(Topic ID: 168149)

Flooding Prevention - Just one ounce?


By bdPinball

3 years ago



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  • 44 posts
  • 30 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by mamawaldee
  • Topic is favorited by 4 Pinsiders

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    #1 3 years ago

    I live along the Anclote River near Tarpon Springs, FL, and up until about 10 years ago, has only flooded once in about 1972. For whatever reason, since I've moved here, It's flooded twice, Once up to my Knees, and again up to my Ankles.

    If the water comes no further than 18 inches in the Mancave, which is on the first floor, everything will be okay, but if it comes up higher than that, either I have to raise the games up more, which isn't much of an option, or, have some contingency that if I know a hurricane is coming, I roll all the games into a Uhaul, and head for higher ground. At least in a Uhaul, I can move them. In the garage, I'm limited by the roof. The Uhaul will double as a storage facility for the few days it takes for the water to receed. It's doubtful that insurance would be interested in compensating someone completely for a loss like that, and, as we all know there are man personal feelings tied up in our collections. I guess I feel like I should take out SOME form of life insurance, or plan, for them, they're almost like my babies!!

    If anyone has any other suggestions I'm game. I even thought of possibly putting some sort of leg extenders on the games.. If I only needed another foot or something, that idea might work, but more than 2 feet, and the game is going to hit the ceiling with the top folded down as well as likely become top heavy and unstable at some point.

    This is what happened this time around.

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    #2 3 years ago

    Dang. Sorry to see this man. I know what it is like. Flood took our house away in winter 96. That was after we completely rebuilt it from another flood in 96 that completely filled the basement and got to about 5' high on the first floor. This was supposed to be in a 100 year flood zone. I would say to definitely have a back up plan before it happens gain.

    #3 3 years ago

    dont live near water, or low lying areas. thats the best solution. not just for the pins, for all your stuff

    #4 3 years ago

    What I would do is quickly epoxy up every tiny gap on each of my pinball machines so that they become watertight. Then you can tie them all together and build a big pontoon boat for your whole family to float on down the river on.

    #6 3 years ago

    Complicated answers that can be answered with one of three simple solutions.

    1) Raise house on stilts
    2) Put games in a loft
    3) Move

    Active flood zone = going to happen
    You already have repetitive history.

    As I stated before pinball is best collected at elevations above sea level.
    Right now you are just living on borrowed time before things really get bad. Next time may be worse.

    Make sure you get flood insurance and a rider policy in your pins.

    #7 3 years ago

    Even if you keep the pins dry by raising them up out of the water, as the floor is covered in water, even a few inches, wouldn't all the moisture in the room damage or ruin the backglasses? (assuming backglasses not translites) or the playfields? or would the backglasses be moved to a dry area well before the flood?

    #8 3 years ago

    Very tall walls around your home?

    funny-house-flooding-protection[1] (resized).jpg

    That or a channel around your home that drains into a giant overflow tank buried under the ground, but even then it won't help if the land is pretty flat and ALL the water from the nearby area drains into it.

    #9 3 years ago

    There are no "flukes" of nature when it comes to flooding, if it happened once it can happen again. Living alongside a river, especially in a coastal area it will happen again. If you are set on staying in the area, house raising probably is the best option. Sometimes raising just a few feet can make a big difference in flood risk. Your risk of experiencing a damaging flood of similar or larger magnitude will increase the longer you stay, so it is not a question if, but when will the next flood happen(are you listening PAPA HQ?).

    #10 3 years ago

    I don't know where in tarpon springs you live, but they say sea levels could rise by 6.5 feet (2 meters) by 2100. Now that's minimum water levels, it would go above that during heavy storms. Here's what your area will likely look in 2100:

    http://geology.com/sea-level-rise/florida.shtml

    tarpon_springs_2-meter_sea_level (resized).jpg

    #11 3 years ago
    Quoted from toyotaboy:

    I don't know where in tarpon springs you live, but they say sea levels could rise by 6.5 feet (2 meters) by 2100.

    In 2100 all of his games will be on micro-nuclear reactor-powered hovering platforms with built-in moisture sensors, which will automatically adjust for water levels.

