Not like the good old days when the Helms truck brought them to us.

I'm all for the ban but if they are going to ban vape liquid then why not cigarettes as well? Maybe just set the agent limit at 21.

Not necessarily true, reputable vape manufacturers will provide ingredients lists. Also, many people make their own juice.

I used vaping successfully to stop smoking (almost 3 years nic-free now) after failing other methods. I made my own juice with (all USP grade) propylene glycol, glycerin, trace of wintergreen or peppermint oil flavoring, and nicotine (in a tapering concentration over time). Unlikely to be significantly more harmful than stage fog juice (which is often scented), and the positive benefits to my health, breathing, and overall energy level were noticeable literally within a matter of days of switching.

While it is unlikely to be 100% safe and research must definitely continue in order to better quantify risk, it is almost certainly much less toxic than tobacco smoking; the political and popular hysteria is really a bit over the top, and I hope cooler, more rational heads will ultimately prevail. Vaping has been fairly widespread for roughly 10 years, and we are just now seeing serious problems in a minuscule percentage of vape users (who appear to have used illicit products containing ingredients which deviate from the formulations produced by the reputable manufacturers). At this point, taking acetaminophen or ibuprofen is probably statistically more likely to cause harm than vaping.

Vape juice from reputable sources vaped at reasonable temperatures (sufficient to cause atomization to vapor, but not so hot as to cause combustion or any other chemical changes) will produce vapor which contains none of the known problematic compounds from tobacco smoke such as CO, heterocyclic aromatics/pyrenes, radon, cyanide compounds, NOx compounds, heavy metals/compounds, or any of a myriad of other reactive molecules produced from the incomplete combustion (oxidation) of the tobacco.

Oh those I *have* done

Thank you for your intelligent response to this very unintelligible discussion.

Chemicals in a cigarette: https://www.lung.org/stop-smoking/smoking-facts/whats-in-a-cigarette.html

Also, those friggin pens occasionally BLOW UP IN YOUR MOUTH...

Cigarettes are as bad as vaping and they’re not banned? Is that what you’re complaining about? Vaping is being picked on? What’s unintelligible? Vaping is bad for you, cigarettes are bad for you, alcohol is bad for you, getting shot is very bad for you....are laws equal? No. Doesn’t mean we do nothing about any 1 of them.

My spidey sense tells me to suspect there's a THC (or at least an illegal substance) link to be found, given the legalization of pot. Vaping seems to be popular on the pot thread that shows up on Pinside occasionally. Add the cumulus clouds some guys like to make...maybe not the best idea long term.

Same, I quit smoking cigarettes after 15 years and been vaping for 8. I'm just happy not to smell like cigarettes all the time, not getting sick (colds) anymore, no more smokers cough etc... I'm fine looking stupid vs. the alternative. Probably need to quit this stuff eventually though.

I'm curious as to what they mean as flavored juice... that candy stuff? Isn't it all technically flavored.

Between that and phones that blow up next to your head, today's youth is living almost as dangerously as we did.

I won’t let my kid use wireless earbuds...lithium batteries are going to kill us all!

It seems like lifetimes ago since the cool kids were huffing PAM.

I hear they eat laundry detergent as well...we had a good run humanity.

Im working for an vape shop https://roken.nl and we do not take 'America' that seriously considering all the statements. Here in Europe we have much stricter rules and have known since 2015 that the electric cigarette is 95% less harmful than tobacco. A huge health gain can therefore be achieved for smokers! On the contrary, it should be encouraged by the government as a means to stop the unhealthy smoking.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/e-cigarettes-around-95-less-harmful-than-tobacco-estimates-landmark-review

Being how tobacco is one of the most damaging things you can do to your body outside of eating asbestos, I'd say even 5% of that is still way too much risk.

We are bombarded by radiation and cell damaging devices and streams all day long. Recent studies have shown that the radiation from cell phones is causing long term damage that could lead to brain cancer. Having said that, the world's population is out of control. If people want to end their lives sooner, who are we to stop them? Make it all legal including drugs, oxy, bacon, etc.

The population in a lot of developed countries has peaked or will peak in the next couple decades. I think African countries are still growing wildly. It's good for the Earth, but bad for the pyramid schemes like social security.

Lol, do you work for Samsung's PR team?

