Galactic Tank Force (DE)
American Pinball, 2023
Galactic Tank Force (LE)
American Pinball, 2023You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider MrSanRamon.
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Quoted from Vino:When does this ship?
Yes, I'm getting a bit impatient too.
I have a Deluxe on order, from hour 1, but my distributor doesn't get the first ones made. He waits until about 100 - 200 are made, then he takes his deliveries.
He says that way the bugs are worked out in the manufacturing process, though in this case I'd expect most issues to be worked out with the LE's.
Robert
Quoted from pinballinreno:Get these: https://www.actionpinball.com/parts.php?item=A-18530-6R Should have put these in from the start.
Ray Johnson at Action Pinball used to be on Pinside years ago. Gave lots of tips and help. I still buy from him occasionally, but since I've sold my all older games I don't need many replacement parts anymore.
Ray's a good guy, I miss him on Pinside.
Robert
My Deluxe is planned to be drop shipped later this week. I was told that I'd be getting the bracket reinforcement when the are manufactured.
Looking forward to playing this. Could possibly arrive late next week or soon after.
Robert
Do you have to do something to make the cow target work?
I've hit it many times and it always comes up as no cows saved.
Robert
Quoted from Bos98:If it’s a deluxe you need to add a D so GTFDXXX
Thanks!
Quoted from flynnibus:start with the switch test diagnostics and confirm it's opening and closing as expected.
One of the wires to the cow switch was broken. The wire was stretched until broke at to solder joint when the target moved. There was no slack in the wiring, so I had to cut one of the harness cable ties to get some.
It's a crowded area around the switch, but I was able to reach in and reattach the wire without any collateral damage.
If any of other games harness are routed and tied like mine was, this could be an issue for them too.
Robert
I'm going to ask questions and list issues as I find them. Using latest s/w I downloaded yesterday.
When I let ball 2 just drain after hitting Nothing on launch, I got a ball save message but no ball serve. I had to turn it off and on to get the game to serve another ball in a new game.
Is the game supposed to randomly serve a ball into the shooter lane while you're playing a ball? Mine has done that a few times.
The shooter rod is binding on something or the bearing is bad. I've lubed it twice with silicone and I still have issues getting the ball over to the LAB switches.
Is it possible to turn down the stadium lights?
Robert
More comments:
Why do some of the balls ejected into the server get automatically shot and why do some just sit there during a game?
I sometimes get 2 balls ejected into the server during a game, and they just sit there until the plunge them.
Since there are no rules published, I have no clue if what’s happening during a game is supposed to be happening or it’s a bug or glitch. Or what’s supposed to be happening and doesn’t.
There is sometimes an inordinate amount of time when a ball is in a gobble hole, before something happens. Sometimes so long that I think the game has locked up. This may just be a software timing issue, hopefully not a lack of processing power.
I have maybe 30 games played and I am starting to get airballs over the slings.
The game is pretty fun but these issues have me really wanting another software update.
Robert
I get this fairly often and it's kinda annoying...this ball will probably fall through the lucky break but many times it gets "stuck " between the flipper, the lucky break wire, the rubber ring post and the up post. So the flipper can't go back to the rest position and one side of the playfield can't be hit. It's definitely an odd arrangement.
Has anyone started a rules list for GTF yet?
For me the game is so fast that I have little idea of why things happen. A couple times I have gotten an almost endless multiball session. There's 2 balls, then 3, then 4, then I guess 6, then 2, then?...over and over again. I score lots of points, but don't know exactly why.
I really think that 6 balls on that small of a playfield (between the flippers and the tank) is too many. I end up hitting 3 sometimes 4 balls simultaneously. There's no accuracy doing that.
Robert
Quoted from Wild_duck:Doesn’t exist that I know of. I didn’t have one in my box either.
I will tell you my experience with hot wheels. If you're waiting for a manual it's gonna be a while.
I suspect that american pinball does not have enough people to generate a decent manual. If you're expecting a manual with a parts list and pictures of assemblies, I don't think that's going to happen.
Go to the american pinball website and look at the manual's page.. Take a look at the Hot Wheels Manual and then take a look at the Houdini manual.
More than likely we're going to get a manual like hot wheels. Eventually, we're going to need parts And we really need the manual to contain pictures of assemblies with part numbers.
Hopefully Ferret will address this.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:Have you watched the AP video on the rules
No...I expect the rules to be printed in the manual, like Williams manuals were.
Then you would know both how to plan a playing tactic AND help in troubleshooting your game should need be.
Robert
Quoted from Vino:but they are digital these days.
Yes, I should have said "included in the manual".
Robert
Quoted from John_I:My recent Stern games have great manuals that show every assembly down to the nut and bolt level...
The last few American Pinball games don't have that level, so I suspect GTF won't either.
Robert
Does anyone who has had the game for awhile, when you are playing a 4 ball or more multiball...do you have a good idea what you are hitting (other than the tank)?
Robert
Quoted from luvthatapex2:Maybe this will help. Rules for the multiballs and everything else and what to hit
Thanks, I looked at pinwiki about it week ago and there was nothing there.
Appreciate the response.
Robert
What exactly are the correct flipper alignments?
I looked on the website and looked at the Houdini manual (the most complete) and didn't find anything.
Given the hole location, I assume that the correct alignment is where my left flipper is. The game came with them misaligned, so I'm not sure which is factory.
I'm going to align them how I want, but I'm just curious.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:I had the same problem on my game and my buddies game.
Did you find a solution?
I'm curious to know, before I start tearing things apart...so I can have any parts needed on hand.
I can get the ball into the lab switches when I manually plunge about 10% of the time.
Robert
Ferret...if the manual guys need a template, look here:
https://www.chicago-gaming.com/product/manuals/coin-op-pinball
Robert
Quoted from Sorokyl:Who do you think is going to make the drawings? and create a manual? I
All of the information that American pinball needs to generate parts assembly drawings with a BOM already exists in their CAD drawings.
It is a simple process to copy and paste from a drawing to a *.pdf format. An engineering summer student from a nearby college or High School could generate the mechanical parts section easily with minimal instruction and cost.
Robert
Quoted from rodcom:Stuck balls….the middle post can’t go down
I'm not sure the dual posts with the up/down post was the best idea.
Maybe no 2 side posts and a single post between the flippers, like some of the williams games had. It would make the ball congestion at the flippers go away.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:On my game, the atomic shield sometimes sticks up since the hole is rather tight around the white up post rubber.
At first mine appeared to get stuck fairly often, but now it's working better but I can tell that there is still a bit too much friction.
I hate to have to take the game apart when it's so new, so I haven't done so yet.
Robert
Quoted from rodcom:Stuck balls….the middle post can’t go down, thr flippers can’t go up during ball search so guess what have to take the glass off to fix. Frustrating and not fun in the middle of a fun game.
[quoted image]
You could probably wait a bit for the game to go into ball search.
Robert
Quoted from billsfanmd:How this was not picked up during design and play testing makes no sense. Seems a new designer would avoid this potential design. All that said hoping to add this game when the dust settles.
According to Rocketreach.co, American Pinball has 16 employees. Not sure what that means, 16 employees and a bunch of part timers and contract hires. Hopefully not 16 total people!
My sense after owning both Hot Wheels and GTF is that the company is small.
It seems to me that GTF was an idea that was either rushed into production too fast or that it was designed and built with minimal adult supervision.
Don't get me wrong, this is a very fun game but with some design features that could have been thought out better.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:I also removed the two post near it for about a week but I recently just reinstalled them.
What did you think of game play while they were out?
Robert
Quoted from flynnibus:Because it is extremely unlikely and almost questionable.
Yes, but other than the ball in the center I've had a similar configuration. Basically you know that the balls are going to drain when the post retracts, so you just hit the remaining ball/balls until it happens...with limited flipper motion.