    Or he'll be dead.

    #12 3 years ago

    Just my two cents worth of be prepared. I live at the top of a hill with the nearest river a mile away. We once had 18 inches of rain in about 24 hours several years ago. The ground was so saturated that we had an inch of water in our basement. We lived in a split level our neighbors with full basements had about 8 inches of water and that was with a sump pump. Whether its an inch or a foot it destroys your carpet, trim and anything left on the floor that soaks up water.

    So my advice is to have some type of backup plan no matter where you live. Something as simple as blocks to put your games on can make a difference.

    #13 3 years ago
    #14 3 years ago
    Quoted from bdPinball:

    For whatever reason, since I've moved here, It's flooded twice

    *cough* Global Climate Change *cough*

    Seriously though, I studied environmental science in college, and I've worked with several municipalities regarding flood preparations and the like. Flooding is a problem that isn't going away anytime soon, and I'd expect that the United States will be seeing more powerful storms and more powerful flooding events moving forward. Look at Louisiana... Texas...

    The best solution is to move, but realistically, a decent solution would be to relocate where you keep your pinball machines.

    Good luck!

    #15 3 years ago

    Build an ark.

    #16 3 years ago
    Quoted from Blackjacker:

    In 2100 all of his games will be on micro-nuclear reactor-powered hovering platforms with built-in moisture sensors, which will automatically adjust for water levels.

    Yes, and we were supposed to be eating re-hydrated pizzas, riding hoverboards, and driving flying cars by 2015.

    If you wanted to float say a 250lb pinball (in the same footprint of 2' x 4'), you would need a "boat" that was 6 feet high. More incentive for pinball manufacturers to get their weight down to about 170lbs.

    #17 3 years ago

    You might consider adding a second story to your house or building an elevated game room.

    th (resized).jpg

    #18 3 years ago

    It's not my place to criticize or question the motives of anyone's choice to live where they do. There are lots of factors and circumstances to consider. But when it comes to a "clean slate / long term" view, what I tell my kids is:

    If you have to put your stuff on stilts, you've made a bad decision.

    I'm sure "moving" is not as simple a solution as you'd like, or others would like to believe. There's probably no place completely safe in Florida for that matter. Historical records and "X00 year events" are being shattered nationwide. In urban environments, aging infrastructure is unable to keep up with increasing demand, so basement floods are far more common even with no rivers in sight.

    That said, don't be naive. Mitigate what you can, but know some things will be out of your control. You could move your pins to a second floor out of a floodplain, and be leveled by a hurricane or tornado or resultant fire down the block. Roof could get torn off allowing things to get soaked from above. In the end, what will be will be: at some point we're all playing the odds and hoping for the best.

    If moving is impractical and your possessions are unusually important, get an insurance rider.

    #19 3 years ago

    No sarcasm intended: do any storage/container companies offer a furniture-sized line of ziplock-type bags, thick enough to be fairly puncture resistant?

    #20 3 years ago
    Quoted from jibmums:

    No sarcasm intended: do any storage/container companies offer a furniture-sized line of ziplock-type bags, thick enough to be fairly puncture resistant?

    There use to be one made for cars. Hold up an end, roll car in, then vacuum the air out. Seen it, but not up close.

    #21 3 years ago
    Quoted from jibmums:

    No sarcasm intended: do any storage/container companies offer a furniture-sized line of ziplock-type bags, thick enough to be fairly puncture resistant?

    Yes, but they do not have a "zip lock" type seal.
    At least not the conventional ones for heavy duty purpose.
    I have used them, but not for pinball machines.

    Normally, I just had them shrink wrapped, blanketed, crated, and vaulted.
    I was not building the "pinball ark".
    The vaults did not go underwater, but are watertight.

    I can tell you putting a pinball machine in a plastic bag is a stupid idea.
    If the bag has more than a foot of water, the bag will start to float and either tear the bag or knock the machine over.
    Head for high ground instead of wasting money crossing your fingers with bags.
    Even a watertight shipping container would be a better idea.

