(Topic ID: 279578)

Future Spa Hardtop Install - Vid's Guide

By vid1900

3 years ago


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  • Latest reply 7 months ago by dnaman
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46
#1 3 years ago

Guys who like broads with harry legs love Future Spa, because all that un-removable ball swirl in the flesh colored paint, makes for a strange attraction.

I found these pics from over a year ago, so I put up a quick guide. Because they are old, it's possible that some things have changed with the FS Hardtops. Consider it a snapshot in time.

I've installed over a dozen Hardtops, and have the process almost down to a science. The Outside Edge guys probably think I'm being overly critical every time I post about their products, but I just report how I see it. If I did not like the product, I would not keep using it, lol.

Here is a Comet I documented, read this for more tips that I won't repeat: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-hardtop-restoration-comet

http://www.outsideedgeproducts.com/store/p75/Pinball_Playfield_Hardtop.html
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#2 3 years ago

Here is a pic of the uninstalled Hardtop lit from behind.

It gives you an idea of where bare wood is going to show through; so you can see where you have to repair the existing table.

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#4 3 years ago

There is a line where no adheasive is applied.

Don't panic, it does not seem to telegraph through the playfield once installed.

It also gives you a way to install it in two steps, peeling as you go.

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#5 3 years ago

The backside where you peel away the paper from the glue

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#6 3 years ago

After 40 years, the upper arch and shooter lane will need to be sanded, stained, and clearcoated; before the new Hardtop is installed.

You also need to scrape off the ink from the inserts and sand them to get the scratches out.

DON'T SAND THE ENTIRE PLAYFIELD INTO A "WHITEWOOD".

^ read the above again before continuing ^

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#7 3 years ago

Because I did not have the Hardtop in hand, and there were no pictures of it anywhere on the internet, I sanded off a bunch of ink that I should not have, making more work for myself.

ONLY sand the shooterlane, the kickout, and the upper arch.

How to fix the shooterlane is here:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-ultimate-playfield-restoration/page/3#post-640071
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#8 3 years ago

The freshly sanded Maple is too bright for a 40 year old game.

Before clearcoating the shooter lane and ball arch, I sprayed it with oil based polyurethane. This turns the wood a golden color.

Poly is not tough enough for a final shooterlane coating, so it gets a normal 2PAC clear over the top of it.

Put old lightbulbs in the sockets to keep the poly and 2PAC from coating the electrical contacts.

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#9 3 years ago

The original inserts were tragically cupped, so much so, that I though they would be visible through the HT.

I filled them in with 2PAC, then scraped them level.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-ultimate-playfield-restoration/page/17#post-1717646

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#11 3 years ago

FS only has a few clear inserts, and unlike let's say Comet, none of them are Jeweled or decorative in any way.

You probably could just leave the clear inserts sanded to 400 grit and they would look fine (better maybe?).

I sanded them to 1500 here, and in hindsight, probably should have left them frosted at 400 like all the opaque ones.

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#12 3 years ago

Since you have to wait for the Poly to dry, you can get everything else ready.

Use zip ties to get the rollover wire arm out of the way.

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#13 3 years ago

A few things to note in this shot:

Ziptie all the coils to the harness, you are going to be flipping the playfield a lot, and you don't want them swinging around getting damaged.

Ziptie all the loose switch stacks, or they will come apart (trust me on this)

Throw out all the common coil sleeves (you can't clean them). Save the larger coil sleeve for the drop targets, since you probably don't have a new one lying around)

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#14 3 years ago

The giant FS playfield only has 25 GI lamps....

So add a few more in obvious places, like around the Drops and in front of the flippers.

Don't think that adding brighter LEDs will fix this oversight, it won't (you'll see why latter)

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#15 3 years ago

The drop target cage needs a slight modification to keep the topside GI lamps symmetrical.

It's a one minute fix with a cut-off wheel, fine tooth hacksaw, or even a Dremmel

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#16 3 years ago

While you have the drop target cage apart, put the proper drops in.

