(Topic ID: 30823)

FT: High-end Congo restoration for High-end Paragon restoration


By snaroff

8 years ago



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  • 78 posts
  • 36 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 8 years ago by TowMater
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There are 78 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 2.
#1 8 years ago

Here are pics of my Congo:

http://s1205.beta.photobucket.com/user/snaroff/library/Congo

Both the cabinet and PF are beautifully clear-coated. The cabinet is also custom painted (red eyes, more green added)...stunning. Lot's of great powder-coating. The slightly worn window to the mini-PF is being replaced with a brand new window tomorrow. Also have a mantis amusements black zink volcano weldment that I'm adding.

For now, I'm not looking to sell outright...only looking for a beautiful Paragon.

Thanks for looking.

#2 8 years ago

wow! great job. nice looking Congo .

#3 8 years ago

If you change your mind, or if my $ can intervene to get you your Paragon, LMK.

#4 8 years ago

WOW, what a beauty. That looks like the top end for a Congo.
I do not have a Paragon, but...out of curiosity...

Who did all the work on it? Where are you located? If you did have a cash price, what would it be?

#5 8 years ago

I'd trade a very nice Shadow if interested. Mine has wire forms at plating and gun at plating. New ramps etc.., Very nice

#6 8 years ago

Brian Dendis did the restoration...he's an amazing artist. Don't know if you've ever seen this "before/after" of a destroyed MM PF, but here is a "sick" PF restoration I'm told he did (not mine):

http://s1205.beta.photobucket.com/user/snaroff/library/Brians%20work%20is%20awesome

After receiving the pin, I've done a bit of work to tweak/optimize gameplay. Since I play my pins, it's important for them to play as good as they look (or better

Here's a STTNG restoration I just finished up...really happy with replacing all the red trim with blue (the pop bumpers and lane guides really brighten up the pin).

http://s1205.beta.photobucket.com/user/snaroff/library/STTNG%20restoration

I'm in South Florida...

IIRC, I have about $4,700 in the pin. Certainly a lot of cash for this title, but it's extremely rare to find one with this much love given to it. I've had restorations from a couple of the top name pros, and this custom artwork and clear coated cabinet is the nicest I've seen. If this pin were restored by one of the top name pros, it would more than 2x what I paid.

If I'm dealing with a trusted collector (i.e. someone who will give it a good home) I typically sell for roughly what I have in it. This rule doesn't apply to retailers, who I very rarely deal with.

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#7 8 years ago

This congo is spectacular. One of my favorite pins.

#8 8 years ago

That is great! My rough guess was 5k, which is pretty cool that I was close in my own head.

Good luck in your hunt. I am guessing if you do sell it outright you should not have much issue getting what you have into it , out.

#9 8 years ago

I would pay that for this. Its a one of a kind.

#10 8 years ago

Great looking pin. Wish I had a paragon for you.

Mk

#11 8 years ago

I have seen this Congo, it indeed looks & plays amazing. The art work was custom(as you can tell) and looks great! Snaroff is a good guy to deal with all of his pins are pristine he is very picky I wish he was selling that STTNG Good Luck!

#12 8 years ago

People need to stop with this High end stuff ! The game is different than other congos that is for sure . High end ? Not even close .

Jim

#13 8 years ago

This is usually where the train goes off the tracks on some boards

#14 8 years ago
Quoted from McCune:

People need to stop with this High end stuff ! The game is different than other congos that is for sure . High end ? Not even close .
Jim

Since it looks like you own a Congo, why don't you show us pics of your example? I'd love to see what you consider "high end"...always happy to learn from more experienced collectors.

#15 8 years ago

High end means its better than when it left the factory. Every ounce of the unit is clean and beyond mint. Corners so sharp as to cut your fingers off etc. Dirt not even within 50 feet of the game etc.

Your game while nice is not what i would call high end either. There is coil wrappers that dont match some are faded some are wrinkled. Midway sticker wrinkled lock down latch chipped up etc. I could go on but i am not gonna nit pick it. Its a very nice machine. But when you throw out high end some people go right to Hutchinson quality.

#16 8 years ago

Best of luck with the trade/sale Steve.

