(Topic ID: 145461)

Game Plan: "24VDC" is about 17% high

By swampfire

8 years ago


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  • 14 posts
  • 3 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 8 years ago by swampfire
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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#1 8 years ago

I'm getting 28 volts DC at my coils, and as a result, my Andromeda is way too rowdy. The ball hits the glass constantly, and I'm surprised I haven't broken a drop target. I confirmed that the transformer is configured for a 115V AC source, with COM connected to 1 and 4 connected to 4A. My other DC voltages are good.

Is this normal, and if so is there a trick to taming the coils? I thought about putting a 20W cement resistor in series with the output of the bridge rectifier, to drop the voltage down.

I have the power supply / transformer assembly here at my desk, so I can experiment without risking the game.

#2 8 years ago

I'm also reading 14 volts AC at the 24V test point. I'm swapping out the middle bridge rectifier to see if this helps.

#3 8 years ago

Okay, I found the root cause: the transformer' secondary winding is putting out 34 VAC, instead of 28. I guess I'll hit up eBay for a replacement.

#4 8 years ago

The 28 volts does not sound high when the circuit is not under load. The voltage readings are typically nominal, so a higher reading like on the transformer is not automatically an issue.

I would test the bridge rectifier before replacing it. If a diode is shorted in the bridge it will be pretty obvious. I'm finding it hard to believe there is 28 VDC and 14 VAC at the test point. Some cheap meters can give pretty wacky readings when reading ripple on a DC circuit. What type of meter are you using and how did you test for AC?

#5 8 years ago

Yes, the existing bridge rectifier tested fine once I pulled it. I swapped in a new one with a 35A rating. My DMM is a Klein Tools MM200, not too fancy but it did cost me about $50-60. I tested for DC and AC voltages the same way: with the black lead on the ground TP, and the red lead on the 24V TP. I just used the DMM's "FUNC" button to switch between DC and AC.

I've got a Bally transformer / PSB (Skateball), so I'll look at what voltages I see there. I'm hoping that Bally and Game Plan used the same transformer (edit: nope).

#6 8 years ago

I really don't think you have a voltage problem. The 24 volt solenoid suppy reading at 28 volts when not under load is not surprising, and I can't think of any way you could have 14 volts AC on the same test point so that only leaves a meter issue. If you check AC at that point with the meter set to the lowest AC range I would bet you get a reading in the milli-volts rather than 14 volts.

Personally I would look for the mechanical reasons as to why you are getting air balls.

#7 8 years ago
Quoted from terryb:

If you check AC at that point with the meter set to the lowest AC range I would bet you get a reading in the milli-volts rather than 14 volts.

[EDIT] I just re-checked, see pic below.

My biggest problem was that the ball would smack the glass every time it came out of the trough (into the plunger lane), and sometimes even jump up between the glass and the playfield and get stuck (!). I solved that by putting a 5 ohm, 10W cement resistor in series with the return lug.

The airballs aren't too surprising, since Andromeda is loaded with drop targets mid-playfield. I just wish I could calm down the flippers a bit. I've adjusted the EOS switches so that they open as soon as possible, but the flippers are still too strong. I know, nice problem to have.

#8 8 years ago
Quoted from terryb:

The 24 volt solenoid suppy reading at 28 volts when not under load is not surprising [...]

Sorry, I forgot to mention that I measured this at the flipper coil, with a game in progress (everything connected).

#9 8 years ago

Brady Miller's manual does indicate that the "24V" can be +/- 6 volts, so I agree that it's within "normal" range. I wonder if I could add a cement power resistor in series with the 24V output of that bridge rectifier, to drop it down.

#10 8 years ago

OK, I am reading 14.57 VAC with my cheap DMM, but I think that's just because it's a rectified sine wave - this is not a true DC signal.

IMG_7464.jpgIMG_7464.jpg

#11 8 years ago
Quoted from swampfire:

OK, I am reading 14.57 VAC with my cheap DMM, but I think that's just because it's a rectified sine wave - this is not a true DC signal.

Correct. I presume that's an auto-ranging meter which also adds to the problem. Keep in mind that meters where never designed to read AC ripple on DC.

So we agree there is no problem, but you still want to reduce the coil power? I'm not that familiar with GamePlan, I don't suppose there's a way in the settings to change the coil power? Can you buy lower powered coils for the game? Is the game leveled properly?

Can you post a photo of the power supply schematic?

#12 8 years ago
Quoted from terryb:

but you still want to reduce the coil power?

I don't know how you'd check GamePlan. But is it wired for your outlet voltage ? If outlet is 120 and game wired for 100, coils will be stronger.

LTG : )™

#13 8 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

is it wired for your outlet voltage ? If outlet is 120 and game wired for 100, coils will be stronger.

I'm getting 122 at the outlet, and the transformer is wired for 115. So that alone accounts for a 6% boost in coil power. No option for 120.

Quoted from terryb:

So we agree there is no problem, but you still want to reduce the coil power? I'm not that familiar with GamePlan, I don't suppose there's a way in the settings to change the coil power? Can you buy lower powered coils for the game? Is the game leveled properly? Can you post a photo of the power supply schematic?

Yes, I want to reduce the coil power at the flippers, pops and slings. It's an early SS pin, so there's no way to adjust coil strength via the settings. The game is at about a 4.5% incline.

I'm leaning toward adding a rheostat in series with the 24VDC output of the bridge. What power rating would I need for a 2.5k ohm rheostat?

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