brett:
yes, we're aware of that [other] mistake (wrong colors on transition vs. playfield color transitioning) and we've already corrected that.

back to the question at hand, what are everyone's thoughts to extending the cross over piece a bit to cover the star post completely?

ok, this side-by-side (or above-below) comparison is for the caffeine deprived
brought to you by the number '2' and the letter 'c'

original:
joust cross over.JPG

proposed:
joust cross over (proposed).jpg

31 jan 2014 update:
picked up the new test plastics this morning. will check them for fit tonight. if all looks good, the next phase will be running a direct printed set to check all of the artwork. based on the time line of working with the laser cutting company, look for updates on a bi-monthly basis.

and since I managed to solve our critical layout issue early last week, we will still be able to get the yield per full 4'x8' sheet of PETG that we originally planned. (that was a 2+ hour puzzle that I don't want to relive!) the image on page 1 of this thread representing the original layout had to be completely scraped due to the lack of a bleed area as well as additional space required between each piece to prevent distortion from the laser.

the upside to this is that we don't have to worry about increasing the price per set by almost 50%

we've still got some "extra" space left to work with, so we may include a few bonus items (in addition to the extra set of playfield sling, outlane and cross over plastics)

on the crossover piece:
we plan to correct the color transition to match the playfield below the section in question as well as extend the edge to cover up the transparent red post and screw below it. I think that the change compliments the overall outline of the plastic and how it was meant to cover all of the elastic areas underneath.

and with regards to our change to eliminate the potential breaking point at the narrowest point of the plastic, I believe that our solution completely resolves the issue. I'll post a few photos tomorrow.

a few photos of the crossover piece as promised

IMG_2915.JPGIMG_2917.JPGIMG_2919.JPGIMG_2921.JPG

yeah, that would be great, wouldn't it?

here's a look at the change to the crossover. it still need a bit of tweaking in the transitioning of the colors to match the playfield, but for a first shot, it's looking pretty darn good

IMG_2925.JPG

19 feb 2014 (micro update):
new die-lines were submitted this past sunday with what is hopefully the last set of changes. I hope to have the new set of test plastics in hand for the weekend.

if everything fits well, we'll move onto a set of 0.80" thick PETG samples that are direct printed to start verifying the artwork and test the bend for the aprons.

edit (21 feb 2014):
picked up the plastics this morning. hooray, they were laser cut this time and not routed. will check fit tonight or tomorrow morning (pinball league tonight)

will post pics of them on my playfield tomorrow as well

22 feb feb 2014 update
here's a pretty good photo that shows where we're at with most of the plastics in place on my machine (upright in service mode since the aprons are not bent yet)

IMG_2945.JPG

we're pretty happy with the fit at this point (with just a few minute adjustments which we will roll out with the next test set, along with cutting them on the final .080" thick PETG and applying the artwork on using a direct print method (just for image placement testing).

we also hope to run a 2nd set and have it screened in one color to test how the screened ink on the aprons will hold up to the required bending (testing for shrinkage, cracking, etc...)

not me. the real hero is jim smith who has pored countless hours into the artwork to make this happen

no, because currently the test plastics are being produced at a thickness of .040" (half of what the production plastics will be). it's cheaper to use the thinner material to get all of the fit testing out of the way. the next run will be with the final .080" thick PETG

just a head's up:
the next update won't be for another 2-3 weeks (mr. smith is currently busy an unable to make our next batch of necessary changes), however it should be worth the wait since the photos of the next test set of plastics will be the final product thickness 0.080" and direct screened with the artwork. with this set, everyone will *finally* be able to see exactly what they will look like on their machine.

I still have no final pricing or a set date for the completion and availability of the product (which is why I haven't opened up pre-orders yet), but we are seeing light at the end of the tunnel and believe that the still required changes are very small and we hope include all of them with this next test set. our fingers are crossed that these are the last few hiccups preventing us from moving forward and producing the final screened product with only the bending of the aprons to conquer

thank you everyone for your support and patience so far!!

if you'd like brett, I can ship your plastics out like a "beer of the month club" and stretch out your receiving the entire set over the period of a year! LOL

although, to be honest, I really do want to get this finished so that I can go back to working on another [super secret] project which has been in the planning stages for the past 18 months

just an fyi for all joust owners:
if you're looking for new (or better looking) black oxide carriage bolts to hold the coin door and marquee plastics, this ebay seller has the correct bolts. he sells them in lots of 5 with the sems lock washers for $1.00 plus shipping and he combines shipping costs.

ebay.com link: 8 32 X 3 4 BLACK FINISH CARRIAGE BOLTS PACK OF 5

all 15 should be black oxide. I already purchased and received from this seller, so I know that these are the correct parts.

at one point, I owned 3 jousts (at the same time) and they all had black oxide bolts. mine were just a bit on the 'could be nicer' side, so for the price I figured it was well worth the purchase price and given that we're getting closer to actually releasing the plastics, I thought that I would share my good fortune in finding these.

I believe (and you can't quote me on this, because all of mine had different options), that the original machines were shipped with the white nylon acorn nuts for the playfield plastics. that's what the flyer shows as well.

I've been using the rubber "barrel" shaped post caps, because I wanted to stay away from anything metal which might pop off and then scratch the playfield, but they don't really work all that well (they end up drying out over time and then don't stay on the posts).

I picked up a set of the white nylon acorn nuts for mine for when the project is done. I figure, I'll set it up just like the flyer. and since it's been huo only for the past 15+ years, it's not like it gets a ton of play.

mar 12 2014 mini update
mr. smith and I went over the parts this past weekend and found a few more inconsistencies/mistakes that williams made with the originals. we've implemented some [minor] corrections with what we hope will be the last run of test plastics for fit (which I hope to have in my hands by the end of this week)

we're also moving forward with producing a set of test aprons on .080" thick PETG which will be screened with color and white masking and then bent to see how the inks react to the bending process. we hae 2 ways to perform the bend and will see which one works best.

if everything goes as expected, the next set of [complete] test plastics will be produced on .080" PETG and direct screen printed. I'll post photos of them when I receive them.
note: the reason why this hasn't been done to date is that each direct screened run is pretty pricey. we're trying to keep the final [per set] costs down because no one wants to pay more than they have to

and finally, I should be able to nail down a price per set soon. we know exactly what our yield is and how many screens that we need to run. the only outstanding cost lies with the bending process. once we have that set in stone, pricing will be set and a reservation list will form to gauge how many sets we will be producing.

mar 13 2014 update
I picked up our first set of .080" thick PETG test plastics early this morning (it's kind of a pain having to get up at 5:30am and travel 20 mins in the opposite direction of work since their shop closes well before I'm out of work, but that's part of the cost of doing business

fingers crossed that the minute changes & corrections that we made this time around will pay off and we can run the direct printed set in the next week or 2. additionally, we discussed (at length) all of the requirements needed for the bend testing, so hopefully we're on track to conquer the final hurdle of this project

the results are that a few of our changes have paid off but we still need to make 2-3 more corrections. we still need to determine if we want to risk moving forward or run one more set of un-screened plastics for fit.

(on second thought we'll probably run one more clear test set, it's better to be safe than sorry and it will only push the completion of the project back by 1 week)

ps
the .080" thick PETG that all of the machines use today is a bit thicker than the original materials used by williams for joust, however it should also strength the pieces

btw, one of the [corrections] that we've made was to expand the length of the last slotted hole on the crossover plastic (the bottom one near the lava kickout) so that you can actually use all 3 playfield post holes to open or close up the right side out lane

yep, it's all about girth
bert (facepalm).jpg

scott,
how many of the drop targets do you need?