On the old Bally ads, they are either all stars, or one star and 2x,4x,6x so either one could be considered "correct"

http://www.pbresource.com/pfdroptar.htm#Bally

Don't trust ebay sellers who sell a "kit" of all bullseyes, that's not correct.

#17 3 years ago

Install (because they are probably missing or clipped) or replace any green original Bally switch caps.

These are always bad, or about to become bad.

If you get all 4 dangerous drops down, and then don't get the Extra Ball credit because you were too lazy to replace the cap, you will be pissed.

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Note here that someone clipped this cap rather than replacing it.

Note also that heavy duty threaded Tnuts have been added to keep the worn post holes upright

Note #3 that blue painters tape keeps any overspray from sticking to the new spoons (only important if you replace the spoons before you spray the shooterlane) .

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#18 3 years ago

No playfield overlay, decal or hardtop is going to match the existing one exactly.

Sometimes 3 different companies made the playfields, and each can have slight variances.

So don't align your HT with the holes in your playfield, align with the INSERTS.

We can drill more holes, we can't change the position of the inserts.

If nothing gives you perfect alignment, then favor the inserts close to the player!

This playfield's serial was in the 3000s, so it was halfway through the run

All the arrow insert cutouts on the HT were just a little too large, so I blackened around them with some Createx Flat Black Paint.

Unless you have your eye right against the playfield, nobody will ever know.
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#19 3 years ago

Here I have a double 4 foot florescent lamp on the floor under the playfield rotisserie

This allows me to check all the inserts at once.

After a few more touchups with the black paint, I clamped the HT at the bottom of the playfield, then peeled off the paper backing and installed it.

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#20 3 years ago

Next, it's time to do all the dust making tasks, before repopulating the playfield.

I drill out the new GI lighting holes (see, why I did not install the sockets yet?)

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#22 3 years ago

The holes for the Pop Bumper Nails have to be enlarged to clear the nail heads.

Williams nail heads are smaller than Bally, so I used those instead

Once you have the holes drilled (there are a lot of them with 5 Pops on FS), then drive the nails in with a Punch or Nail Set.

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#24 3 years ago

Don't reuse the old Star Rollover. It's brittle and those little tabs inside will often break off, even if you are careful

The original was amber or orange, not red; so buy the correct one:

https://www.pinballlife.com/star-rollover-assembly.html

First, Dremmel out the hole in the HT:

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The insert is not flat from the factory, so you have to put sandpaper upside down on your table saw, and flatten it.

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120 grit

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240 grit

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500 grit

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800 grit and done

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#25 3 years ago

Rough up the sides of the insert with 120 grit, prime with Plastic Primer, and epoxy flush with the HT:
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Clean up any epoxy squeeze out with a rag. It won't stick to the HT.

#28 3 years ago
Quoted from Cheddar:

could you elaborate on the drilling of holes in the hardtop?

Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:

Here you added extra GI. Do you have suggestions on the best way to drill the holes and make it look original?

I drilled the holes in the original playfield (the same size as the original Bally lamp holes), before the hardtop was installed.

(Use a centerpunch to mark the wood, drill a 1/8" pilot hole, follow with full size bit)

Then installed the hardtop.

Lit from bellow, the holes in the playfield are evident through the HT (see arrows in pic)

Drill 1/8" hole through HT, then follow will full size bit.

Install sockets and add to GI circuit (because LEDs draw less current that incandescent, we are not worried about overloading the power supply connectors)
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#29 3 years ago

We will kill 2 birds with one stone here.

Sockets in Pops are often problematic from all the vibration.

Skip the sockets.

LEDs in Pops have a very hard time illuminating the playfield, because LEDs are very directional

Skip the conventional LEDs.

I unsoldered the socket bases from these Comet Pop LEDs:

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Then I flipped it upsidedown, so the bright side faces the pop body, and soldered on my own 3" long leads (I know, I voided my warranty)

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Even with the dim side up, they are still WAY too bright for the caps (fix latter), but they light up the body and playfield nicely.

So no crappy light sockets, and no dark bodies. Win/win

Other pop discs do not fit properly in classic Bally, these do:

https://www.cometpinball.com/products/pop-bumper-discs

#30 3 years ago

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Here you can see the excellent, even illumination from the upsidedown Comet discs (click for moneyshot)

#31 3 years ago

With the HT installed, we have made the playfield 30mills thicker.

