Flight 2000 not working

Hello fellow Pinsiders. I recently picked up a non working Flight 2000. Cabinet, backglass, and playfield all in pretty good shape I got it pretty cheap and would love to get it running again. When you power it up the GI lights work, and there is a small ball of light on all the displays. The led on the mpu does not flash when turned on. I tested all the fuses and they are fine. I have been using flipperwinkels guide for Repairing Bally Electronic Pinball Games from 1977 to 1985, Part One to test what voltages my boards should have.

Power Transformer Module (Rectifier board):

TP1 = +6.5 vdc (AS2518-49 version, feature lamps) Im getting +6.03
TP2 = +230 vdc (score displays) I am getting +254
TP3 = +11.9 vdc (+5 regulated) I am getting +14.2
TP4 = 7.3 vac (general illumination) I am getting 7.13
TP5 = +43 vdc (solenoid voltage) I am getting 45.8
GND = Ground

Solenoid Driver/Voltage Regulator board:

TP1 = +5 vdc I am getting -.487
TP2 = +190 vdc I am getting +164.7
TP3 = +5 vdc I am getting -.487
TP4 = +230 vdc I am getting +256
TP5 = +11.9 vdc I am getting +31.5 (this voltage drops into the negatives (-120)when the mpu is plugged in)

MPU board:

TP1 = +5 vdc I am getting -.421
TP2 = +11.9 vdc I am getting -103.8
TP3 = +21.5 vdc (comes from +43 vdc solenoid voltage) I am getting +22.4
TP4 = Ground
TP5 = +5 vdc I am getting -.421

I`m not getting my 5 volts at all, and also some other funky voltages. I`m a newbie when it comes to a pinball not working at all, hoping someone could look at the voltages and steer me in the right direction of what to look at next or what to concentrate on (MPU, voltage regulator)

#2 7 years ago

DAV

wayout440

Pinside member

OP
Quoted from Tablewicked:
TP3 = +11.9 vdc (+5 regulated) I am getting +14.2

TP5 = +11.9 vdc I am getting +31.5 (this voltage drops into the negatives (-120)when the mpu is plugged in)

That 11.9 VDC supply is fine at the regulator board reading +14.2, but if I am reading this correctly, the 11.9 vdc rail jumps from 14.2 to +31.5 VDC when the SDB board is plugged in, correct?

Did you perform the solenoid driver board upgrades and replace capacitor C23 like the guide suggests? (section 2c.)

#3 7 years ago

JLC

Tablewicked

Pinside member

Thanks for the reply, when the mpu is unpluged I get 31.5 vdc on the SDB, but when the mpu is plugged in it drops to -120. I have not replaced anything on the boards yet, so am I losing my 5volts because of that capacitor c23?

Thanks again.

#4 7 years ago

DAV

wayout440

Pinside member

Possibly. General rule of thumb is to never plug in the MPU until you have verified the voltages are in spec. You may have blown your MPU board. Leave that unplugged for now and work on getting the 5 volt rail correct on the SDB board. At minimum, you will likely need to replace C23 and probably the 5V regulator as well. Hopefully you didnt over voltage the MPU, that could potentially destroy all the 5V ICs on the board.

#5 7 years ago

JLC

Tablewicked

Pinside member

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-quick-bally-driver-board-repair-bulletproofing/page/2#post-1969462

Ya its unplugged now, hopefully I did not mess the board up. Got the C23 on order, hopefully that is all it needs, could you point me in the direction to where the 5v regulator is?

#6 7 years ago

BOY

vid1900

Pinside+ Member

Sana'a

12y 164K 40,199 18

OP
Quoted from Tablewicked:
Got the C23 on order, hopefully that is all it needs

It will probably need other parts too:

#7 7 years ago

DAV

wayout440

Pinside member

OP
Quoted from Tablewicked:
Ya its unplugged now, hopefully I did not mess the board up. Got the C23 on order, hopefully that is all it needs, could you point me in the direction to where the 5v regulator is?