    #22 3 years ago
    Quoted from toyotaboy:

    Yes, and we were supposed to be eating re-hydrated pizzas, riding hoverboards, and driving flying cars by 2015.
    If you wanted to float say a 250lb pinball (in the same footprint of 2' x 4'), you would need a "boat" that was 6 feet high. More incentive for pinball manufacturers to get their weight down to about 170lbs.

    Or not. A cubic foot of freshwater is just over 62lbs. A 2x4 footprint, 1 foot deep, would displace just under 500lbs of water. In other words a 6 inch deep "boat" would easily float a 250lb pin.

    #23 3 years ago
    Quoted from Darcy:

    There use to be one made for cars. Hold up an end, roll car in, then vacuum the air out. Seen it, but not up close.

    I saw these guys on an episode of Shark Tank a while back:
    https://www.extremevehicleprotection.com/

    #24 3 years ago

    What a lively discussion!!

    I don't think the "bags" idea is stupid. If they could put a car in one I don't see why a pin wouldn't work? You just have to make sure the "bag" is reinforced for this purpose. I like the idea of some stilts or something, that could buy a well needed foot!

    My house is already on stilts, and if I had my way all my games would already be upstairs in my living room, spare room, bathroom, etc..

    Thanks again for the encouragement and suggestions. A "pin rescue" service is what I need..

    #25 3 years ago
    Quoted from bdPinball:

    I don't think the "bags" idea is stupid.

    If it can keep water out, it can keep moisture in.

    LTG : )

    #26 3 years ago
    Quoted from bdPinball:

    My house is already on stilts, and if I had my way all my games would already be upstairs in my living room, spare room, bathroom, etc..

    Could you spend money on a system of block and tackle for each game. That would allow to raise the pins to the ceiling of the pin room. Securing that weight to the ceiling above would have to be worked out.
    Then create a way to get all of the flood water out of that room as fast as possible. You should be prepared, generator, electric fan/blowers, floor squeegee, and sump pump with battery back up. Which ever works for your room.

    #27 3 years ago

    If you could build a brick room with a seal-able gasketed door, drylok coating on the walls stops water up to 12psi, or equal to 22 feet high. Maybe what you really need is a pinball panic room.

    #28 3 years ago

    I'm i crazy to think you could just buy some pvc pipe, cut it to length and slide the legs into it raising the whole machine temporarily. You will need help or a lift to get the machine off the ground to install the leg extenders.

    Or if you wanted to get fancy and plan ahead you could get some custom bent that bolt on to regular legs or even better an extension that screws into where the feet are.

    #29 3 years ago

    This is getting ridiculous.
    I am not making fun of anyone, but think logically and analytically here.

    Plastic storage bags under water? (Humidity temperature condensation changes)
    Cranes?
    Float pontoons?
    Sandbags?

    How about just installing a moat with a 25,000 gpm pump?

    Just live on a houseboat, if you want to live this close to the water.

    The OP shows photos of the river less than 50 feet from his house at non flooding levels!
    Hopefully, the OP never get hit by a serious tropical storm or hurricane.
    The whole house is going to get moved if not built on a solid foundation.

    The bottom line is prepare to be flooded or not...
    It is going to happen and eventually your machines and house are going to take damage repetitively.

    There are other problems not even being considered without the flooding.
    Namely moisture and humidity damage on electronics, wood, and backglasses, along with various insect damage including termites.
    I lived in Central America for over 5 years.
    I know all about moisture and civil engineering.
    They don't even use windows, just storm shutters, and no basements in that part of the world.
    You have to run a dehumidifier 24 hours a day at certain periods of the year, and use moisture absorbers in the cabinets just to avoid having the games turn into trash.
    Fortunately, I was not living near the ocean which adds even more problems with calcium chloride deposits.
    I have dealt with this problem elsewhere and those windows were sealed with an air purifier.

    #30 3 years ago

    I am thinking Logically. That is why I'm discussing it with like minded people, maybe some of whom have dealt with this before.

    I don't think the idea of the bags was necessarily for some massive flood event, if the water gets 8 feet deep, the bags probably wouldn't be a great solution, and I suppose you wouldn't really know how far up the water was going to come. Are you a lawyer or something? The way you say, "The OP Shows a photo.." I thought I was on trial! haha..