Robert
Quoted from rodcom:here is the two ball version of the stuck situation from Sunday
I've had this happen, but always had another ball in play. So when the post dropped the balls would drain.
Robert
Quoted from Sorokyl:I'm confused... the top ball is not even touching the black rubber of the post. What two things is the ball wedged between?
I'd appreciate an explanation too.
Robert
Quoted from flynnibus:Balls getting trapped below the flipper to nerf bars etc is nothing new. Nor is a flipper trapping a ball. But that kind of configuration shown here is nothing like random trapping. Seems contrived
Just a clarification, I have never seen this and it does seem to defy odds.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:I was having the same problem with my Atomic shield up post assembly. The hole is too tight and the Atomic shield white rubber did not always fully retract into the playfield. It would stick up and the ball will stop on top of it and the posts. I removed my assembly, made the hole slightly larger and it is no longer an issue. My game is an early built game so maybe the later games already have a larger hole.
Clear coat in the hole? Mine sticks a bit still...but not enough to take it apart.
Robert
Quoted from rosh:Game was in development, at AP, for close to two and a half years which was far, far longer than any other AP game.
I was chatting with matt christiano yesterday about GTF. He confirmed what I thought I knew about the game. Nordman has been trying to get this made for about 20 years. He shopped it around to get it made...Stern turned him down, not sure of any others.
I never saw a proto or Whitewood, so I don't know what it looked like when you started.
How did the game get though 2 years of development when about 3 weeks after deliveries you found out that the standups were bending and needed reinforcement?
Other than Nordman who thought it was a good idea to have 2 nerf bar guides, 2 stationary posts and a large up/post in the flipper area? This is different and odd to me. Maybe there is another game like this, but I've never played it.
Everyone who sees it agrees my deluxe is a beautiful machine.
It's a fun game until I still get air balls over the flippers or I get balls jammed beneath the flippers.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:Robert - Did you install the 2-piece kit that AP should have sent to you? It eliminated all the air ball problems that I had. You can also pull (unscrew) the 2 post near the flippers. The game plays fine without them.
Yes. Had about 15 games on the game before I got the 2 piece kit.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:Robert - Did you install the 2-piece kit that AP should have sent to you? It eliminated all the air ball problems that I had. You can also pull (unscrew) the 2 post near the flippers. The game plays fine without them.
Today I had to adjust the magnet in front of the Tank.
Before I put the glass on I went to coil test and moved the post up and down a bunch of times. It seems to be good now.
Also, my shooter rod seems to have worn whatever was rubbing on it. I did give another shot of silicone. It's almost free enough to actually try a skill shot. Before when I pulled the rod all the way back, the ball would barely make it to the top of the playfield.
Robert
Today I had to adjust the magnet in front of the Tank.
When I lifted the playfield i saw the issue, the lock nut had backed off about 3 turns and the magnet was about a quarter turn below the playfield surface.
I suggest that if you raise the playfield, to check that the lock nut on the 2 magnets are tight. Also check that the magnets are flush with the playfield surface.
The lock nut I tightened did not have any locktite on it.
Robert
Quoted from Big_Whoopin:Even with the added support they're still bending back on that machine.
Yes, I have this issue too, air balls still occur just not as many.
I find mine & others target tipping to be in direct contrast to Ferret: "My whitewood has hundreds, maybe thousands, of plays, and the targets are nice and straight".
I've struggled with this especially since I've installed the kit and the issue seems to continue.
It could be that the material changed, the hardness changed, material thickness changed or the design changed. I can't see a "thousand" plays and no bending verses on my machine maybe 50 plays with bending, with the same configuration.
The strap idea could work if it's thickness was on the order of that of the kit bracket. I'm not sure why the original bracket wasn't solid, without slots at each switch. That would have probably been strong enough.
I want to let American Pinball that there are a couple things that I appreciate about this game.
1. Ease of s/w updates
2. Screws instead of nuts in many places
3. Long threads on some plastics attachments.
I was doing some work on the game and used my magnet and found these. Not sure where the thumb screw goes.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:The large screw on the right is from the coin door.
Thanks.
Quoted from BAMcDonald:I’ve had my GTF LE for a bout 5 days and figured I’d share a list of helpful adjustments made so far.
Nice synopsis!
Robert
Quoted from BAMcDonald:Sadly the "support" bracket below the playfield has not done much to keep the targets from bending backward
I have experienced the same.
I believe that the root cause is the design of the original switch bracket.
There are "fingers" because that facilitates the easy fab of the bracket. With a curved surface, from flat, the openings are to allow the bend into a curve simpler. As the curve is bent, the space between the fingers increases. This is a simple fab method.
There are a couple ways to make the bracket stronger. Manufacture it with a solid switch section...ie without fingers.
To do this it would take probably 2 stamping steps with better tooling.
Conversely, it could be manufactured like it is and in a secondary operation add a thick curved stap to the fingers.
In any case I believe that the bracket material needs to be upped.
What I may try is to cut a strip of high durometer rubber behind the switches, after I remove the gray foam rebound material.
Presently I believe that the soft foam is just compressing and allowing the switches to bend back.
It's unfortunate that such a predominant toy on the playfield is currently prone to such issues as to make playing the game less than enjoyable at times.
Robert
Quoted from BAMcDonald:What I did was fabricate a piece of plastic to insert behind the targets to support them above the playfield.
Nice idea!
I am working on a solution to reinforce the grey foam by putting a rubber piece in front of them. I took a red flipper rubber I had and cut it to length.
Then I placed it ahead of the grey foam directly against the targets.
There are no more airballs, but the continuous red rubber strip is causing the tank targets to not register all the time.
So I took an exacto knife and sliced the rubber strip between targets. Still no airballs and all of the switch hits register.
But since there are now loose segment of strip, the end piece on one edge started to come out. So I think I'll put some adhesive on the strip segments and call it good for now.
Robert
Quoted from Ballderdash:There must be some alignment and stop/end point adjustment to that mechanism. I had to learn how to lower a drop target for the first time on HW and LTG had my back. Raise the playfield and take a look from underneath.
I took a quick look as I was heading out the door. But I didn't see any height adjustment, by glancing at the assembly. Yes, a bit more investigation is needed.
Robert
A note to everyone, my magnet in front of the Tank was low, again. I guess it slipped when I tightened it or it became loose over time.
This will cause playfield damage if it's not corrected.
The next time the glass is off, check it out. The magnet top should be flush with the playfield surface.
I used a 1-1/8 socket to loosen the lock nut.
By the way, both of the adjustable magnets are NOT perpendicular to the playfield. The magnets on my Williams games were always perpendicular, so I know it can be done.
There is also no thread locker used, so I suspect that the nuts will become loose over time.
Robert
Quoted from SpacelySpliffs:Anybody have plunger issues out of the box?
I did also. So did others.
When reported here, there was no response from American Pinball. They seem to ignore anything that they (Ferret) probably don't understand or know what to do about.
Ferret does s/w, almost all of the problems and issues are mechanical. I think that it would be better if someone from mechanical design spent time with this thread.
Robert
Quoted from billsfanmd:you literally needed a torque wrench with length to break the seal on the double nuts.
Yes, I had the same issue with a couple Stern games. On one I ended up cutting off the nut with a Dremel. I suspect that they used a Thread locker (probably Loctite) that was too strong or they used too much.
I was noting that w/o some locking method, that the nut could come loose and the magnet move out of position. I don't think that a liquid locker is the best option. I'll probably double nut the assembly and call it good.
Robert
Quoted from luvthatapex2:Ferret replying to this thread is a courtesy and because he has passion in what he does, but he is under no obligation to do so.
Whether he's obligated or not isn't what I wrote.
If someone from American Pinball wants to hang out in this topic, I think that person should be mechanical.
Sure there is a "ticket" process, but if everyone stopped posting their issues and their efforts to address them here there would be no group knowledge. Also, every issue would then have to be addressed by American Pinball over and over using the ticket process.
