The Big Lebowski
Dutch Pinball, 2016This topic is linked to a classified ad.
The Ad Listing has been ended, so this topic closed automatically.
I just want to say that Kim is more than just a good guy, he has gone to bat for pinsiders like me in ways I can’t talk about right now.
GLWTS Kim! I wish included afford this game!
PS. If your low on room you can store it at my house indefinitely 
With all the bantering that goes on in threads like this, I sometimes wonder if some people here even PLAY pinball....
More philosophy than an ivy league university.
I understand that people get concerned about their game going down in value (MMR, AFMR, etc.). I may be in the minority here. I've bought my games in the past based on whether I like the title and like to play them, not to make money. If you're buying as an investment, history shows that pins have been good in the past, but recently not so much with the remakes in the works. I got into the hobby at the right time and bought my pins "right" allowing me to enjoy the heck out of them for years and years and then sell them and at least get my money back if not make money on them. Most investments don't let you enjoy something for a lot of years and then breakeven or make money when you sell.
To OP...GLWS. Looks like a beautiful machine.
Buying the game as a pure investment is a complete concept failure.
A person should only buy this game as piece of technical pinball history and entertainment.
This has nothing related to Mr. Mitchell. The seller reputation is not in question or care for the machine. This does not negate enthusiasm for a sale. This is not about price. It is not about the manufacture history or challenges of Dutch Pinball. It is about the game itself. I must restate that this game should be treated as a pure prototype, not a production game. I am not sure if I can qualify it as a sample game, but the first small run was certainly close. Not everybody seems to understand this concern. It is evident by responses. In comparison, anyone that has inspected an original Capcom BBB for example and compared it to an IPB remake knows that the IPB was superior it its design, as fixed many problems from the prototypes. However, the prototypes always command a higher price because they were the original creations of Capcom, not just rarity. If you were not around either when that specific game was made (1994-1996), or remade (2004-2007), you cannot have an objective opinion.
Only a handful of people truly understand TBL functionality, the parts, or the proprietary design. Lack of available parts of the original game, incompatibility of the new sample games with the electronics, breakability of the lower bowling assembly, and other factors such as the schematic layout makes this have the potential to be a 300lb doorstop. I know because I have inspected/played the game before it broke, saw the vulnerabilities, and witnessed the problems afterward to get it functioning again. Right now, it is not worth the time or effort to correct from my company's perspective. Essentially, the operations manager is waiting to see if a complete boardset could be swapped in design (and potential "restart" of production), than trying to rebuild the entire game. This does not consider some mechanical issues, that still have to be addressed unrelated to electronics. They don't want me spending dozens of hours trying to create a new solution. Other people asked me for advice regarding upgrades or parts, and there is no present source, and the future as already reported remains unknown.
This is not the same as any low run prototype/sample game made by a primary manufacturer in the past at least the electronics were acquirable such as BBB, Krull, Going Nuts, King Pin, or even PtC. You cannot compare this to any of these from the past This game has no reference point, and requires a person with significant time and pinball experience to work around potential pitfalls, using aftermarket components, electronics engineering, and mechanical tool and die, when, not if, the game fails. Few high end collectors today are pinball technicians adept at dealing with proprietary new designs, rather than existing established ones. Many have been in the hobby for less than a decade today.
I can offer a comparison. The level of complexity concern here is similar to what I am doing presently with Merit Mega Touches that had the medical monitors die after warranty, parts wise. They simply were not available (and prohibitively expensive for those that were left), which they required me to figure out how to integrate/disassemble a modern Dell LCD screen and merge it with the touch screen and controller board, recut the mounting panels, remount all new PCBs, tap power from the main chassis, and get everything to be able to function and calibrate, not short out anything, all in the constraints of the existing platform space and not look like an amateur hack job. I suspect this is not something general hobbyists would relish.
These are the concerns, I offer to potential buyer, looking at the game from a technical point of view presently, not as a pure collectible.
Quoted from NPO:I sometimes wonder if some people here even PLAY pinball....
Curious why that would matter.
Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:Buying the game as an pure investment is a complete concept failure
This is opinion! There have been many to buy games for investment and sold those games for profit! Period! I am one of those people. It is all about timing and risks. There have been a few I know that have profited very well indeed. But they took big risks too. Just buying one of these BL games was risk. To the victor go the spoils! 
Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:Buying the game as a pure investment is a complete concept failure.
A person should only buy this game as piece of technical pinball history and entertainment.
This has nothing related to Mr. Mitchell. The seller reputation is not in question or care for the machine. This does not negate enthusiasm for a sale. This is not about price. It is not about the manufacture history or challenges of Dutch Pinball. It is about the game itself. I must restate that this game should be treated as a pure prototype, not a production game. I am not sure if I can qualify it as a sample game, but the first small run was certainly close. Not everybody seems to understand this concern. It is evident by responses. In comparison, anyone that has inspected an original Capcom BBB for example and compared it to an IPB remake knows that the IPB was superior it its design, as fixed many problems from the prototypes. However, the prototypes always command a higher price because they were the original creations of Capcom, not just rarity. If you were not around either when that specific game was made (1994-1996), or remade (2004-2007), you cannot have an objective opinion.
Only a handful of people truly understand TBL functionality, the parts, or the proprietary design. Lack of available parts of the original game, incompatibility of the new sample games with the electronics, breakability of the lower bowling assembly, and other factors such as the schematic layout makes this have the potential to be a 300lb doorstop. I know because I have inspected/played the game before it broke, saw the vulnerabilities, and witnessed the problems afterward to get it functioning again. Right now, it is not worth the time or effort to correct from my company's perspective. Essentially, the operations manager is waiting to see if a complete boardset could be swapped in design (and potential "restart" of production), than trying to rebuild the entire game. This does not consider some mechanical issues, that still have to be addressed unrelated to electronics. They don't want me spending dozens of hours trying to create a new solution. Other people asked me for advice regarding upgrades or parts, and there is no present source, and the future as already reported remains unknown.
This is not the same as any low run prototype/sample game made by a primary manufacturer in the past at least the electronics were acquirable such as BBB, Krull, Going Nuts, King Pin, or even PtC. You cannot compare this to any of these from the past This game has no reference point, and requires a person with significant time and pinball experience to work around potential pitfalls, using aftermarket components, electronics engineering, and mechanical tool and die, when, not if, the game fails. Few high end collectors today are pinball technicians adept at dealing with proprietary new designs, rather than existing established ones. Many have been in the hobby for less than a decade today.
I can offer a comparison. The level of complexity concern here is similar to what I am doing presently with Merit Mega Touches that had the medical monitors die after warranty, parts wise. They simply were not available (and prohibitively expensive for those that were left), which they required me to figure out how to integrate/disassemble a modern Dell LCD screen and merge it with the touch screen and controller board, recut the mounting panels, remount all new PCBs, tap power from the main chassis, and get everything to be able to function and calibrate, not short out anything, all in the constraints of the existing platform space and not look like an amateur hack job. I suspect this is not something general hobbyists would relish.
These are the concerns, I offer to potential buyer, looking at the game from a technical point of view presently, not as a pure collectible.
Wow, you are an amazing novelist. I recommend you publish that book on Amazon.
Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:Buying the game as a pure investment is a complete concept failure.
A person should only buy this game as piece of technical pinball history and entertainment.
This has nothing related to Mr. Mitchell. The seller reputation is not in question or care for the machine. This does not negate enthusiasm for a sale. This is not about price. It is not about the manufacture history or challenges of Dutch Pinball. It is about the game itself. I must restate that this game should be treated as a pure prototype, not a production game. I am not sure if I can qualify it as a sample game, but the first small run was certainly close. Not everybody seems to understand this concern. It is evident by responses. In comparison, anyone that has inspected an original Capcom BBB for example and compared it to an IPB remake knows that the IPB was superior it its design, as fixed many problems from the prototypes. However, the prototypes always command a higher price because they were the original creations of Capcom, not just rarity. If you were not around either when that specific game was made (1994-1996), or remade (2004-2007), you cannot have an objective opinion.
