(Topic ID: 265551)

Flipper Troubleshooting Modern Stern Help Needed Video Inside


By sataneatscheese

3 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 26 posts
  • 5 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 months ago by chuckwurt
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

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#1 3 months ago

One of my flippers on my Stern Jurassic Park is not like the others. I can force it down when activated and even a strong ball return will force the flipper down. The bottom of the flipper assembly seems to be correct. Any ideas and/or help would be greatly appreciated.

#2 3 months ago

Put the game in switch test and make sure that the flipper is opening and closing the eos when you flip. Should hear a beep when you flip the flipper saying the eos is open, then another beep for when the eos switch closes after you let go of the flipper button.

#3 3 months ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Put the game in switch test and make sure that the flipper is opening and closing the eos when you flip. Should hear a beep when you flip the flipper saying the eos is open, then another beep for when the eos switch closes after you let go of the flipper button.

Still no luck.

Thanks Chuckwurt. I tried the switch test and it seems to test correctly, but it still has the same symptoms. The E.O.S. test performs correctly unless I am missing something.

#4 3 months ago

Just for shits and giggles. Adjust that left eos to have it open a bit more when the flipper is engaged. Then try again.

#5 3 months ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Just for shits and giggles. Adjust that left eos to have it open a bit more when the flipper is engaged. Then try again.

No luck.

#6 3 months ago

Now rebuild the flipper (coil stop, link and plunger, sleeve)

That’s what i would do. After that, I am officially out of ideas. Haha

#7 3 months ago

I don't think a flipper rebuild will do anything for you. I would concentrate on your EOS switch, your cabinet flipper switch, and the coil wiring. I'm not familiar with how these new Sterns are set up, but anytime I've had trouble with flipper holding strength, it's almost always been one of the switches. Make sure your EOS is making good contact and isn't gapped too far. 3/16" is enough. Run a crisp bill or a business card between the switch contacts to clean them. Is this a recent thing or did it always behave like this?

#8 3 months ago

I’m not confident the new parts will fix it either but based on his previous testings all switches are fine.

#9 3 months ago

I have taken it apart and put it back together with no success and am stumped. The flipper could have been like that since I got it last month (used). If nobody has any good ideas overnight I'm going to order a new flipper assembly to throw in there. Thanks for the help all.

#10 3 months ago
Quoted from sataneatscheese:

I have taken it apart and put it back together with no success and am stumped. The flipper could have been like that since I got it last month (used). If nobody has any good ideas overnight I'm going to order a new flipper assembly to throw in there. Thanks for the help all.

Call stern first to see if they can help.

#11 3 months ago

Do not put a new assembly in your machine, the problem is not mechanical.

You Clearly don’t have enough power in your hold circuit. It could be the coil or it could be the driver board that sendS the reduced power in the hold (after the eos is triggered. )

If you jumper the EOS together or adjust so it doesn’t open, you should have plenty of hold power. Don’t do it long as it will burn the coil of course. This will prove you you that the mechanics aren’t the problem if you don’t believe it.

It’s prob not the coils as these are single windings but you could Swap the coils side to side. If the problem moves, it’s the coil, if not it’s the hold circuit.

You could also measure the power sent to the coil when the EOS is activated to see if there is a difference between the sides.

I don’t know the spike system enough to help track Down the circuit. As suggested, call chas at stern to help before you throw parts at it.

#12 3 months ago
Quoted from Black_Knight:

If you jumper the EOS together or adjust so it doesn’t open, you should have plenty of hold power.

If you do this, there will be no hold power. Only high flip power. That’s why we made sure the EOS switch was opening when he flipped. This is my understanding of the spike flipper system. The open eos tells the MPU to switch to hold power.

#13 3 months ago

I'm sure you've checked your coil stops. They can fall out into the cabinet, be loose or fall into the coil itself. They are known to fail in the new Sterns and basically need to be replaced after 100 games.

#14 3 months ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

If you do this, there will be no hold power. Only high flip power. That’s why we made sure the EOS switch was opening when he flipped. This is my understanding of the spike flipper system. The open eos tells the MPU to switch to hold power.

There wouldn’t be hold power there would be strike power right? That’s what I was trying to get him to demonstrate that this isn’t mechanical.

Is the strike power instantaneous or does it get cut when the EOS is opened?

