Yeah it seems I can cut them, but hopefully they send me what I payed for. I specifically searched for ones that were already cut. I saw a bunch of the connected ones.

Joining the club today! Picking up a basket case, but that's part of the thrill. I'll post picks later, hope it's a keeper!

Welcome!

well, we had storms in the area last night ,so today is the big day..finally. Quick question, as I've never owned/moved one of these (or any other stern) - does the head unbolt, or hinge on this game?

Unbolts. Take photos of all your connections to the boards.

First thing to do is disconnect the ground strap that comes from the cabinet and screws to the bottom of the head if it was attached. Unplug all connectors that are coming from the cab to the boards in the head and any wire to wire square connectors. Once they are all free, drop the harness down into the cab. There's a long harness that goes from the head to the rectifier board by the transformer. Unplug J3 from the rectifier board and the connector for the speaker volume. Then pull that harness up out of the cab and through the head. Remove bolts.

Thank you so much! Quick and thorough. It was diff from any other pin I’ve moved so that helped tremendously !! Thanks again !

Good luck with it. Hit this thread of you need more help...

well, it's me Margaret...got her home (already had ordered the rebuild kit) but wanted to get this thing actually working (it was totally DOA, which was part of the deal I'd made)..hoping it was a fuse, etc..(Wishing)..

Anyhow, I knew there were flipper rebuild issues as well (next purchase) as I'd seen on coil hanging inside..ugh

It looks like 2 or 3 of the end brackets on some coils had broken, so two wedged, one hagnin..lol (got some of those, so no issues there).

It was blowing the 3A "Line" Fuse (F6), got that worked out.

Now down to the solenoids.. its now blowing the 7A solenoids fuse...

I've unplugged the following on the SDB, and its still blowing:
J1, J2, J4, J5...individually. Combination, altogether...still blows

Any suggestions?

It did go from nothing, to now I'm getting (after that circuit blows) 6 red flashes with beeps, a loud spaceman like verbal at the very start, nothing on the displays...GI and back box lights do come on...making some progress

Congrats on the F2K!

First off you won't get the final 7th flash of the MPU without the coil voltage.

Coil voltage fuse blowing, could be bad BR3 on the rectifier board since the fuse comes before the bridge rectifier. Could also be a shorted VR1 on the rect board.

Could also be the coin lockout coil shorting. Pull the coin door connector and try that.

There is coil voltage coming in at the solenoid driver J3, and that's the only one you didn't disconnect. J3 is where the flipper enable comes in. Pull that one too.

This is a stretch but R113 and R16 are where the 43V comes in at the MPU. Maybe one of them shorted.

If you have the Alltek MPU, it's normal for the spaceman blurp at power up, mine does it. It was covered in a prior thread. No harm if you leave it.

There's a fuse under the playfield for coils, minus the flippers. If you had a shorted coil, that use would blow first unless someone put a higher value fuse in there.

So it sounds like your coil stops came loose from the flipper mechs? Typical of the early sterns. They used very cheap hardware and usually the screw holes strip out. The Stern flippers work best with the original style copper colored stops. The repro stops are not as good even though the look similar. You can rob the stops from the sling shots since they usually don't wear as much. Replace the stops with these:

https://www.pinballlife.com/classic-stern-coil-stop.html

Or full assembly, just swap the coil stops as I explained:

https://www.pinballlife.com/full-flipper-assembly-for-classic-stern-machines-031980-to-021982.html

Thanks. Will work on these items today. Great help! Appreciate it I’ll post back status

whoop whoop! Disconnected the coin door, nuttin. The rect board looked ok, but did notice two fo the connectors had burnt spots (I'll re-pin those later) I did have a replacement rect/with transformer mounted from a "Hotdoggin" - laid it in the bottom of the cab and connected it up, now getting 7th flash and game starts up. I reconnected the coin door, added credits and started a game! Now working! I'll have to make some mods in the cab and replace those not working, but now it's time to clear the playfield for a deep cleaning! Thanks again for the amazing help here !!

Well, I seem to have the faulti-ball problem others have written about. I seem to have cured the problem I wrote about a earlier this week with regard to multiple balls being kicked out due to a bad trough switch and the game loosing track of where all the balls were. Changing the angle of the trip wire on the first switch in the trough allows me to lock two balls into the stepper without the game freaking out.

But, now I have the issue that if I have two balls locked the game will randomly think a ball has drained and end the ball and count up the bonus. It sounds like others have had the same problem. I did some quick testing and found that multiple different switches would trigger end of ball but none were consistent. I have seen it happen on multiple slings, drop targets and even on a spinner. Very strange. I suspected vibrations triggering one of the three switches in the trough but I held onto them to make sure they weren't moving and it still happened.