This thread is about their game, so it would benefit American Pinball if they addressed the multiple issues that are presented here in this thread.
Robert
Quoted from Method_Own:Same. Haven’t sorted it yet
I feel your pain.
I used a bit of Silicone lube on it. Probably made 4 applications as it dissipated over time.
It's getting better, but it's useless to try for a skill shot as the plunger output is still so variable. It may work out for you too if you just wait for the assembly to wear in.
I posted this issue here quite awhile ago, to see if others have seen this too...and to possibly get a response from American Pinball. To date there's been no response.
I didn't and still don't want to start ripping my game apart to diagnose the issue, then attempt to generate a solution.
Maybe some game owners can post their experiences.
Robert
Quoted from transprtr4u:post this in the CCR thread ... you will get crickets !
That's not true, Lloyd (LTG) is support for CGC and he address issues as they arise in that thread.
Robert
Quoted from Big_Whoopin:MrSanRamon had you seen my post
I saw it and was amazed at the thoroughness of your investigation and solution. Did you ever get a response from American Pinball about extra stickers?
My puck moves up and down freely. It just moves up too far and a side of the bottom of it catches on the top of the playfield. It's also a bit recessed when it's down.
I need to take a look at the assembly to see if I can make some adjustments. I hope I don't have to remove the sticker as I'm not as patient as you.
Robert
Quoted from transprtr4u:never hear anyone for CGC directly reply
Lloyd is support for CGC and is therefore responding as CGC. He is also posting solutions for everyone to see.
American Pinball has no such person, as far as I can tell, so we wallow around trying to find solutions that should be addressed by AP support.
If American Pinball generates a solution through the ticket process and no one posts what that solution is here, then everyone would need to go to the trouble of generating a ticket...for a problem already solved.
Most of the issues are mechanical, so if there was a mechanical support person that could address issues posted here, that would help us greatly.
Robert
Quoted from flynnibus:You should have used heat - that's the way you undo threadlocker
Yes I know, but on that particular game there was too much around the assembly to use a torch or heat gun and it was too massive to use a soldering iron (or at least the one I had).
Robert
Quoted from SpacelySpliffs:On a full plunge we can barely get the ball past the top spinner
Ok, there is a solution to this binding issue. If you have binding, the assembly was probably assembled incorrectly at the factory.
First, the plastic "beehive" is the support and the bearing for the shooter rod. There is no Oillite bearing employed.
If you lift the playfield and rest it on the backbox, take a look at the shooter assembly from the inside.
There are 2 Phillips screws that hold the assembly against the cabinet. You can also see a metal piece that the screws and shooter rod feed through. It's this metal piece that is probably resting on the shooter rod...and probably on the top of the rod.
You can pull the spring back to see how the piece is relative to the rod. There should be clearance all around.
If its rubbing on the bottom of the rod, loosen the 2 screws slightly and tap the metal piece down a bit to give clearance on the bottom of the rod. Then retighten the screws.
If you have no clearance on the top of the rod, do the following. There is not enough clearance from a sensor at the bottom of the metal piece to get a screwdriver in there to push the piece up.
What I did was loosen the 2 screws enough so you can slightly move the metal piece, but not too much as to make the piece too loose. I grabbed the end of the rod at the rubber tip and pulled it up. While holding the rod up I tightened the 2 screws. After tightening the screws I tried the shooters performance and it now moved freely with no binding.
Note: if you take the assembly apart and remove the plastic piece, the hole in it is drilled at an angle. When reassembling the plastic piece, the shooter rod should point up slightly, instead of pointing down slightly.
Hope this helps anyone that is observing this issue.
Robert
Quoted from Ballderdash:There must be some alignment and stop/end point adjustment to that mechanism. I had to learn how to lower a drop target for the first time on HW and LTG had my back. Raise the playfield and take a look from underneath.
There is no adjustment to limit up travel.
What I did didn't fix the issue, but made the issue of the puck getting caught on the top of the playfield happen less.
I took the assembly off the game to inspect it.
Thanks American Pinball for putting plugs on the coils! That helps so much with working of the game.
I replaced the assembly with 2 washers under the bracket, then adjusted the puck to be flush with the playfield surface. When I tried it out, the puck bottom still was above the playfield surface, but not as much.
I suspect that a better solution would be to remove the sticker and remove the puck, then cut down the plastic piece at the end of the armature/plunger. But I don't have another sticker.
If anyone else has this issue, let me know what you did or plan to do.
Robert
PS: And yes, I did generate a "ticket".
Quoted from Tommy-dog:My shooter rod has a lot of wobble in the white beehive housing.
I think that plastic wear will be an issue in the future, on all of the games.
When I looked at the insides of the beehive piece, it didn't look like there was adequate plastic to bore it out and put in an Oilite bushing.
I suppose with some ingenuity, a plastic piece could be fabricated to surround the existing bore...or a hardening material, like epoxy poured in. If its an ancillary plastic piece, it could be glued in...using either solution it could then be bored out and a bushing inserted.
Or American Pinball could make a better replacement part and save us a lot of effort.
In any case, when they become available, I'm going to purchase another beehive to have as a spare.
Robert
Quoted from SpacelySpliffs:wondered about losing the beehive and just changing the whole assembly to the normal style with the plate and bushing
I thought about this too, but kind of hate losing the look of the current assembly.
If I was going to use a historically standard assembly, I'd use probably use this one:
https://www.pinballlife.com/stern-ball-shooter-assembly.html
I think I have one of these in a box in the garage. If I get up the energy, I'll pull it down and see if it would fit...which it probably would physically. Not sure if the shooter rod would line up with the ball in the trough though, using this replacement assembly.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:My shooter rod has a lot of wobble in the white beehive housing. On my other games there is a sleeve bushing in the housing. I tried to add one but it would not fit.
Not sure if these would fit GTF...might be worth the effort to contact AP to see what they know.
https://www.marcospecialties.com/control/keywordsearch?SEARCH_STRING=beehive
https://www.pinballlife.com/search.html?Search=beehive
Robert
EDIT:
I just found this on Pinball life for the white beehive:
"White beehive shooter housing.
Used in some Gottlieb, Classic Stern, Chicago Coin, Classic Stern, Game Plan & American Pinball machines.
Classic Stern - #4A-115-W 48WA
Chicago Coin - 16519-W
Game Plan - 03-40010N
Gottlieb - 48WA
American Pinball - RND0206-00"
Quoted from Tommy-dog:My shooter rod has a lot of wobble in the white beehive housing. On my other games there is a sleeve bushing in the housing. I tried to add one but it would not fit.
I just purchased both the red and white beehives from pinball life. I'll let you know how they work after they arrive.
Robert
Quoted from LORDDREK:Tell me those bent looking legs are an optical illusion…
Bowlegged version...
Quoted from SpacelySpliffs:I took the rubber tip off the shooter rod and 2 washers exactly like that were in the tip.
That's odd.
Robert
Quoted from Big_Whoopin:Hey all, I've published my tank target support models!
I ordered my parts today, from a local 3D printing company.
Robert
Quoted from Big_Whoopin:Hey all, I've published my tank target support models!
My parts are in production, I chose black as this was going to be the fastest apparently.
Hopefully I'll get them early next week.
Robert
Quoted from SpacelySpliffs:looks like they're meant to give the tip a bit more reach.
Maybe Ferret can comment on this...my game seems to play fine without them being installed.
Robert
Quoted from MrSanRamon:My puck moves up and down freely. It just moves up too far and a side of the bottom of it catches on the top of the playfield. It's also a bit recessed when it's down.
I submitted a ticket a couple days ago and got a response from Kevin yesterday.
Today I sent him an email with 4 solutions that I came up with and asked his opinion on a path forward.
I'll post my solution when I get one that works.
