(Topic ID: 209681)

Fossil Fuels - is the USA getting left behind?


By vid1900

1 year ago



Topic Stats

  • 132 posts
  • 43 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by Yoski
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

You

Topic Gallery

There have been 13 images uploaded to this topic. (View topic image gallery).

1970s-los-angeles-smog-depicted-in-the-honda-short-film-never-ending-race_100457095_h (resized).jpg
download (1) (resized).jpg
agqFU-1456338742-2059-list_items-telegraph.gif
IMG_4077 (resized).PNG
nyc-taxi-1_3504833k (resized).jpg
phpjc5202.gif
00wyoming4-master675 (resized).jpg
screen_shot_2013-03-11_at_15.31.01 (resized).png
black-lung-display-edit-62f8859fdf7947f25bb389dd4bde094bae966c67-s900-c85 (resized).jpg
bladerunner.gif
DumpsterFire2 (resized).jpg
203_co2-graph-021116 (1) (resized).jpeg
totala (resized).png

There are 132 posts in this topic. You are on page 3 of 3.
#101 1 year ago

The only part of this discussion I find useless is when people that run their AC all summer and their heater all winter and drive hundreds of miles a week tell those of us that don't how we need to save energy.

#102 1 year ago
Quoted from Methos:

It is hypocritical when we won't change the demand (our behavior), but turn around and blame the suppliers, which is what this thread is doing. Many of us have changed our lifestyles, our diets, and the way we conduct business to use less natural resources. Or we can just blame coal industries I guess.

Well, it's all about harm reduction. I'm aware my plane travel sucks for the environment. In my day-to-day, I stopped driving a car (I walk to work/to places of leisure, and use an uber/lyft once or twice a month), I stopped eating meat and dairy, use LED bulbs. My electric bill is about $30 a month. Can I do more/better? Of course! I could make a better effort to buy locally-made food/reduce the food miles. I could stop flying places. I'm imperfect, like everyone else.

#103 1 year ago
Quoted from o-din:

The only part of this discussion I find useless is when people that run their AC all summer and their heater all winter and drive hundreds of miles a week tell those of us that don't how we need to save energy.

That is annoying...BUT, I haven't really seen any posts proposing anyone should save energy. Only that energy should, someday, come from different sources.

#104 1 year ago
Quoted from Pinfactory2000:

BUT, I haven't really seen any posts proposing anyone should save energy. Only that energy should, someday, come from different sources.

Good point. But to me not using excessive amounts of energy or as little as possible is a similar goal.

#105 1 year ago
Quoted from o-din:

Good point. But to me not using excessive amounts of energy or as little as possible is a similar goal.

There is certainly a nuance though. If my house was solar I'd crank the AC to 55 degrees in the summer. Let the fat lady on the beach suffer...I'm stealing the suns rays!

#106 1 year ago
Quoted from adania:

- The crazy suggestion by the US department of energy to subsidize un-economic Coal plants and how the ENTIRE ENERGY INDUSTRY told them WTFNO! https://www.utilitydive.com/news/ferc-rejects-doe-nopr-kicking-resilience-issue-to-grid-operators/514334/ (the point of this is that renewables are ALREADY cost-effective generation over coal in many cases)

So while I am in agreement with most of your posting and am really pro renewable. I think that ensuring grid stability by subsidizing coal and nuclear isn't a bad idea. Right now natural gas is the fuel of choice. Mothballing nukes and coal plants and relying just on natural gas just isn't a good idea. You really should have diversity in fuel choice. I think we need reasonable energy policy that allows for subsidization of renewables as well as coal and nuclear to have a more balanced energy profile. Another thing to consider is the impact on the local economy when these plants are shut down. The impact will kill entire communities. When you subsidize the cost you realize far greater benefits than what the subsidy costs and adds to system stability as a whole.

#107 1 year ago

We aren’t likely to get to China-like smog conditions too soon in major US cities I don’t think? So it’s down to relative costs.. or how the government alters relative costs with incentives, funding or legislation. It would be nice to see storage tech make a leap.. you can only put so many renewables reliably on the grid without traditional reserve spinning to pick up load because we have yet to put in a good, cheap storage system. That could be a game changer but it doesn’t help when the government slashes research funding

#108 1 year ago
Quoted from roffels:

I stopped eating meat and dairy, use LED bulbs. .

