(Topic ID: 155337)

Fireball ranked 35?

By Zep

8 years ago


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  • 207 posts
  • 53 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 years ago by o-din
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There are 207 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 5.
#51 8 years ago
Quoted from Boatcat:

Hey, RT................. You kind of revealed it all in this statement.
I'll go with the sentiments of NicoVolta, EM'sInKC and Whysnow. xTheBlackKnightx says, most hold onto them with a death grip, but they're in storage. You mean they don't even bother to display it in their gamerooms? Not a surprise, it's novelty driven, and that's about it. I need a game-lasting objective or sequence to sustain my interest. OK, that's a single-player mindset, I get it. The game has 1 too many options for me, that friggin' spinning disc. I might've even warmed up to it a bit if it didn't have this!
Hey, Levi............ Can you say YOU really played it? Don't recall the replay thresholds, but let's say at 60K, how long/how many times will I need to send/sustain the ball in thumper land even at the skill shot "100 when lit" value to get there?

This is kind of my issue with most multiplayer EM games. I want the game long objective. Playing a multiplayer is like playing five 1 ball games. That's probably why I only own just Grand Prix, which I consider a really great multiplayer game.

#52 8 years ago
Quoted from Boatcat:

Hey, Levi............ Can you say YOU really played it? Don't recall the replay thresholds, but let's say at 60K, how long/how many times will I need to send/sustain the ball in thumper land even at the skill shot "100 when lit" value to get there?

I'm not worried about any replay threshold - why would I? I haven't paid 25 cents for a game of Fireball...ever. I'm worried about getting a big score and/or beating my opponents.

I've gotten 60K scores before. I've rolled the game before. I'm pretty sure it didn't take me any longer than it would on most games not named Jungle Queen. There's lots of points in the skill shot and you get a shot every time you lock a ball, which is a lot. You get the ball into the bumpers every time you lock a ball, which is a lot.

And don't forget, hitting the mushroom bumpers lights various shots for additional thousands of points.

It's time for you to confess - you have not played this game very much, and are latching onto the "it's overrated" mantra to score hipster cool points!! I bet you have lots of tats and "frieking" backwards baseball hat! And underwear showing.

#53 8 years ago

Damn! Have to admit I wear my baseball hats backwards to keep the friggin' sun off my neck! (LOL)

So much for those, "100-point-when-lit pops! (Naturally the skill shot will offer the majority of the points).

I played the game in it's day, then operated it, worked on one at the Asbury Park Museum, flipped a couple over the years like yourself. No, I really don't have a whole lot of play-time on it. It failed to sustain my interest from the get-go. IMO you can go just about any direction and find something better for the money.

#54 8 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

just a brutal random monster.

What can I say then... Play better?

If Xerico was able to score 130,000 points on that game during tournament play in TPF, then it was NOT a random monster. It's a super hard game with wide outlanes. It's a pin where everything is deadly dangerous until you close the zipper flippers and then... everything is still somewhat dangerous. You quickly learn how to steal captured balls from your opponent and learn what to do to minimize risk (the bumpers area is not risky and you can easily score 1,000 points each time you venture there... if you got the skill shot).

#55 8 years ago
Quoted from jlm33:

If Xerico was able to score 130,000 points on that game during tournament play in TPF, then it was NOT a random monster. It's a super hard game with wide outlanes. It's a pin where everything is deadly dangerous until you close the zipper flippers and then...

that is the whole thing, though... It ia super random and hence why there was such a wide range of scores with no real grouping in the top/middle where a game with more skill would naturally occur.

I only played it a couple times in the competition. 1st game was 3 house balls and I never got a chance to close the zippers. 2nd game the mushroom didn't close the zippers unless you hit is perfect/hard so I it really wasnt a zipper flipper for me, lol.

It really is probably one of the most random EMs I have ever played (and that is saying alot since most EMs are pretty random to begin with). It also seems to be entirely based on skillshot and then just some total random action/luck. Get lucky and put up a big score by locking and replunging and hitting bit points on skillshots then try to dump to the pops. Get unlucky and never touch a ball. Fun for the novelty but I learned enough that it is no longer on the list unless one pops up for a really good price. I would rather get an Atlantis or 4milBC as my first EM at this point.