Only a handful of people truly understand TBL functionality, the parts, or the proprietary design. Lack of available parts of the original game, incompatibility of the new sample games with the electronics, breakability of the lower bowling assembly, and other factors such as the schematic layout makes this have the potential to be a 300lb doorstop. I know because I have inspected/played the game before it broke, saw the vulnerabilities, and witnessed the problems afterward to get it functioning again. Right now, it is not worth the time or effort to correct from my company's perspective. Essentially, the operations manager is waiting to see if a complete boardset could be swapped in design (and potential "restart" of production), than trying to rebuild the entire game. This does not consider some mechanical issues, that still have to be addressed unrelated to electronics. They don't want me spending dozens of hours trying to create a new solution. Other people asked me for advice regarding upgrades or parts, and there is no present source, and the future as already reported remains unknown.
This is not the same as any low run prototype/sample game made by a primary manufacturer in the past at least the electronics were acquirable such as BBB, Krull, Going Nuts, King Pin, or even PtC. You cannot compare this to any of these from the past This game has no reference point, and requires a person with significant time and pinball experience to work around potential pitfalls, using aftermarket components, electronics engineering, and mechanical tool and die, when, not if, the game fails. Few high end collectors today are pinball technicians adept at dealing with proprietary new designs, rather than existing established ones. Many have been in the hobby for less than a decade today.
I can offer a comparison. The level of complexity concern here is similar to what I am doing presently with Merit Mega Touches that had the medical monitors die after warranty, parts wise. They simply were not available (and prohibitively expensive for those that were left), which they required me to figure out how to integrate/disassemble a modern Dell LCD screen and merge it with the touch screen and controller board, recut the mounting panels, remount all new PCBs, tap power from the main chassis, and get everything to be able to function and calibrate, not short out anything, all in the constraints of the existing platform space and not look like an amateur hack job. I suspect this is not something general hobbyists would relish.
These are the concerns, I offer to potential buyer, looking at the game from a technical point of view presently, not as a pure collectible.
Quoted from RTS:I can never read through xtheblackknightx posts.
He writes to satisfy his ego.
You should try making it thru one of his podcasts with Kman.
Quoted from turbo20lbs:You should try making it thru one of his podcasts with Kman.
They all can't be gems, like mine.....
Based on reading some of @xtheblackknightx's posts meeting to him would be like Neo meeting the Architect in the Matrix 
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:Does this pin come with a happy ending?
Only if it's self inflicted.
Quoted from Bryan_Kelly:Only if it's self inflicted.
Seems like seller should be willing to go the extra mile.
Quoted from Tuna_Delight:The Dude abides:
» YouTube video
Lol we posted at almost same time
Quoted from RyanStl:Wish this could be moved to a new thread from the for sale, but what do you think is the max for a pin? Will this really go up from the asking price better than normal investments?
Worth Every Toe!
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/235377962
Worth noting that the machine in the Bowen Kerins tutorial has been on route for well over a year now.
I have great respect for my friend Gene Hwang for putting such a rare game on location for all to enjoy. Stop by the Alamo Drafthouse in San Francisco to check it out.
I love watching those PAPA tutorials with Bowen. How the hell can he speak so intelligently explaining the rules is beyond me.
Man, I did not know how in depth the rules were but when I played it in Allentown 2 years ago I didn't play very long. I love the layout and mini playfields especially the car mode. It looks like a polished game and not half assed at all. If its on location for over a year without major issues, it must be built well.
Love the Bowen tutorials as well. He makes it all look so easy. I played TBL at a show years ago. Game looked and played pretty solid. Felt closer to a 90's B/W pin than anything else at the time. I just didn't know the rules or gel with gameplay. Tutorial makes me want to play it again. Rules seem really fun and not overly complicated like a lot of other newer pins.
Quoted from Mr68:Worth noting that the machine in the Bowen Kerins tutorial has been on route for well over a year now.
I have great respect for my friend Gene Hwang for putting such a rare game on location for all to enjoy. Stop by the Alamo Drafthouse in San Francisco to check it out.