Nice job! If only everyone else did this not only would we reduce our energy consumption, but increase our life expectancy and quality of life.

#109 1 year ago

I eat plenty of meat and dairy, but can't stand LED bulbs. And my quality of life is just fine.

#110 1 year ago
Quoted from Mbecker:

We aren’t likely to get to China-like smog conditions too soon in major US cities I don’t think?

Certainly not in Cali

1970s-los-angeles-smog-depicted-in-the-honda-short-film-never-ending-race_100457095_h (resized).jpg

#111 1 year ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Certainly not in Cali

Latest word is a lot of our smog is coming from fertilizer and not so much cars anymore.

So the best thing to do would be Ca. not being such an agricultural force anymore. And let each state grow it's own crops.

#112 1 year ago
Quoted from o-din:

And let each state grow it's own crops.

Florida oranges are green, and have to be dyed orange........do I want that?

#113 1 year ago

Ironic that we live in Orange County and our orange juice comes from Florida. But they would have a hard time beating our Avocados.

#114 1 year ago
Quoted from Pinfactory2000:

Pretty sad if people have retreated so far into their political corner that a factual discussion on electricity causes issues lol.

Yay for the era of "alternative facts" and science that doesn't matter provided you get your daily pep talk from a news channel paid to tell you global warming is a commie lie.

#115 1 year ago
Quoted from cait001:

Yay for the era of "alternative facts" and science that doesn't matter provided you get your daily pep talk from a news channel paid to tell you global warming is a commie lie.

Take it easy there sparky, lets keep the politics out of this. Everyone here agrees that clean air and water are good things. No need to get political about it.

#116 1 year ago
Quoted from adania:

TL;DR = Energy Storage is cool! It can help alleviate some of the challenges presented by renewable generation sources. Ask me more if you want!
I work in Energy Storage, which is an excellent solution to many of the challenges presented by trying to incorporate renewable generation into the existing power grid. As has been said already, renewables such as solar and wind power do not generate a specific amount of electricity on demand in the same way that combustibles can. This means that no matter how many wind turbines you have running, if no one needs that electricity right then, you are just gonna have to throw it away (or blow up your transformers, etc). This leads to things like negative electricity pricing, which has shown up many times already in North America, Europe, and Australia (just off the top of my head) due to windfarms in Texas or Scotland or South Australia (for example) having windier days than the loads could account for. HOWEVER, if you have a battery ready to accept that electricity, that negative pricing means THEY WILL PAY YOU TO TAKE IT. And then you wait for the opposite and offer that stored energy when everyone is demanding more moremore power and the prices spike. And you get paid twice for the same power, once on the way into your battery and once on the way out!
We are seeing more and more energy storage options showing up as the technology advances. Surely you've already read about Elon Musk's giant battery in SA that is already working on their grid to support those spikes and sags and take even better advantage of the huge uptick in renewable generation being installed around Australia.
But you can have smaller batteries in your own home to help support renewable absorption too. This is actually required in Hawaii now, iirc, because they were not allowing ANY powerflow outward from your meter ("Net Zero"), meaning that anyone who wanted to install solar was required to also install energy storage to prevent any reverse powerflow onto the grid. Tesla's powerwall is a well-known example of a consumer-grade residential energy storage product of this type. There are many others now, and my previous job was with a company making utility grade products in a similar vein for a few years before Telsa showed up in the market to find more uses for his EV batteries. (My last employer is still around, actually, but I decided to move on to MUCH bigger batteries with a different company.)
Speaking of EV, energy storage is one way we are finding ways to mitigate the environmental impact of disposing of EV batteries at end-of-life. When your car's battery can only get you 25 miles on a single charge, it's probably no longer useful as a family car. But link up hundreds of those for a STATIONARY bank of storage, and you can still get lots of value from them (with some clever software)!
Anyway, I could go on and on about this (and related) topic(s), but I would be pleased to answer any specific questions people have about these things for starters:
- Residential Energy Storage Batteries (measured in kWh and the size of an A/C unit or fridge or other large home appliance)
- C&I Energy Storage Batteries (measured in MWh and the size of a house or bigger!)
- Challenges facing utilities who want to incorporate more renewables into their generation.
- The Grid and Energy Markets and painstakingly balancing them so consumers can just flip the lightswitch on and it magically works!
- The crazy suggestion by the US department of energy to subsidize un-economic Coal plants and how the ENTIRE ENERGY INDUSTRY told them WTFNO! https://www.utilitydive.com/news/ferc-rejects-doe-nopr-kicking-resilience-issue-to-grid-operators/514334/ (the point of this is that renewables are ALREADY cost-effective generation over coal in many cases)

