(Topic ID: 331760)

Foo Fighter and JJP Pricing and Quantity

By iceman44

1 year ago


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  • Latest reply 1 year ago by jgentry
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    There are 246 posts in this topic. You are on page 4 of 5.
    #151 1 year ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    ... Big improvement overall from Bond which feels like it came and went.

    Gomez needs to stop, let the next gen take the wheel

    #152 1 year ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    Gomez needs to stop, let the next gen take the wheel

    I kind of agree with that but love my Bond LE

    #153 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    I kind of agree with that but love my Bond LE

    Bond will be awesome....some day.

    #154 1 year ago
    Quoted from Damonator:

    Bond will be awesome....some day.

    In Lonnie we trust.

    #155 1 year ago

    and after reading all the internets - FOMO is still alive and well as predicted

    #156 1 year ago

    I just haven't seen a pin of late I can connect with. Maybe I'm just too old, but it feels like pinball isn't really about pinball anymore. It's more about getting original charactet callouts and high-def cartoons. Thank goodness there are a lot of pkd school machines still around, waiting to be restored. I even like FF and still have zero interest in this pin.

    #157 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    I kind of agree with that but love my Bond LE

    It's kind of diff'rent I'll give him that. I'm been playing the Pro at a bar and having fun with some shots but waiting for the code yada yada.

    But DP is the Avengers layout, Beatles/Seawtich, B66/batman etc....and some of those are great but let's move on.

    #158 1 year ago
    Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

    and after reading all the internets - FOMO is still alive and well as predicted

    It's so easy between releases (which is the vast majority of the time) - when the natives are bored, grumpy, and restless - to make these sweeping predictions. FOMO is dead, it's all over, etc. etc.

    We hear it all the time, every time.

    And then a game comes out, it looks awesome, and it's just like old times, every time.

    "I didn't think I'd be into this theme, but it looks like they hit it out of the park!! Just ONE MORE LE for me, this one!"

    That's just how it is. Pinball is cool. People who collect pinball machines have plenty of disposable income. They buy pinball machines. That's why they are in the hobby.

    None of this is gonna change just because prices have gone up a little, or someone can't get a node board, or 4 pinball companies announce a new game in the same month, or one vocal guy who has bought every expensive machine, ever, suddenly declares it's over and we are supposed to believe it.

    People STILL want to be the guy who is "right" when they declare it's over, so they'll keep doing it. Even though it's never over. The bubble hasn't burst, the goose isn't cooked, the demand clearly isn't destructed, the "looming recession" hasn't stopped people from buying.

    Sorry, I guess. We'll all just have to continue to live with a thriving hobby and industry that keeps giving us what we all want and crave and can't do without.

    #159 1 year ago
    Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

    and after reading all the internets - FOMO is still alive and well as predicted

    Sure, SOME people haven’t gotten the message yet Bill.

    Crazy can’t help himself. He’s wrong though.

    I get why he so one-sided. It’s his business and has a lot riding on it

    Lmk when all 1,000 LEs sell out

    I’ll buy one at $17k then

    I’ll wait for some actual gameplay and details on the game and buy one later, maybe.

    FOMO doesn’t live here.

    The reality train will kick in over the next few days.

    #160 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    Lmk when all 1,000 LEs sell out

    My regular distro sold out of his allotment before noon today, so you shouldn't bet any real money on your prediction with this release.

    #161 1 year ago
    Quoted from Black_Knight:

    My regular distro sold out of his allotment before noon today, so you shouldn't bet any real money on your prediction with this release.

    I’ll bet that I’ll be able to buy an LE for $13k or less next month or 3 months from now?

    Any takers?

    We are in the initial panic phase. Just day one. The dust will settle. No RUSH

    #162 1 year ago

    I like turtles

    #163 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    I get why he so one-sided. It’s his business and has a lot riding on it
    .

    You can be such a clown with this stuff, always trying to find an angle. I'm seriously flattered that you think I'm some pinball industry maven (is my bullshit really that convincing?!), but I sell 20 games or so a year. It is not my livelihood, it's a hobby, and every cent I "make" goes into buying more pinball machines or paying for parts and the rent on my tiny little workshop. This isn't a secret; I tell my buyers this stuff all the time.