#17 8 years ago
Quoted from snaroff:

Since it looks like you own a Congo, why don't you show us pics of your example?

Get ready to get beat over the head with his mm/mb/afm resto's. i don't think Jim does high end restores on b listers. That is not a knock on Congo by any means.

#19 8 years ago
Quoted from McCune:

People need to stop with this High end stuff ! The game is different than other congos that is for sure . High end ? Not even close .

Jim

There may have been a nicer way to say it.

Quoted from AkumaZeto:

High end means its better than when it left the factory. Every ounce of the unit is clean and beyond mint. Corners so sharp as to cut your fingers off etc. Dirt not even within 50 feet of the game etc.

Your game while nice is not what i would call high end either. There is coil wrappers that dont match some are faded some are wrinkled. Midway sticker wrinkled lock down latch chipped up etc. I could go on but i am not gonna nit pick it. Its a very nice machine. But when you throw out high end some people go right to Hutchinson quality.

Like that see!

I do agree tho, unique yes high end...probably not

#20 8 years ago
Quoted from AkumaZeto:

High end means its better than when it left the factory. Every ounce of the unit is clean and beyond mint. Corners so sharp as to cut your fingers off etc. Dirt not even within 50 feet of the game etc.
Your game while nice is not what i would call high end either. There is coil wrappers that dont match some are faded some are wrinkled. Midway sticker wrinkled lock down latch chipped up etc. I could go on but i am not gonna nit pick it. Its a very nice machine. But when you throw out high end some people go right to Hutchinson quality.

His name is "Hutchins" (assuming you are talking about Chris, of High End Pins).

Listen, I restored an AFM with Chris Hutchins, had a MM done by Chad Keller, and a TOM done by TreasureCove. Having owned pins from all these talented folks, I am well aware of what "high end" means. Nevertheless, you are certainly entitled to your definition!

I stand by my original assertion that this cabinet artwork and clear coat are gorgeous (when compared with other high-end restorations I've seen and more importantly, owned). The underside of this pin was certainly not restored with the completeness of some other restorations I've owned...nevertheless, I don't play or look at the underneath of the PF or inside of the cabinet (so it just isn't that important to me). If that is important to you, I'm sure there are plenty of pro restorers that will be happy to restore one for you! The labor alone will approach the price I paid for this entire pin...so, I'm very happy with the tradeoff's made when restoring this Congo (which as you know, isn't an "A list" title).

#21 8 years ago
Quoted from DougPiranha:

There may have been a nicer way to say it.

I know , what can I say? It was not intended as a dig towards the op but more of a educational public service announcement .

Jim

#22 8 years ago
Quoted from McCune:

I know , what can I say? It was not intended as a dig towards the op but more of a educational public service announcement .
Jim

It came off as a dig.

Just being honest... think of it as a MCCune service announcement

#23 8 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

It came off as a dig.

Sorry, I will try harder next time .

#24 8 years ago
Quoted from snaroff:

His name is "Hutchins"

auto correct on my phone my bad. Nobody said the cab art was not awesome, think you are like taking it the wrong way. OH well GLWS

#25 8 years ago
Quoted from McCune:

Sorry, I will try harder next time .

No worries, now just show us some pretty restoration pictures. Have you restored a Congo> I would love to see more Congo love pictures. (maybe start a new thread so we can stop with the thread jacking> sorry snaroff).

#26 8 years ago

I don't want make this thread about me !

The op ask to see some of what I think a restoration is, here you go,small sample .

image.jpg image.jpg

#27 8 years ago
Quoted from McCune:

I know , what can I say? It was not intended as a dig towards the op but more of a educational public service announcement .
Jim

Frankly, your terse comment really doesn't provide much info/education. All it really does is give folks the impression you hold the sacred definition of what a high-end restoration is (which is silly). Hey, it you want to assert your the alpha dog, that's fine...

Here is some education...restoring *non A-list titles* with the usual pros isn't typically a smart financial decision. Many of the pro-restorers typically caution collectors on the financial pitfalls of restoring a title like Congo with them. So, this (dare I say) high-end Congo restoration was done by someone who I believe does really nice work (especially on the artwork and clear coating)...especially for the modest investment.

