I feel, I expect a $500-$1000 loss on NIB. It is my fun tax. Why I usually try to buy second hand and let someone else take the beating.

    #803 11 months ago
    Quoted from FalconDriver:Holy crap. Open the gates. Here come the secondary $20k POTC LEs or are we there already?

    Four days into this and look at all of them. Whew!

    #804 11 months ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    Over the years I've defended JJP price increases by saying "Well, look at what Stern is offering for the same price". No more as these $10k+ LE prices have entered crazy town territory. Both Stern and JJP have been playing this back and forth game of raising prices after seeing what each of them do and as a result both companies have now priced a lot of people out of the market.
    I've often criticized Stern as in my opinion they don't justify the price with enough features and toys. Well for the first time I'll say the same thing about a JJP pin with the new $10.5k GNR LE price. There's not enough features and toys in GNR LE to justify the new price tag. For $10.5k you don't even get all of the mechanical features in the game, that being the missing coma lock reserved for the CE. $10.5k and you still don't get all of the mechanical features? That was bad enough to stomach at $9.5k but at $10.5k there's just no words. I shouldn't be surprised as this is the same company charging $11.5k for yet another "limited" version of WOZ that doesn't even come with the monkey mech.
    The same thing can now be said about GNR SE. $7,800 and the only toy is a spinning disk...wow. I'll take an AIQ Premium that has far more in for the same price over GNR SE any day. How about an Alien from Pinball Brothers? That now looks like a steal compared to the prices (and what you actually get) that both Stern and JJP charge.

    Never thought we’d see the day (lol), but right on the money Panzer. JJP a small manufacturer is getting too big for their britches! You’re right enough is enough, we should all say no to their new shiny’s at those prices because there is not $10.5k of toys and such in their product. Prices will stabilize when people stop buying.

    Stern is charging way too much as well, but their price increases have not gone up 10% in one go, on already way overpriced machines. JJP prices are now $4000 to $6000 over Stern’s for the same 3 tiers. (Yes, JJP has used tricky marketing wording on those 3 tiers, but they’re the same 3 tiers.)

    #805 11 months ago

    Phew! Finally....the silence is over, and JJP has posted via their social media accounts, and addressed the GnR price increase...!!!

    Screenshot_20210208-163117_Twitter (resized).jpg
    #806 11 months ago

    So my GNR will come with 2 foxy ladies? Take my money!

    #807 11 months ago
    Quoted from thechakapakuni:

    So my GNR will come with 2 foxy ladies? Take my money!

    Suddenly a $1K price increase doesn't sound so unreasonable...

    #808 11 months ago
    Quoted from wesman:

    Phew! Finally....the silence is over, and JJP has posted via their social media accounts, and addressed the GnR price increase...!!!
    [quoted image]

    Ahhhh that's more like a $100 price increase...

    18
    #809 11 months ago

    Why are you people expecting JJP to launch a multimedia PR campaign explaining and promoting their price increases?

    Pretty sure that’s never happened in the history of business.

    Pinball people live in la la land.

    #810 11 months ago
    Quoted from tslayer71:

    Ahhhh that's more like a $100 price increase...

    Ziiiiing! I'll admit it, I laughed.

    -4
    #811 11 months ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Why are you people expecting JJP to launch a multimedia PR campaign explaining and promoting their price increases?
    Pretty sure that’s never happened in the history of business.
    Pinball people live in la la land.

    Not expecting, just hoping non Pinsiders down the road would be able to be aware. Which....given the lack of, uh...pimping of that price increase, they won't be.

    A one month window would have been "fair", and transparent regarding Pinsiders and people really into pinball, at the very least. But pinball is definitely not good on the latter, and the prior is a case to case basis.

    I genuinely hope AIP gets their shit together, and offers solid games that entice many, many people, at prices still lower than JJP and Stern.

    #812 11 months ago
    Quoted from wesman:

    Ziiiiing! I'll admit it, I laughed.

    Hey, I'll be here all week folks! This is what a $1000 price increase looks like. She's even all tatted up for you tough guys getting your GNR pins...

    #813 11 months ago

    Why didn't JJP take a Super Bowl ad where they addressed pinsiders' concerns with price increases?!

    THEY ARE MOCKING US!

    #814 11 months ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Why didn't JJP take a Super Bowl ad where they addressed pinsiders' concerns with price increases?!
    THEY ARE MOCKING US!

