You are entering the period where you could file a complaint. In 6 mos, you may get to go before an arbitrator to have your complaint heard. If you haven't received the product by then, you may be entitled to a refund. So, I guess that could work out.

Either way, as I said, a respectable seller would issue a refund in this case.

Problem is, there was no "promised" date, only an "expected" date

And I imagine the contract the buyer agreed to had terms that stated their deposit would be forfeited if they decide to cancel their pre-order

What's dumb is we could fix this . As a group we should not do business with folks that won't do the refunds and we should support those that do. We are not being smart as a group here.

Per the FTC ...

"By law, a merchant should ship your order within the time stated in its ads or over the phone. If the merchant doesn't promise a time, you can expect it to ship your order within 30 days."

A merchant can insist on many different covenants in their contract, but failure to deliver on a product sold does not protect them from courts and/or federal agencies that have consistently ruled in favor of the consumer.

The bottom line is that every pre-order customer has an ally in the FTC. If you really want your deposit back, you have a Federal Law and a potent federal agency to will help you.

Marcus

well played dunb is doing pre orders, dunber is a company not giving a full refund and having us talk about it here. there you have it dunb and dunber.

first to pay first to play!.jpg

The law regarding pre-orders is different from the law regarding sales. Bottom line, it will cost you more money and energy than it's worth to cite some FTC regulatory guideline, rather than a law (which varies by jurisdiction), before some arbitrator, who may or may not agree with you. The FTC is a regulatory agency, you act like you can call them up and they'll send out some guy who will fix your problems for you.

The laws for pre-order are the exact same for pre-sales. And while it may take a while for someone at the FTC to help, the law is on the side of the consumer. And the fines that the FTC can levy on companies is tremendous.

But rather than continue this discourse, I will let those who want a deposit from any retailer or manufacturer decide on their own proper course.

One does not need a lawyer to provide Federal Law as reason for a refund. If the retailer/manufacturer still refuses the refund, then the buyer will have to make some tough decisions regarding next steps.

Maybe these Pinball Boutiques are not as fearful of the FTC. But it doesn't change the fact that a pre-buyer of a Pinball machine has a good deal of leverage when demanding a refund for a machine that is delayed.

Maybe the boutique refunds the customer just to avoid any possible dealings with the FTC or lawyers. Maybe the boutique is willing to play hard ball and take on lawyers and federal agencies in the hopes that the buyer does not have the stomach for such things.

But one thing is for sure, a buyer does not have to take the boutiques decision as the final decision. A buyer can take some personal time and effort and determine if the law protects them. One way to do this is to contact the FTC and ask for advice.

Some businesses may choose to ignore the FTC and the laws in place regarding these type of transactions. But in my professional world, where I am a subject matter expect on FTC Compliance, large retailers give the FTC sufficient respect and do everything possible to avoid angering the FTC.

In my professional opinion, these boutique pre-order fall under the umbrella of the FTC's "Mail or Telephone Order Merchandise Rule". But rather than take my word for it, these buyers should contact the FTC and find out from the agency themselves.

And then, when sufficiently prepared with a full knowledge of the rights afforded under US Federal Law, the buyer should contact the company again and see if the information will facilitate a refund.

Marcus

What's your angle man? You're splitting hairs over the definition of a sale versus a preorder to prove a guy should be stuck in financial limbo. If PPS would have delivered a game when stated a year ago, the op could have sold it and got most of his money back. In this situation, he's out the money with no recourse. I'm scratching my head as to why you are championing this as a good thing. You're on the wrong side of the coin on this one. By a lot.

Plain and simple, people need to start holding these vendors accountable. That's you jack/pinball sales. It's horse shit and you know it. You presented a quasi-demand letter for full payment forever ago and have been sitting on the payments month after PPS delayed months. Do the right thing.

His angle is obviously trolling...

Agree with this estimate, expect to knock off 1k to sell it here. I hope you vigorously pursue the refund instead, although I can see their side. Well, maybe you'll luckup and congrats on the baby.

Go for your refund or take delivery. I wouldn't lose money to sell your spot. You'll recoup it if you resell it in the box after these hit the market IMO.

Not if Rick holds to his "warranty coverage is not transferable and only applies to original registered owner" policy as announced at Expo 13.

If you want out, ask for your refund. Holding onto a game NIB after paying even more to have it shipped to you with a slim hope of breaking even is non-medieval madness.

Exactly. Following the "speculator" angle I could just buy the three slots that gap has for sale, only invest $3000 now then "cash in" by only paying the balance 10 days before it ships. It almost sounds like a Nigerian scam... I stand by my advice to the OP. Demand a refund!

Great news!!!
Kudos to Jack for doing the right thing.

Glad it worked out for you and congrats on the new addition. Kids are so much more fun that pinball machines

Happy to hear that it worked out! Enjoy your upcoming addition!

Glad to hear Jack did the right thing. Thanks for posting the update.

Way to step up to the plate, on both sides.

Awesome and glad it worked out!

Hey guys in an unrelated note Id like to start taking deposits for a new pinball machine. Only a few catches:
1: There will be no updates as to progress on machines
2: There will be no theme to the machine, just what I feel like doing at the time
3: $20,000 dollar minimum deposit and $10,000 extra if I mean when it gets released
4: Do not communicate with my company as I am out spending your money I mean working on the machines.
5: Also very limited machines will be made ie as many as I can until y'all are broke

Last but not least I move around from city to city "Working" on making the best pinball machines so again do not call me I'll call you First expected release date 2052 so get me the pre order money quick.

Jack is a good guy. Comes off a bit brash sometimes. But he always tries to make things right. That has been my experience with his company and I have purchased several pins from them.

ok Jpop.

Glad it wasn't as hard as pulling teeth.