#56 8 years ago

And it won't pop up at a good price unless it's just roached.

I played it enough in the 70s to know it really well. As I said, I think the novelty of some of the stuff on it was cool, mainly the disc. Then years away from it tended to make it better in my memory than it really was. If I came across one somewhere I'd still give it a game or two out of nostalgia. Putting it in the house to play all the time, that I wouldn't do.

#57 8 years ago
Quoted from InfiniteLives:

The worst part about this thread is that after people read it and rated Fireball for the first time it dropped from 35 to 44 lol

And if you listened closely you could here o-din's ghost cry out.

#58 8 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

It's actually not true, nor is it funny.
It conflates the common "thug/trash" argument with the decidedly middle-aged, middle class or rural demographic you see in the hobby. I really don't see too many "25 year old jackwagon with 6" inches of underwear showing , arms and neck covered in tats, huge holes in his ears being pried open by metal hardware, and his freiking hat on backwards" at pinball shows.
Maybe I'm missing something but that's not a real common sight for me in pinball - DMD/EM or otherwise. Still, I guess it has its place in this thread as any EM thread needs a fare share of "get off my lawn!" type old-man ranting.

It was meant to be funny not a knock on pinball hobbyists more of a knock on today's youth. (.Easily sucked in by bells, whistles, and spinning houses) I've seen these bozos I described at shows but they're the exception not the rule, point taken. Whoever said SS brought on the video games you sir are spot on. I quit playing once Gold Strike was replaced with PAC Man in the Arcades. A local beach arcade held EM's into the Early 90's and then they sold out. Sad day for me.

-2
#59 8 years ago
Quoted from YeOldPinPlayer:

EMs stand there unplayed most of the time at Pinballz in Austin too.

I'm sure that has NOTHING to do with the fact that any time an EM is spotted at Pinballz, you can be nearly 100% guaranteed it's going to play like crap, and even if you manage to flip the ball and the game doesn't just eat your money, half the features won't work and it won't score correctly, right?

#60 8 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

I would rather get an Atlantis or 4milBC as my first EM at this point.

4 Million BC is essentially the same game as Fireball without a spinning disc. "My first EM" <---shows you don't know jack about EMs

Quoted from Whysnow:

I only played it a couple times in the competition. 1st game was 3 house balls and I never got a chance to close the zippers. 2nd game the mushroom didn't close the zippers unless you hit is perfect/hard so I it really wasnt a zipper flipper for me, lol.

Unfortunately Saturday morning there was a hiccup with my blue mushroom bumper because the tip that holds everything underneath fell off from it being adjusted at some point. It was my fault that I didn't warn the Tournament guys to be careful with the mushroom bumpers because the repro mushroom bumpers don't have a clip and are held by a plastic tip. Luckily Evan the Pinsmith fashioned eclips for each mushroom bumper that work fabulous. Unfortunately when you move a machine things break or get out of whack. Sometimes you don't know what the problems are until the dust settles. This goes for ALL EMs when they are moved. I spent the better part of the day Thursday after setup test playing several games on all 4 player reels etc. I tested pitch, scoring, level, it had 4 of the most expensive pinballs one can find with a mirror gloss from pinball life. It was stripped down months prior too the show and given a 4 step process for getting off old wax, any swirl marks, new coast of very expensive carnuba wax was applied. (Blitz Wax)... I made treated this machine as if it were my first born child...pampered the crap out of it. I spent approximately 150 in parts and another 125 in a service call 2 weeks before TPF just to make absolutely sure everything was rebuilt 100% whether it needed it or not. Fresh pops, fresh kickers, new mushroom bumpers, new flipper rebuild kit, new flipper bats, fresh rubber, fresh bulbs, old NOS GE #455's for the backglass. (difficult as hell to secure a box) correct nos #51 bulbs in the pop caps, correct "2 for a quarter" coin plates. I brought this game as a proud parent would display his child. I was asked nicely by the tournament director to display my game in the tournament. (I was reluctant at first)

I can't make everyone happy. For the 100 people that love my game and told me so either in person, facebook or on pinside, there are a few people that just have to crap on a game they have zero experience on or were unfortunate to not have the best experience on. Some of those people didn't know how to play the game or it was their first experience playing Fireball. EMs always throw people off every year and the one that throws people off their game the most is the one that will get bitched about. As for the 130k game it was 116k (I believe) and Marcus is an awesome player especially with EMs and early Solid States. He knows his craft. He owned a Fireball at one point. He knows the skill shot, how to lock the balls and when to release them. He knows how to line up his shots past the spinner. He knows how to tap and give english to the table at the proper times.