    Don't be silly! We all know the game would then be increased to 100K for increased costs! Not to mention the wax figures of Slash, Axl, and Duff that would be surrounding the game during the half-time show!

    #815 11 months ago
    Quoted from wesman:

    Not expecting, just hoping non Pinsiders down the road would be able to be aware. Which....given the lack of, uh...pimping of that price increase, they won't be.
    A one month window would have been "fair", and transparent regarding Pinsiders and people really into pinball, at the very least. But pinball is definitely not good on the latter, and the prior is a case to case basis.
    I genuinely hope AIP gets their shit together, and offers solid games that entice many, many people, at prices still lower than JJP and Stern.

    AP has released 3 solid games. Houdini is freak'n phenomenal (yes, it's a game that requires lots of fine tuning so location play probably will let you down)... I play it more than any other game in my collection, and have owned it for almost a year. Oktoberfest is also a fun game. And Hot Wheels has turned a lot of heads.

    I think players are going to regret not giving Houdini a fair shake... too many people let others judge for them, or played one that wasn't properly set up. I know my first encounter with the game (on location) left a sour taste in my mouth. So glad I took the plunge.

    #816 11 months ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    I've often criticized Stern as in my opinion they don't justify the price with enough features and toys. Well for the first time I'll say the same thing about a JJP pin with the new $10.5k GNR LE price. There's not enough features and toys in GNR LE to justify the new price tag. For $10.5k you don't even get all of the mechanical features in the game, that being the missing coma lock reserved for the CE. $10.5k and you still don't get all of the mechanical features? That was bad enough to stomach at $9.5k but at $10.5k there's just no words. I shouldn't be surprised as this is the same company charging $11.5k for yet another "limited" version of WOZ that doesn't even come with the monkey mech.
    The same thing can now be said about GNR SE. $7,800 and the only toy is a spinning disk...wow.

    Where is our PanzerFreak and what have you done with him???

    #817 11 months ago
    Quoted from MrBally:

    Where is our PanzerFreak and what have you done with him???

    Not enough toys makes Panzer an angry boy

    #818 11 months ago
    Quoted from Thunderbird:

    Never thought we’d see the day (lol), but right on the money Panzer. JJP a small manufacturer is getting too big for their britches! You’re right enough is enough, we should all say no to their new shiny’s at those prices because there is not $10.5k of toys and such in their product. Prices will stabilize when people stop buying.
    Stern is charging way too much as well, but their price increases have not gone up 10% in one go, on already way overpriced machines. JJP prices are now $4000 to $6000 over Stern’s for the same 3 tiers. (Yes, JJP has used tricky marketing wording on those 3 tiers, but they’re the same 3 tiers.)

    "we should all say no to their new shiny’s" I remember this being suggested in 2012...when Stern LEs were 8k Canadian...

    #819 11 months ago
    Quoted from pinmister:What is everyone's true opinion on true valuation of GNR and others?
    For me GNR SE is a $5500 machine
    the CE is a $8400 machine
    The Big Lebowski is a $9000 machine
    Rick and Morty is a $6000 machine
    Rick and Morty BS is a $6800 machine
    MMR Royal is a $9000 machine
    Supreme turd is worth $3000
    The list goes on....
    I tend to set my own price points for games. Sometimes they align with reality and sometimes they do not. Are some of these games worth nearly what people are asking nowadays-hell no.

    You can think it all you want. The market says otherwise.

    I think houses, iphones, and vehicles are way overpriced, but...the market says otherwise.

    #820 11 months ago
    Quoted from Animal:

    "we should all say no to their new shiny’s" I remember this being suggested in 2012...when Stern LEs were 8k Canadian...

    Well, the "good" news is that if CE's had lingered like Wonka and DI, this would now be $13,500 USD.

    #821 11 months ago
    Quoted from wesman:

    Phew! Finally....the silence is over, and JJP has posted via their social media accounts, and addressed the GnR price increase...!!!
    [quoted image]

    Jeff looks different that I expected.

    #822 11 months ago
    Quoted from zaphX:

    Here's how I see the world.
    You can do one of two things:
    1. Accept the world as it is, and let life happen to you.
    2. Make your life what you want it to be, identifying the change you want and taking steps to make it so.

    Unless others cause you to misstep. One can try. Absolutely. But it’s always a coin flip.

    I didn’t stop trying.

