(Topic ID: 326861)

Fireball scoring oddities

By jlbintn

3 months ago

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  • 9 posts
  • 3 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 months ago by jlbintn
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Fireball 10pt relay (resized).jpg
20221204_170612 (resized).jpg

#1 3 months ago

Two that I have noticed for the past few months.

The slingshots will kick the ball away, but not score 10 points. No little bell chime, either. It's hard to put a percentage on it, but I'll guess around 10-15% of the time. Just a guess, though.

In a four player game, when hitting the skill shot, will sometimes score 10k per rollover switch. Sometimes only two of the three rollovers will score 10K. I can replicate it, but only on a fourth player game. To further weird it out, only seems to happen on the first make of the skill shot, immediately after sending the ball up the lane to start fourth player.

Neither are game breakers, as the game plays quite normally, and quite well in all other aspects. Timing issues are my guess, atm.

#2 3 months ago

there's two switches on the slingshots. One with yellow and a jumper wire to the coil to kick the ball, the other switch has yellow and white/blue wires and powers the 10 point relay (which fires the chime). Check the switches with the yellow and white/blue wires.


the ramp rollovers power the 1K relay identically for all players. The difference would be the player unit wipers and the EOS switch on the player 4 1000 reel.

make sure the player unit contact plate is clean and check the EOS switch. If the EOS doesn't open, the 1K relay will stay powered, which will stick on the 1K score reel coil.

#3 3 months ago

Thank you. The player unit was cleaned recently, mid September time frame. The wipers were off a bit on the 1-2 players. It wouldn't step back enough to turn off the player 2 light when going back to player one after a ball drain. For now I'll focus on the EOS switch and report back. As an aside, the wires on the slings may still be white/blue, but it's really hard to see the white after all this time, because as somebody else mentioned in another thread about this machine.... people like to lube, grease, oil the spinner area. I've cleaned up a lot of crap since this project began

#4 3 months ago

I have the switch gaps on the slings adjusted pretty tightly, but may have to tighten them up a bit more, enough to resolve this issue, but not so much to cause chatter. I can live with it as it is right now, it doesn't occur that often.

The other issue, I think I got it resolved. I pulled off the 1K score reel today, cleaned it up and still had the issue. I manually walked through the reel movement using a small flat head screwdriver. The reel moved as it should, and when I got to the point that it had to turn over the 10K reel, there was a slight difference, it took more of a plunging effort. I pulled another 1K reel off and it did the same thing, so my assumption is this is how it's supposed to work, probably to give the 10K reel enough time to fire.

Anyway, still had the same problem after all of this.
20221204_170612 (resized).jpg

If you zoom in, note that orange and green wire. I noticed that there was a lot of the wire strand exposed. None of the strands were broken, but a small section of the exposed area was unwrapped, so to speak. Looking at all of the other reel switches, there was an insulator on every one. So, I pulled that wire, trimmed about a 1/4 inch of it, put a tube insulator on it and hooked it back up. I have tried half a dozen times to replicate the issue, but it has not occurred since.

There is an insulator tube on the other wire going to that switch and it looked to be in the proper place so I don't know that there was any issue there. Who knows, it seems to be working.

#5 3 months ago
Quoted from jlbintn:

The slingshots will kick the ball away, but not score 10 points. No little bell chime, either. It's hard to put a percentage on it, but I'll guess around 10-15% of the time.

Do they score more reliably if you close the sling shot switches manually? If so it might be that the 10 pt relay isn't holding itself on once it fires. If the problem happens for all players check the 10 pt relay lock in switch in the red box.
Fireball 10pt relay (resized).jpg

#6 3 months ago

Yes, they seem to. I've played around with ball impact. The harder the ball hits, the more likely I'll get the score and the chime. I just built four new switches for the slings, and I can say that the issue has not changed, for better or worse, so that's good, from my perspective. I'll work on gapping the switches a bit tighter and see where that takes me. If the problem persists, it's on to the 10 pt relay. I'll probably take a look at it anyway, now that you mention it.

#7 3 months ago

adjust the sling switches so the one that powers the 10pt relay closes first.

if the one that powers the kicking coil closes first, then it's a race to see if the ball kicks away before the 10pt switch closes. That's what the hold-in switch mark referenced is for, but the 10pt relay has to power to get the hold switch closed.

a simple test is jumper the active player 10pt reel EOS closed and to something to score 10 points - or just manually close the 10pt relay. If the 10pt relay and the score reel don't stick on, then something is wrong in the circuit mark indicated. You can jumper more reel EOS switches or jumper bypass reels to find the problem.

#8 3 months ago

Got it. Thanks for the tips. Y'all are great.

#9 3 months ago

Bit of an update: So far, no reoccurrence of the 10K scoring issue. Did have an issue with the 10 pt coil buzzing. A bit of a backstory that applies: When I got the game and started looking under the hood, I noticed that the 10 pt coil was loose. Even after ever so slightly snugging it down, it always managed to work it's way loose.

After working the switches per the suggestions offered in this thread, I noticed that 10 pts would not score and I got a buzzing sound. A look at the 10 pt coil showed it sliding out of it's slot. So, I tightened it down, more than snug this time and everything is good for a couple of games. Then the buzzing came back, this time whenever I hit anything that scored 10 pts. Not every hit of a 10 pt score, but every couple of hits.

So, I loosened that coil up again just a bit, and the problem is gone. Wouldn't be surprised if it comes back. FYI, I replaced all of the coils in that row in the backbox. All but one that came with the game looked like they had seen better days, and at one point in the past, there was a fire where the 10 pt coil is located. The wood behind it is charred.

So, we'll see what happens, and I hesitate to say it, but the slings are working better than ever, so I think I nailed the adjustment. But....

we will see what we will see

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