Here's what I know, it only happens when two balls are locked and as far as I know the machine only knows two balls are locked becaise they are no longer in the trough tripping the switches.

So, I immediately suspect those micro-switches. The wires leading to them seem a little toasted so they (and their diodes) may have seen some heat in the past. (See photos) I also discovered a possibly toasted cap on the upper left sling. I suppose it could have been discolored by a run in with an errant soldering iron or something could have stopped on it but it is a suspect as of now. (See photo)

Anyone have any success troubleshooting this faultyball phenomenon? Should I start with the cap and diodes and see what happens?

Anyone know propper replacement values?
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UPDATE:
The dark goop on that capacitor scraoed off so it really was just some gunk like solder flux. I tested every diode on every switch and they seem good. Not sure where to go from here.

It looks like someone did not cut those connectors off of the belt with a clean cut.

You should be able to cut the rest of the belting material with some small, sharp wire cutters

EDIT: I should have read farther down before I made this post.

The two micro switches are the same switches used on the coin doors. You can swap them and swap the trigger wires, too.

Those switches are either on or off. You can check them with an ohmeter.

But I doubt those switches are bad.

I had a similar two-ball launch problem on my Nine Ball and was blaming those switches.

My problem is that I had removed a blade switch for cleaning and reinstalled it incorrectly. This saucer switch is normally open and activated closed. I had installed it backwards and it was always closed, which was incorrect.

Suggest you check any blade switches related to the ball launcher and assure some one before you did not install one backwards.

Thanks for th thoughts. I had originally tested both of those micro switches via the built in switch test. I tested them earlier this morning when testing the diodes too. They tested out perfect. I'll go over all the blade switches too. Wouldn't that show up on the switch test though if they were backwards?

Well, after the help here, a thorough cleaning, new bulbs and rubbers, some soldering and flipper maintenance - she’s back in business!

All but the right bottom kicker. Giving credit and sounds when hit. But coil not firing.

Thinking if the left one worked, the transistor would be ok - unless these are fed off diff ? I’ll try to find a schematic to trace it down. Any help tho would be appreciative

First time playing this game. First stern. First wide body.

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Glad it worked out for you. Are you going to get a replacement rectifier board? Or keep the Bally set up for now?

Wow, you're not wasting any time! All 4 slings operate separately. Bottom right sling is Q6 on the driver board. First check connector pin Sol drv. J2 pin 11. Or temporarily jump the coil from the lug with the Gr/red wire to ground and see if it fires. If the coil looks burnt or the mech is stuck, you need to replace it.

switch errors are a pain. Did you verify no closed switches during the initial self test feature. The balls need to be removed and all drop targets reset. The display should read 0 if all switches are open. If a switch is reading closed and is physically open, then there's an error in the switch matrix. Most commonly caused by shorted caps. But the trick is finding which one. You can snip one at a time and re-solder them later. Start with the unnecessary caps first like the tilt mechs. A bad diode can cause this as well but they are harder to test. One lead of the diode has to be removed from the circuit by clipping. A good VOM with a diode tester helps. A good diode will read about 60mV IIRC. Diodes don't fail as much as the caps. The caps are old and leak over time. It's best to replace them anyway. The value for them is .05 micro farad and anything over 10V rating should be fine. The .05 mf is hard to find these days but you can use the more common .047 mf just fine. Diode is 1N4004

Another thing I would check is J2 on MPU, connectors and header pins. It's possible that somebody may have worked on the MPU and caused a short on the header.

IThanks for the suggestions. I adjusted switch 34 and that seems to have fixed the faultyball. It wasn't showing as closed on the switch test all the time but was intermittent and that was causing the confusion.

New problem I'm working on now is the letter B inlane. It is acting backwards. When I start a game it is out instead of lit. When I roll over it, the light comes ON. This is opposite of what should happen. Also, rolling over it does not spot the "B" in the launch lane. It does advance bonus, make sound and award 3000 points.

Related, when I start a game the "L" at the top is also not lit. Rolling over it spots the L in the launch lane, scores 5000 points and triggers sound. The light does work in attract but does not display the backwards coming on like the B. It is just never lit during a game no matter what.

Weirdly, if I trigger the "L" switch at the beginning of the game it spots not only the "L" but ALSO the "B" in the launch lane.

If I then roll over the "B" switch the launch lane B is taken away and the light in the inlane turns ON as described above.

Ring any bells for anyone?

Which switch is #34?

33, 34 and 35 are the trough switches. I said it was 34 based on my memory but I believe it was actually 33 which is the right most of the three switches. It is the leaf switch while the other two are the micro-switches.

Is it possible there are multiple wiring issues?

