(Topic ID: 314160)

Firepower speech problem

By Andy_B

1 year ago


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  • 24 posts
  • 8 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by Andy_B
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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#1 1 year ago

Just picked up a project Firepower. It was missing the speech board which I have sourced with original FP speech ROMs but can't get any speech.

Originally the problem was that the sound board worked fine on its own but would produce no sounds at all when the speech board was connected. I found that W1 was installed on the sound board which I understand is for games that produce sound only. I clipped W1 and now the sounds play with speech board connected but no speech. All the other jumpers check out OK.

I replaced the original Scanbe speech ROM sockets and buzzed out all the connections. Similarly there is continuity on each side if the ribbon connector. Dip switch 2 is on and dip switch 1 is off which I believe is correct - in any case any variations in the dip switches don't produce speech.

During the sound test there are no gaps where the speech should be. I just get the sounds repeating.

I'm a bit stumped and would welcome any suggestions.

Andy

#2 1 year ago
Quoted from Andy_B:

Just picked up a project Firepower. It was missing the speech board which I have sourced with original FP speech ROMs but can't get any speech.
Originally the problem was that the sound board worked fine on its own but would produce no sounds at all when the speech board was connected. I found that W1 was installed on the sound board which I understand is for games that produce sound only. I clipped W1 and now the sounds play with speech board connected but no speech. All the other jumpers check out OK.
I replaced the original Scanbe speech ROM sockets and buzzed out all the connections. Similarly there is continuity on each side if the ribbon connector. Dip switch 2 is on and dip switch 1 is off which I believe is correct - in any case any variations in the dip switches don't produce speech.
During the sound test there are no gaps where the speech should be. I just get the sounds repeating.
I'm a bit stumped and would welcome any suggestions.
Andy

Having same issue. I got tired of it and haven’t looked into it further in a couple of weeks. Very annoying. Will be following this thread.

#3 1 year ago

Check the DIP Switch settings on the sound board. If they're set for no speech, you'll get the scenario where you have sound and no "silent pause" where speech should be.

#4 1 year ago
Quoted from jhend1000:

Check the DIP Switch settings on the sound board. If they're set for no speech, you'll get the scenario where you have sound and no "silent pause" where speech should be.

He already indicated he’s moved the dip switches to match with the manuals position. As have I.

#5 1 year ago

I have some experience with these boards. Do you have the ability to read the speech roms to confirm they are good? What about replacing the capacitors or the two LM1458 amps? That's about all else that ever fails on these boards...

You can also order one of these and be done with it if you don't want to shotgun it:
http://pinballpcb.com/products/replacement-system-6-7-9-speech-board/

#6 1 year ago

Follow the schematic and verify the dip switch settings are making it to the PIA correctly. If they are, I’d replace the PIA.

If there was a gap in the sound test where the voices should be, I’d suspect the caps or op amps on the voice board but since there isn’t a gap, it isn’t even trying to play voice and that can be caused by bad dip switches, bad PIA, bad CPU or bad ROMs.

#7 1 year ago
Quoted from snyper2099:

I have some experience with these boards. Do you have the ability to read the speech roms to confirm they are good? What about replacing the capacitors or the two LM1458 amps? That's about all else that ever fails on these boards...
You can also order one of these and be done with it if you don't want to shotgun it:
http://pinballpcb.com/products/replacement-system-6-7-9-speech-board/

Not sure about op, mine has had all caps replaced. I have not changed my sockets yet. The sound dipswitch is working as I can get it to go back and forth between “tones” and “music”

#8 1 year ago
Quoted from Andy_B:

Just picked up a project Firepower. It was missing the speech board which I have sourced with original FP speech ROMs but can't get any speech.
Originally the problem was that the sound board worked fine on its own but would produce no sounds at all when the speech board was connected. I found that W1 was installed on the sound board which I understand is for games that produce sound only. I clipped W1 and now the sounds play with speech board connected but no speech. All the other jumpers check out OK.
I replaced the original Scanbe speech ROM sockets and buzzed out all the connections. Similarly there is continuity on each side if the ribbon connector. Dip switch 2 is on and dip switch 1 is off which I believe is correct - in any case any variations in the dip switches don't produce speech.
During the sound test there are no gaps where the speech should be. I just get the sounds repeating.
I'm a bit stumped and would welcome any suggestions.
Andy

Suspect a faulty ribbon cable between the speech board and sound board.