#28 8 years ago

Another restored MM...in the words of Rudy "Big deal!"

#29 8 years ago
Quoted from McCune:

I don't want make this thread about me !
The op ask to see some what I think is a restoration, here you go,small sample .

That is not what I asked for. I asked specifically for pictures of your Congo. I've seen many AFM/MM/MB that look like yours...and I've owned several. Not impressed...sorry. These 15-20k restorations are boring...

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#31 8 years ago
Quoted from turbo20lbs:

Another restored MM...in the words of Rudy "Big deal!"

I agree!

Quoted from snaroff:That is not what I asked for. I asked specifically for pictures of your Congo

My Congo is just a stock low play game , Big deal .

Jim

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#32 8 years ago

Call it whatever you want. The fact of the matter is that this is an absolutely beautiful Congo. It's easily the nicest one I've seen by far. Good luck with the sale!

#33 8 years ago
Quoted from snaroff:

Here is some education...restoring *non A-list titles* with the usual pros isn't typically a smart financial decision. Many of the pro-restorers typically caution collectors on the financial pitfalls of restoring a title like Congo with them. So, this (dare I say) high-end Congo restoration was done by someone who I believe does really nice work (especially on the artwork and clear coating)...especially for the modest investment.

You are dead on..... Only a handful of guys can approach what Chris does....Brian has been doing nice work for a long time, but a lot of people don't know who he is.

The reason you see a lot of guys showing the same games over and over is because all the parts are available to swap out. Not that there isn't skill in swapping parts (I am not understimating that in the least), but the incredible skills are with the guys that will fab a part from scratch, airbrush dithered artwork, etc...

Bump for one of the nicer Congos I have seen... Not usually a fan of powdercoating/mods, etc.... but this one is really cool looking....

#34 8 years ago

Oh, quit your bickering, all o' y'all! I've seen Jim's restos--they are on par with Bryan Kelly, Chad Keller and Chris Hutchins. Brian Dendis (Prowlerman) has sold me more thn one of his restorations. Generally, they're good, but he does almost exclusively "B" titles. In my experience, he's excellent with clearcoat--among the best, actually--adequate with touchup (not on par with the expensive guys), and doesn't even touch the inside of the cab or underside of the pf. Very creative with mods.

#35 8 years ago
Quoted from gweempose:

Call it whatever you want. The fact of the matter is that this is an absolutely beautiful Congo. It's easily the nicest one I've seen by far. Good luck with the sale!

Thank you! Just to be clear, I'm not selling it...just looking for a Paragon trade. The only reason I mentioned what I had in it was "Whysnow" asked.

Quoted from pinlawyer:

Oh, quit your bickering, all o' y'all! I've seen Jim's restos--they are on par with Bryan Kelly, Chad Keller and Chris Hutchins. Brian Dendis (Prowlerman) has sold me more thn one of his restorations. Generally, they're good, but he does almost exclusively "B" titles. In my experience, he's excellent with clearcoat--among the best, actually--adequate with touchup (not on par with the expensive guys), and doesn't even touch the inside of the cab or underside of the pf. Very creative with mods.

Brian actually did a very nice job with the inside of this cabinet. I think he spent so much time on the outside of the cabinet, he decided to make the inside nice as well.

Thanks for speaking up and confirming the quality of Brian's clearcoat work. The cabinet artwork he did on this is definitely much better than adequate. It's hard to compare with the A-list restores, since most of them involve applying new decals (and don't require artwork touchup). The artwork touchup he did on this Congo PF was also very nice...

From my perspective, B-list restorations are a different beast than A-list restorations. I think evaluating them in the same fashion doesn't make much sense.

As gweempose says, "Call it whatever you want". The bottom line is how does it look/play and what do you think it's current value is. If I said I thought it was worth 7-10k, then the push back would be justified. At 4.7k, it's arguably a nice example. Also important to note that I've seen really expensive restorations that didn't play well at all. This pin plays fast/awesome.

It's all good...

#36 8 years ago

I will second that this is by far the nicest Congo I have heard of or seen! I also think if you were to sell, that 4.7 would be a steal for a buyer looking for a super sweet congo.

