(Topic ID: 66172)

F14 Tomcat Owners Club Fans Also Welcome.

By Hellfire

10 years ago


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Topic index (key posts)

19 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items.

Display key post list sorted by: Post date | Keypost summary | User name

Post #91 Insert color list Posted by jodini (10 years ago)

Post #98 Video - Add red flashers back to light show. Posted by Patofnaud (10 years ago)

Post #163 Technical Sheet - Matrix, etc. Posted by Snux (10 years ago)

Post #205 Speaker Panel - Early model= glue Posted by IceCreamMan (10 years ago)

Post #406 Pop bumper cap replacement. Posted by Fifty (9 years ago)

Post #466 Bulletproof - rectifier fuses Posted by Snux (9 years ago)

Post #477 Removing warming resistors Posted by Jumping-Box (9 years ago)

Post #513 Cliffy Flipper Frames Posted by Xenon75 (9 years ago)

Post #569 How to increase Bonus Posted by wayout440 (9 years ago)

Post #747 Pinball Cards Posted by agodfrey (9 years ago)


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#163 10 years ago

I just posted this thread for a new Technical Chart for F-14, in case anyone would like a copy..

http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/f-14-tomcat-technical-chart-attached

Mark

3 weeks later
#176 10 years ago
Quoted from SUPERBEE:

another question for all you Tomcat owners. Has anyone replaced any of the playfield plastics with the rivets ?
Some of the domes are riveted onto the clear plastics that i want to change and i know a regular rivet and rivet gun wont work .

In the past I've used a small stainless steel screw with one of those little nylon locking nuts underneath. Not quite "stock", but nice and easy and looks fine to me.

#178 10 years ago
Quoted from GPS:

Quick question. Does the pop number get more powerful as to the speed at which it launches the ball as the difficulty of the game increases. Saw the f-14 at the ohio show and that pop bumper was moving a whole lot faster than mine. Thought it was due to the fact that I have mine set on easiest skill level
Anyone confirm??
Thanks
George

On earlier System 11 machines like Tomcat, the machine has no direct control over the firing of the bumper when it's being played. When the ball touches the "skirt" on the bumper, it closes the little "spoon" switch underneath and that causes the bumper to be fired directly via a direct switch on the MPU. If yours is not as quick as you'd like, I'd suggest adjusting the switch underneath the bumper that is activated by the skirt to make the gap a little smaller, which means it will activate sooner and be more sensitive. Don't over do it though.

3 weeks later
#204 10 years ago

Mine had the Z type, with no lip on the front and the panel is glued. Check the IPDB entry for the machine, there is some mention there of different types :

http://www.ipdb.org/machine.cgi?id=804

I suspect what you have is original.

2 months later
#324 9 years ago
Quoted from mbott1701:

Put leds in the backbox last night.

That looks really good! Can you post a picture without the translite so we can see what you put where?

thanks!

2 weeks later
#369 9 years ago

+1 to Vids comment about the switch matrix and checking it out. If a ball is locked on F14, and then the machine thinks that the switch on the ramp that feeds the lock is closed, as far as I remember the machine will kick out the locked ball to avoid getting 2 in there. So it could be that one of the ramp switches is faulty and closing when it shouldn't, or a bad diode somewhere else is causing a "phantom" closure.

#399 9 years ago
Quoted from TomGWI:

There are 6 boards under the playfield with 4 resistors. Make sure the resistors have not fallen off. It is common for the resistors to fall off and cause god flashers to stop working.

And if they haven't fallen off, check the solder. They can indeed get hot enough (or rattled enough) to desolder themselves but they don't always fall off.

The click you are hearing is the A/C select coil, switching over to allow the flashers to fire instead of the coils. Odd you don't hear it on #6 and #7, but check the resistors first. There are no other relays involved with those flashers, snubber boards are only used on coils....

1 week later
#429 9 years ago

Never seen that before. Can't think of any reason for it to be there.

1 week later
#457 9 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

During one game I had that two ball multiball thing happen on me again. I mentioned it back a few posts. The second ball fired out of the ball lock on the right. I had not hit the release, it just fired prematurely. I think it fired as I spelled T-O-M-C-A-T the second time.
For reference, I reset the pin to factory settings back in May.

Great you have the machine working again

For the mystery ball kickout, try putting the machine in switch test and thumping quite hard on the playfield a couple of times and see if you get any switch action. The right hand eject will kick a ball out if the switch at the entry of the lower habitrail gets activated - it does that to avoid the possibility of 2 balls getting into the lock which it might then have problems kicking out.

#460 9 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

Sorry, but what is the "lower habitrail"?
I have my defective PinScore installed so I'm able to put the pin in switch test mode now. I tried this very quickly last night, but there seem to be a few different switch test modes. I'm still getting familiar with going through the menus. Is there a specific switch test I should be in?

It's the long wire ramp that runs right across the playfield to the lock on the right hand side from the bottom of the plastic ramp on the left of the playfield. Some folks call them habitrails although thinking about it I'm not sure why they're called that. Just into that wire ramp is a switch that closes to tell the machine that a ball is on the way to the far right lock. If that's closing when it shouldn't a ball kickout could happen.

