(Topic ID: 238458)

Flight 2000 help!


By Supersunny76

7 months ago



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  • 237 posts
  • 23 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 22 days ago by Lovef2k
  • Topic is favorited by 11 Pinsiders

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There are 237 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 5.
#1 7 months ago

Hi. Have a flight 2000. Had it for 6months or so..not working and started to look under the playfield. When turned the GU lights work and a buzz from.the speaker.The rectifier looks like a hack job. When i did turn it on.. it blows F4 7amp slo blow 43vdc. So i unplugged everything from the back box (solenoid ,light board and mpu board. Ive looked again online manual and looks like the header pins are not in..lower middle and left of the power broad. And wire has been soldered on to...well.. a big heat sink of sorts,below that is the speaker off centred..also looks like the wires have been cut and plugged in the bottom...and has two transformers .this is my first pinball... and tbh..am keeping it forever ... need help guys

Here's a video

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#2 7 months ago

Man that’s a hack job.

#3 7 months ago

If that game's a keeper, I'd remove everything including the extra transformer, and rectifier board. Install a new rectifier board and re-wire it with new connectors. With that mess you'll forever have problems.

I'm surprised you only have one fuse that blows when you turn it on.

#4 7 months ago

I would suspect that was done before new rectifier boards were easier to find ...

https://pinside.com/pinball/market/shops/1055-nvramweeblycom/01123--new-bally-stern-rectifier-board-as-2518-18-ta-100

Connector kit: ebay.com link » As 2518 18 Power Supply Connector Kit W Headers Bally Stern Pinball Machines

Ratchet crimper: amazon.com link »

probably a burnt coil , you can check resistance across each one of them to find the short

#5 7 months ago

Thanks for the quick reply guys,

Thats the way to go, I have to be honest, am a novice on these as this is my first pinball, so if i ask dumb questions forgive me

Yep..thats the way I want to go , to bring the wiring back to its original state.(need help with this guys)

ive order the crimping tool , should be arriving Saturday, and ordering a new power board too.(MAY TAKE 2 WEEKS FROM USA, AM BASED IN LONDON UK)Rotten Dog, and some other bits and pieces. I think your right Chas10e that it was repaired before they were available

Ok, am planning to plug in a new rectifier board but my old one only has one molex plug(right bottom), plugged in...the middle and left molex are a bunch of wires on the ground.

Does anyone have pictures of the molex plugs and there colours on the rectifier board, or the harness colours leading up to he transformer and power board.

Ive another question..looks like both transformers are connected...I live in the UK,...so would there be an extra transformer for a uk standard plug?.

Change of topic just finished two mame machines , i had the cabs(gutted from previous owners for parts) i found online years ago..and were sitting around, so i made a Street fighter 2 cab and Outrun turbo, kids love them.

also will be working on a Operation wolf , bits were imported from Italy , (just the marquee , coin door, Gun , base and metal top base with instructions.

PIN3 (resized).jpg
#7 7 months ago

thanks CanadianPinpall but 90 % percent of the harness is great, I would think it would be over kill
to replace the whole harness, just want to repin the power lines to the power board and get the right molex connectors,

Would you have the colours for the power rectifier board?.or info on two transformers on a uk model?...

thanks in advance guys!

12 (resized).jpg13 (resized).jpg
#8 7 months ago

That second transformer on the left shouldn't be there - you'll have to find out why it's been retrofitted. Maybe post some pictures of where its wired from and to so we can see why it's there.

The picture gallery in the Flight 2000 club thread has photos showing the rectifier board connectors:
Club thread:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/flight-2000-club-members-and-fans-welcome

Club thread picture gallery:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/flight-2000-club-members-and-fans-welcome/?gallery&galleryp=2

#9 7 months ago

thanks Quench!

heres a photo of which i have on my phone.. i can check again tonight and get a better photo/video. looks like it wiring to the harness with black tape near the
coin mech?....

Screenshot_20190315-160146_Gallery (resized).jpg
#10 7 months ago

Looks like there's only two wires on that extra transformer. Taking a guess, your main transformer might be wired for 110V AC, and someone added that extra transformer (probably also 110V AC) in series with the main transformer so you can run it on your countries mains wall power. Unless the main transformer is faulty, this secondary transformer is unnecessary as the original main transformer can be wired for 220V or 240V as per the sheet behind the transformer.