Want to know how to play this game then watch this video by PAPA. I guarantee you if you are a serious tournament player then this won't be the last time you play this machine.

#61 8 years ago

I own a fireball for about 20 years. I owned a a four million BC for about 5. Both are great games and very simular in game play. Though the artwork on the fireball is 500x beter than that of the 4mbc..,( 4mbc plastics are yuk).. That's why I always kept the FB.. The artwork on this is just amazing.

#62 8 years ago
Quoted from Rat_Tomago:

I brought this game as a proud parent would display his child.

you should be proud, it was an amazing condition game and it showed how much you have done to it. Thanks again for sharing it.

Quoted from Rat_Tomago:

there are a few people that just have to crap on a game they have zero experience on or were unfortunate to not have the best experience on.

I was not crapping on YOUR game, just stating that in general it is not for me as a deck to own. It is extremely random and up until I played it at TPF I had thought it was possibly a game I would like to own. The randomness of the entire game and reliance on skillshot made me realize it is not worth the price to me.

Still a pretty game and cool feature and HAPPY to have been able to play your example! IMO, just not one for me and I will seek out a different EM as my first.

#63 8 years ago

I'd have to give the edge to Fireball over 4MBC... just slightly. They are somewhat similar. Both have high concept artwork and features but Fireball is a bit faster and more memorable overall. Can't really go wrong with either in a good sized collection... love the classic Bally's.

For pure gameplay with 2" flippers it's hard to beat Capersville and Dixieland with an honorable mention to Cosmos and Rocket III.

#64 8 years ago

(Though my very favorite Bally EM's all have 3" flippers... Old Chicago, Skyrocket, Freedom prototype, and Bow & Arrow)

#65 8 years ago
Quoted from NicoVolta:

For pure gameplay with 2" flippers it's hard to beat Capersville and Dixieland with an honorable mention to Cosmos and Rocket III.

4 games I will have in my collection at some point.

Quoted from Whysnow:I was not crapping on YOUR game, just stating that in general it is not for me as a deck to own. It is extremely random and up until I played it at TPF I had thought it was possibly a game I would like to own. The randomness of the entire game and reliance on skillshot made me realize it is not worth the price to me.
Still a pretty game and cool feature and HAPPY to have been able to play your example! IMO, just not one for me and I will seek out a different EM as my first.

Sorry to hit you so hard in my posting. Things start to fester. *handshake* Play more EMs please. Play lots of them, and then play some more of them. Play lots of games on a 4 Million BC before you buy it. Because a 4 Million BC is about 75% of what a Fireball is.

#66 8 years ago
Quoted from NicoVolta:

(Though my very favorite Bally EM's all have 3" flippers... Old Chicago, Skyrocket, Freedom prototype, and Bow & Arrow)

I still need to play your Skyrocket and Dixieland. I am jonesing to try both of them.

#67 8 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

that is the whole thing, though... It ia super random and hence why there was such a wide range of scores with no real grouping in the top/middle where a game with more skill would naturally occur.

I do not agree with your assessment of Bally Fireball.

Here is some data from the 2013 TPF Tournament where Bally Fireball was a game players could play as often as they wished. The format that year was HERB.

72 players submitted scores at 2013 TPF on Bally Fireball using the unlimited entry format.

2 Players scored more than 69,999 but less than 80,000
4 Players scored more than 59,999 but less than 70,000
8 Players scored more than 49,999 but less than 60,000
17 Players scored more than 39,999 but less than 50,000
14 Players scored more than 29,999 but less than 40,000
20 Players scored more than 19,999 but less than 30,000
6 Players scored more than 9,999 but less than 20,000
1 Players scored more than 0 but less than 10,000

Based on these numbers, 14 players scored 50,000 points or higher.
31 players scored between 30,000 & 49,999 points
27 players scored less than 30,000 points.