    My house is on the river. Does that mean I don't get to own Pinballs? No, obviously not. If I were a bachelor, Like I said, the'd all be upstairs with me. The house is secured to it's pilings with some sort of Metal clips of some sort. An engineer friend of mine looked at it and gave it his blessing. I'm not worried about the house. I'm several miles from the gulf.

    I do have a soft spot in my heart for block and tackle, I that arrangement with my last boat. I'd lift the entire boat out of the water, so the boat couldn't sink! I'm not sure if the garage could support all 8 pins suspended from the ceiling like that though, I like a simpler PVC solution.

    4 PVC Pipes for each machine, whatever the distance is from the folded down head to the ceiling. I could put bolts through the PVC to keep the feet from falling through. The problem I see is how am I going to get the pin up onto these things in the first place? I have one of those Harbor Freight Hydraulic lifts, but that will only lift a pin maybe a foot off the ground.. Maybe in stages?

    Oh well. I'll draw up my contingency plans for the NEXT time..

    -Brian

    I'll mark this as dead.dddd

    #31 3 years ago

    https://www.daftlogic.com/sandbox-google-maps-find-altitude.htm

    check with this before you buy your next home

    #32 3 years ago
    Quoted from bdPinball:

    If I were a bachelor, Like I said, the'd all be upstairs with me. The house is secured to it's pilings with some sort of Metal clips of some sort. An engineer friend of mine looked at it and gave it his blessing. I'm not worried about the house. I'm several miles from the gulf.

    I have the same concerns, and your post has me thinking.

    How about hauling them upstairs when flooding is eminent? The easy way would be to use an Escalera, but those are expensive, and large for keeping around.

    I like the idea of the winch at the top of the steps:

    Some discussion -

    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/moving-games-up-stairs

    #33 3 years ago

    Sorry to hear about the flooding. After much family discussion and taking into account local ground water concerns, we put "the man cave" on the first floor of our home rather than our basement. We are now considering adding upward to move the gameroom to the second story.

    #34 3 years ago

    Take pictures, get flood insurance, enjoy your river front home.

    #35 3 years ago

    Maybe find another collector in the area and rent an warehouse space in another part of town where the flooding is not an issue.

    #36 3 years ago

    Ben- (and the others too)

    Thanks for more of your great ideas! Sounds like as I suspected, I'm not the only one with this problem.

    For those who do not enjoy riverfront housing, the easy thing would be to just Move. At some point I will, but with the housing situation the way it is, the market and all, I'm going to sit it out for another little up-swell. Hopefully before the GUlf does it's next "upswell"

    The block and tackle ideas are the greatest.. I like the decision to move the gameroom consecutively upstairs- Unfortunately I don't have that much room upstairs. I could probably fit my collection in the house, the bathrrom, Betroom ,Kitchen stuffed with the things.

    But something someone else said might make more sense.

    1) I"m limited in the Garage Gameroom anyway,
    2) A location close, but not my house, would make it slightly more difficult to access, but the space I could gain.
    3) But where? I looked at a commerical store front type thing, or even just commerical looking space, without really much for a public front, but space is outrageous! I thought about something like a U-Store-it type of place, and I guess they are temp controlled.. Has anyone tried this? Housing their pinball collection at a storage place? I know some people use them as little workshops, the have power, so why not Storage, and once in a while they get played

    There is a new place in Tarpon Here, the Replay Museum, where this guy has basically taken his pin collection, and opened it up to let the public play. At storefront, for $13 for the day. Does the word museum make it somehow "Non-Profit" or something?

    -Brian

    #37 3 years ago

    Just curious we bought a second house in central Florida, it's very flat country. I looked on the Internet was said we are in a low/moderate flood area. Which is the same as my primary residence. But my primary residence is hilly and I think we live higher than other parts. I never thought about flood insurance in my primary residence but I'm curious if you guys think it's worth it for Florida at about $400/year? We're near WDW it's flat but lots of lakes.