The voltage configuration lugs are on the back of the main transformer along its lower area. You'll probably need to unbolt the transformer to get to the voltage lugs.

You probably also noticed your rectifier (power) board assembly isn't mounted in the original location:
https://images.pinside.com/0/f5/0d/0f50d377d9ca8f95404c07229a3f7e8f34cdc69c.jpg

#11 7 months ago

Your the man Quench !

Just got home..heres a better video.

P.s am soo excited to be on the road to get this working

#12 7 months ago
IMG_2660 (resized).JPGf2k (resized).PNG
#13 7 months ago

Hmm, the extra transformer looks like it's running in parallel on the mains power wires. It also looks like it's come from an older electromechanical machine. However it seems to me there is no output of that transformer connected anywhere. Remove it and properly insulate the mains wires where it's been connected to.

With a bit of work you can restore the rectifier board connectors to factory so they look like the picture from oldschoolbob above. You need to cleanup the wiring mess where the wires have been soldered directly to the back of the rectifier board. Note, only the wires from the transformer solder directly to the back of that board. The remaining wires running to the backbox, playfield and cabinet connect via the front three connectors. The 8 pin connector goes to the playfield. The 10 pin connector which is still there is for the cabinet, and the 20 pin connector runs to the backbox.

#14 7 months ago

Thanks oldshoolbob and Quench!

I know this is going to sound dumb..just trying to get my head around it before the new board comes..

On the schematic above ..do the wire colours run in order..for j1 j2 j3..so they match each molex connector..? ie j2 pin 1 y/b - pin 2 G

Also J1 pin 3 say feature lamp bus.. is that missing a colour code?

Thanks dudes

#15 7 months ago
Quoted from Supersunny76:

do the wire colours run in order..for j1 j2 j3..so they match each molex connector..?

The wire colors don't match on each connector. Also the schematic pin numbers don't run in order. Just follow the connector number (J1, J2, J3) and the pin numbers and the wire colors.

Quoted from Supersunny76:

Also J1 pin 3 say feature lamp bus.. is that missing a colour code?

I don't have the game here anymore but I think the J1 pin 3 is blue - the same as pin 7. Check your connector blocks and it looks like you have 2 blue wires connected to the same block. They should connect to pin 3 and pin 7. You can check continuity to the underside of the playfield to be sure.

Here's a photo of my F2K when I got it. And I thought it was a mess.

bP1010002 (resized).JPG
#16 7 months ago

Thank you so much guys!
Your all legends ..legends I tell you! !

Ill be pulling out the board and transformers this weekend...that and trying to finish my vw 68 bug resto too...busy weekend guys.. ill keep you all updated.. hopefully this post help anyone in the future whos in the same boat

#17 7 months ago

I find it easier to remove the base panel with everything attached (Transformer, board, etc.) and work on it at the workbench.

IMG_3673 (resized).JPG

Good luck on the bug.

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#18 7 months ago

What a mess....

Ive labelled up the wires and ill double check with the schematic just in case they were wired up wrong by the previous owenr and await the new power board...why that other transformer was in there i don't know...

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#19 7 months ago

Check the main transformer to be sure it's jumpered for 220.

#20 7 months ago

Nice beetle bob! What year is it? 68 69?

Ill check on the transformer jumper?..but how do i check.. just look at the back of it..?

Past bits.. built my daily ride to work honda cg 125 café

The beetle has had
New brake lines
Master cylinder
Fuel line
Discs
Drums
Pads
Rubbers
Tail pipes
Interior
Carpets
Torsion bar
Shocks
Alll welding done sills channels etc
Erm..front axle
Used to work in the car trade so bits were mega cheap... and the car i picked up in 2003 and been stored for yrs..stop start project..but now it all done... just the paint left to do...will be in gt3 rs grey...like the wheel alloy colour ..cant wait

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#21 7 months ago

Bob.. is this the jumper..3 to 5?

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#22 7 months ago

According to the diagram, yes, lugs 3 & 5 are jumpered correctly. Red wire is connected to lug 1. The diagram says the yellow wire is connected to lug 12 BUT it's shown connected to lug 13. That's confusing.

I'm not that familiar with British mains. May be someone more knowledgeable - like Quench - can tell if it's correct.