    Quoted from iceman44:

    It's hard to believe it's been 10 years or so Rick since we were early adopters on a WOZ.
    10 yrs later i still have my WOZECLE and now a JJP GNRCE. My how things have changed in the last decade.

    True Amigo. Been a long ride.

    #823 11 months ago
    Quoted from underlord:

    Unless others cause you to misstep. One can try. Absolutely. But it’s always a coin flip.
    I didn’t stop trying.

    True Amigo. Been a long ride.

    That's the thing, isn't it? It's a combination of both as I see it. We can be accountable, accept our faults in decision making, correct them, move forward with knowledge and make more empowered decisions, no matter what the stage.

    But there are also inevitable factors, forces beyond our control, that impact and influence our lives in ways that we are so utterly powerless to alter.

    One change I will definitely make, is crossing JJP off my list for NIB purchases. As an owner of two of their 6 games, that kinda sucks, but financial comfort + defining my own principles in this matter, makes a more contented me.

    #824 11 months ago
    Quoted from thechakapakuni:

    So my GNR will come with 2 foxy ladies? Take my money!

    Don't you already pay to get women?

    #825 11 months ago
    Quoted from wesman:

    That's the thing, isn't it? It's a combination of both as I see it. We can be accountable, accept our faults in decision making, correct them, move forward with knowledge and make more empowered decisions, no matter what the stage.
    But there are also inevitable factors, forces beyond our control, that impact and influence our lives in ways that we are so utterly powerless to alter.
    One change I will definitely make, is crossing JJP off my list for NIB purchases. As an owner of two of their 6 games, that kinda sucks, but financial comfort + defining my own principles in this matter, makes a more contented me.

    What about this offends your senses? Prices for manufacturing are up across the board since 2019. I mean, i get the 'it's too rich for my blood' mentality, but what about this makes you 'cross them off your list'.? Companies raise prices on items all the time.

    #826 11 months ago

    Anyone notice that PDI glass went up 10% too? I think we’re in for inflation bumps across the board..........

    #827 11 months ago
    Quoted from wesman:

    Not expecting, just hoping non Pinsiders down the road would be able to be aware. Which....given the lack of, uh...pimping of that price increase, they won't be.
    A one month window would have been "fair", and transparent regarding Pinsiders and people really into pinball, at the very least. But pinball is definitely not good on the latter, and the prior is a case to case basis.
    I genuinely hope AIP gets their shit together, and offers solid games that entice many, many people, at prices still lower than JJP and Stern.

    I get confused with statements like this. No disrespect but if you were not in at $9500 then sorry about your luck.

    How may buyers do u think would have jumped in to take advantage of the perceived future equity of $1k. Or the $1k would save the "fun tax" of getting to crack open that NIB pin. They get to do what they want. As you did as well. You opted to not buy it.. now it's more or you buy used. Super simple.

    #828 11 months ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Why didn't JJP take a Super Bowl ad where they addressed pinsiders' concerns with price increases?!
    THEY ARE MOCKING US!

    Why didn’t they pay for Guns and Roses to do the halftime show? We needed it after that disaster. They could have had a pinball rising up with Slash playing it.

    #829 11 months ago
    Quoted from snaroff:

    Unfortunate? Hmm. Did you ever consider that Jack & company weren't actually running the company well? I've worked for several tech startups and one of them needed to be "saved" just like JJP. It needed to be saved because the management sucked and made many bad decisions.
    It's just shocking to me that you have the nerve to disparage someone that helped Jack continue producing games.

    Leonard and the other 2 main investors got involved in 2015, and the company was founded in 2011. If so, 4 games in 5 years doesn't seem like the magical turnaround you're presenting here. In that time period, Stern has produced 20 games or more?

    I'm not "disparaging" him, as you say. I don't even exist to him. Not even as a customer. I don't believe in some of their actions in the last year or so. It's a viewpoint, as a customer. I'm okay in having it, and you, yours. Let's not act like a friggin' glove has been thrust on the ground here.

    Quoted from Zablon:

    What about this offends your senses? Prices for manufacturing are up across the board since 2019. I mean, i get the 'it's too rich for my blood' mentality, but what about this makes you 'cross them off your list'.? Companies raise prices on items all the time.

    The early run markup. I'd have no issue if this occurred in October. Wouldn't be buying at $10500 back then either. I bought a loaded wide bodies POTC at $9500, which presented more value, and was a financial stretch for me.