These seem pretty cool and a step in the right direction...
https://www.tesla.com/powerwall

#117 1 year ago
Quoted from o-din:

Ironic that we live in Orange County and our orange juice comes from Florida. But they would have a hard time beating our Avocados.

I worked with two guys a few years ago. One was from Cali and the other used to be an independent trucker who hauled produce from California.

Both of them, at different times and different places in the shop, said Florida oranges were trucked to Cali and then Cali oranges were trucked to Florida.

It always sounded like a waste of gas to me but searching Google shows that Florida's hot and humid climate produces oranges with more juice while Cali's hot and dry climate produces oranges with thicker skin and they are better for eating instead of juicing.

#118 1 year ago
Quoted from Pinfactory2000:

These seem pretty cool and a step in the right direction...
https://www.tesla.com/powerwall

What's even cooler is that some people offer DIY on how to make them for much cheaper.

This is just an example but there are litterally 100's of post out there about this topic

#119 1 year ago
Quoted from Duvall:

The *only* reason they are doing anything is because they have to. They would pour lead and mercury down the sewer and pump whatever they could into the atmosphere if they thought they could get away with it.

I think you're talking about capitalism in general, not just China. Before regulations, EVERYONE did that kind of stuff. Why spend tonnes of money safely disposing of chemicals when you can just build your factory by the river and dump the chemical slurry into the water? There's no law against it, and it is very profitable.
All across North America and Europe this happened all of the time until regulations were enacted. Some waterways are still in their decades/centuries long recoveries.

#120 1 year ago
Quoted from cait001:

I think you're talking about capitalism in general, not just China. Before regulations, EVERYONE did that kind of stuff. Why spend tonnes of money safely disposing of chemicals when you can just build your factory by the river and dump the chemical slurry into the water? There's no law against it, and it is very profitable.
All across North America and Europe this happened all of the time until regulations were enacted. Some waterways are still in their decades/centuries long recoveries.

Yep. Has nothing to do with china. Has to do with where they are in their economic development. When we were in our industrial revolution companies did horrifying things. Still do but with cameras in everyones pocket the power of better information plays as big/bigger a role than regulators can sometimes...

#121 1 year ago
Quoted from flashinstinct:

What's even cooler is that some people offer DIY on how to make them for much cheaper.
» YouTube video
This is just an example but there are litterally 100's of post out there about this topic

I'm literally drooling over that 21 window VW bus in the thumbnail of that video.

#122 1 year ago
Quoted from fisherdaman:

I'm literally drooling over that 21 window VW bus in the thumbnail of that video.

Right? Dude has a 6 figure VW and is soldering LION batteries together!

#123 1 year ago
Quoted from Pinfactory2000:

Right? Dude has a 6 figure VW and is soldering LION batteries together!

He knows how to save money!

#124 1 year ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Certainly not in Cali

Your pic of whatever smog filled city that is reminds me of when I was passenger on a military flight into Orange California in 1973. I loved looking out the windows when i used to fly. The plane started losing altitude when preparing to land. As I as looking the window and watching the buildings, roads, and cars grow larger we flew into the smog. It was a son-of-a-bitch! moment as visibility dropped to zero and the only thing I could see was brown smog.

Once landed and outside the plane there was this brown haze in all directions. It was a sobering experience.

#125 1 year ago

Ok I didn't read the whole thing but I have read that the 4th and 5th generation nuclar, as Bushie would say it, are far safer and cleaner than anything els we could use. They also can burn the use the waste that is left from older powerplants. If so why are we not doing this?