#23 7 months ago

Pinball’s, VW’s, and motorcycles – Sounds like you’re my British cousin. Now that I think about it I did trace my ancestry back to Yorkshire, UK. to 1598.

The black bug is actually a ’73. But I hate the ’73 taillights and bumpers. I replaced the fenders, bumpers, and taillights for earlier parts. Some of the specs are - 1776 cc - mild cam - Weber Carburetor - Electronic ignition - Flow-thru oil system with external oil filter - S & S headers - Electric fuel pump. 800 watt stereo system with electronic crossover and 10 speakers.

I posted some photos and video a while back:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/muscle-car-thread-for-pinball-and-car-enthusiasts-/page/5#post-4559630

And I see you’re into motorcycles. I posted some photos of some of my bikes a while back too.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/how-many-of-you-pinheads-have-a-motorcycle/page/11#post-3877258

Good luck with your hobbies. I think you'll enjoy pinball's too.

#24 7 months ago
Quoted from Supersunny76:

Ill check on the transformer jumper?..but how do i check.. just look at the back of it..?

You currently have the transformer on 220VAC, but I would change it to 240VAC. I know there was a change in Europe to "230VAC" to standardise, but apparently it didn't really take effect - only the allowable tolerances were changed to create an overlay with 220VAC countries, so UK is still 240VAC:

https://www.schneider-electric.co.uk/en/faqs/FA144717/

Post a picture that clearly shows the back of the transformer and the lug numbers. As Bob noted, the paper voltage chart on your transformer board is incorrectly marked. It says the yellow wire should go to lug 12 for 220V operation, but then points it to lug 13...

#25 7 months ago

Evening guys..ok..here we go...

Has numbers marked as

Top 17,18,8,10,12,13

Bottom 1,3,5,7,9,11

Other side 14,15,16,2,6

On the instructions the it has two part numbers on the schematic ...or is it referring to the same part..i dont know...thanks in advance guys! You rock!

Pics below

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#26 6 months ago

According to the schematic, Lugs 13 and 14 are the taps for 7.8 VDC - so I don't think the mains would connect to lug 13.

Looking at the notes at the bottom left of the schematic (in post #12) - for 220 VAC - mains connect to 1 and 12. For 240 VAC - mains connect to 1 and 7.

The jumper at 3 to 5 are correct for both 220 and 240.

If you are on 240 volt mains you need to move the yellow wire from lug 12 to lug 7.

Quoted from Supersunny76:

On the instructions the it has two part numbers on the schematic ...or is it referring to the same part..i dont know.

I think you're referring to the Varistor in the back of the cabinet. I understand it's for voltage spikes. Quench would know the difference. My guess is 25A-18-1 is for 115 Volts and 25A-18-2 is for 220 Volts.

bP1010020a (resized).jpg
#27 6 months ago
Quoted from oldschoolbob:

My guess is 25A-18-1 is for 115 Volts and 25A-18-2 is for 220 Volts.

Yes that's correct. 25A-18-2 is used in 220 volt and 240 volt environments. Since the game was wired for 220 volts you should have the right part.

Unsolder the yellow wire from lug 12 on the transformer and then solder it onto lug 7 (which is along the bottom) for 240 volts configuration.

#28 6 months ago

Thanks guys!

Am learning loads here lol,

ill sort that out when i get the power board

Dumb question, if its was on 220v prior as it was...and has been working since the 80s(and when i powered it on with GI lights were working...since then Uk volts have changed to 240v(just trying to get my head around it)

i did google Uk volts and found this on wiki.

https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1CHBF_en-GBGB834GB834&ei=hbiQXPqQBfCg1fAPnJCg0AI&q=uk+main+power+in+volts%3F&oq=uk+main+power+in+volts%3F&gs_l=psy-ab.3..33i160.1352631.1352631..1352823...0.0..0.127.127.0j1......0....1..gws-wiz.......0i71.wlubsbNKE6Y

Saying UK is 230V at 50hz

Silly question, but i no nothing of volts , 1a, 3a etc..220v and 240v or their values, are the numbers higher in terms of the higher numbers..?

What would happen if i left it at 220v.?....Would it still be ok?, would a void open and tear into the fabric of space?would i be sucked into another
dimension??!