    #38 3 years ago

    How about having a stack of cinder blocks saved somewhere. They can then be put under the legs of the games if a flood is coming.
    Won't save you if the water comes up 10 feet though

    #39 3 years ago

    8" bed risers on the legs or how about a garbage can under the cabinet, should raise by 18-20"

    #40 3 years ago

    Sorry to see this and I moved out of a flood zone 15 years ago, so my pins are safe from rivers now.

    But you can get a hell of a lot of damage from a plugged running toilet, or busted pipe, depending on where the games are located. Seems the best place for a lineup is ALWAYS underneath a bathroom.

    The plugged running toilet dual point failure happened to me recently.

    We were fixing to go kayaking and would have been gone about 6 hours. I was downstairs letting the dogs out, admiring the games when the first drop fell on TZ's glass. It went to hell real quick from there.

    Somebody had flushed the toilet upstairs and it completely filled the bathroom floor, and then came down all over the place in the basement arcade. I managed to pull some games out from under the waterfall and had materials handy to cover the ones I couldn't move. It's good to be in the process of insulating your basement walls with 4x8 sheets of extruded foam. They make excellent watersheds in a pinch. In the end, miraculously I suffered no damages.

    Had I been the one to flush that toilet and we had been out the door, I would have no games today, not a one.

    So if anybody has any ideas on how to prevent death from above, I'm all ears.

    #41 3 years ago
    Quoted from mamawaldee:

    So if anybody has any ideas on how to prevent death from above, I'm all ears.

    Waterproof roof insulation over the standard insulation or floor joists, sheetrock, and floorboards with a downslope drain outlet through the soffet or floor separation to the outside wall.
    It is a "sandwich" layer.
    The costs are not extreme, but does require planning during construction or addition.
    Not something you want to be ripping up and doing after a home is built.
    It is possible to do it from underneath, at additional cost, say under a pinball area.

    Fairly common on home construction that can experience regularly flooding or fears of individual sections of roofing being torn off due to high winds.

    1 week later
    #42 3 years ago
    Quoted from mamawaldee:

    Sorry to see this and I moved out of a flood zone 15 years ago, so my pins are safe from rivers now.
    But you can get a hell of a lot of damage from a plugged running toilet, or busted pipe, depending on where the games are located. Seems the best place for a lineup is ALWAYS underneath a bathroom.
    The plugged running toilet dual point failure happened to me recently.
    We were fixing to go kayaking and would have been gone about 6 hours. I was downstairs letting the dogs out, admiring the games when the first drop fell on TZ's glass. It went to hell real quick from there.
    Somebody had flushed the toilet upstairs and it completely filled the bathroom floor, and then came down all over the place in the basement arcade. I managed to pull some games out from under the waterfall and had materials handy to cover the ones I couldn't move. It's good to be in the process of insulating your basement walls with 4x8 sheets of extruded foam. They make excellent watersheds in a pinch. In the end, miraculously I suffered no damages.
    Had I been the one to flush that toilet and we had been out the door, I would have no games today, not a one.
    So if anybody has any ideas on how to prevent death from above, I'm all ears.

    Wow. That's a horrible Story! I'm glad you got most of your games out of the way!!

    #43 3 years ago
    Quoted from bdPinball:

    Wow. That's a horrible Story! I'm glad you got most of your games out of the way!!

    I got incredibly lucky. Nothing got damaged, but only because I was standing right there when it started. I only had four pins at the time. I was able to pull two pins out of the area, the other two pins and vids I covered with 4x8 sheets of pink foam that just happened to be right there. Water came down from the joists all around the bathroom perimeter for 20 minutes like rain.

    We have since moved to a bigger house, and now we have seven pins in a finished basement and the of course the best way to arrange them is under the bathroom again. So I have games kinda scattered all around in a maze like fashion to avoid water sources from above. I would prefer to put "something" under the joists to make a dry zone over the arcade.

    Seems most people have pins in the basement. Many are perhaps unaware of this particular risk.

    #44 3 years ago

    In a related incident, I once had the garbage disposal in the kitchen blow a seal and rained rotten lettuce water all over the couch in the basement below. Friend of mine lost some electronic stuff in his basement from a hose coming off the clothes washer in the upstairs laundry room.

    Lots of home appliances would love to kill pins.

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