I just saw that India just put a ban e-cigs all together

You might want to let all the commercially available devices know that, I don't think they believe you.

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/07/06/484988211/half-a-million-hoverboards-recalled-over-risk-of-fire-explosions

https://www.consumerreports.org/safety-recalls/why-lithium-ion-batteries-still-explode-and-whats-being-done-to-fix-the-problem/

http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2016/ph240/sheu2/

https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/19/health/e-cigarette-vape-explode-teen-study/index.html

Edited to add: I do occasionally vape. I don't see a problem with it in moderation with quality carts or oils.

Miss those days when I could walk into Mr. Donut, stick my 2 quarters in and pull the handle and get a pack of Marlboro reds. I quit smoking years ago but it was so much fun when I was a kid.

China has always had a ban.

Vaping upsets the 4000% tax one gets from high tar tobacco cigarettes favored by the chinese.

$2 billion a day in revenue at stake.

Vaping upsets tax revenue everywhere. It's not popular with governments at all.

Public health be damned, increase tax revenue at all costs.

High tar cigarettes are favored in countries that have retirement obligations.

The sooner you die the less it costs.

San Francisco has a proposed ban on vaping.

But cigarettes will be ok and protected.

They wont give up the tax revenue from cigarettes.

If you smoke cigarettes, the government loves you.

I'm seeing 11% tax on cigarettes in China (well below international average), still accounts for 7-10% of China's tax revenue given their insane number of smokers. The bigger issue may be that the Chinese government owns the entire tobacco industry, so there's a real financial disincentive to get people to quit.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-smoking-idUSKCN0Y10QA

Tobacco companies knew exactly what they were doing when they settled with the states in the 90s. States effectively became shareholders, and were paid based on sales/profits. The opioid boys could learn a thing or two from big tobacco.

Ah yes you can sell flavored alcohol all you want and not only that but flavored chewing tobacco and get this, if you throw a brown paper on it you can sell it as a cigar. But a white paper or now as a liquid? Fuck you we can keep it from you by fiat order, who cares about your opinion.

I did whatever I wanted like 44 years ago. At 6 I was buying Red Man. By 10 it was Skoal, then at 13 I was buying cigarettes. I also could get beer anytime I wanted starting at 6.

Anyway, I am healthy and doing just fine and have never went to jail or been in any trouble at all. Today if a kid did what I did when I was young they would be labeled all kinds of stuff. BTW, I grew up in a family construction company with around 14 employees, there was open beer coolers on the jobs back then.

Interesting turn of events as weed is becoming more and more legal and less a stigma and now they are trying to faze out tobacco.

30 or 40 years ago if somebody had told me that it would have gone something like this.
images (resized).jpg

Yeah, it’s overreaching and anti-poor. People of means just order vape stuff online and have it shipped home. They don’t care if it’s slightly more expensive.

Poor folks just go back to cigarettes they can buy from the corner store.

I agree. Vaping sort of slid in under the regulator radar several years back. Everybody wants to dis smoking but the truth is that tobacco tax generates a lot of revenue.

Pack of smokes= $8.00 tax = $2.00 ?? Lotta tax money there.

16 years ago I started rolling my own. 400 tubes and 1 lb. of tobacco was $12.00. The cigarette companies did not like that and forced the govt. to jack taxes on RYO tobacco when cigarette taxes were raised. A 1lb. Bag of tobacco went from $8.00 to $50.00.

But all the congressmen like to smoke pipes and did not tax RYO pipe tobacco. So I switched to pipe tobacco for around $12.00 a bag.

Nicotine gum costs $32.00 a box. I don’t know how much sin tax is put on a box of gum but it is almost cheaper to smoke cigarettes.

And then I discovered vaping and learned I could choose how much nicotine to put in my vape juice. The only tax was normal sales tax.

46 years of smoking was finally conquered with 4 months of vaping for about $120.00 total.

I hate to see the kids get hung up on this vape biz but I also hate to see what can be an effective cheap method to quit smoking get regulated into a wallet busting tax collecting exercise.

But you are right. Once the govt. figures out how to lay the taxes on it will never go away.

Skipped a huge chunk of this thread because the beginning and END of this whole “issue” is the Chinese.
China sells is cheap garbage drugs to US, they sell shitty tainted liquor, and now they’re selling tainted, internet-order vape cartridges.