Sorry...i.....i got carried away there for a sec....

Vodka and typing is a mad mix! , why do the Russians make it so pure!?..*Chic*

Your input is always greatly appreciated.

#29 6 months ago
Quoted from Supersunny76:

Dumb question, if its was on 220v prior as it was...and has been working since the 80s(and when i powered it on with GI lights were working...since then Uk volts have changed to 240v(just trying to get my head around it)

UK was always 240 volts as I understand. Your game might have come from mainland Europe at some point who are 220 volts.

Quoted from Supersunny76:

What would happen if i left it at 220v.?....Would it still be ok?

You can leave it on 220 volts - but the game will consume 10% more power which equates to extra heat and stresses.

If you're not familiar with voltage and current then I'd suggest you leave it as is for now. After you have more electrical experience with the machine from reinstating new connector on the cables that plug onto the rectifier board and then deal with the low voltage issues, you can consider visiting this at a later point.

Note, you have 10 other wires coming from the transformer that will need to be soldered onto your new rectifier board when you get it. The transformer is hard wired to that board, it's not attached via a connector.

#30 6 months ago

Thankyou buddy , and yes, ill switch to the 240v , who wants more heat eh?..lol

yup, ill solder the wires as you mentioned on as pictured below..i did label them..but counted 12?...instead of 10? is that right?..

06fbe7e4173541bafbcc07319d63539f3a823af0 (resized).jpg
#32 6 months ago

That's fantastic! !

This is the same feeling I had when i was 5 and saw He-man on tv for the first time! Lol

Thank you guys( salutes you all)

Of course ill keep you posted on my progress..

#33 6 months ago

This is the back of my F2K board.

PB290004 (resized).JPG
#34 6 months ago

cheers bob!

any and all photos are always great , you guys have given the the confidence to wire up the board and minimise the doubt it being
wired up wrong.

while am waiting for the board , i seen online how people can test the mpu broad for 6 or 7 flashes using a pc mains (and crocodile clips ) is
it worth me checking the mpu board or just wait till the power broad comes, the mpu has had the battery removed by the looks of it..

cheers dudes!

#35 6 months ago

quick questions guys,

When i have the new board solder in , am i ok to test it by not connecting the J terminals plugs, just to check if any fuses blow..( the same i had originally F4 Coils fuses blowing ) and then plug in the J connectors on the power board and ...then plug in the connectors on the back box one by one to check if anything blows as i go?

thanks

#36 6 months ago

You'll need to plug in connector J2 onto the rectifier board to power it up. J2 carries the wall mains power connections through to the transformer.

Check out the quick process on what connectors connect to what when you first power up the game and verify voltages:

http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Bally/Stern#Powering_up_the_first_time

#37 6 months ago

Like Quench said you'll need J2 connected to get mains power. I made up a J2 connector with just pins 6 and 7 connected to a wall plug. That way I can test all the voltages at the bench. But be very, very careful - you're messing with 240 volts here. Check then re-check your wiring before plugging it in.

R01010002 (resized).JPG

Quoted from Supersunny76:

i seen online how people can test the mpu broad for 6 or 7 flashes using a pc mains (and crocodile clips )

Yes, you can use a computer power supply to check the MPU's first 6 flashes. The PC power supply will give you 5 and 12 volts but you'll need 24 volts for the seventh flash. However, I've never had good luck using PC power supplies. I made my own power supply for 5, 12, and 24 volts. See post 287.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/meteor-resets-with-rottendog-solenoid-driver-board/page/6

This is probably overkill for most people but the first thing I do with a game is remove the MPU, bench test it and replace any components that are bad or look questionable. Then I replace all the connector headers.

Post some photos of your MPU when you can. Quench is excellent at finding problems with just a few good photos.

#38 6 months ago

I counted 12 wires from the transformer to your board.

0178978079d9423c93423973070d25ba6b84fa62a (resized).jpg

8ec7d4787ecdab73f11d86ffae58d95063344ae9a (resized).jpg

And I counted 12 wires on your board the board.

b97f9046321caee838e08f680337614244398a37a (resized).jpg

I also counted 12 wires on my board.

b99cae971fb6538d4b89033ce457bf8b215b78c8a (resized).jpg

Remove one wire at a time and connect it to the new board to the same "E" number.Check the "E" numbers because they may not be in the same location on the new board.