Based on these numbers, the top players were able to execute strategies that required skill rather than luck.
These top players included many players in the top 200 at the time.

Players of similar skill were grouped as one would expect with a skill based game.

So while I agree that the 2016 TPF Format left a player susceptible to a "house game", I do not agree that Fireball is a game of random luck rather than skill.

Instead, I would argue that Fireball emphasizes a different skill set than other machines. It placed an emphasis on the plunger skill shot and the ability to make six important shots (Odin capture, Wotan Capture, captured ball, center shot to pop bumpers, odin release mushroom and wotan release mushroom) on demand.

Given enough practice on the machine, a skilled player would easily distance himself from the average pinball player.

Marcus

#68 8 years ago
Quoted from NicoVolta:

(Though my very favorite Bally EM's all have 3" flippers... Old Chicago,...

More people I talk with like that game, which is one I cannot stand. I'll have to put some more plays on it and see if it grows on me.

#69 8 years ago
Quoted from Rat_Tomago:

4 Million BC is essentially the same game as Fireball without a spinning disc. "My first EM" <---shows you don't know jack about EMs

Unfortunately Saturday morning there was a hiccup with my blue mushroom bumper because the tip that holds everything underneath fell off from it being adjusted at some point. It was my fault that I didn't warn the Tournament guys to be careful with the mushroom bumpers because the repro mushroom bumpers don't have a clip and are held by a plastic tip. Luckily Evan the Pinsmith fashioned eclips for each mushroom bumper that work fabulous. Unfortunately when you move a machine things break or get out of whack. Sometimes you don't know what the problems are until the dust settles. This goes for ALL EMs when they are moved. I spent the better part of the day Thursday after setup test playing several games on all 4 player reels etc. I tested pitch, scoring, level, it had 4 of the most expensive pinballs one can find with a mirror gloss from pinball life. It was stripped down months prior too the show and given a 4 step process for getting off old wax, any swirl marks, new coast of very expensive carnuba wax was applied. (Blitz Wax)... I made treated this machine as if it were my first born child...pampered the crap out of it. I spent approximately 150 in parts and another 125 in a service call 2 weeks before TPF just to make absolutely sure everything was rebuilt 100% whether it needed it or not. Fresh pops, fresh kickers, new mushroom bumpers, new flipper rebuild kit, new flipper bats, fresh rubber, fresh bulbs, old NOS GE #455's for the backglass. (difficult as hell to secure a box) correct nos #51 bulbs in the pop caps, correct "2 for a quarter" coin plates. I brought this game as a proud parent would display his child. I was asked nicely by the tournament director to display my game in the tournament. (I was reluctant at first)
I can't make everyone happy. For the 100 people that love my game and told me so either in person, facebook or on pinside, there are a few people that just have to crap on a game they have zero experience on or were unfortunate to not have the best experience on. Some of those people didn't know how to play the game or it was their first experience playing Fireball. EMs always throw people off every year and the one that throws people off their game the most is the one that will get bitched about. As for the 130k game it was 116k (I believe) and Marcus is an awesome player especially with EMs and early Solid States. He knows his craft. He owned a Fireball at one point. He knows the skill shot, how to lock the balls and when to release them. He knows how to line up his shots past the spinner. He knows how to tap and give english to the table at the proper times.
Want to know how to play this game then watch this video by PAPA. I guarantee you if you are a serious tournament player then this won't be the last time you play this machine.
» YouTube video

Is the left outlane kickback permenantly activated in this video? I've NEVER had that many balls kick back on me in a game of fireball in my life. Would make the game a little easier id say.

#70 8 years ago
Quoted from Xerico:

I do not agree with your assessment of Bally Fireball.

we can agree to disagree.

5 ball game and 4k per plunge = 20k just in skill shots.
The largest grouping got 5 skillshots and not much else.
A skilled player would be overrunning this luck factor by locking 2 balls and releasing them every ball (at minimum), effectively making it a 15 plunge game or 60k ONLY on the plunge. Since the highest score was less than 80k in your data, I see luck that won that hypothetical battle between luck v. skill.