Robert
Quoted from Ferret:. If your game is working well without them, I wouldn't worry about 'em.
I sent you a PM.
Electronic:
Google play store: Pinball Leveler.
Mechanical:
Amazon: Swanson Tool TL011 9-Inch Speedlite Torpedo Level Yellow
Robert
Quoted from Big_Whoopin:Hey all, I've published my tank target support models!
I pick up my parts Monday morning at the printing company.
Yep, got them this morning and will probably install them tomorrow morning.
Robert
I also posted this in the thread about the 3D printed parts that Craig designed...big thanks to him for doing this work!
I installed the 3D printed parts today.
It wasn't difficult, but I did have to bend the switch brackets a bit (probably 3/16-inch at the tip) to be able to get the 2nd smaller piece to slip in. I used a small socket on an extension, gently tapped it with a hammer to affect the bracket bending.
I played a couple games with no airballs. But I wouldn't expect any, as the switch brackets and switches were now repositioned perpendicular to the playfield. Those 2 pieces should keep the switches positioned properly from now on.
Robert
Quoted from Method_Own:Really teaches recovery skills!
Yes it does!
I've found that when you flip at the tank, keep your flippers up so the bounce back will also bounce off your flippers and give you a chance to continue playing that ball.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:My shooter rod has a lot of wobble in the white beehive housing. On my other games there is a sleeve bushing in the housing. I tried to add one but it would not fit.
Mine also had some looseness to it, so I replaced the beehive with one from Pinball Life: Product ID: 4A-115-W, Beehive Shooter Housing - White.
I took the shooter assembly off the game and used a caliper to measure some dimensions. It's difficult to measure inside holes, especially in plastic, so I used some drill bits to help out.
Shooter Rod: 0.376" OD
Current Beehive: ~0.383" ID
New Beehive: ~0.371" or 0.372" (clear through) About 0.375" each end
The Beehives have a front and a back. I found the holes in both the new and the old have offset centerlines. A drill bit would go into each end, but would not traverse through the other side's hole.
So, the shooter rod wouldn't work with the new Beehive, without some enlarging and straightening the holes in that Beehive.
I ran a 3/8 bit through the plastic and tried the rod again. It barely went through (both holes) and had way too much friction to work properly. I tried reaming it again with similar friction related results.
I checked and the next bit diameter was 25/64 or about 0.390", so too big to use.
So I tried lapping the hole in the Beehive, with the shooter rod and some grit. The only grit I could find was Comet.
So, I chucked the end of the shooter rod in a drill motor, got the rod wet and sprinkled on some comet on the wet rod. I then started the drill motor and moved the beehive up and down the rod. I did this 3 times, then took the setup apart and cleaned everything really well to get off any comet.
This method left a lot of very fine scratches on the rod, they didn't seem to cause any issues but wanted to let you know what I found.
After I cleaned everything up (water, alcohol and paper towels) I sprayed a bit of silicone on the rod and the rod moved freely in the Beehive. A little friction, but what one would expect on a tight fitting assembly. The return spring would have no difficulty in resetting the rod after release.
Then I put the new Beehive back into the game. Remember, the Beehive's through hole is at an angle, be sure to install it so that the rod points up slightly...not down slightly.
The holes in the new Beehive were very tight for the screws, I couldn't get the screws to bottom out and secure the metal plate inside the cabinet...even after I drilled out the holes with a 3/32 bit. So, I ended up putting the 4 spacers on 1 screw and finding another spacer in my box of parts for the other screw. If the assembly becomes loose later, I'll have to go in and rethink the spacer sizes.
One reason that people may have issues with getting the shooter rod assembly aligned correctly is that on my machine the ground braid is under the metal bracket on the inside of the cabinet. This really hoses up the reassembly.
I may have damaged one of the 2 led's (1 above and 1 below the metal bracket. The Beehive lights up before I launch a ball, but goes out after I shoot. It doesn't light up again until I need to shoot a ball again. Someone may have to help me on this, please.
So now my shooter rod has repeatable friction so I can try for a skill shot and it has no excessive wobble to it.
Robert
Quoted from littlecammi:Sounds like you went through an awful lot to get your behive to behave.
Too much really. It was about 2 hours or so from start to finish.
I wanted to see if I could make the shooter assembly work better so I could actually try a skill shot.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:I thought about drilling out the original one so a shooter rod sleeve will fit.
You could try and if you f it up, you can get another one from either AP or Pinball Life.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:I already have a few extras in my parts inventory so I am good to go. I am tempted to just install a regular square base shooter rod assembly but I will try to make the beehive style work first.
The beehive guide looks good, but I understand your frustration.
Because the through hole in the beehive from pinball life was undersized, when enlarged it ended up supporting the rod very well. There's essentially no looseness in my assembly.
I liked the beehive look enough to go through a lot of time to fix this issue and keep that look.
Also, I don't know that a standard square base assembly will work. The beehive has an angled through hole and you need to install it so the rod points slightly up. If a "normal " assembly doesn't have the same rod slope the rod tip won't align properly.
Robert
Quoted from littlecammi:Sounds like you went through an awful lot to get your behive to behave.
Did you get a set of 3d printed parts yet?
Robert
Quoted from Rizmo:Is there a reason this has not been reviewed yet on Pinside? Would really like to see what everyone thinks
The DE has 23 ratings and the LE has 10 ratings.
Go to machines, then search for galactic tank force, then click on the game, then click on ratings...
Robert
Quoted from BAMcDonald:At first I turned the left vuk (Vertical Up Kicker) was not getting the balls up into the lock area a lot of the time
Mine works fine, never had an issue with the left one. I started having issues with the right side because the gray plastic thing had moved into the ball path.
The only suggestion I have is to ensure that the
metal track is directly over the gobble hole (and not loose) and that there are no obstructions in the ball path.
On my game the LAB sign wires are really close to being in the ball path.
If there are no obstructions, I would lift the playfield and inspect the VUK coil assembly, it may be loose. When you're looking there, make sure that the coil is plugged in properly.
Not sure why there is no ball release. Check to see if there is any obstructions to keep the mechanism from operating and that everything is aligned and tight.
Good luck.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:I think the requirement is 50 rankings before a score is given on Pinside. So if you own a GTF, please give it a score.
It's 40...but one can read what has been written to date.
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:Installing a shooter rod sleeve worked
Great, and a much easier path than the one I took!
A couple of other questions...
Is the metal bracket over a grounding braid?
Does your beehive light up all the time or only before you plunge a ball?
Robert
Quoted from HOOKED:have installed the target fix and the airball fix.
Targets bent back after 10 plays.
What are your results?
Those results mimic mine.
The solution that has worked for me has been by installing the 3d printed parts. I used the design that went over the factory fix.
The post in this thread about the 3d parts is about 1 page back.
I had my parts printed locally. Another Pinsider had the parts printed at craftcloud3d.com...which were about half the cost of mine.
Robert
AP has apparently hired 2 new people, the info is here:
https://www.american-pinball.com/news/american-pinball-update-and-new-hires
From their "American Pinball update and new hires!" page:
"Additionally, we are excited to announce that with the brackets issue resolved..."
I think that this is a bit of a stretch..
Robert
I like all of the software suggestions above, but with a new release date of a week or so (according to Ferret) that version is probably in testing.
Perhaps at a future date, additional changes/polishing will occur with these suggestions incorporated.
Looking forward to see what's next for the code. Maybe a lot of the suggestions above are already incorporated in the upcoming update.
Robert
Quoted from Big_Whoopin:I think the three page PDF QRG that is on API's site is all we have thus far.
AP has released 5 games, and only the first 2 have an actual owners manual like Bally, Williams, Stern, etc...have generated.
There is no equivalent manual for Hot Wheels, LOV or GTF...and I suspect that there might never be. While it's not too difficult to generate a manual these days, with drawings now generated in modeling software (I assume that's the case at AP), it would still take time/effort to generate and check.