If so; I’d start by verifying the correct B wires are pinned to the correct B lights on the lamp driver board. It sounds like they might be backwards.

The L never coming on during gameplay and spotting a B as well is interesting. What happens when you push the white square that spots a B up by the pops? I wonder if that could be tied into the L somehow.

Is this similar to the problem I had with my Nine Ball then?

It was the coil! Lol. Had an old one and now that’s working. Ahh. Nice to play!

Sweet! Another F2K coming back to life!

It was similar to your nine ball problem in that it involved that switch. It wasn't I stalled backwards though, just poorly adjusted. It would randomly be closed when it should be open as it was just barely open and little vibrations (or maybe even spikes of current?) Would cause it to close and the machine thought the ball had drained.

I had some time.tonight to dig out the manual and look at the wiring and it looks like all of the weird switches are wired up right. As far as I could tell everything was original and correct. The colors.of wires matched what was shown in the manual. The only thing that looked weird was that every switch aside from the "B" had two colored wires coming to it (aside from the ground). You can see in the photo below that the switch on the right has two orange wires but the switch on the left, which is the troublesome "B" only has the one brown wire, not.a pair of brown. There is no sign of a missing or detached wire, I just thought it was odd that it is the only one not doubled up. Doubting this is the problem, but thought I would mention it.

Since that wiring checked out I pulled the MPU out to look at the solder. It looks great. All header pins look nice and we'll soldered. It also doesn't look like anyone has ever messed with the board.

I noticed that the issue isn't just with the "B" but also with the "O" on the opposite side. They both spot the launch lane backwards. So weird.

IMG_20190702_174710.jpg

I’m guessing the switch with only one wire was the last in line, so to speak. Or the first in line, depending on your point of view.

Can someone check if their F2K has this same wire? On the left inlanes there is a small jumper wire between the "B" and "F" switches (switches 17 and 24). On the right inlanes there is a jumper wire between switches 22 and 23, the other "F" and the "O".

I only ask as they appear to be different wire than all of the other in the pin. While they are white wires with blue it looks like a different brand. I want to make sure if someone messed with that wiring they put it back correctly. See photo. I'm pointing at the wire in question.

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I do not have a F2K to look at but that looks "normal" to me.

If you look at the switch matrix, you have rows F,F,O,T,S,A, L and a stand up target all feeding of of the A4J2-3 (W-BLU) wire.

One F connects to the orange wire. The other F connects to a (BRN-Y) wire (I can't see what the color of the other is).

One thing you have to keep in mind is that while the switch matrix drawing is drawn in a linear fashion, what is on the play field is just the usual maze of wires.
Screen Shot 2019-07-02 at 11.56.46 PM (resized).png

I’m not at home to take a picture but I had this on my phone. That section looks correct to me.

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Ok, thanks guys. That different type of wire just looked weird to me and I wanted to eliminate that variable before diving into troubleshooting the switch matrix. I've never tried it before but I found a good video tutorial online so hopefully I can figure it out.

No bad switches show up in switch test so I suspect it is a bad diode causing a signal to leak through the matrix the wrong way.

From what I understand, I have to look for four faulty switches that form a square on the switch matrix diagram.

Currently I am seeing problems with switches "B", "L" and ""O" and "T". Weirdly the diagram does not show a switch B but based on the wiring it must be the one just labeled "S.W."

Now I needed two more suspects, both in the same column and sharing rows with my other problems. I remembered that sometimes my bottom thumper would fire randomly during gameplay. I set about getting it to do it again. I could get it to fire when I hit D.T. #3. Ok, makes sense, it is in the same row. But, then my square would be completed with Top(R) D.T. and I have had zero issues with that. Since the main problem seems to be with the bottom thumper I can then complete the square by going up to (L) Top Slingshot. This makes some sense. Earlier that slingshot was actung weird. It would fire multiple times when hit and then the bottom thumper would go off.

So, I assumed my problem was one of those switches and set out to clip and test diodes. And....of course they were all fine.

While looking at the drop targets I noticed the switch had been replaced on target 2 and the diode was backwards as compared to all the others. Great! I unsolder it, test it, reinstall it the correct way and....no change except that drop target 2 now won't register at all. The replacement switch must somehow be wired different than the originals and need the diode the other way. When I put it back, the switch would again register in switch test.

I clipped a bunch more diodes and tested them including both thumpers/pop bumpers and some other stuff. Everything checks out.

Damn, I really thought it would be one of those given the behavior I am seeing. I need to think about this more.

As I suggested earlier. Check the caps. My f2k also has random phantom firing of the top left sling shot. It's not a matrix issue. Something to do with feedback in wiring. It a pop bumper is firing randomly it could be the switch adjusted too close and picking up vibration.