Quoted from Xerico:

20 Players scored more than 19,999 but less than 30,000

5 skillshots does not = fun pinball for me.
Random monster that tossed balls out the gaping maws of outlanes and center drain is just that, a random game with lots of luck. Not a game I want in my collection. I actually liked the Cleopatra much better for game play.

#71 8 years ago
Quoted from Xerico:

Instead, I would argue that Fireball emphasizes a different skill set than other machines. It placed an emphasis on the plunger skill shot and the ability to make six important shots (Odin capture, Wotan Capture, center shot to pop bumpers, odin release mushroom and wotan release mushroom) on demand.
Given enough practice on the machine, a skilled player would easily distance himself from the average pinball player.

Thank you for stating what I wanted to state all along.

Quoted from TheLaw:

More people I talk with like that game, which is one I cannot stand. I'll have to put some more plays on it and see if it grows on me.

It has been the better part of 17-18 years since I played one. I keep hearing recent praise for this machine. It is a game they made plenty of and it is a game obtainable for sub 1000. I was looking at Old Chicago, Bow and Arrow and Night Rider as a nice mid 70's Bally for my collection.

#72 8 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Is the left outlane kickback permenantly activated in this video? I've NEVER had that many balls kick back on me in a game of fireball in my life. Would make the game a little easier id say.

I was just thinking the same thing myself. Either the bulb was burned out or the game needed the kicker serviced? *Shrug*

#73 8 years ago

I can say I am realy looking forward to the World EM Pinball championships in MI/VFW in 2 months, specifically with the thought of more closely evaluating what title I may actually want to seek out.

I was recently told my collection of games is crap without 1 EM and even though I am pretty fearful of learning how to work on EMs, I have to say I think the person that said it was right. I value a diverse collection which means I need atleast 1 EM.

#74 8 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

we can agree to disagree.

Fair enough. I don't think you'll go wrong with a 4MBC, Atlantis or even Cleopatra. All three games represent different styles of EM play.

Any of those three would be excellent examples to add to your collection.

Marcus

#75 8 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

I was recently told my collection of games is crap without 1 EM and even though I am pretty fearful of learning how to work on EMs, I have to say I think the person that said it was right. I value a diverse collection which means I need atleast 1 EM.

We have been known in the DFW area to convert some Non EM people/players into EM owners. Once you get the bug and the hang of one machine then you will end up liking and keeping a few others.

#76 8 years ago

I've said this before: it's easy to say EMs suck and are all the same if there is nothing on the line. That's why so many will play one ball of an EM at a show and then move on to the baywatch next to it.

If you are a tournament player and are forced to actually play, and learn these games, or if you play some $1 betting games or even just some 4-player grudge matches, your understanding and appreciation of EM games will grow quickly.

#77 8 years ago
Quoted from NicoVolta:

hard to beat Capersville

Ugh. Just about anything beats Capersville. That game is.. <voice of Cleveland Brown> TURRIBLE.

Quoted from Rat_Tomago:

We have been known in the DFW area to convert some Non EM people/players into EM owners. Once you get the bug and the hang of one machine then you will end up liking and keeping a few others.

I had never touched an EM game prior to my second competitve tournament, which was at Ken H's.. was hooked from the start. I still prefer to own modern games, because that's what people seemingly want to play, but Crescendo is MINE...and once I figure out a good way to make it a competitive tournament game I will be lobbying HEAVILY for it go in the tournament area, so more people can complain about unfair 2" flipper games that are fast and brutal.

#78 8 years ago
Quoted from Xerico:

Fair enough. I don't think you'll go wrong with a 4MBC, Atlantis or even Cleopatra. All three games represent different styles of EM play.
Any of those three would be excellent examples to add to your collection.
Marcus

I really enjoyed Cleopatra, even tho it was the machine that knocked me out of the finals. If I see one up for sale near me I may have to grab it!

#79 8 years ago

The #1 reason people turn away from EM's is due to poor playing condition. Weak pops, flippers, flaky steppers, dim lamp sockets, floaty leveling... too many look and play like warped foosball tables left out in the rain. This is not good for building demand and praise.