But now the Drops are recessed 30mills below the playfield surface, causing the balls to hang.

I cut a piece of 30mill Lexan from some scrap.

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The Drop Targets rest inside the cage on top of the strip, raising them up flush with the HT surface.

If you don't have any Lexan, you can just cut a slice from the end of the playfield, under the apron (Outside Edge should obviously include a piece of scrap with each purchase)

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#32 3 years ago

No sense in doing all that work and not rebuild the filppers back to factory.

Note here how much nylon has worn from the old bushing, you know this would have dragged on the thicker playfield:

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#33 3 years ago

Note here how the new EOS switches are slightly bent at the tips to work with these Lever Arms.

Note that the Coil Lugs are mounted opposite the Coil Stop

Get the Rebuild Kit here for $36 (minus your 10% discount for exceeding $100)

http://www.pbresource.com/rebuildkit.html#KT-BFLIP03

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#34 3 years ago

light your Kickout and Rollover with some "bendies*"

https://www.cometpinball.com/products/1smd-flex

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* TM Todd Tucky

#35 3 years ago

The client who gave me this project had somehow lost the Cam that flips the ball save gate.

I made a new one from a $2 set of Drill Stops from HF

Drill hole in Stop wall, put piece of rod in hole, hit with hammer to expand rod.

https://www.harborfreight.com/7-piece-drill-stop-set-38336.html

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#36 3 years ago

Get a new set of pop caps, because the old ones always have melted areas that look even worse when lit by LEDs

http://www.pbresource.com/pfbumper.htm

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#38 3 years ago

On the Right spinner lane, there is a bracket that can hang up a slow roll ball.

Most operators used to put a metal washer there, but a clear PETG one looks better, and does not chew up the ball.

Use your wire cutters, and snip off the edge of the washer, install between bracket and screw head.

https://www.pinballlife.com/clear-petg-fender-washers.html
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#39 3 years ago

To maximize light transmission on an already dark playfield, I used clear beehive posts (get the taller ones, not the 1")

https://www.pinballlife.com/finned-star-post-1.html

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and Titan transparent rubbers:

https://www.titanpinball.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=52

#40 3 years ago

Strange things....

So there was a big hole, that I had already sanded off the paint from (mistake) in front of the left outlanes in the HT.

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There was no hole in the factory playfield (mid run, serial number #3000 playfield)

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So I saw online that some games had a post here, some did not.

The owner of this game now has one, he'll just have to adjust his playing strategy...lol

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#41 3 years ago

Many of the HT holes were large, even if they just had a tiny pin installed in them.

Other holes were drilled, even though there was no hole at all in the original (like under the Pop Skirt)

Best to leave the paint on the old playfield, rather than have to mix paint touch up the holes.

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#43 3 years ago

There were some strange water marks visible in some of the insert windows.

Nothing too crazy, but I wish I would have seen them before I stuck the HT down

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#44 3 years ago

Never put the playfield back in the game until you've tested all the lights and solenoids

Way easier to flip the playfield back and forth as you track down any gremlins, or set up all the switch gaps - while it's still in the rotisserie

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#45 3 years ago

The owner gave me the game broken, with mixed rubbers, LEDs and Incan bulbs; just a giant random pile.

One thing I noticed after I installed all his LEDs, was you could no longer read any playfield printing.

All you could see was the bright glare of the inserts and playfield plastics.

It sucked (especially compared to my own, all incandescent FS)

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#46 3 years ago

TAMING THE WILD LED BEAST

=====================

Job one was to remove all the 1 SMD LEDs from the inserts, they were simply too bright blasting into your eyes, compared to how dark the rest of the playfield was.

I replaced them with those super cheap .25 cent LEDs

These cut the glare down a lot, and gave a better hue of cool white to match the game. Big improvement.

https://www.pinballlife.com/ablaze-1-led-4447-bayonet-base-lamp-with-flat-top-lens.html

abl_bayonet_flat (resized).jpgabl_bayonet_flat (resized).jpg

Next, all the plastics were crazy bright.