    Quoted from smokinhos:

    I get confused with statements like this. No disrespect but if you were not in at $9500 then sorry about your luck.
    How may buyers do u think would have jumped in to take advantage of the perceived future equity of $1k. Or the $1k would save the "fun tax" of getting to crack open that NIB pin. They get to do what they want. As you did as well. You opted to not buy it.. now it's more or you buy used. Super simple.

    None taken.

    Let's look at it this way. I bought a Hobbit in late 2019, with a slight discount. Those were available for 3 years, not due to overwhelming success. API still is making, and selling Houdni's at 7K. There is NO way whatsoever that API will up the price to $7700. At least if they're sane, they won't.

    Not an absolute concrete comparison, but in those two particular instances, lack of demand did not increase price.

    I definitely scratched the possibility of a Batman 66 off a short list of Stern's after the, well in advance, price increase there. That took what, 1 or 2 months to occur? At least Stern gave possible buyers a window, and getting a possible distributor discount is FAR more likely with Stern games, than JJP.

    #830 11 months ago

    I think u made the point.. its demand that drove up the price on GnR.. or so one can perceive. I am personally cheering on Stern, spooky, API, and any pinball company that can build fun games that aren't 5 figures.

    #831 11 months ago

    I get the price increase and compaired to Sterns its not surprising,But a dick move not to give people a week heads up or a chance to buy at the 9500.The only people they screw over is the pinheads who keep up with whats happening in the pinball world.JJP should have either taken a hit and stuck with the 9500.00 or give their main customer base, and the ones on the fence a chance to buy at 9500.
    The way they handled the CE edition sales,and now this, JJP is sending a clear message they dont care about the pinheads or the venders and are totaly out of touch with the market.They keep makeing crap moves and sticking to their best customers or one could say the current pinheads.
    I would hope and expect Toy Story to be at the new price (1000$ more) out of the gate,but do they know their market ? People are buying GNS because of Eirc, and toystory will sell,but their customers are not biting at the chomps to get pats games.I have the upmost respect for what Pat has done and his games,but again its not as high demand as Eircs games.
    For the record I am a big JJP fan and love what they bring to the market, But man they sure know how to ignore us and stick it to their customers.

    #832 11 months ago

    If JJP had even a put out a simple message like" Due to covid we have to increase prices going forward". They wouldn't be getting this much backlash. I will say I agree with TigerLaw the mentality of feeling like a sucker is very real with this game now because now you have to pay 1k more simply because you bought on Wednesday and not Tuesday

    13
    #833 11 months ago
    Quoted from Mrawesome44:

    If JJP had even a put out a simple message like" Due to covid we have to increase prices going forward". They wouldn't be getting this much backlash.

    I agree. Due to COVID, I'll no longer be buying JJP games.

    #834 11 months ago

    Reading through the 17 pages, would it be safe to assume that there won't be a rush and there will be plenty of availability of Toy Story CEs that I can get in on one?

    Asking for a friend.

    #835 11 months ago
    Quoted from Mrawesome44:

    If JJP had even a put out a simple message like" Due to covid we have to increase prices going forward". They wouldn't be getting this much backlash. I will say I agree with TigerLaw the mentality of feeling like a sucker is very real with this game now because now you have to pay 1k more simply because you bought on Wednesday and not Tuesday

    I do get the “next day” price increase problem have. But this game was announced 4 months ago with orders being taken Oct 5th. People complaining had time to get in, they didn’t. Not sure I understand the whole “this company owes me”. They really don’t. The good news is everyone can vote with their wallets. If this is a bad move, the bottom line will show as much. If not, then it was good business.

    #836 11 months ago

    This could al be justified by the recent 30% price increase in lumber prices. Also the shortage, rationing and price increases on certain integrated circuit chips......

    #837 11 months ago
    Quoted from 27dnast:

    I think players are going to regret not giving Houdini a fair shake... too many people let others judge for them, or played one that wasn't properly set up. So glad I took the plunge.

    Funny, I think the same about DICE. That game is phenomenal and an amazing shooter. I think it will be a cult classic.

    #838 11 months ago
    Quoted from MrBally:

    This could al be justified by the recent 30% price increase in lumber prices. Also the shortage, rationing and price increases on certain integrated circuit chips......

    Regardless of the reasons for the price increase. I'm saving approximately $11280
    Game, Tax & Shipping
    At some point It will be found in a Arcade. Then feed it some dollars and help your local barcade, game room or arcade.