The regulator is the can on the big heat sink. Check out vids thread. besides the big cap and the regulator, it looks like your high voltage section needs to be rebuilt - you'll fry your displays if you leave it that way (the existing ones in the game might already be toasted). Also do the reliability mods as in the repair guides, and replace the headers and repin the connectors. After all that, check all the voltages again to see if they are in spec, any not will need further repair. Check the MPU power pins for a direct short to ground before even thinking of plugging it in.

Edit: just saw barakandl has a couple of tested boards available that you might consider:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/rebuilt-bally-22-solenoid-driver-boards-75-each

#8 7 years ago

JLC

Tablewicked

Pinside member

Thanks guys for all the help! I have decided to get the rebuild board from barakandl. I love reading and learning everything there is about pinball repair, just not up to the task yet for a whole rebuild of a board. When the new board arrives I should prob check the voltages again before plugging in the mpu?

#9 7 years ago

BOB

0geist0

Pinside member

Royal Palm Beach, FL

14y 60,050 1,778 4

Send me your email and I can take any pics you need.
I would start here you said you had some cut wires on the rectifier board.

Flight_2000_rectifier_board_001_(resized).JPG

Flight_2000_rectifier_board_002_(resized).JPG

Flight_2000_rectifier_board_003_(resized).JPG

2 weeks later

#10 7 years ago

BOB

0geist0

Pinside member

Royal Palm Beach, FL

14y 60,050 1,778 4

Did you get this problem resolved?

#11 7 years ago

JLC

Tablewicked

Pinside member

Still waiting for the rebuilt driver board I bought from barakandl to show up, hoping it shows up soon. Your pic were a big help in cleaning up the wiring. thanks again. Ill keep you posted.

4 weeks later

#12 7 years ago

JLC

Tablewicked

Pinside member

Hey guys sorry for the long delay, summer started and I haven't had much time to work on the arcade stuff. I finally got around to installing the power supply I got from barakandl, tested my new voltages
TP1 and TP3 I am getting .487
TP2 I am getting 180.7
TP4 I am getting 260
TP5 I am getting -190

I decided to check the voltages at the rectifier board again. I am getting different voltages on two test points.
TP4 I am now getting .8
TP5 I am now getting 63.6
The rest of the test points are getting the same as the last time.

Looking closer at the rectifier board I would say it need to be replaced or rebuilt, also the connectors look a little suspect. Would this be my next plan of attack? If so are there any recommendations for a replacement?

Thanks again

#13 7 years ago

DAV

wayout440

Pinside member

OP
Quoted from Tablewicked:
I decided to check the voltages at the rectifier board again. I am getting different voltages on two test points.
TP4 I am now getting .8

TP4 is general illumination, which is AC. You had you're meter on AC and got only .8V? The only purpose of the rectifier board for the GI is to fuse it. Check for presence of the AC at the fuse, continuity of the fuse, and condition of the fuse clips. If you don't have the voltage present at the fuse, then you probably need to repin the input connector coming in from the transformer.

#14 7 years ago

JLC

Tablewicked

Pinside member

My bad, I had the meter on dc. Checked the voltage again and I am getting 7.3AC. Would repining the female connectors and changing the pins be the next step?

#15 7 years ago

DAV

wayout440

Pinside member

https://ksarcade.net/new-rectifier-board-for-bally-and-stern-games.html

OP
Quoted from Tablewicked:
My bad, I had the meter on dc. Checked the voltage again and I am getting 7.3AC. Would repining the female connectors and changing the pins be the next step?

There's only do much we can see from an online forum, but typically yes. These games, at this age will usually have oxidation and reduced contact (the metal has lost its "springiness"). Even if I don't repin everything, every used game I have worked on has needed some amount of repinning. Especially Bally/Stern rectifier and solenoid driver boards.

2 weeks later

#16 7 years ago

???

sweetpj

Pinside member

Monee, IL

7y 17,500 1 3

where did you purchase your Rectifier board from. I just purchased a Flight 2000 Played it for several hours, went out and left the game on. The game was not working on return and the rectifier board is not putting out amps. It is also blackened.

Post last edited 7 years ago: “spelling”

#17 7 years ago

TPR

frunch

Pinside member

Point Pleasant, NJ

11y 135K 3,637 10

I was able to find 2 places that have new replacements in stock:

https://www.flippers.com/catalog/product_info.php/ballystern-replacement-rectifier-board-p-2678

Hopefully that's all you'll need!