Dan's Fireball and a handful of others at TPF defied expectations. Those who took a chance to play them kept coming back again and again.

Better to have fewer games which play awesomely than a barn full of "mostly functional" ones...

#80 8 years ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

More people I talk with like [Old Chicago], which is one I cannot stand. I'll have to put some more plays on it and see if it grows on me.

I should have one ready for TPF 2017. Reserve your final judgment until then.

#81 8 years ago
Quoted from InfiniteLives:

I really enjoyed Cleopatra, even tho it was the machine that knocked me out of the finals. If I see one up for sale near me I may have to grab it!

Agreed. Solid EM.

#82 8 years ago
Quoted from NicoVolta:

The #1 reason people turn away from EM's is due to poor playing condition. Weak pops, flippers, flaky steppers, dim lamp sockets, floaty leveling...

That is often stated as the main reason, but I wonder aboot that actually. It might be they are seen as just too basic and not as fun to play as modern machines, that probably most people (here anyway) grew up playing?
It's hard for me to say...I didn't want anything to do with them and was forced to play them...but it gets a little cloudy then because when I did play the games they where in good condition.

Quoted from NicoVolta:

I should have one ready for TPF 2017. Reserve your final judgment until then.

I got one close I'll have to get over it's looks and give it some solid play

#83 8 years ago

"Speed and Chrome" edition, out of CA. That is what the printed card on the apron says.

I would let it go for 4000$.
Can deliver to Allentown if pre sold with deposit.
All metal is chromed. Lock down bar has very minor scratches.
New CPR BG. BG that came with the game to me was plastic, Shay say's it did not come from Germany which I had heard somewhere. He told me it was just a repo by someone.
Spare (NOS?) set of plastics. Mirrored balls from Pinball Life.
PF touch up by CPR artist Lance Foster.
Cabinet repaint.
Plays and scores perfect, BUT HAS one coil in backbox that buzzes.
I will start taking pics but I am not good at posting them and it will take me awhile.
Any info on Speed and Chrome edition, please share.

#84 8 years ago
Quoted from wolftownjeff:

"Speed and Chrome" edition, out of CA. That is what the printed card on the apron says.
I would let it go for 4000$.
Can deliver to Allentown if pre sold with deposit.
All metal is chromed. Lock down bar has very minor scratches.
New CPR BG. BG that came with the game to me was plastic, Shay say's it did not come from Germany which I had heard somewhere. He told me it was just a repo by someone.
Spare (NOS?) set of plastics. Mirrored balls from Pinball Life.
PF touch up by CPR artist Lance Foster.
Cabinet repaint.
Plays and scores perfect, BUT HAS one coil in backbox that buzzes.
I will start taking pics but I am not good at posting them and it will take me awhile.
Any info on Speed and Chrome edition, please share.

From the random posting files...

#85 8 years ago
Quoted from Rat_Tomago:

Play more EMs please. Play lots of them, and then play some more of them. Play lots of games on a 4 Million BC before you buy it. Because a 4 Million BC is about 75% of what a Fireball is.

I would also like to thank you for bringing a great example of Fireball to the TPF. My lack of enthusiasm for EMs in general doesn't lower my appreciation of the hard work done by owners who enjoy sharing them with a wider audience.

#86 8 years ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

I got one close I'll have to get over it's looks and give it some solid play

Ah... I get it. You're in Ann Arbor. I see Clay has an Old Chicago in his collection.

Well then, see you in a few weeks...

#87 8 years ago
Quoted from NicoVolta:

Well then, see you in a few weeks...

Looks like I'll be hitting that Old Chicago right quick and getting my ducks in a row

#88 8 years ago

I sold a Bally NR EM at the show that was mint. Paul Faris said it looks better then some that came out of the factory and said nice restore. I said I didn't touch it except shop it out. It was crazy beautiful. Counter showed 16k...It looked like it.

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#89 8 years ago

Sexy machine man!

#90 8 years ago

Just one question.Name 4 EM pins on the MT Rushmore?

#91 8 years ago
Quoted from Boatcat:

xTheBlackKnightx says, most hold onto them with a death grip, but they're in storage. You mean they don't even bother to display it in their gamerooms?