While you got it apart you may as well clean things up a bit. Maybe sand and paint to base and the speaker base too. A good cleaning in the bottom of the cabinet would help too.

#39 6 months ago

here you go dudes, my mpu , I wrote on the headers M1 M2 etc..and the light broad L1, L2 etc

thanks for the above bob and quench , your the man!

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#40 6 months ago

hi guys, just thinking , when this is all sorted.

Does anyone know the bulb (part numbers) count for the Flight 2000 play filed, back back etc, looking to get some LED..and maybe make a rail for resistors

cant wait

#41 6 months ago

There's a fair amount of battery corrosion on that MPU board and its connectors. You have some work ahead of you. The battery has leaked and also caused corrosion on the lamp driver board beneath it, but it may/may not exhibit issues.

If I were you I would be bench testing that MPU board now. The memory chip at U8 looks like there's green corrosion on it. The pin headers look corroded too - you will have to re-terminate those connectors if you want the game to run reliably. Presuming the MPU board fails to boot you'll want to work out how to move forward with it.

#42 6 months ago

p.s forgot my lamp board ,

yup, ill get to work on it, best stuff to clean it with?.

20190312_194357 (resized).jpg
#43 6 months ago
Quoted from Supersunny76:

hi guys, just thinking , when this is all sorted.
Does anyone know the bulb (part numbers) count for the Flight 2000 play filed, back back etc, looking to get some LED..and maybe make a rail for resistors
cant wait

If you plan on using led bulbs under the inserts you will need an led lamp board. They're around $100

#44 6 months ago
Quoted from 0geist0:

If you plan on using led bulbs under the inserts you will need an led lamp board. They're around $100

Or you can try the Comet Optix LEDs. Those seem to work fine with the original light board on my machine. Also same for Meteor.

For added effect try some of their fire LEDs behind the backglass for the rocket trails.

#45 6 months ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

Or you can try the Comet Optix LEDs. Those seem to work fine with the original light board on my machine. Also same for Meteor.
For added effect try some of their fire LEDs behind the backglass for the rocket trails.

Those work for you under the inserts with no strobing? I can see the incandescents strobing on mine.

#46 6 months ago

Ok got home from work and treated the family to burgers and kebabs..lol

Back down the cellar and ive pulled out the
Mpu board....not tested yet... i might tonight...

20190321_193225 (resized).jpg20190321_193246 (resized).jpg
#47 6 months ago
Quoted from 0geist0:

Those work for you under the inserts with no strobing? I can see the incandescents strobing on mine.

You may want to get in a few to test but they look great in mine and didn't notice any strobing. They cost more than regular LEDs but not really when you can use the factory board. I color matched the led to the insert.

I just used cheaper regular brightness behind the backglass. At the moment playfield GI are still bulbs but I may change those

#48 6 months ago

As quench pointed out, there's a fair amount of corrosion on that board. Someone recently tried treating the corrosion with hydrochloric acid (found in certain toilet bowl cleaners) with success. Here's the link to the thread where it was discussed: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/stripping-battery-corrosion-with-a-strong-acid

While removing the corrosion is an important step, it may have already compromised some components, so you may have some board work ahead of you (and probably some connector replacement to do too)...in a similar situation i had to replace the U8 chip and socket (blue arrow) most of the male and female connectors (yellow arrows), and a few transistors/diodes/etc in the same region as U8. Most of the corrosion is in the big yellow region i circled, but look around the perimeter of the board and you'll see it can travel pretty far (an arrow is pointing at one of the mounts where the board connects to ground in the backbox--make sure that gets cleaned up too!)... Look very closely at the male connector pins, sometimes the crap will actually creep up some of the pins and get into the female side of the connector as well...

You're in good hands here, it's merely a matter of time before you'll be flipping! Good luck!


1111433761.png

#49 6 months ago

I'd also recommend putting covers on the EPROM chips.

#50 6 months ago

Thanks guys..me and the hundreds to follow are reading this as we speak... yes! you in the t-shirt and jeans with the kids running around and not going to bed so you can finish your pinball! Hahahha

Being as a big kid.. i couldn't wait not to try the board..soooo...

Here's what it did....two flashes .... i had to improvise onto crocodile clips...but made sure nothing was touching.....

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