    It's all for fun, for me and my friends, and if pinball machines were suddenly worthless tomorrow it wouldn't affect my life one iota.

    I don't have shit "riding on it," I just like calling people out on the same dumb proclamations of doom they've been making for 20+ years, and are ALWAYS WRONG.

    Maybe next time! FOMO LIVES HERE!

    #164 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    I’ll buy one at $17k then
    FOMO doesn’t live here.

    Channeling my inner Gryszzz…

    Quoted from Gryszzz:

    Well aren't you fuckin special

    #165 1 year ago

    Stern will survive any upcoming downturn just fine - they can always scale back the # of LEs on future titles, vault some games, etc to keep rolling.

    JJP is on thinner ice. Ask your distrib how many GnRLEs & TS4LEs they have sitting in the warehouse.

    #166 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    I’ll bet that I’ll be able to buy an LE for $13k or less next month or 3 months from now?
    Any takers?
    We are in the initial panic phase. Just day one. The dust will settle. No RUSH

    I had distributors calling me for weeks on Bond. I called tons of them before gameplay was shown and none had availability. I don’t think that happens with Foo Fighters - I’m getting much close Godzilla vibes in terms of reaction from people. I think distributors will convert a lot more of their lists into purchases on this one.

    #167 1 year ago
    Quoted from MikeS:

    My prediction is that we will see 1K units at $13K plus and that it will be a day one sellout. There will still be FOMO even with 1000 units. Scalpers will be selling them at a premium soon after just like every other recent LE.

    fixed

    #168 1 year ago
    Quoted from JSC:

    I had distributors calling me for weeks on Bond. I called tons of them before gameplay was shown and none had availability. I don’t think that happens with Foo Fighters - I’m getting much close Godzilla vibes in terms of reaction from people.

    By all accounts all the LE's are gone.

    Perhaps the distros will be sitting on them but now that the game trailer has been revealed the hype is real and looks to be well warranted.

    Nobody ever knows what the next pin will do, and Foo Fighters wasn't a grail pin for many.

    But neither was Iron Maiden and it is thought of as a great pin.

    I wasn't excited until the trailer, but always excited for a new pin. Bond disappointed and is super easy with long ball times and very repetitive ahots. Which equates to getting boring fast for me.

    Foo Fighters looks fresh with unique shots and great things included in gameplay! I'm pretty excited after seeing the trailer.

    #169 1 year ago
    Quoted from Ecw0930:

    By all accounts all the LE's are gone.
    Perhaps the distros will be sitting on them but now that the game trailer has been revealed the hype is real and looks to be well warranted.

    Pinballs.com and gameroom goodies still have on their website. I doubt for much longer. From what I see this is getting pretty universal positive reaction.

    #170 1 year ago
    Quoted from NimblePin:

    Channeling my inner Gryszzz…

    Tongue in cheek joke NP!

    Yeah I won’t have to worry about that scenario.

    No need to get all triggered Crazy.

    Looks like another excellent offering from Stern. Not the point.

    No one needs to freak out with 1,000 LEs at $13k. They will be plentiful.

    The last 20 years? I know you just blow right through as if there were never any ups and downs. That ain’t reality, but you know this.

    #171 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    Looks like another excellent offering from Stern. Not the point.
    No one needs to freak out with 1,000 LEs at $13k. They will be plentiful.

    On all of this we agree!

    #172 1 year ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    An all of this we agree!

    See, I knew we did!

    Doesn’t take away from the excitement of a new game like FOO

    #173 1 year ago

    If JJP actually turns out The Godfather, they’re gonna have to lower the price

    #174 1 year ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Pinball is cool.

    Pinball even made the Foo Fighters cool!

    Sorry Ice, those LEs are gone, that playfield is too good. Jack just dropped a bag of uncut raw and the fiends are getting the shakes.

    I'm not buying and I think prices are ridiculous, not defending a thing, but they're still gonna sell out.

    -1
    #175 1 year ago
    Quoted from thechakapakuni2:

    If JJP actually turns out The Godfather, they’re gonna have to lower the price

    Lower it to what price though? Stern LE's are now $13k, JJP LE's are $12k. Both are comparable models. A JJP CE is more in line with a Stern SLE due to it's extra features.