Wow someone is putting a TBL on route. Crazy!
yeah not to derail this for sale thread, but I am not a collector but more a player. I had people coming over to my photography studio to play it but that was kind of a pain to manage so instead decided to route it so more people could enjoy it. Doesn't hurt that it earns well too
I'm considering buying this.
My only question is how long would I have to leave it set up at Chucky Cheese to recoup my initial investment?
Quoted from o-din:I'm considering buying this.
My only question is how long would I have to leave it set up at Chucky Cheese to recoup my initial investment?
At Chuck E Cheese, about 3 days.
Quoted from TRAMD:At Chuck E Cheese, about 3 days.
And who says pinball is not an investment!
Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:Buying the game as a pure investment is a complete concept failure.
A person should only buy this game as piece of technical pinball history and entertainment.QUESTION:
WHY SHOULDN'T SOMEONE BUY THE GAME AS A PURE INVESTMENT EXACTLY? CAN YOU SUPPORT THIS STATEMENT?
SINCE YOU BELIEVE IT TO BE UNRELIABLE AND UNFIXABLE, THEN THE BUYER WOULD BE FOOLISH TO USE IT FOR ENTERTAINMENT, CORRECT?
IT SEEMS LIKE THEY ARE PRESENTLY SELLING FOR $13K - $14K, THAT'S ON THE LEVEL OF OTHER HIGH END COLLECTABLE PINS.
IT'S NOT LIKE THEY'RE SELLING FOR $100K AND HAVE NO POTENTIAL TO INCREASE IN VALUE.
NOT GETTING YOUR POINT ABOUT "CONCEPT FAILURE." TO BE HONEST I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THAT PHRASE MEANS.
This has nothing related to Mr. Mitchell. The seller reputation is not in question or care for the machine. This does not negate enthusiasm for a sale. This is not about price. It is not about the manufacture history or challenges of Dutch Pinball. It is about the game itself. I must restate that this game should be treated as a pure prototype, not a production game. I am not sure if I can qualify it as a sample game, but the first small run was certainly close. Not everybody seems to understand this concern. It is evident by responses. In comparison, anyone that has inspected an original Capcom BBB for example and compared it to an IPB remake knows that the IPB was superior it its design, as fixed many problems from the prototypes. However, the prototypes always command a higher price because they were the original creations of Capcom, not just rarity. If you were not around either when that specific game was made (1994-1996), or remade (2004-2007), you cannot have an objective opinion.
TO SUMMARIZE:
YOU FEEL THE GAME IS A PROTOTYPE LEVEL OF BUILD QUALITY AND YOU EXPECT THEM TO BE UNRELIABLE?
Only a handful of people truly understand TBL functionality, the parts, or the proprietary design. Lack of available parts of the original game, incompatibility of the new sample games with the electronics, breakability of the lower bowling assembly, and other factors such as the schematic layout makes this have the potential to be a 300lb doorstop. I know because I have inspected/played the game before it broke, saw the vulnerabilities, and witnessed the problems afterward to get it functioning again. Right now, it is not worth the time or effort to correct from my company's perspective. Essentially, the operations manager is waiting to see if a complete boardset could be swapped in design (and potential "restart" of production), than trying to rebuild the entire game. This does not consider some mechanical issues, that still have to be addressed unrelated to electronics. They don't want me spending dozens of hours trying to create a new solution. Other people asked me for advice regarding upgrades or parts, and there is no present source, and the future as already reported remains unknown.
TO SUMMARIZE:
YOU FEEL THAT THE GAME IS NOT GOING TO BE EASY TO REPAIR BECAUSE OF A LACK OF PARTS?
This is not the same as any low run prototype/sample game made by a primary manufacturer in the past at least the electronics were acquirable such as BBB, Krull, Going Nuts, King Pin, or even PtC. You cannot compare this to any of these from the past This game has no reference point, and requires a person with significant time and pinball experience to work around potential pitfalls, using aftermarket components, electronics engineering, and mechanical tool and die, when, not if, the game fails. Few high end collectors today are pinball technicians adept at dealing with proprietary new designs, rather than existing established ones. Many have been in the hobby for less than a decade today.