#15 3 months ago

Check the back end of your coil and you'll see one of these coil stops. Look at the back of the round button. It should be round and bronze in color. Check to see if it's missing or loose. If it is, you can order a new coil stop here. I would replace both.
https://www.pinballlife.com/flipper-coil-stop-for-sternsega.html

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#16 3 months ago
Quoted from Black_Knight:

Is the strike power instantaneous or does it get cut when the EOS is opened?

Striked when open I believe. If the eos was not making contact, he would get super weak flips. In switch text he confirmed the eos is making solid contact. I could be wrong, but eos seems fine based on the previous testing.

#17 3 months ago

In the video it opens at EOS.

#18 3 months ago
Quoted from Black_Knight:

In the video it opens at EOS.

Correct and when it closes the test confirms its continuity when closed. If the eos wasn’t making good connection it would weak flip. It’s like a limp noodle. And in switch test it would be intermittently registering as closed.

Your idea is worth a shot, I just don’t think these new flippers work quite the same.

#19 3 months ago

Sorry that I wasn’t clear. I wasn’t suggesting an EOS test by jumping them. I was trying to demonstrate that this isn’t a mechanical issue, but an electrical one.

I probably just confused everyone by my testing approach.

#20 3 months ago

I think I understand haha. But with the new spike flippers if the eos ever opens I think he will still have the issue. But like I said, worth a shot.

#21 3 months ago

Please post findings Satan.

#22 3 months ago
Quoted from Black_Knight:

If you jumper the EOS together or adjust so it doesn’t open, you should have plenty of hold power. Don’t do it long as it will burn the coil of course. This will prove you you that the mechanics aren’t the problem if you don’t believe it.

I tried this and even holding the EOS switches together I have the same symptom. I don't have enough hands to hold the camera and do this but it's the same. What would this mean?

Quoted from trk12fire:

I'm sure you've checked your coil stops. They can fall out into the cabinet, be loose or fall into the coil itself. They are known to fail in the new Sterns and basically need to be replaced after 100 games.

The coil stop is indeed garbage and I have it glued back in for the moment. Even when switched with the other side I have the same symptom.

I unplugged and plugged in the node board connectors (while powered off) but all that did was give me node board not found errors until I power cycled a few times.

The only troubleshooting step I can think of short of the node board is by switching out the coils themselves. I am reluctant to mess up their nice soldering job but may have no choice.

Thanks again for everyones help!

#23 3 months ago

Have you called Stern? If you talk with Chas ask how the circuit is supposed to work and fill us in.

Have you checked the resistance on the coils or measured the power when activated?

#24 3 months ago

Bad coil stops will cause those signs and symptoms. I'm not sure if glueing them would solve the problem, especially if you didn't put it deep enough and the plunger isn't hitting the coil stop. However you said the the problem exists even if you put your other flippers coil stop in. Did you say both stops are junk?
When a coil stop completely separates from the bracket it could leave fragments of metal inside the sleeve. This would cause magnetic disturbance within sleeve and could be creating your problem.
If your other coil stop is good, I would switch them again, take the plastic sleeve out and give it a good cleaning and clean the surrounding area of the coil itself. You need to also make sure that the coil is sitting tight against the coil stop bracket and the bracket is secure. When you have everything rebuilt, push on the plunger and make sure you here it click/contact the coil stop.

#25 3 months ago
Quoted from trk12fire:

Bad coil stops will cause those signs and symptoms. I'm not sure if glueing them would solve the problem, especially if you didn't put it deep enough and the plunger isn't hitting the coil stop. However you said the the problem exists even if you put your other flippers coil stop in. Did you say both stops are junk?
When a coil stop completely separates from the bracket it could leave fragments of metal inside the sleeve. This would cause magnetic disturbance within sleeve and could be creating your problem.
If your other coil stop is good, I would switch them again, take the plastic sleeve out and give it a good cleaning and clean the surrounding area of the coil itself. You need to also make sure that the coil is sitting tight against the coil stop bracket and the bracket is secure. When you have everything rebuilt, push on the plunger and make sure you here it click/contact the coil stop.

100% This.

I took the flipper coil out, ran a rag through it, put a replacement coil stop (an ancient one I took out of an LAH a year ago I think) and it worked like a charm. It wasn't just the coil stop, it was the small metal fragments inside causing the issue.

Thanks everyone!

#26 3 months ago

Nice! That’s gotta feel good. Now to escape Nublar!

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