    Regardless of fun factor between any games I wouldn't be surprised if the build of materials cost for the cabinet, boards, wiring, etc is much higher on a JJP versus a Stern. For example JJP after all is still using proper Williams lockdown bars and head lock mechs (not to mention the head itself is entirely made out of wood versus sheet metal...). Not saying any of that is better or worse but it all adds up.

    #176 1 year ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    Lower it to what price though? Stern LE's are now $13k, JJP LE's are $12k. Both are comparable models. A JJP CE is more in line with a Stern SLE due to it's extra features. Regardless of fun factor between any games I wouldn't be surprised if the build of materials cost for the cabinet, boards, wiring, etc is much higher on a JJP versus a Stern.

    That’s wrong Panzer. 1,000 CEs in line with 1,000 LEs.

    JJP is F Ed if they price it at $15k

    As far as Foo and no gameplay seen yet?

    Where are the “innovative mechs” again?

    Ramps, Ramps and flowy trails.

    Good art, animations, EL lighting and music, as good as it may look, covering up nothing really great mech wise, again

    And that may be enough for people because it’s def the Stern model now

    #177 1 year ago
    Quoted from Aurich:

    Pinball even made the Foo Fighters cool!
    Sorry Ice, those LEs are gone, that playfield is too good. Jack just dropped a bag of uncut raw and the fiends are getting the shakes.
    I'm not buying and I think prices are ridiculous, not defending a thing, but they're still gonna sell out.

    We will see how it shakes out. No RUSH

    I think they will sell a bunch of premium and pros.

    LEs? Always available.

    The hype train is full force day one.

    The flippers are trying to decide if they can squeeze a grand out of the early hype.

    Similar to Aerosmith.

    #178 1 year ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    Stern LE's are now $13k, JJP LE's are $12k. Both are comparable models. A JJP CE is more in line with a Stern SLE due to it's extra features.

    LOL, Freak you don’t give up trying to convince us: in name only Stern LE’s are the same as JJP’s LE. False name trickery is all that’s being done here by JJP. We all know only fair comparison is JJP CE vs Stern LE both limited to 1k. JJPs falsely named LE is not limited in pinball numbers at 5K for any of their offerings. JJP has never made 5k of any LE, except maybe WOZ that sold for $6500. You nor anyone else does not have any proof of JJP numbers sold, as JJP will never release official numbers sold. So stop with all your trolling, just stop, we don’t believe your nonsense. You endlessly troll all Stern releases, just quit.

    #179 1 year ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Why such a hostile response?
    I'm just asking if you think the hobby is done and there aren't gonna be more noobs there to pick up the slack?
    We've hit the peak?
    Did you only start this thread so you could yell at people, or have a good old fashioned civilized Pinside price thread discussion?

    Agree with CrazyLevi. I came into hobby five years ago (after a 30 year hiatus from when I was a kid), and like my Momma taught me I continue to grow my career and earnings each year and am lucky to have had an increase in income over the years. At the same time I live below my means (very comfortably) and pinball is my indulgence (screw golfing haha). And a hobby where I can own multiple pins, play them everyday, enjoy them with my family and friends, and break even in the end when I decide to change things up…priceless!. Have a long list of buddies who are deep into this hobby in same situation and we are not “rich” guys we are just hobbyists with disposable income who love to try the new games coming out. We sometimes spilt the price, rotate pins and sell too which increases buying power. With that said, I am not a sight unseen LE guy and actually have moved more towards trading lately as like many of you I enjoy the hobby, meeting new people and trading is just fun. Never came into the hobby to make $$$ just to have fun. Still, there are PLENTY of folks with access to much more $$$ and prices will keep going up just like cost of eggs haha. I do not like the price increases, but damn I do enjoy the new pins these companies are making!

    #180 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    Where are the “innovative mechs” again?

    I was actually thinking the same thing, but IMDN really has none either and it's one of my favorite machines
    FF looks like a lot of fun

    Quoted from iceman44:

    I’ll bet that I’ll be able to buy an LE for $13k or less next month or 3 months from now?
    Any takers?