I can muddle along without a manual, but since there are limited part numbers for parts and assemblies I'm a bit concerned about an adequate supply of parts in places like MARCO, Pinball Life, etc. Many unique parts will have to come from the factory.
As an example, MARCO has 21 parts listed for Hot Wheels, of which 10 are Pin Buddy's.
These posts are for AP to read and maybe do something about; and for enthusiasts to sort of know what to expect. I think that AP sees these as critical and not helpful, and perhaps they are. I hope things improve there.
Robert
Can someone enlighten me as to how the "Atomic Shield" operates?
Sometimes its up for quite awhile when hitting the tank targets, then its down when i hit the tank targets.
I haven't been able to figure out it's operation.
Robert
I can report that after about a month and a half, I still don't have air balls after installing the printed parts that Craig designed (Big_Whoopin).
Craig, thanks again for the effort...and an actual solution to an issue.
Robert
Quoted from HOOKED:I would recommend early owners check to see if there pods are switched.
So i did a check of all my LEDs.
Shooter Lane 5 & 6 are reversed
Robot Flasher Right is out
Also...
Tank Flasher left, right & back work but their locations are depicted incorrectly on the screen.
Robot Flasher Right also has it's location depicted incorrectly on the screen.
I didn't realize there are as many LEDs as there are in the game.
Not sure why the right Robot flasher is out, maybe due to me having to add supports to the tank switches.
Robert
Quoted from djblouw:A couple of oddities I've notice, and wondering if anyone is seeing the same:
1) With the latest code, when reaching the third tank (Did a robot just come out of that tank!?), all lights turn off, except the tank light. Even the expression lights. They stay off for a very long time (~15 seconds), which makes it very difficult to play/find the ball. I don't remember this in the previous code. EDIT: This also occurs on the fifth tank too.
2) When balls enter a VUK (L or R), it take a long time to register/start the video. If you let the video play through it takes another long amount of time to fire the coil. If I cancel the video though double flippers, the ball kicks out almost immediately
3) No music or sounds are played during the match sequence. It's just dead silence. If a video pops up, that has sound, but otherwise it just quiet. Kind of a rough transition from the bumping bass in the game.
4) Ball lock release doesn't always work. Sometimes in multiball it will only release one, and the other two stay in the lock. I have checked for magnetized balls (nope), and also increased the coil strength to max (35). It seems that something isn't right in this area?
1 yes
2 yes...and really annoying (at any activation) when multiple videos play sequentially.
3 don't use match
4 never had an issue with this or with balls being magnetized. Still using original supplied balls.
Robert
Quoted from Disruptor71:I am also the only one without any available manual and rulesheet so far?
There is no real owners manual and there hasen't been for the last 3 AP games.
There is a rules post here:
http://tiltforums.com/t/galactic-tank-force-rulesheet/8473
Robert
Quoted from roscoepinball:It was also shooting 2 balls into the lane and start.
Mine does this too, very occasionally, and usually (always?) during multiball.
This is my analysis (guess):
I think that this is due to the game always trying to immediatly eject and then shoot a ball into the playfield. So during multiball if the game gets 2 inputs to eject and then shoot a ball, the ejects happen so fast that 2 balls end up in the shooter lane before the first can be shot.
So, there may be a way to add a delay (or increase it) between ball ejects. I don't know if it's worth it to try to eliminate this, as it doesn't happen that often. That said, I don't know if I've ever had this happen on a Williams, Bally or Stern game (that I can remember).
Robert
Quoted from gunstarhero:Well I somehow managed to make an even bigger mess of things by going into the bios and trying to reset the settings and now the game doesn't even seem to see the display, I just get a no signal message.
Anyone know if AP support works on weekends?
You are probably going to have to update the BIOS via the USB port, if that's possible.
Call AP. Let us know how you fixed your game.
Robert
Quoted from gunstarhero:Turned out I had disabled the ability for the PC to power on when the game turned on. Just needed to hit the power switch, go back into the bios and re-enable the power on setting.
Too easy!
Robert
Quoted from gunstarhero:don’t mess with the bios
No truer words of warning..
So I've decided that now is going to be the time to fix some of the issues with my game:
1. Shooter lane lamps are wired incorrectly.
2. One of the tank flashers doesn't work.
3. The left VUK works intermittently.
4. The shooter rod still isn't operating smoothly.
5. I may go back to the original two center posts and their rings. The small rings trap the balls and make me shake the game to loosen them.
Robert
I went thru my game this morning and have the following comments, findings and suggestions.
API: PLEASE MAKE THE DIAGNOSTIC FONT LARGER!
The following LED locations are not shown on the diagnostic screen correctly:
Tank Flasher Left, Right & Back.
Same for the Robot Flasher Right.
The screen shows all of them located on the Right Orbit 2(?).
The diagnostics says "Robot Flasher Right" and both the Left & Right Flashers illuminate.
The Right Robot Flasher was out, I replaced it with a green flasher I had on hand. When I went to the manual to find the P/N of the non-working flasher so I could get a replacement...oh yea, no manual.
I corrected the wiring on the 2 lane lamps that were reversed.
I spent about 20 minutes re-routing and securing the under playfield wiring harness.
While I was correcting the harness I noticed the long black circuit board to the left of the left pop bumper has an open connector. All the lights in that area seem to work, so wondering if others have the same.
I burnished my shooter rod, so it now it allows a fairly consistant plunge.
I took out the 2 posts next to the atomic shield and replaced them with these:
On the LHS over the outlane plastic, I removed the existing post and installed this. It's not a trapped ball location anymore. I relocated the screw hole about 0.15 inches toward the coin door.
Mystery P/N green flasher and some plastic tie ends:
I took a look at the Left VUK that has been intermittent a few times. When I touched the switch, it activated fine and seems ok. It isn't loose, so the switch is either flakey or when multiple balls end up in that area the switch plunger doesn't get properly activated. I did nothing for now.
Robert
Quoted from Ferret:Which font are you referring to?
I'm referring to the fonts used in the test menus.
When I was in the LED & Switches Tests menus yesterday, I had some difficulty reading the names.
There is a huge amount of space between the info left & right, so increasing the font size won't cause issues. I see no reason why the letters are so small.
Robert
Quoted from Ferret:At least for Switch Test, there's a non-obvious reason: each column represents a switch board. And some of the switch names pretty much fill the width of their columns already. We could round up some extra pixels here and there, but I don't think we could significantly increase the font size and still display all the information that's on that screen.
Ok, but why are there 6 columns on 1 screen for switch tests, how about 3 columns on 2 screens?
For coil & LED tests I see no obstacles to making the fonts a bit bigger so old guys like me could see them more easily.
The following cropped pics were all taken from the lock down bar on GTF & Cactus Canyon Remake.
20231002_085431~2 (resized).jpg
20231002_085505~2 (resized).jpg
20231002_085354~2 (resized).jpg
20231002_085735~3 (resized).jpg
20231002_085735~2 (resized).jpg
The way CCr was done makes it very easy to see what's necessary.
Just some thoughts as I find the GTF diagnostic screens difficult to read.
Robert
Quoted from billsfanmd:I’m on the fence about trading for this title. Just very nervous about mechanical issues, magnetized balls snd if sales have been enough to warrant them to keep improving code and making parts.
I suspect that unless things change, like AP closes shop, that at least 1 more s/w update will come.
I have s/n 023 deluxe GTF, and am using the original balls. I've noticed no magnetism issues to date.
If it's not already done, I strongly recommend installing the 2-piece printed part to minimize airballs back from the tank. It's an easy install.
I don't know the s/n of the game you are looking at, and whether or not it's a deluxe or LE.
It's a fun game. Why does someone want to trade it so soon? Couldn't have had it much more than 6 months. Is the seller on Pinside? Has the seller posted in this GTF thread?