Ok thanks, will try caps too. I appreciate your help.

Yes !! My Big Game kept Tilting out. I cut the wire for the cap in that circuit and the Tilt issue went away. Caps are easy to overlook.

Stern did some crazy things on the manufacturing line. When I was restoring my Big Game and re-soldering the wire harness, I found 4 wires that did not match the colors as shown on the switch matrix. My matrix called for a purple/white wire; My BG was wired with gray/black. I cannot remember what the other 3 colors were that did not match blueprint. So, I'm guessing that Stern ran out of PUR/WHT and substituted what was one hand to keep from shitting the line down.

And I am guessing Stern ran out of one style of WHT/BLU and grabbed what they could to keep the ling running. Using this logic, your F2K should be the only one with the 2 different styles of wire. I have a F2K folded up in the corner that I cannot access right now but when I can I will look and see what wiring I have on those "F" switches.

Well, bad news. I clipped every cap on the game, one by one and nothing changed. It is sitting here now with every cap only attached by one leg and the problem remains so I'm guessing it is not the caps.

I've run into odd switch issues when I had an open connection in the switch matrix. Had a broken pin where it plugged into the MPU board. The contacts are often brittle and can break. Check those too.

I figured a matrix issue was causing my issues...you have me rethinking this. Mine does not go to next ball, it occasionally advances the ball walker one step. Maybe the roll over switch wire at the entrance to the walker is adjusted too close and vibration from an upper sling or pop bumper can trigger it...game thinks a ball was locked and steps them down like it should. Will have to put it in switch test and see if i can duplicate it...happens maybe once in ten games so might not be easy to replicate

I took of the J2 connector earlier and all of the header pins looked great.

That is a good sign since I've had to replace many where the plating was coming off. Still need to check for broken solder connections on the solder side of the MPU to confirm that part is ok.

While the headers may be fine the small contacts in the connector shell of the harness that plugs onto the header can be broken inside. You can sometimes see by shining a light in the end.

http://www.robotworkshop.com/robotweb/wp-content/uploads/badpin3.jpg

Ok, I will check the internals on the connector. When I inspected the headers earlier I removed the whole board. The solder looked immaculate.

Sometimes those little pins can fold up and lose connection. Those are hard to find.

I pulled the J2 connector to take a look. It is a lot harder to see inside the small brown connector as opposed to the larger white ones but it looks ok. I took a look with 48x jewelers loupe and it looked good.

So how about this funky wiring on the right flipper? I'm assuming the stereo speaker jumper is not factory original.

This seems to be wired up different than the left. Not sure if that could be causing any of the weirdness I am seeing but thought I should mention it.

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UPDATE: Nevermind, I see from a photo on page 2 of this thread that one of the posts as supposed to have 3 wires going to it. Someone must have just figured a jumper was easier to solder than 3 wires. Well, scratch that one off the list.

So focusing on something other than the mixed up switch signaling for a moment, am.i correct in thinking this spinner switch was assembled wrong at the factory? Both of mine are like this. The large gold contact point is visible and the smaller rivet is what is being used as the contact point. That isn't right is it?

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It's correct. just move that wire out of the way. the down rod should be resting in the groove at the end of the blade.

Is there a better way to secure these metal supports on the Apollo lock mechanism plastics? They’re all loose on mine so they make taking the plastics off to clean the playfield a real chore.

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Ahhhhhh! Success!

I figured out my bizarre problem. I tried a number of other troubleshooting methods and I did overed some strange grounding faults that disappeared when I disconnected the ground wire from the Siegecraft lighting boards. Then it hit me. The switch problems didn't exist before I out the boards in. Even though I had double checked them before, I took them off and set up the lighting direct to the board. There was LED flicker galore but my switch problems all disappeared.

Ah ha!

I carefully put each of the three Siegecraft boards back on one by one testing for the switch errors after each one. Once they were all back on and the ground wire put back in place the game operates perfectly. I'm not certain but I'm thinking I was one pin off on my original placement. That would explain why some lights would come on for the wrong switch and why some wouldn't come on at all.

Oh well, lesson learned. I hope it helps someone else in the future.

Next up I need to see if I can fix one of the displays and then install my new CPR backglass.

Thank you to everyone who gave me suggestions on tracking down this gremlin. I learned a lot about my machine in the process!!

Moving on to other items, someone had replaced the left spinner with one from another game. It was originally yellow so they painted it black. I have no idea why other than I can just assume they were lazy and only had black paint.

I stripped it all off and I'm putting on multiple coats of white. I have a vinyl cutter so I'm tempted to try making the stars and "S" myself. Looks like decals are pretty cheap too though. I thought about cutting my own numbers for the drop targets too.

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