They own way too many games.
Anywhere between 300-1500+.
Keep in perspective does not mean they are either assembled, complete, or working.
It is common occurence, as a collector gets older and they play less and restore more.
Unless they turn their home into Sam Harvey's old house (no personal offense to the man or his enthusiasm) which most families do not appreciate, it is just not very conducive to normal life.
Many have been at the "tipping point" for years.
Generally the "big boys" rotate their "player stock" like most large collectors.
Variety is key, are there plenty of great EMs to play and collect.

It does not bother me, more EMs for the rest of older collectors.
Six or more for one NIB machine.
Still a great deal.

Probably one of the funniest things I heard a while back was a very young electrical engineer stated that EMs were "too complicated to work on and restore".
Not much of well trained engineer and makes me question the overall technical education system.

#92 8 years ago
Quoted from Classic_Stern:

I sold a Bally NR EM at the show that was mint. Paul Faris said it looks better then some that came out of the factory and said nice restore. I said I didn't touch it except shop it out. It was crazy beautiful. Counter showed 16k...It looked like it.

Gorgeous game

#93 8 years ago
Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:

Generally these "big boys" rotate their "player stock" like most large collectors.

I think these guys just like to hoard. With 300 games, you'd be too busy rotating, rather than playing. I'm saying more people have this game in their collections but it's in storage, preferring other games to play daily. Seems to me it's a game people feel "Completes" their EM collections, but rarely do I see it set up in their limited-space gamerooms.

Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:

Probably one of the funniest things I heard a while back was a very young electrical engineer stated that EMs were "too complicated to work on and restore".

I've heard this several times over the years. Having worked on both back in the late '70's, when it was common to have both on location, I can sort of understand. It took me making a few mistakes to sort some basic EM logic, (with it's method of communication being more hard wiring and relays). Later on, I briefly took on a second job with an amusement op converting vids to newer games, (with kits). Most of those full-time techs told me they wouldn't even touch an EM.

#94 8 years ago
Quoted from Xerico:

Given enough practice on the machine, a skilled player would easily distance himself from the average pinball player.

Doubt it.................... Backhand shots don't fully define one's shooting ability, which you can't exploit with that spinning disc in your face.

#95 8 years ago
Quoted from Boatcat:

Doubt it.................... Backhand shots don't fully define one's shooting ability, which you can't exploit with that spinning disc in your face.

I get beat handily at Fireball by a good player. The spinning disk is just another randomization element. Like pop bumpers, or slingshots.

#96 8 years ago

Here is my Fireball (German ed) set up in my basement,
and it will always be a permanent part of my collection for
a variety of reasons. Artwork, gameplay and nostalgia.
Apology to my game for the junk stashed ontop of it.

76f121ee754a39b654199c50673aad059a9c2c98_(resized).jpg76f121ee754a39b654199c50673aad059a9c2c98_(resized).jpg

Comparing EMs to DMDs is fruitless,
like comparing a ModelT to a '57 BelAire to a 2000 Honda Accord.
Comparing multi-player pins to single player pins
is like comparing a SUV or Truck to a little roadster/coupe.

#97 8 years ago

Clay has come on here before and said that when you own games up in that range (1000 or more) you've got a serious hoarding issue. He even included himself a bit in that, although he's different with the VFW deal where the game are set up and playing. When you've got them stacked like cordwood in a storage facility to where there are games that you'd have to spend days digging to get, you've gone past collecting and you're hoarding. There's simply no way to rotate that many games.

I'd love to own more than I do, but there has to be a limit. I think if I could get up to about 20, all set up and playing, I'd be happy. I simply don't have that room. I also have a wife and that's a limiting factor. But I think the dividing line between being a collector and hoarder is when you last actually saw, much less played, some of the games. It's cool to have a ton of games, but if you can't even see them, much less play them, what's the point?

#98 8 years ago

1000 is beyond hoarding... I don't know what the right word would be for it at that point.

BTW if you happen to be at this level, call me immediately for assistance.

10
#99 8 years ago
Quoted from Boatcat:

made popular from an article in a '72 Playboy Magazine.

You read the articles?

#100 8 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

You read the articles?

welcome back ODIN!

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