#126 1 year ago
Quoted from zr11990:

burn the use the waste that is left from older powerplants

#127 1 year ago
Quoted from Bryan_Kelly:

And I find discussions like this useless. Will any of us here actually do anything to make a difference?

Yes, conserve resources. Look at enery efficient heating and cooling products, appliances, lighting, transportation. Every bit counts. Less demand = less usage. I just replaced my 25+ year old clothes washer with a new high-efficiency top-loader. It's weird to see it not fill with water and cycle the agitator constantly, but it is for the greater good. Also the clothes still come out clean.

#128 1 year ago
Quoted from cottonm4:

It always sounded like a waste of gas to me but searching Google shows that Florida's hot and humid climate produces oranges with more juice while Cali's hot and dry climate produces oranges with thicker skin and they are better for eating instead of juicing.

By taking care of and watering the orange tree in my back yard, it produces some of the tastiest and juiciest oranges around, but I can see how on a larger scale a moister climate would produce juicier oranges overall.

#129 1 year ago

Renewable energy and energy storage is the future. Lithium Ion batteries will be replaced with improved technology in the next 2 decades. Renewable energy can be captured on a more localized basis reducing the risk of large regional blackouts due to storms, terrorists, etc. New products like the Solar City shingles are a really interesting and as efficiency improves and prices come down, these will become a practical solution for homeowners just like LED bulbs were $10 to $15 a bulb just a few years ago and had a 5 to 10 year payback timeframe but now I can buy one for < $2 per bulb.

#130 1 year ago
Quoted from o-din:

By taking care of and watering the orange tree in my back yard, it produces some of the tastiest and juiciest oranges around, but I can see how on a larger scale a moister climate would produce juicier oranges overall.

Yep. My Mom’s orange tree produces really sweet oj. I’ll usually throw a few less ripe ones in because I like it a little tart. Avocados off her tree are great too.

#131 1 year ago
Quoted from vid1900:

How has the USA fallen so far behind, where they once were the leaders in new technology?

Lobbyists

#132 1 year ago

Without advanced energy storage (battery or some other scheme) wind and solar are of limited usefulness. Currently batteries lack capacity and are very destructive to the environment to manufacture plus they and wind turbines require exotic raw materials which are mostly mined in China. New nuclear plants are safe (pebble bed reactor) if you don't build them in areas prone to natural disasters and have proper maintenance.
Here in Florida solar would work great but it is still not anywhere near to competitive with $0.085/kWh which I am paying to FPL. Currently our biggest resource is our wastefulness. With minimal effort we could reduce energy consumption by 30-40%. Insulation, smaller cars (I know that's IMPOSSIBLE), efficient public transportation, bike lanes, etc.

Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
$ 28.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ULEKstore
$ 109.95
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
Pinball Pro
$ 19.95
$ 10.00
Playfield - Decals
Metal-Mods
$ 90.00
Lighting - Under Cabinet
Rock Custom Pinball
$ 115.00
Playfield - Other
Great American Pinball
$ 149.00
$ 29.95
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ULEKstore
$ 6.00
Electronics
German-Pinball-Modular
From: $ 175.00
Gameroom - Decorations
Pinball Photos
$ 229.99
Lighting - Other
Lighted Pinball Mods
From: $ 175.00
Gameroom - Decorations
Pinball Photos
$ 44.95
$ 5,999.00
Pinball Machine
Nitro Pinball Shop
$ 78.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Lermods
$ 109.00
Cabinet Parts
Tilted Pinball
$ 15.00
Playfield - Protection
Professor Pinball
$ 5.00
$ 999.00
Pinball Machine
Mircoplayfields
$ 22.00
Hardware
The MOD Couple
$ 48.00
Cabinet - Other
ModFather Pinball Mods
From: $ 11.95
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ULEKstore
From: $ 149.10
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
PinWoofer
$ 34.95
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ULEKstore
There are 132 posts in this topic. You are on page 3 of 3.

Hey there! Got a moment?

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run thanks to donations from our visitors? Please donate to Pinside, support the site and get anext to your username to show for it! Donate to Pinside