    #839 11 months ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    Over the years I've defended JJP price increases by saying "Well, look at what Stern is offering for the same price". No more as these $10k+ LE prices have entered crazy town territory. Both Stern and JJP have been playing this back and forth game of raising prices after seeing what each of them do and as a result both companies have now priced a lot of people out of the market.
    I've often criticized Stern as in my opinion they don't justify the price with enough features and toys. Well for the first time I'll say the same thing about a JJP pin with the new $10.5k GNR LE price. There's not enough features and toys in GNR LE to justify the new price tag. For $10.5k you don't even get all of the mechanical features in the game, that being the missing coma lock reserved for the CE. $10.5k and you still don't get all of the mechanical features? That was bad enough to stomach at $9.5k but at $10.5k there's just no words. I shouldn't be surprised as this is the same company charging $11.5k for yet another "limited" version of WOZ that doesn't even come with the monkey mech.
    The same thing can now be said about GNR SE. $7,800 and the only toy is a spinning disk...wow. I'll take an AIQ Premium that has far more in for the same price over GNR SE any day. How about an Alien from Pinball Brothers? That now looks like a steal compared to the prices (and what you actually get) that both Stern and JJP charge.

    Get yourself a Jurrasic Park Premium instead. Its a better game.

    #840 11 months ago
    Quoted from beelzeboob:

    Don't you already pay to get women?

    Yes I do! Now name a man alive who isn’t?

    12
    #841 11 months ago
    Quoted from smassa:

    Get yourself a Jurrasic Park Premium instead. Its a better game.

    Get a JP Pro instead and save even more bucks.

    Actually ... for $10,500 you could almost get a JP Pro AND an AIQ Pro. Sorta a no brainer ...

    rd

    #842 11 months ago
    Quoted from rotordave:

    Get a JP Pro instead and save even more bucks.
    Actually ... for $10,500 you could almost get a JP Pro AND an AIQ Pro. Sorta a no brainer ...
    rd

    I was talking about getting a JP Premium over an AIQ premium.

    #843 11 months ago

    I’m still sore over missing out on the Collectors Edition.
    I know it sounds silly but I would rather it had been a time locked system for the CE.
    - JJP releases new pin
    - Pinheads get chance to see 3 versions
    - CE gets 5 days then locked out - no more sales - they could round the number up to the nearest mark - say 650 or so...

    I know it will potentially increase the CE numbers, at least collectors gets a fair crack of the whip, chance to research prior to making their mind up before dropping a boat load of cash.
    At least there won’t be any excuses.

    #844 11 months ago
    Quoted from rotordave:

    Get a JP Pro instead and save even more bucks.
    Actually ... for $10,500 you could almost get a JP Pro AND an AIQ Pro. Sorta a no brainer ...
    rd

    Or maiden pro + jp pro huo combo for close to the same price. Absolute no brainer.

    Never thought I'd be pushing stern spike machines over jjp. How times have changed.

    #845 11 months ago
    Quoted from Tranquilize:

    Or maiden pro + jp pro huo combo .... Absolute no brainer

    Yes.

    rd
    59A7F059-1714-4B7B-8D07-9043C57A86CD (resized).jpeg

    (New dust free photo, just for Pinside!).

    #846 11 months ago
    Quoted from rotordave:

    Yes.
    rd[quoted image]

    That’s some epic dust buildup on your Maiden glass, brother. You must realllllly love playing that game!

    10
    #847 11 months ago

    I was saving for a SE, finally Jack made a pin that I felt was affordable. Then he goes and raises his price 1k? Keep your pin jack. Hot wheels is a bargain @ 6300 free topper,side blades,shaker motor.

    #848 11 months ago

    To me this increase is a middle finger to the average joe pinball collector.

    #849 11 months ago
    Quoted from thechakapakuni:

    Yes I do! Now name a man alive who isn’t?

    I know a few gay guys...

    #850 11 months ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Why are you people expecting JJP to launch a multimedia PR campaign explaining and promoting their price increases?
    Pretty sure that’s never happened in the history of business.
    Pinball people live in la la land.

    I have to agree. Why would jjp address this via Twitter? In fact why would they address it at all? They know people in this hobby are idiots and spend 2k on toppers..... so they “Jack” it up 1k. That’s it. Continue being stupid and it’s another 1k before Labor Day.

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