Robert
Quoted from Tommy-dog:Here is a GTF bug: turn off end of game match. Play a game, and the very end of the game hit both flipper buttons to speed up the end of score stats. The game will lock up (lights and display). This bug has been on the last code update and the current code update. The game will un-freeze IF you press the start button to play another game. The game match has to be TURNED-OFF for this to happen.
I have match shut off and do exactly what you do and I have never had this happen.
Just another issue on a random game.
Makes me wonder if my left VUK not firing is a s/w issue rather than a hardware issue.
If I continue to experience issues, I'll do a factory reset and see if that clears it.
Robert
Well, I had a ball sit in the left VUK during multiball and when all the balls drained (except that one) the game just sat there.
So after about 30 seconds, opened the coin door and went into switch test. This is what I found:
It appered to be continuous intermittent activation of the "Tank Home" switch.
I then slid down the glass to reach the tank. I tried to get the intermittent activation to cease. If I moved it and held it in a few orientations, it would stop. As soon as I let go, it would start again.
As you may be able to see, the left VUK is activated. When I activated the top lane roll overs they would show up on the LHS of the screen, but the intermittent activation never stopped and didn't show them in the RHS.
If I grabbed the tank and twisted it, the intermittent would stop and a roll over switch activation would show on both the RHS & LHS. When I let go the intermittent would start again.
When I went out of test, the game activated the left VUK and the ball (ball one) drained and the game was over and the dimmed multiball lights were activated back to full illumination.
I rebooted the game and went back into switch test and the Tank Home switch had stopped intermittent activation.
I'm not sure what happened with the "Tank Home" switch. Previously, 2 months ago, I went through all the switches and that switch was ok as far as I can remember.
A bit puzzled as to why during a game it was intermittent and not after reboot. Could it have something to do with game instigated tank movement during play?
So it seems that if a switch is intermittent, that it interferes with the games ability to read other switch activations.
I guess I need to disassemble the tank and figure out what the problem is.
Robert
Josh,
Thanks for the response. I did get most of the issues worked out.
After some thought, I took a look at the quick reference sheet for GTF. After some study, I thought it had to be a wiring issue.
So I did some harness shaking, and found that a connector was now only partially connecting. So I re-seated it and the intermittent activations went away.
I still have the issue where the 2 VUKs can get jammed with multiple balls. I suppose a solution is to ramp up the power. Though I think that when another ball rests against the ball in the VUK, the ball is shifted to the side and lifted enough so not to activate the switch.
Thanks again for the response.
Robert
Quoted from Method_Own:Was there a definitive fix for the shoot rod being misaligned from new?
Lift the playfield and loosen the the beehive securing screws and move it around.
There is a metal piece behind the beehive that you'll need to make sure that it doesn't rub against the shooter rod.
Robert
Quoted from flynnibus:SMH...
Great, let’s design, build and sell a new version instead of fixing the existing ones…
Robert
Quoted from Ferret:Finally, a manual!
http://s4.american-pinball.com/img/support/2023-11/Galactic-Tank-Force-Game-Manual-(Version-1.0_October-2023).pdf (linked directly off the americanpinball.com support page)
If you believe that this is an actual manual, you have a future in sales...
Robert
My game is pretty much unplayable now. I’ve always had a minor intermittent issue with the ball being ejected into the shooter lane, but now it happens every game or two.
When a ball is ejected properly, the ball speed and force is “normal”.
Sometimes when a ball drains, the game will go into ball search and after the 4th search cycle or so a ball will be ejected. Other times ball search will go thru a couple cycles then stop, and the game just sits there with the tank on the screen and cows being stolen until I cycle power. Occasionally the ball saver graphic will be shown, no ball is ejected, the game goes into ball over mode.
I’ve checked the connectors and they are all fully seated. Has anyone else had this issue?
Robert
Quoted from flynnibus:I've seen it where once it gets confused about ball state.. you have to power cycle it to get it to really clear things up. Just starting a new game doesn't seem to be enough once it gets into that state. But we haven't really seen it enough or consistently to ID when/what caused the initial ball confusion. We don't have trough issues like that.. but there are some gremlins when it comes to 'something happens' and then it gets confused about balls in play.
Thanks for the reply.
Not sure if I should wait for the next update or start tearing things apart. I originally thought that 1 or more of the trough optos are intermittent, either because of a wiring or connection issue or an opto issue. But after diagnosing further, it seems to be a software issue like you mentioned. Also occasionally a ball won’t be ejected at a new game start (the ball just doesn’t make it out of the trough, it just falls back) and the game doesn’t try to eject a second time…but sometimes it does eject a second time.
I’ve read all of the posts in this thread, and many of the issues others have experienced I’ve never had…and issues I’ve had others haven’t. Being an ex-engineer I tend to occasionally overthink things, but I’m tending towards thinking that the “software system” has some linking and timing errors. These could be an artifact of the extensive video outputs, with several clips played back-to-back and with clips being played simultaneously.
I'm not a software engineer, my expertise was with Fortran 4 and I did some programming with HP basic 35 years ago so I apologize in advance if I say something incorrectly. I do think that the video is vastly overdone in the game and just annoying at best. This isn’t a video game where 2, 3 or more clips are playing simultaneously, some for several seconds. I get really frustrated with having to hit the flippers over and over to get them to stop. But to get back on point, if the videos were taken out of the programming and the software was fixed of any issues with gameplay and rules…then some videos were then added back in, there would probably be less bugs/issues with the game.
Robert
Quoted from MrSanRamon:Is there a "factory reset" on GTF?
Robert
I found it.
Quoted from HOOKED:From AP. The two anchor posts have hex bottoms that would not let the bracket fit flush with the PF surface, so I mod'd it a bit.
how can I get one of these?
Robert
Quoted from Ferret:Also check if the balls have become magnetized -- when that happens and they start sticking together in the trough, weird stuff can happen.
Did a factory reset and played 3 games, 1 of which was partial. Only change from factory reset was lower the volume and increase shooter lane eject power from 18 to 21.
In the second game it locked up. All the lights froze and none that were out re-lit for any reason. Scoring continued. This occurred during multiball after 2 balls were ejected into the shooter lane and had to be manually plunged.
After the last ball drained, I started the 3rd game. The game was indeed locked up and didn't reset when I started this game. All the playfield lights were as before in the previous game. Game scored but nothing else seemed to work
Log file was sent.
Robert
Quoted from HOOKED:Modified. With the beehive set up the c clip is almost in the middle of the shaft. Diameter is the same as Williams / jjp
Yes, thanks. I know that there is a new version of a GTF manual, but as an owner it's really not that valuable.
I've looked at the new GTF manual, the other game manuals as well as the AP parts and accessories section. The only manual that is useful is the Octoberfest Assembly Manual. There you can figure out a p/n of a coil if need be. But the coil stop has a different name than normal and both the coil stop and the flipper bushing have just AP part numbers. It would REALLY be helpful if they had equivalent Williams/Bally/Stern part numbers in parenthesis. Or you could buy a coil stop (SUB00025-01) for $17.89 from Game Room Guys! Alternatively, you could look at every coil stop on Pinball Life to see if they have the equivalent.
But, GTF doesn't have an assembly manual. So if I want to get stuff, it's a hassle. Not only don't you have a p/n, even a AP number, you probably have to either generate a Ticket, take measurements or look at the part and guess what might fit.
Some examples of hassles for some consumables:
Rubber rings...no sizes in manual you may have to take each one off to measure.
Playfield posts...no sizes given.
Flipper bushing/coil stop. ..only AP part numbers.
I should probably stop with my annoyance of not having a decent assembly/parts manual with equivalent p/n's if possible. But I think that no real manual is indicative of other issues. What if in the future I need something? Are they so financially strapped that they can't afford to generate a parts manual, if so are unique parts like plastics/ramps/circuit boards going to be made and stocked in enough numbers for future needs?
