World Cup Soccer
Bally, 1994Restoring a WCS right now. Did a complete rebuild on flippers. The flippers fire a full strength when pushing the flipper buttons in the test menu. However, when in game play the right flipper barely flips and the left flipper does not flip at all. voltage tests at about 65V at both flippers. Thanks for any help guys.
Sounds like low 12 vdc. I would disconnect soccerball motor and start a game. Its possible motor is bad dragging down 12 v which affects optos. Seen it before.jr
I have a lighting mod attached to the Test
Quoted from pinballplusMN:Sounds like low 12 vdc. I would disconnect soccerball motor and start a game. Its possible motor is bad dragging down 12 v which affects optos. Seen it before.jr
I have a lighting mod attached to the 12v test point 1. Could that be causing an issue? I ran the black Wire for this mod to the ground screw in backbox? Is that a no-no??
Thanks for the help. Will try to diconnnect Ball motor and see what happens
Quoted from pinballplusMN:Sounds like low 12 vdc. I would disconnect soccerball motor and start a game. Its possible motor is bad dragging down 12 v which affects optos. Seen it before.jr
Should mention its a new motor but I could have botched something else. Although it works correctly it seems
Quoted from pinballplusMN:Sounds like low 12 vdc. I would disconnect soccerball motor and start a game. Its possible motor is bad dragging down 12 v which affects optos. Seen it before.jr
Well, bravo. It is definitely the soccer ball motor causing the issue with the weak flippers during game play. When I unplug the soccer ball motor from the board the flippers work as expected. At one point, I was working under the playfield with the game OFF but still plugged in. A ring on my finger hit something and did create a small spark. I don't know if this issue was occurring or not before this spark or not. Any ideas on where I can go from here? Thanks in advance guys. -- Craig
EDIT: I did not fix the issue. Removing the mod didn't help actually.
Found the issue. I had a mod hooked up to test point 1 on PD board. Removed this and everything worked fine. I thought you could draw power from TP1. No??
Turns out I didn't fix the issue by removing the mod from the test point 1. Still have little to no power to flippers when soccer ball is active. Also noticed that even when soccer ball is unplugged the flipper power seems to deteriorate as the game goes on in length. Wanted to bump this and see what you guys think. Here is what I know:
1. Both flippers were completely rebuilt with all new parts (coils, sleeves, EOS switches, springs, etc)
2. EOS switches register perfectly in switch edge test
3. Voltage to all lugs on both flippers reads about 65V with or without soccer ball turning
4. Test Point 1 registers at 11.5V with the soccer ball activated.
Do you guys think that I'm having the same issue that is outlined here: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/wcs-problem-with-flipper-when-motor-turn#post-3074880
How else could I go about troubleshooting this issue? Thank you geniuses of Pinside for your input.
Craig
Quoted from Cserold:1. Both flippers were completely rebuilt with all new parts (coils, sleeves, EOS switches, springs, etc)
2. EOS switches register perfectly in switch edge test
3. Voltage to all lugs on both flippers reads about 65V with or without soccer ball turning
4. Test Point 1 registers at 11.5V with the soccer ball activated.
everything seems in working order according to all what you have done.ok,flippers work in test but not in gameplay..Hmmm,this is a real brain challenge lol!! let me check on the pinballninja site and see if Clay has any info about this.
Quoted from Cycloneman:Craig,when you power on the game any errors or messages popping up on the screen?
There is one error about the upper left flipper (which the game doesn't have). Somebody had said this is an issue with the older ROM version that is installed. Seems like a few think it is an issue with BR5 and C30 (as pointed in the link in previous post). Does that make sense to you guys? They also mention that Test Point 1 should be around 14V when soccer ball is NOT spinning. Is that right? Why would the 12V test point be 14V? Thanks!!
EDIT: Should also mention that TP1 on power driver board registers at around 12.4V when ball is NOT spinning.
Quoted from Cserold:issue with the older ROM
i dont think that it would cause flipper issues
Quoted from Cserold:Seems like a few think it is an issue with BR5 and C30
This is a possibly and would be a good thing to test.
Quoted from Cserold:Why would the 12V test point be 14V?
this should not be that high,usually it dips down to around 11V not up.
Quoted from Cserold:EDIT: Should also mention that TP1 on power driver board registers at around 12.4V when ball is NOT spinning.
thats fine,normal
i checked the pinballninja site and found nothing like the problem your having.what's really puzzling the heck out of me is the flippers work in test but not in gameplay!!??...
Heres what i would do Craig,i would reseat ALL connectors in the backbox including the ribbon cables and i would look around the hi-power knob near the coin door.Craig,when you start up a game with the coin door closed do other coils fire such as bumpers,slingshots,ect.?
reseat ribbons, boards screwed down tight,fuse holders good, tarnished pins on flipper board?
cab flipper board optos clean?swap to see if it changes anything.
If you ground the flipper coils with a jumper is it strong?
are all the wires punched into their connectors well?
you mention they work in the test menu...What about in the flipper test itself?
I'm just trying to be all inclusive.
Sounds like bad cap and or bridge rectifier on power driver board for 12vdc. If you can swap driver bds and see if problen clears up this would help.
Quoted from Cycloneman:Craig,when you start up a game with the coin door closed do other coils fire such as bumpers,slingshots,ect.?
Thanks for the reply. When I power up the game the VUK in back next to the goal fires like 2-3 times. Thoughts on that?
Quoted from Wolfus:I'm just trying to be all inclusive.
Thank you very much. Going to try all these things.
Quoted from pinballplusMN:Sounds like bad cap and or bridge rectifier on power driver board for 12vdc. If you can swap driver bds and see if problen clears up this would help.
Thank you. If reseating, etc. doesn't work then on to the BRs and CAPs.
Really appreciate it gents.
Quoted from Cserold:VUK in back next to the goal fires like 2-3 times. Thoughts on that?
it means the opto is out,most likely the transmitter opto/the one with the bulb.williams has this feature in most of their games to let the operator know the opto has gone out and needs replacing
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Dallas, TX