Send a photo of the sound and speech board

#9 1 year ago

What revision is the speech board you acquired? If it's from the Sys9 era, it may be factory jumpered for different ROM chips which were larger than Firepower's... you'll have to jumper the Sys9 speech board to support the earlier roms, or burn larger roms with the FP sounds. Of course if it's a SYs6 speech board you should be OK.

Every WMS Sys6 + speech game I 've acquired has had bad OEM speech roms; not sure why those tend to go rotten. If you have the means (a rom burner) I would definitely verify they are good before chasing your tail. If you don't have a rom burner, try swapping them into a known good speech board (in another game) if you have access to that.

I've yet to have a ribbon cable go bad, but you can tone them out end to end. A little tricky but worth the effort to solve that variable.

#10 1 year ago

Also check that the sound board ROM is correct for Firepower, Sound 3.

#11 1 year ago

Thanks for the replies guys, lots of useful stuff there.

Here are pictures of the boards.

To answer a couple of the points raised, the sound board has had some caps replaced by a previous keeper. I buzzed out the ribbon cable from the solder pads on each board and everything buzzed out ok.

I was informed that the ROMs in the speech board are for Firepower but are they in the correct locations?

I have ROM burner - GQ 4x4. I'm a bit of a bewbie with it but checking the ROMs will probably be next.

Is there an easy way to check the amps on the speech board?

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#12 1 year ago

If the problem were in speech amp circuits, then your board would have silent pauses when it tries to say something during game or sound test. Since you don't have those pauses, the sound ROM does not recognize speech board and thinks it is not installed - or misreads the speech enable DIP switch.

#13 1 year ago

Ok. Will check the dip switch too.

#14 1 year ago

Not sure if this is relevant but the volume pot on the speech board alters the sound volume just like the volume pot in the cab.

#15 1 year ago

Yes, it is supposed to adjust the balance between speech and sounds so it also affects sound volume.

#16 1 year ago

Bad speech roms will cause the sound test to skip the attempt with no blank/pause as well. The boards could be perfectly fine and functional otherwise.

Test your roms first and check back: You can download the rom images from ipdb. Read the physical ones with your GQ4X4, and compare to the ipdb image, one at a time. They need to be perfect before you proceed any further.

#17 1 year ago

Your roms are in the correct sockets... But, your speech board has "Scanbe" sockets. I would replace those 3 sockets before worrying about too much else. They are notoriously faulty. It's tricky to replace them if you've not done it before. It may be easier to just buy the Pinballpcb sound board linked above if you've not replaced sockets before. Your speech board is repairable but it comes down to how much patience and time do you have?

Also note the SIP style sockets that were replaced on your main sound board. I would strongly suggest that type if you do replace them.

#18 1 year ago

Scanbe sockets are best replaced by first prying off the black plastic frame, then taking the pins out one by one, warming pin with soldering iron and pulling it out with tweezers. After that, use solder wick or desoldering pump to clear holes. Don't try to desolder and remove the whole socket at once.

#19 1 year ago

I replaced the populated Scanbe sockets and buzzed them all out

#20 1 year ago
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#21 1 year ago

Incorrect Speech Roms
Speech Roms shown are for BLACKOUT Game# 495-1 495-2 495-3
The speech Roms needed are 497-1 497-2 and 497-3

No Speech will be produced using with Rom 3 at IC 12

Blackout speech Roms are triggered by Sound Rom 2 software

#22 1 year ago

Good catch!

#23 1 year ago

Wow, great spot. I see that now on the www.firepowerpinball.com site but would never have picked it up without your prompt

Are the ROMs 2532s?

#24 1 year ago

Looks like I may be modding the board to use 2732s. Stand by.....

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