I know I am able to find and replace common parts or modify a shooter rod (if I want a different one), but given some of the questions I see, some others couldn't without help. Good thing that Pinside exists.
Robert
Quoted from jonnyqtrek:Hi owners!
I'm headed to pintastic in April. One vendor will have a floor model for sale for ~$700 more than NIB
Why would you pay more than NIB for a used machine?
Robert
I recently generated a ticket to get the p/n of the shooter rod...and no response.
I wanted to make one with a custom knob, so I guess I'll just measure mine.
Robert
I spent a bit of time and generated a topper, in 2 heights.
The first one is too tall, I think, so I made a second one that is shorter. I like this one more.
I did miss-measure the slope of the backbox top. I thought it was 10 degrees, but it is more like 13-15 degrees. So the graphic is tipped a little back.
Tall:
Shorter:
Robert
Quoted from Ballderdash:like the taller one because the aspect ratio of the shorter one is off. He looks squatty.
Yes, the shorter one is squeezed down about 15-20%. If you see them side by side, the difference is noticeable. By themselves, I don't notice it.
The taller one looks a bit too tall, to me, when installed, but I get what you are saying.
Robert
Quoted from Ballderdash:Or there’s this Robert ebay.com link: itm
I've seen this, and it's more than I think it's worth.
Robert
I assume that with a lot of knowledge, a few tools and a lot of effort that one may be able to substitute new video for the existing.
Then the only hurdle would be to get Kerri to send you some videos to substitute.
Robert
Quoted from 1963BSARGS:I can’t seem to get a response from AP or anyone to even answer the phone. Is this file available somewhere so I can 3d print it myself?
No file available as far as I know.
Robert
Quoted from 1963BSARGS:I can’t seem to get a response from AP or anyone to even answer the phone.
The service guy that was pretty helpful, Kevin, left the company and I don't think anyone else at the factory has his expertise. Lloyd is good and as soon as he comes up to speed things will be a lot better.
Also AP is generating a new board set, and that's taking up a lot of effort.
Apparently AP is working on updates for other machines, which is odd given the amount of code issues on GTF.
Robert
Quoted from jonnyqtrek:These are Torx screws, yes?
Sets are cheap I got mine off Amazon.
But if you only want to get 1...it's a T-15.
Robert
Quoted from MrSanRamon:Sets are cheap I got mine off Amazon.
But if you only want to get 1...it's a T-15.
Robert
I played a game today and a ball sat in the left VUK until it went into search mode and kicked the ball up.
I went over to where my coffee cup was and drank a bit while waiting.
I am just being patient until my Labyrinth shows up so I can sell GTF.
I've lived with the current s/w version for 6 months and am just tired of the issues.
I know that I'll probably take a $3k hit now, but this GTF is probably the last AP game I'll have.
Eventually it may turn out to be a fun game, with a couple more s/w updates. Maybe 3 updates given the extensive use of videos, I'm just not willing to wait another year or 2 for that to happen.
Robert
Quoted from 1963BSARGS:the coder contacted me directly on pinside when I was having some issues. Hopefully that is a sign that things are turning around.
The “coder” just needs to read about 1000 posts in this thread to get an idea of what needs working.
Robert
Quoted from 1963BSARGS:I bought my GTFLE last week, NIB, for $8,800
Fire Sale...
Quoted from 1963BSARGS:The balls are advancing correctly in the lock. I’m going to check the trough optos. I’m beginning to think these may be the issue as two balls are being occasionally kicked into the shooter lane
My game occasionally has:
1. The left VUK issue
2. Two balls ejected into shooter lane
3. Ball just sits in shooter lane during multiball
4. Unable to advance video by pushing both flipper buttons
5. Semi-endless multiball
6. Ball goes through "Lucky Break" and isn't saved (lite is lit)
7. Atomic Shield lip gets hung up on the playfield and doesn't retract
So there are only a few things but they are annoying. I've only had to stop a game once or twice and address something. I have tilted a game several times trying to get the LHS VUk to fire.
Since several people appear to have the same issues, it doesn't seem reasonable that they all have the same flakey optos/switches...in the same locations. Some switch failures may be the issue, but these are new machines with minimal games on them. I believe I have about 300 on mine.
I think that one reason there hasn't been an update is due to the extensive use of back-to-back videos, which makes trouble shooting of code complicated. Especially when the issues are intermittent. It's probably some timing issues with the various switch inputs into the system along with the videos being cued up or playing. Once this gets worked out, the game will reach it's potential.
Robert
It's official...I have playfield paint chipping at the Tank magnet...about 300 games!
Resale probably drops another grand.
Robert
I filled out their web form about the chipping paint on my playfield last week.
And not unexpectly...no response.
I guess I'll have to call them, but I wanted to use their system so I would have a record of all communications.
Any suggestions?
Robert
Quoted from littlecammi:Got my GTF deluxe down into my game room late yesterday. Put it next to EHoH because both used live actors filmed just for the games. Just realized I should have posed my GTF lunchbox on it as a topper. I haven't had a chance to really play it yet.
[quoted image]
Nice!
Robert
Since I never got any response from AP, I’m discussing with my distributor on my playfield issue.
I sent the email to him and after only a few hours I had a response. I’m 2 weeks out with AP, and still no response.
Robert
Quoted from calprog:what happened with the playfield?
I sent an email to David Fix today as this is what my distributor suggested. I was just caught up in stuff, so I didn’t do it right away.
I’ll let people know here what the outcome is.
Robert
Quoted from SpacelySpliffs:He mentioned in his reply that he has been trying to get caught up on parts requests and that he doesn't have access to the online forms that get submitted.
No wonder I didn’t get a reply from AP…what a company.
Kevin was good too, hope Maurice stays for awhile before he quits.
Thanks for the email address.
Robert
Quoted from calprog:AP never contacted me after 6 attempts. Lol. I am having a tech check the VUK. What a company!!????
You probably need to email maurice.
Robert
Well, I was able to come up with a DIY solution for my tank magnet.
The magnet core does not extend perpendicular to my playfield, which caused some paint chipping.
Chipping Below Tank Magnet (resized).jpg
I tried to shim/bend the bracket, but it's attached at about a 45 degree angle so I was only partially successful.
So I took the core out and flat filed the top at about a 10 degree angle, to match the playfield slope. It was a somewhat iterative process, but I did get a fairly good match with the playfield surface.
I then went over to Cliffy's and picked up a carbon fiber magnet "surround". It looks pretty nice.
Robert
Quoted from Method_Own:I hope the extra time spent by the team will add even more polish and improvements to the update that was being tested at Texas
Given what seems to be happening with staffing and games being released, this will most likely be the last GTF code update for awhile.
Robert
I suggest to those that have not done so. go to the GTF machine page on Pinside and post your review.
A few more ratings (9 I think), and GTF will be included in the game rankings.
Robert
Quoted from BamBam:Is American Pinball's site down? I haven't been able to get to it for a couple of days.
https://www.american-pinball.com/games/galactic-tank-force/
I get a warning sometimes about the website not providing secure content. I'm able to work around this, but depending on your security settings you may not be able to.
I was able to get to the site throughout the day.
Robert
Quoted from Disruptor71:Ferret are you able to give a code update timing?
They may have found an issue at TPF and did a change and are testing it at Midwest Gaming Classic.
Robert
Quoted from 1963BSARGS:Looks like the same ball counting mess that was in the prior code.
So, probably no new code for awhile...or better yet, give us this code and let us work out all the issues as they don't seem to be able to.
Robert
Quoted from 1963BSARGS:The issues aren’t related to complex scoring issues, they are simple ball count issues.
I believe the timing issues are the main problem.And I believe ithey are mainly caused by the overlapping and back to back videos that run.
It seems they overstepped in coding and have tried to patch it, but what probably needs to happen is a new approach.