Literally stop kids from buying SHIT on the Internet with their parents credit cards and let their parents paddle them for vaping in the first place.

I don’t smoke, do drugs or drink, but I’ve met many smokes who I have pressed to quit for YEARS and with the help of vapes they finally have quit (a few had a heart attack help them along)

Vaping no doubt has some negative effects that I’m sure will show up down the line, but you genuinely cannot convince me that it’s a bad thing to allow adults to control their nicotine DRUG addictions and slowly ween themselves off.
If you mix your own stuff like most vape shops will do for you, you can drop as little or as much nicotine as you want in the mix. The chemicals in vapes is probably pretty nasty, but the entire addiction centers around nicotine.

Have you SEEN how much nicotine is in JUUL or Blu? They’re both owned by big tobacco companies to keep you hooked.
They are trying to make it so simple with those stupid cartridges that you just take it and get hooked on HUGE doses.

Those goofy-ass giant vape boxes allow users to control what they put in it and most I’ve met have quit smoking AND vaping within 1-3 years which is FANTASTIC.

In my opinion it is a healthier way to help people quit smoking, sure I make fun of guys for doing it and tease them about looking like a metrosexual hipster, but I still support folks trying to better their lifestyle!

Now don’t even get me started on booze, that’s a whole other rabbit hole :b

I'll raise a glass to that!

Ban the douche flutes. They are ridiculous, and the hole in the "people should be able to do what they want to their own bodies" theory is that half of them are uninsured so their hospital bills will be paid by the rest of us.

Vaping is nasty, can't stand walking outside and going though a cloud of flavored vape fumes. Just disgusting. I even smell the crap when driving with my windows open and car In front of me is filled with a vape cloud. Yuck. Can't believe it makes me actually miss regular smokers.

Ban it.....just like slide saves!!

Just kidding. Smoke what you want, just don’t blow it in my face.

For those out there who are wondering, that's a picture of Yul Brenner without his Foster Grants but with terminal cancer.

Yul wasn't the first to run an end of life warning as such.

I remember watching this warning on TV when I was a kid. And then I would go over to the table where my dad kept his smokes, steal a couple, and then go down to my friend's house. His mom was "cool" and we would light up. I also knew about Yul Brenner, as well. Let's see; 1968. I was 15 at that time.

From Wiki:
Four weeks after filming the second public service announcement, Talman died of lung cancer (which had metastasized to his liver, bones and brain[15]) on August 30, 1968, at the age of 53, and was buried in the Court of Liberty, lot 833,[18] at Forest Lawn Memorial Park (Hollywood Hills) in Los Angeles. His widow, Margaret "Peggy" Louise Talman, joined him there at the time of her death in January 2002, aged 73. After William Talman's death, she continued his antismoking efforts. Within a few years she had resumed smoking, however, and the cause of her death was also lung cancer.[14]

How unreal - guess his message didn't resonate too well. If that is the choice you make, so be it. People should be able to make their own choices, but then again - they ultimately will suffer the consequences.

It’s almost as if that shit’s addictive.

I watch a lot of Perry Mason. Puts me to sleep at night. So I started researching what happened to all it's stars. I remember that Talman warning ad and he died not more than two years after the show went off the air.

Ray Collins who played Lieutenant Tragg didn't make it that far. He hard a hard time remembering his lines near the end, but they kept his name in the credits even after he was no longer on the show.

The shocker to me was William Hopper who played Paul Drake who even as a smoker always looked fairly young and healthy. He died of a stroke in 1970, less than four years after Perry Mason came to an end at the ripe old age of 55.

America's first cash crop. Also with a big export market.

It sells itself!

It doesn't hurt that you get a discount for buying two packs and an extra dollar off with your 7/11 rewards.

Ah, the 7/11 app. I’d use it more frequently and be collecting those free 7th coffees if it didn’t take a minute and a half to load up.

I don't have a cell phone so I just punch in my home phone number and get a dollar Slurpee if it's a hot day too. Not often as I am anti fructose, but on a 100 degree day, it can hit the spot.

So what....millions of people have quit, including myself. Take responsibility, you know the shit kills and can't say no? Enjoy your time while you're here.