I used white vinyl tape used to detail cars (removable, no residue) and slapped it on the backs of all the plastics.

This way the light was reflected rather than transmitted through.

This had a BIG effect, and still let about 10% of the light through.

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The 2 SMD LEDs, even when I frosted the domes with 120 grit sandpaper, still had too much light blasting out the tops.

IMG_20201001_163022 (resized).jpgIMG_20201001_163022 (resized).jpg

#47 3 years ago

Although kinda expensive (lucky there are not many GI lights here), the Comet Opmax threw the most light out the sides, and the least light up into the players eyes.

These, with the white vinyl tape, were the winning combination

https://www.cometpinball.com/products/opmax-bulbs
Comet_Pinball_Opmax_Optimus_Maximus_e483e823-08a5-48f9-9403-074bac75c422 (resized).jpgComet_Pinball_Opmax_Optimus_Maximus_e483e823-08a5-48f9-9403-074bac75c422 (resized).jpg

#48 3 years ago

The final headache (literally) was the Pop Caps.

Even though the LED discs were mounted dim side up, they were simply insane bright.

It took 4 layers of the vinyl tape in the domes of the Caps, to finally bring it to a human level (who on earth would want the BRIGHT side shinning up into their faces???)

Now finally, you can play his game and actually read the graphics around the playfield.
IMG_20201010_153449 (resized).jpgIMG_20201010_153449 (resized).jpg

Of course it's impossible for any picture to do the playfield justice, but trust me, you can play this game in the dark and it's plenty well-lit.

#49 3 years ago

Future Spa is one of the best competition games.

It's a perfect fan layout, lots of bumping required, and no crazy rules that only owners understand.

Without the cupped inserts throwing off the ball path in every direction, this one is ready for league play.

----------

Super bonus play: Everyone put $20 in the pot, the first person to light the green arrows at the top (by spelling out F-U-T-U-R-E without lighting any letter of S-P-A ) takes it.

Harder than it looks....

#51 3 years ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

Can you elaborate more on why you don’t want to sand all the art off? For the areas you do sand, what grit are you using?

If you sand all the art off, the bare wood shows through the HT holes.

So even tiny pin or a wire guide leg gets a big, bare hole.

Save yourself a bunch of touch-up time, and just leave the playfield paint alone.

-

I used 120 grit to cut the old finish out, then 220 grit to smooth before the poly was applied.

#57 3 years ago
Quoted from Silverstreak02:

You mentioned sanding the shooter lane and then applying an oil based polyurethane before the clear coat. What brand oil based polyurethane are you using?

Minwax darkens nicely with age.

2pac "sits on top" of the wood, whereas the oil poly soaks in and really brings out the grain.

#58 3 years ago

@Pike Pete asked if lamp holders would short out on the drop cage; nope, plenty of room

IMG_20201002_171706(1) (resized).jpgIMG_20201002_171706(1) (resized).jpg
#60 3 years ago
Quoted from xsvtoys:

I’m a bit confused on this one. Are these marks on the underside of the HT?

Yes, they are on the underside.

Quoted from xsvtoys:

The underside would have the adhesive on it.

There are holes cut through the adhesive, so wherever there is an insert, there is no glue.

b70a25e976db53f5d3fdc1600fbf3b1e3eacb426 (resized).jpgb70a25e976db53f5d3fdc1600fbf3b1e3eacb426 (resized).jpg

Quoted from xsvtoys:

If you had spotted it before attaching the HT, how would you fix?

I wish I would have seen it prior, and I might have a better answer.

Off the top of my head, I'd probably try some Naphtha on a foam wipe (I fear a Q-tip would leave some fuzz behind along the edge of the adhesive)

If they spray a primer on before applying the adhesive, then maybe it's etched into the surface and would have to be polished out?

Or maybe it's some strange condensation from shipping or storage and it would just clean up with distilled water? (although I doubt this, because it was sealed in the factory bag; and it's only on a few inserts)

With the Pandemic, I've got none of these waiting to be installed, so hopefully someone here has an uninstalled HT and can take a closer look.

