Gay 90's Last issues to solve

Hi there!
I got a Gay 90's which I am working on.
Managed to have everything running apart from 3 issues, 2 of which seem related.

Issue 1: When starting a game the outhole is trying to push the basll in game, but lacking the power to do so. Checked outhole relay, seem fine (contact cleaned and spaces ok); checked motor cam 3A, cleaned it, etc: Also checked the hole advance unit which seems ok.

Issue 2: seem related to issue 1: Eject coil (right scoop) is not triggering when the switch is hit, relay "eject" is activated. If I press both the "out hole" and "eject" relays, then the coil activates. Eject relay has been checked, cleaned etc

Issue 3: SOLVED game is alway on 4 players, even when pressing Start only once. Game is advancing through balls as it should.

Many thanks in advance to help me diagnose those so that this Gay can leave my closet and play again with its friends!

#2 3 years ago

SMM

dr_nybble

Pinside+ Frequent

Ottawa, ON

10y 114K 3,540 15

Issue 1: Try to fire the coil with a jumper from the blue-white wire side of the coil to the "Common" on the transformer (tap on the Common lug). If it is good then you must have a poor connection somewhere in the circuit. If it is bad then it seems to be a mechanical problem.

Issue 2: See this thread: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/help-with-eject-relay-on-gay-90s

Issue 3: Reset the Coin Unit back to 1 player manually. Does it go back to 4 players when you start a game? Check the make/break switch "E" on the Reset Relay (see the Instruction Manual on ipdb.org).

A question for you: do you have a Rules Card for your apron? If so, could you upload a scan to the Gallery for Gay 90's ? I'd like to reproduce that card.

#3 3 years ago

LAG

Nihonmasa

https://images.pinside.com/2/90/70/29070295e5ada4aecde428b7d6396a920e50b5f3.jpg

Hi dr,

So :
Issue 1: Common is bottom left and marked "C" correct? Then absolutely no reaction. Mechanical problem seems unlikely, I have thoroughly cleaned it and it move just fine by hand.

Issue 2: I had checked 3A as stated in the first post No change Also checked 5B => same... weird to have the same issue on the same day

Issue 3: solved; "spider" lugs on back of the coin relay were not making good contact.

Down to 2!

I do have a score card but it's in german If you want it PM me your mail, I'll scan it.

#4 3 years ago

???

currieddog

Pinside member

Springfield, MA

7y 63,550 3,312 6

OP
Quoted from Nihonmasa:
Issue 1: When starting a game the outhole is trying to push the basll in game, but lacking the power to do so. Checked outhole relay, seem fine (contact cleaned and spaces ok); checked motor cam 3A, cleaned it, etc: Also checked the hole advance unit which seems ok.

Sw. B is nice and clean and making solid contact?

I would give the M/B on the Hold Advance Unit a real good look, even removing it to check everything. Doesn't take much for it to be off and limited power getting thru.

Capture (resized).png

Capture1 (resized).PNG

#5 3 years ago

???

currieddog

Pinside member

Springfield, MA

7y 63,550 3,312 6

OP
Quoted from Nihonmasa:
Issue 2: seem related to issue 1: Eject coil (right scoop) is not triggering when the switch is hit, relay "eject" is activated. If I press both the "out hole" and "eject" relays, then the coil activates. Eject relay has been checked, cleaned etc

Check the M/B on Index-C.

Capture (resized).png

#6 3 years ago

SMM

dr_nybble

Pinside+ Frequent

Ottawa, ON

10y 114K 3,540 15

OP
Quoted from Nihonmasa:
Hi dr,
So :
Issue 1: Common is bottom left and marked "C" correct? Then absolutely no reaction. Mechanical problem seems unlikely, I have thoroughly cleaned it and it move just fine by hand.
Issue 2: I had checked 3A as stated in the first post No change Also checked 5B => same... weird to have the same issue on the same day
Issue 3: solved; "spider" lugs on back of the coin relay were not making good contact.
Down to 2!
I do have a score card but it's in german If you want it PM me your mail, I'll scan it.

1 - Common is the yellow cloth wire at the top of the transformer between the 6 and 24 volt lugs.

2 - Does the score motor run after the Eject Relay is energized?

3 - Great!

#7 3 years ago

LAG

Nihonmasa

Quoted from dr_nybble:
1 - Common is the yellow cloth wire at the top of the transformer between the 6 and 24 volt lugs.
https://images.pinside.com/2/90/70/29070295e5ada4aecde428b7d6396a920e50b5f3.jpg
2 - Does the score motor run after the Eject Relay is energized?
3 - Great!

1- done, coil fires perfectly then!

2- yep it does. And if there is a bonus like 200, the relay stays energetised till the countdown is done, but no coil action.

Curriedog: issue 1: M/B on the hole advance unit was the culprit! Both issues solved at once!

Will do more tests tomorrow to be sure the game is done, but thanks a lot to both nevertheless!

#8 3 years ago

LAG

Nihonmasa

Ok, there is one issue which appeared (it was working before) : the right gate
it energetizes, but does not stay energetised. Did not find in the schematics what is making it stay open, only found the line where it closes.

Many thanks in advance!

#9 3 years ago

???

currieddog

Pinside member

Springfield, MA

7y 63,550 3,312 6

OP
Quoted from Nihonmasa:
the right gate
it energetizes, but does not stay energetised. Did not find in the schematics what is making it stay open, only found the line where it closes.

Don't forget to check the superb Williams manual that is available:

Capture (resized).png

#10 3 years ago

SMM

dr_nybble

Pinside+ Frequent

Ottawa, ON

10y 114K 3,540 15

It stays open through its own "IN HOLD CIRCUIT TO THIS RELAY" switch + the normally closed TROUGH SWITCH.

pasted_image (resized).png

#11 3 years ago

LAG

Nihonmasa