    I'll take the LE bet for $100 to charity of choice

    #181 1 year ago

    Hopefully price ceiling has been found, as JJP will not sell unless they lower pricing somehow and other manufacturers see that. Stern has reached their limit and they know it. FF is a strong offering for a wider audience in the GB/AFM style. A loaded “world under glass” with game flow pinball players/collectors are looking for. Pro is still priced $6,999 making it best value in pinball period. All other makers are way over that price with about the same bullet point offerings as a pro. Its the high pricing of the Stern LE that causes us to pause, but FF does have some extras most LEs don’t have like expression lighting, plus all the other regular LE options. Pin stadium charges $650 for similar lights like expression that are not built in.

    #182 1 year ago

    After reading the last few pages of this thread I can't help thinking that Ice will be starting another thread in a few months titled "Making FOMO Great Again"

    Prices are crazy but so are we!

    #183 1 year ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    Gomez needs to stop, let the next gen take the wheel

    It’s apparent his co workers are afraid to tell him some of his ideas suck.

    Only that could be worse is if he doesn’t listen if they do.

    #184 1 year ago
    Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

    I was actually thinking the same thing, but IMDN really has none either and it's one of my favorite machines
    FF looks like a lot of fun

    I'll take the LE bet for $100 to charity of choice

    You are on Bill! Will be fun.

    I’ve lost every single one of these bets btw…

    #185 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    You are on Bill! Will be fun.
    I’ve lost every single one of these bets btw…

    This will be your first win.

    There are 2x as many FFLE than IMDNLE. Even if it turns out to be a good game, there's just too many other new games competing for people's $$$. JJP, AP and Danesi's new game are all imminent. Plus hands on with Scooby Doo, Bond and Alien LV at TPF will sell more of those games as well.

    Lots of shuffling incoming!

    #186 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    You are on Bill! Will be fun.
    I’ve lost every single one of these bets btw…

    Can I be the charity? I'm trying to scrape together the money to buy a premium but I fear the tax man is going to clear me out!

    #187 1 year ago
    Quoted from Damonator:

    This will be your first win.
    There are 2x as many FFLE than IMDNLE.

    Yeah but there are 50X as many people in the hobby as there was five years ago.

    These will sell out easy. In fact that are already sold out. We can quibble about Stern vs. Distributor sellouts, but sold out is sold out. Stern is fat and happy.

    #188 1 year ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Yeah but there are 50X as many people in the hobby as there was five years ago.
    These will sell out easy. In fact that are already sold out. We can quibble about Stern vs. Distributor sellouts, but sold out is sold out. Stern is fat and happy.

    Not arguing your point - and I never said it wouldn't sell out.

    The bet was whether Ice can buy a FFLE for $13k or less in a couple of months from now. And the answer is yes - he will be able to.

    #189 1 year ago
    Quoted from Damonator:

    Not arguing your point - and I never said it wouldn't sell out.
    The bet was whether Ice can buy a FFLE for $13k or less in a couple of months from now. And the answer is yes - he will be able to.

    Yes, he will be able to.

    Or he can pick up a Scooby that isn't built yet for a $600 discount. It's already begun.

    #190 1 year ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Yes, he will be able to.
    Or he can pick up a Scooby that isn't built yet for a $600 discount. It's already begun.

    The floor is lower than that

    #191 1 year ago

    We got what we wanted. Demand pruning. The demand is still there but the flipper cushion has been destructed.

    DP baby!

    #192 1 year ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Yes, he will be able to.
    Or he can pick up a Scooby that isn't built yet for a $600 discount. It's already begun.

    I've already got that Scooby coming. #132.

    100% the discounts are coming on that one too. They seem be having a few production hiccups.

    Stern is the BEST by a country mile. Part of the problem is that there are so many GREAT games to choose from these days and more on the way!

    I'm interested in a JJP Godfather too, and i KNOW people aren't lining up for that one right now, although that might change.

    I see a lot of FOMO still exists, mine is gone. I would have bought a FFLE in the past day one. Now we'll see.

    What i did instead? Picked up an AC/DC Luci again, let mine go years ago, want to have fun with that one again.