4 months later

#18 7 years ago

JLC

Tablewicked

Pinside member

I know it's been awhile, but I finally made some headway with my flight 2000. I purchased a new rectifier board from flippers.com, repined the connectors. With barakandl rebuilt driver board and new connectors I tested my voltage at the rectifier board and it all tested good. Moved on to the driver board, all test points were showing proper voltage!. I plugged the mpu board in and fired the game up, the light flashed 7 times and the game booted up. The only major problem is that both flipper were not working, I found a bad crimp at a connector, re crimped now the left flipper is working. The right flipper is getting 43v at the coil, I tested the transistors on the driver board and the all test good. When I try to ground out the coil to the side rail nothing happens, also I am only getting .333 ohms at that coil. Any suggestions to point me in the right direction would be great.

#19 7 years ago

DAV

wayout440

Pinside member

Are you measuring the coil without the diodes across the terminals (one leg lifted)? Should be roughly 297 ohms. The coil could be shorted. Also a good idea, make sure that your side rail is grounded (Does it work for the other flipper when you ground it?)

#20 7 years ago

JLC

Tablewicked

Pinside member

Just got home from work and tested the ground on the rail, grounding the left rail to any coil makes it fire. When I ground from the right rail the coils do not fire. I was always testing the right flipper with the right rail because my alligator clips were too short. Thanks for the tip on the rails wayout440, I still could not get the right flipper to fire when grounded to the left rail. I am testing the coil with the diode still in place, when I test the ohms of the other coils I get between 3 and 12. The coil has two diodes do I only need to remove one leg or one for each diode?

Thanks

#21 7 years ago

DAV

wayout440

Pinside member

Well, at least you know one of your rails is missing the safety ground.
Testng coils

Quoted from cfh:It's very simple to test. First set your DMM on low ohms. Then put each DMM lead on the coil. (i'm assuming a 2 lug coil here, by the way.) Depending on the coil (it would have been nice if you told us the coil number), you should get the resistance of the coil (generally 3 to 300 ohms.)
Now if you get less than 1 ohm, that's basically a dead short. There are two reasons for this - either the coil diode is shorted, or the coil has internally "baked" and is shorted. Now cut one leg of the diode from the coil. Re-measure the resistance. If the resistance changes, you have a bad diode (and probably a good coil.) If the resistance is the same, you have a good diode. (And while you have one diode leg cut from the coil, you can use your DMM's diode test to test the diode - black DMM lead on the banded diode leg, should see .4 to .6 on the meter.)
Now if you're doing this on a flipper coil (3 lugs), the same theory applies. Just remember that a flipper coil is actually two coils in a single package. The "common" coil lug is the one with two winding wires attached. Knowing that, you can measure each side of the flipper coil independently.
This is where things go a stray. "Series" wound flipper coils will have a single diode. "Parallel" wound flipper coils will have 2 diodes. Doesn't really matter, you just have to do the resistance measurement based on the diode(s) position on the flipper coil.
bottom line - less than 1 ohm of resistance, cut the diode off and see if thing change.

#22 7 years ago

JLC

Tablewicked

Pinside member

Quick update, I was double checking my connectors that I repined and found a pin not fully inserted in the housing for J2. Inserted fully and now the flipper works! I knew it was going to be something silly. Still lots of work to do so its 100%, just wanted to thank everyone here who gave me help to bring this machine back to life.

1 month later

#23 7 years ago

DJR

Drickey86

Pinside member

Lucasville, OH

7y 52,800 148 10

OP
Quoted from Tablewicked:
Quick update, I was double checking my connectors that I repined and found a pin not fully inserted in the housing for J2. Inserted fully and now the flipper works! I knew it was going to be something silly. Still lots of work to do so its 100%, just wanted to thank everyone here who gave me help to bring this machine back to life.

I am having the same issue everything works aside from the flippers just put in new coils yesterday , was wondering which j2 connector and pin number you were refering to on the rectifier or on the driver board ?

#24 7 years ago

JLC

Tablewicked

Pinside member