#37 8 years ago

Agreed. It might well be the highest-end Congo in existence, assuming HEP hasn't done one (he's done a few B-titles). And the art on the cab looks amazing. I made an offer to buy this Congo. Yours was higher. I've had two Congos before. Tired of both. Would like one again someday--but that's a lot of money for this title.

#38 8 years ago

I'm interested in this Congo

#39 8 years ago

The thing is, Congo is an awesome Williams title, it just doesn't have the hype or the rabid fans that titles like MM, AFM, TOTAN, TAF or TZ have. I actually think just having the colored art pushes you in the right direction of having a high end Congo. The fact that it works 100%, is 95-99% restored and has some pretty nice powdercoated armor on it make it the most high-end Congo I have ever seen. It seems that if anybody around pin circles tries to give a 'B' title special attention, or actually tries to move a 'B' title into their personal 'A' list, it really causes a lot of waves with the old pin guard. I personally think this A and B list stuff is, if not total nonsense, at least very subjective. The same 20-30 guys have been talking highly about the same 10-15 games for the last 15-20 years. Try to bring up or hype a game not on that list and those people (or their followers) either laugh, get pissed or roll their eyes and try to ignore you. I have played both MM and TZ and have owned TOTAN and I didn't really like any of them. Picked up a Congo and was hooked from day one. I really think Congo was like one of the books that was left out of the bible by mistake. Nice machine, good luck with your trade.

#40 8 years ago

Typical right away someone has to start ripping on a guys machine becouse everyone thinks a high end restoration has to have been done my chris.
There are plenty of restores that do good work as well, friggen people need to quit ripping on everyone elses work unless they can show they can do it better themselves.
Dam a poor guys trys to trade or sell a nice machine and people have to pick apart his description.

#41 8 years ago

It is great to see Congo get this sort of treatment it is such a fun pin. Thanks for posting the link to the pictures and good luck with your trade.

#42 8 years ago

I think it looks wonderful and Id love to own such an example.

#43 8 years ago

That trim looks awesome! I love it!

#44 8 years ago

I wasn't ripping oh him just stating what i think a H.E is. It is the nicest Congo i have ever seen for sure. My honest opinion here man...put this Gem on Ebay and let the people go nuts for it.

Has the Volcano been re worked or show any damage?

#45 8 years ago

Frankly, your terse comment really doesn't provide much info/education. All it really does is give folks the impression you hold the sacred definition of what a high-end restoration is

You are right , I should have provided a little info on why I don't think it is High End, like Scotch tape holding the tags on or a missing flipper opto spring or wrong coil in the gorilla and other reasons that tell me you shouldn't have used the term High End,as it means something else, then the pin for sale in this thread.

High end means near perfect and very very clean no part untouched. You could have stated " Custom Restoration" and no one would have busted your balls !

Sorry for being honest .

Since you requested Congo pictures of my original untouched Congo, here they are . Not perfect but nice unmolested example!

Jim

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#46 8 years ago
Quoted from McCune:

Since you requested Congo pictures of my original untouched Congo, here they are .

now THAT is the nicest congo i've ever seen. we need a drooling smiley face emoticon!

#47 8 years ago

Looks great

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#48 8 years ago

Now, take Jim's Congo, pimp it out like the one Brian did, and i'd be all over it at that price.

#49 8 years ago
Quoted from McCune:

You are right , I should have provided a little info on why I don't think it is High End, like Scotch tape holding the tags on or a missing flipper opto spring or wrong coil in the gorilla and other reasons that tell me you shouldn't have used the term High End,as it means something else, then the pin for sale in this thread.
High end means near perfect and very very clean no part untouched. You could have stated " Custom Restoration" and no one would have busted your balls !
Sorry for being honest .
Since you requested Congo pictures of my original untouched Congo, here they are . Not perfect but nice unmolested example!
Jim

Looks like a very nice example. Listen, I'll call my pin whatever I want. Since I provided plenty of pictures, people can decide for themselves...

Last time I try and trade on this forum...all this BS and not one Paragon lead. Definitely not an efficient use of time.

#50 8 years ago
Quoted from snaroff:

I'll call my pin whatever I want

I agree, just don't do it publicly on a pinball forum as it might mislead unsuspecting new people !

Jim

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