    I like "Demand pruning"

    #193 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    I've already got that Scooby coming. #132.
    100% the discounts are coming on that one too. They seem be having a few production hiccups.
    Stern is the BEST by a country mile. Part of the problem is that there are so many GREAT games to choose from these days and more on the way!
    I'm interested in a JJP Godfather too, and i KNOW people aren't lining up for that one right now, although that might change.
    I see a lot of FOMO still exists, mine is gone. I would have bought a FFLE in the past day one. Now we'll see.
    What i did instead? Picked up an AC/DC Luci again, let mine go years ago, want to have fun with that one again.
    I like "Demand pruning"

    You'll love Luci

    #194 1 year ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    I've already got that Scooby coming. #132.
    100% the discounts are coming on that one too. They seem be having a few production hiccups.
    Stern is the BEST by a country mile. Part of the problem is that there are so many GREAT games to choose from these days and more on the way!
    I'm interested in a JJP Godfather too, and i KNOW people aren't lining up for that one right now, although that might change.
    I see a lot of FOMO still exists, mine is gone. I would have bought a FFLE in the past day one. Now we'll see.
    What i did instead? Picked up an AC/DC Luci again, let mine go years ago, want to have fun with that one again.
    I like "Demand pruning"

    I would argue that CGC is the best overall right now - build quality, clearcoat quality, feature set and value. BUT OH MY *#(&*@& THEY ARE SO SLOW

    #195 1 year ago
    Quoted from Damonator:

    I would argue that CGC is the best overall right now - build quality, clearcoat quality, feature set and value. BUT OH MY *#(&*@& THEY ARE SO SLOW

    If they can't produce pinball machines for people to buy I just don't see them as the best.

    It's repeated a lot but pinball is a manufacturing business. And nobody can manufacture like Stern.

    And it makes a difference. We see it with Spooky all the time - they are so slow, the FOMO dies off long before people's games are even a glint in the Wisconsin sun, so they sell off their "spots" at large discounts.

    If they could manufacture like Stern, this wouldn't happen.

    #196 1 year ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    If they can't produce pinball machines for people to buy I just don't see them as the best.
    It's repeated a lot but pinball is a manufacturing business. And nobody can manufacture like Stern.
    And it makes a difference. We see it with Spooky all the time - they are so slow, the FOMO dies off long before people's games are even a glint in the Wisconsin sun, so they sell off their "spots" at large discounts.
    If they could manufacture like Stern, this wouldn't happen.

    Nobody is selling ccle at a discount. A too long of wait for sure, but no one has bailed yet at a discount

    #197 1 year ago
    Quoted from Hayfarmer:

    Nobody is selling ccle at a discount. A too long of wait for sure, but no one has bailed yet at a discount

    Or Fathom Mermaids....and their rate of production is maybe 2-3 games/week.

    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    We see it with Spooky all the time - they are so slow, the FOMO dies off

    I think Spook is simply making too many games - 1000 games total seems like a better sweet spot for them. Stern has the same issue with their LEs and JJP with their CEs - 1000 is too many at that astronomical MSRP - people may not be bailing while waiting because they are manufactured faster - but they are certainly bailing afterwards- both BondLE and TS4CE can be found WAY under MSRP now.

    #198 1 year ago
    Quoted from Damonator:

    1000 is too many at that astronomical MSRP

    If they are selling out, then 1,000 is still a good number for Stern. The aftermarket isn't what they worry about.

    They do it right: Sell 1,000 and deliver in a month or so. No time for first buyers to back out.

    LEs in the aftermarket for 500-1000 less has been the pinball model for 15 years or more.

    #199 1 year ago

    You don’t see scalping of doo but already foo scalping going on . I guess let stern do another price hike as money must still be left on the table , 15+k for a scalp foo Le . So glad these people got them to pass on the great game to who did not get one whom may have actually wanted one. Glad I been out on the dealer prices let alone the street scalpers price .

    #200 1 year ago
    Quoted from Black_Knight:

    LEs in the aftermarket for 500-1000 less has been the pinball model for 15 years or more.

    Yea, I remember. But 1000 LEs hasn't been the pinball model for 15 years - that's a recent trend that started with GZ.

    ...which is a stable model when GZ/Rush/Mando were priced at $10-11k. 1000 LEs (JJP CEs) at $13k (JJP $15k) is going to bite them in the ass. It already did for TS4CE which is still available at many distribs. It's just going to take a little longer for Stern to run out of steam. The BondLE was instantly sold out. FFLE sell out has been much slower (it's still not technically sold out yet as some distribs have them). If anything, I give props to Danger and his innovative layout for saving their butts this time around. Will Eddy be able to do the same with Venom?

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