TO SUMMARIZE:
YOU FEEL THAT THE BUYER WILL NEED TO PERFORM COMPLICATED AND EXPENSIVE REPAIRS BECAUSE OF THE POOR DESIGN AND LACK OF PARTS?
I can offer a comparison. The level of complexity concern here is similar to what I am doing presently with Merit Mega Touches that had the medical monitors die after warranty, parts wise. They simply were not available (and prohibitively expensive for those that were left), which they required me to figure out how to integrate/disassemble a modern Dell LCD screen and merge it with the touch screen and controller board, recut the mounting panels, remount all new PCBs, tap power from the main chassis, and get everything to be able to function and calibrate, not short out anything, all in the constraints of the existing platform space and not look like an amateur hack job. I suspect this is not something general hobbyists would relish.
TO SUMMARIZE:
DITTO?
These are the concerns, I offer to potential buyer, looking at the game from a technical point of view presently, not as a pure collectible.
TO SUMMARIZE:
YOU FEEL THE GAME IS NOT TECHNICALLY SOUND.
I took a stab at your essay and wrote some questions and comments IN CAPITAL LETTERS.
I could not quite understand your point, except that you believe the game to be prototype level of refinement from an engineering / product development standpoint. Which may be true.
Quoted from NPO:With all the bantering that goes on in threads like this, I sometimes wonder if some people here even PLAY pinball....
More philosophy than an ivy league university.
A guy who hates chitter chatter comes to a pinball site specifically devoted to chitter chatter and then chitter chatters about his scorn for chitter chatter.
Nifty
We all hate ourselves now, your job is done here.
Quoted from irobot:A guy who hates chitter chatter comes to a pinball site specifically devoted to chitter chatter and then chitter chatters about his scorn for chitter chatter.
Nifty
We all hate ourselves now, your job is done here.
Quoted from bigd1979:Thats what they are for.. to play and enjoy. Remember they were 8500-9 when bought new i believe.
Which is exactly why we see so many BBB, CC and other notriously rare games on route.
My point is that it's a balls move to do what this guy is doing and I applaud him for it!
Btw didn't know they were that cheap. Damn. I saw the tutorial and the game looks great
8500 was preorder pay and pray days many years ago. Then it was 10k pay and pray.
I look at these as 10k NIB all day if they were actually available.
GLWTS, I bet Bowen's beautiful tutorial video quadrupled the people drooling over this ad.
What a great game.
don't let the distract you from the fact that in 1966, Al Bundy scored 4 touchdowns in a single game while playing for the Polk city high school Panthers in the state championship game, versus Andrew Johnson High school...........including the game-winning touchdown in the final seconds against his old nemesis, Bubba "Spare Tire" Dixon.
From Dutch Pinball
Welcome to another update on the status of the production of The Big Lebowski™ Pinball.
The coming weeks are quite exciting as we are nearing the final phase for production to start. We expect the last paperwork to be ready next week and then we have green light to start production. This means parts can be ordered, the production line is being prepared as well as all the work instructions, drawings and many other details that are needed for assembly. In the previous update we said we expect production to begin April/May, this has changed a little bit, and we now expect it to be May/June.
In the last update we also told you that Engineering Sample no. 4 was almost on its way to our HQ. A week later the game arrived without any damage. And even more important: the game worked perfectly!
We also came across this very cool video tutorial of the Big Lebowski™ Pinball from Bowen Kerins which shows you it will be worth the wait. This game will be yours:
We will come with a new update in a few weeks, or when there’s other significant news.
P.S. There is a rumor that Barry was hit by a car. Fortunately this is not true. Barry is fine
Barry and Jaap
Quoted from Mr68:Big Lebowski still available for trolling
Yore game is worth $5 bucks!!!
This topic is linked to a classified ad.
The Ad Listing has been ended, so this topic closed automatically.
Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.
Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!
This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/for-sale-the-big-lebowski-6/page/2?hl=bbhenry2000 and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.
Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.
Eugene, OR