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#62 3 years ago
Quoted from alexmogil:

I have a Pinbot waiting to be installed, what do you need to see? I definitely should have cleaned my insert openings on my last Hardtop because there is some cloudiness that I completely missed.

If you see those spots in the inserts, what solvent (alcohol, naphtha, distilled water) removes them?

Thanks!

#65 3 years ago
Quoted from alexmogil:

I did some experimentation with a couple different cleaners and found that alcohol tends to clean the underside of the inserts.

Great research !!

If it was an insert with printing in the window, I'd be VERY cautious about trying to clean away the haze - in case the alcohol removed or smeared the ink.

2 years later
#73 1 year ago
Quoted from cnordquist:

vid1900 I see in the Time Warp in the background you have the standard rubbers on your banana flippers. How did you get those to stay on the face? I'm assuming you like it better that way than with the yellow boots?

They are stuck on with contact cement

2 months later
#75 11 months ago
Quoted from sunarf:

Hey Vid...
Is there any reason why you can't just apply a stain and then clear over it? Something like this...[quoted image]

It's harder to match stain, than just using the yellow, oil based poly.

But if you are an experienced wood stainer, then of course stain then clear.

3 months later
#76 8 months ago
Quoted from joshmc:

Hey Vid, great job. I just purchased a Future Spa in really bad condition and will do the hardtop just as you’ve done. Just wondering, why did you not apply 2Pac after the overlay was applied to the playfield? Does that not add an extra layer of protection?

The 2pac would not stick to the hardtop.

I don't think the hardtop needs any extra protection.

There are a few in commercial use for several years around my place. Still look fine.

3 weeks later
#78 7 months ago
Quoted from dnaman:

- What is the epoxy used to secure inserts from the back side?

You can use any epoxy, they even make "plastic epoxy" if you believe it somehow holds better.

I've even used the $1 HF epoxy and it worked fine.

Quoted from dnaman:

- For this, are you doing a combination of the paint->poly (where required), then sealing with 2PAC on all of your HT installs currently?

Yes, having the 2pac as the top coat gives a seemless finish that buffs to a mirror shine.

Quoted from dnaman:

- When you do the full PF with 2PAC, do you prep the clear prior to installing the HT? Possibly besides a light block/sand where any 2PAC might have walled or run. I am curious if the recommendation is to not have the full clear too smooth.

I leave it full mirror polish.

You won't ever get a run if you shoot with the playfield on it's back, but if you get a walled up area around an opening, just knock it down flat with sandpaper.

Clean with naphtha, then use a tack-cloth.

Quoted from dnaman:

- What type of surface is best for the 3M adhesive, or whatever is now used on the HT, to adhere to.

Glossy is great.

All those car emblems are attached with 3M VHB, and nothing is exposed to worse conditions than an automobile

#79 7 months ago
Quoted from sunarf:

Hey Vid...
Is there any reason why you can't just apply a stain and then clear over it? Something like this...[quoted image]

Sometimes you have to stain a repair, like on an old EM that has a very darkened wood surface.

But stain does not seal the wood, so you would still need to seal before 2pac.

The poly deepens the color, and seals the wood (especially in the alternating grain of the shooter lane), so it kills 2 birds with one stone.

#81 7 months ago
Quoted from dnaman:

Thank you for the detailed response vid! I am looking forward to running the the process and learning on this first one.
I will likely have to use a 2K MAX clear as I am not setup with a gun to run 2PAC. I am going to do 3 pins with HTs so I will have to see how that goes with rattle can. I will likely have waste as I am only going to be setup to do one pin at a time and hate to waste a 2K Max can or two but if I am only doing a couple of these, not sure that I should look too far ahead. That said, out of curiosity while I was out yesterday I did see these smaller 'mini' guns at Princess Auto. Much larger than an air brush but smaller than a standard sized spray gun. If I end up doing more clearing or painting, would these work well for a 2PAC? I guess that I would likely need a 'Mini In Line Filter Moisture Trap 1/4"'?[quoted image]

You can use a detail gun; but note that a regular size HVLP gun is usually less money.

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