Get the game running flawlessly, then add in SOME videos. I'm tired of watching a movie on my pinball game.
Robert
I got the tank magnet to be planer to the playfield by replacing the factory bracket with one I purchased from Pinball Life.
This bracket is attached on 2 sides rather than 1 like the factory bracket.
The black object is the 3-D printed part I used to fix the factory issues with the tank targets.
The new bracket needed to have a corner trimmed off to fit around the 3-D printed part.
The new bracket makes the magnet core top flat with the playfield, something I couldn't achieve with the factory bracket.
The 3 holes on the right are the attachment points for the original bracket.
I'm putting together a list of things that I did to my GTF, and will post it a bit later.
Robert
Quoted from billsfanmd:Was there ever a model matrix made? May get the LE and was not sure what you get besides the side treads and turret..
As far as I know...and I've seen both the LE & DE, but not the SE...the playfields are idenical.
I believe the SE has the same playfield too. I'm sure someone will correct me if necessary.
Robert
Quoted from Ballderdash:You’ve already done more than paid AP tech support staff. Owners are lucky to have your troubleshooting tips.
Thanks.
I'll try to post what I have done to my game shortly, so people don't have to search thru the approx 1400 posts, if they are interested in my journey.
Robert
Quoted from gunstarhero:It would be a shame if this game never gets the code it deserves because it is darn good otherwise... cool shots, great art, fun to play and amusing calls and video.
Nice to see you Saturday. It was interesting to see 3 of us in the same room that own a GTF.
It is a shame that GTF gets so much negative press and I am one of those people that are vocal about it. GTF could be a good case study paper for a college business major on how not to build, release, market and support a product. Along what happens when a company does that... with the "humorous" anecdote about a companies issue/problem ticket system being unavailable to the employees involved with adressing those issues.
Hopefully the people that have board and mechanical issues get the parts that they need. Machines needing warranty parts waiting weeks and months for parts is a travesty.Releasing a code update is a good first step in getting these machines working better and thus limiting people's complaints.
Robert
Quoted from gunstarhero:if David Fix was smart he would just swap you a new one to fix the situation.
I asked for a new playfield when I realized that there was paint chipping due to the magnet core & bracket...but the sent me new cores, thinking that was the fix. Plus it's the cheapest warranty "repair" possible. So I doubt that a new game is on any horizon.
Besides, I believe there are people here that have non-working games due to no parts availibility or no response from AP. Maybe AP should cannibalize a game and give those parts to people in need so their game will play. If there is a playfield left over, then they can send that to me.
Robert
Some of the things I have done to my GTF to date, along with a few general gripes about AP:
1. Cow Target: Harness was too tight and wire to target broke. (Assembly Issue) Solution: Cut cable tie and resoldered wire and re-tied. Suggestion: If you have an issue with the target, check the wires and harness.
2. Power Up Target: Target difficult to register hits. (Standard Parts Issue) Solution: Re-gap target. Suggestion: If you have an issue with the target registering, minimize points gap.
3. Magnets: Core loose and rotating up or down. (No Jam Nut or Locker used) (Design Issue) Solution: Re-level core and add another nut to lock factory installed nut. Suggestion: Ensure magnet core is flush with playfield and add another nut to lock factory installed nut.
4. Shooter Rod:
A. Shooter Rod too Short (Design Issue). Solution: Factory installed 2 small washers in the shooter tip to “lengthen” rod. Suggestion: When you remove shooter tip, make note to replace washers.
B. Shooter Rod Binding & I had difficulty getting ball to get to the top lanes (Design, Assembly & QC Issue). Solution: Had to move the support bar inside the cabinet (which on my game sits on top of the ground braid) away from the rod, not easy due to the ground braid.
C. Shooter Rod doesn’t fit well in beehive (too loose) (Parts/QC Issue). Solutions: I replaced the beehive with one from Pinball Life: Product ID: 4A-115-W, and I ran a 3/8 bit through the it and lapped the hole in the Beehive, with the shooter rod and Comet. It works fab now. Suggestion: Do what Tommy-dog did in post #545 instead.
5. Tank Target: Switches Bend Backwards and then send air-balls over the Flippers (Design Issue). I tried AP’s first air-ball solution and the targets bent backwards again after about 15 games. I then had the 2 piece solution 3D-Printed (Big_Whoopin Design) locally and installed them. Everything is great now! Suggestion: AP supposedly has a better design now, but I would go with Chris’ design (Post #473).
6. Ball Saver Center Puck: The puck bottom rises above the playfield and if it gets hit hard, the lip of the puck can get pushed over the playfield and it won’t easily retract. (Design Issue). Not sue why AP would design the puck mechanism with this much stroke (maybe to catch air-balls?). Solution: I re-centered the assembly as close to the centerline of the playfield hole that I could. Suggestion: If yours hangs up this may be why.
7. Shooter Lane Lights: Mine were miss-wired (Assembly Issue). Solution: A bit of time in the Service Menu checking if the menu and lamp locations matched up. Suggestion: Spend a bit of time in the Service Menu checking if the menu and lamp locations match up.
8. GTF/AP General Issues:
A. Service Menu: The font of much of the service menu is WAY TOO SMALL.
B. Manual: There isn’t a complete manual like you would get from Stern, Chicago Gaming or other reputable company.
C. For quite awhile the Ticket System for Support wasn’t available to the people doing support, plus AP never seems to answer the phone.
D. Needed Code for GTF delayed, delayed & well delayed.
E. Video: I’m tired of watching a movie on my Pinball game.
F. Not for me, but people have had their games down for weeks and months without needed parts.
G. When I tried to register my GTF, I followed their instructions and couldn’t register it. Seems AP left out the info in the instructions to add a “D” before the S/N to designate a Deluxe model.
H. Something I’ve overlooked.
9. Tank Magnet: The core and the playfield surface were not planer (QC< Parts & Assembly Issue). The magnet bracket was bent, this caused my Tank Magnet area’s paint to chip on the playfield.
A. Solution 1: Bought a new magnet bracket from Pinball Life and installed it. This bracket is a much better design that the factory bracket.
B. Solution 2: Bought a Cliffy protector for the Tank Magnet Core, looks and works great...and covers my chipped paint.
C. Suggestions: Check to see if magnet core top is flush and planer with playfield. Place mylar over magnet cores on playfield. Buy a new magnet bracket. Install Cliffy Protectors.
10. Ball Trap Area: There is a location on the LHS oof the playfield at the lower outlane plastic that can trap the ball (Design or Assembly Issue). Solution: I moved the post that was there and installed in the incorrect position, toward the lock-bar about 1/2 inch. Suggestion: If you get balls trapped there, move the existing post.
11. Posts at the Flippers: Balls would and will get trapped between the posts, the ball save puck and the Lucky Break Bars. Solution: I put in a bigger post
and rubber to replace factory parts. Still not perfect, but much better than before. Suggestion: If game play doesn’t bother you, no need to do anything. Why they would put 2 posts. 2 Lucky Break Lanes and an Up Puck at the flipper area is beyond me.
12. There is probably more, but I’ve forgotten at this point.
Robert
The first ball I plunged went into a kick-out-hole.
I got a promotion in rank and a video came up with no sound.
This was about 30 seconds into the first game after the code update.
Robert
Quoted from PinballManiac40:They are working on getting it on the website.
How hard can this be…
Robert
I'm uploading my new GTF code file now. When I get back from a couple errands, I'll send out links to it.
So, if you want to download the Code file I have, send me your email address in a PM.
Robert
Edit: Upload is complete, if anyone is in need of the file.
Quoted from EasternBloc:Now says too many users have attempted to download. Imagine how hard it would be to get this code if there were as many as 100 of these games out there.
PM me you email address. You may be able to download from my dropbox.
Robert
Quoted from calprog:Any idea where the release notes are for this code.
Not sure, plus they haven't been able to put together a decent manual in a year +.
Robert
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