The switch test you want is the "switch edge" test. When in that mode, you can activate all the switches on the playfield by hand and you should see them appear on the display if they are working properly. So in switch edge, a thump in the centre of the playfield in theory should not activate any switch, but if one is loose or badly adjusted a thump usually triggers it.

(and thanks for the PM!)

#463 9 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

I think I need to play a few games without the glass and try to duplicate the issue to narrow down what exactly is happening.

This

#466 9 years ago

Vids guide to bullet-proofing Sys3-7 has some useful advice in for Sys11. Things still wear out, so it's a good read. For Sys11 the particular one to take care of is adding the 2 missing fuses to protect against rectifier failure. Direct link to that is here:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-bulletproofing-williams-system-6/page/2#post-945742

2 weeks later
#510 9 years ago

I think once the value is where you want it, you press the start button on the front of the machine to save it. To get out of the menu, just run all the way up to adjustment 70, once you go over that it'll quit back to attract mode

#516 9 years ago

I think that after you change the values, you then need to reset the high scores, that's a button inside the door from memory

#519 9 years ago

My F14 is one of the earlier ones, so the 6 flashers across the back of the playfield have clear covers instead of red. That hurts even more

#542 9 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

Does anyone have a picture of the ball trough and/or know what the gate is supposed to look like? I can't find a part number in the manual. Maybe it's not a gate? I just have the broken part to go on

There's a picture here from a PinBot, trough is the same.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/outhole-kicker-weak#post-59486

I think that would do the trick

#548 9 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

Before you know it, you'll be rolling the displays back to zero & beyond.

There is an unofficial F-14 ROM that divides the scores by 10 (since the last digit on the display is always zero in the regular game, dividing by 10 to get 'bigger' scores works). I don't think it's been tested beyond me (using pinmame) and the author in his actual F-14, but it's an easy way to make rolling the game over take 10 times longer

I have a copy of the ROM files but can't share them. If anyone is interested, there is a thread about it on the pinhacks site here, maybe the author will share them.

http://pinhacks.com/showthread.php?tid=110

I ran it in my F-14 "Second Sortie" when I was working on pinmame a while back. Here's a picture :

http://www.pinballcontrollers.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=237.0;attach=567

1 week later
#561 9 years ago

Nice work! From chewing on it, and thinking about how I had to code for my Second Sortie re-write, this makes sense. The machine uses that switch part way up the wireform to sense that a ball is on the way to the main ramp. Once it knows a ball is in transit, it will open one of the divertors on the ramp to send the ball to the appropriate lock.

If that switch doesn't register, neither divertor will activate and the ball will always route through to the lock on the far right of the playfield. In theory it should work around the problem but I can see how it could end up confused sometimes and give unexpected results.

Let us know if it carries on behaving

1 week later
#597 9 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

Should they be?

No....

Just took a look at my old playfield and the manual. I see where you found the comment in the manual (on the page with the flipper assembly, right)? The comment there about the blue wire is wrong - checking my old playfield and the schematics later on in the manual, they are not blue. Also - this comment would only apply to the flippers anyway.

For general coils, there is one power line which daisy chains around all of them (there might be a couple of chains, but you get the idea). This one is easy to spot as generally there are 2 wires on that lug. One bringing the power line in from the previous coil, the other looping off to the next one. Only exception is the last coil in the line. You can also tell which one is the power line as the cable is thicker. The other lug has the ground connection - this gets connected to ground by the driver board when it's time for the coil to fire. The banded end of the diode goes to the power side, so generally speaking the lug with 2 wires on.

#600 9 years ago

By only applying to the flippers, I meant the blue wire. The other coils have all different colours. But then the manual is wrong about blue too

And if the flipper coils were backwards, you'd pop the flipper power supply fuse, so you should be fine.

1 week later
#616 9 years ago

Good that another F14 is coming back to life

I checked the F14 manual, which you can download from IPDB amongst other places, and took a look at the switch matrix table. So I can answer your first 2 questions :

1 - White/Red is row 2 in the matrix, it daisy chains around all the switches in that row, including the outhole switch. In the bottom left of the cabinet the only item on that row is the ball roll tilt which mounts to the left side. At the back end of that is a switch which gets activated when the front of the machine is lifted high enough to roll the ball back. That switch is where this wire goes.

2 - White/Purple is row 7. The only item on that row by the coin door is the slam tilt switch. On the inside of the door is a switch with like a little weight on it. The idea being that if you slam the door when it's closed, the switch will activate and tilt the machine. That's where this wire goes.

It kind of sounds like someone had a problem with the machine tilting when it shouldn't and decided to cut the wires. But I'm sure you'll find/fix these on your "journey".

have fun and post more questions for the folks here as and when you have them!

Mark

#618 9 years ago

Looks nice. I have a set of new plastics for mine to go on the new playfield, whenever they finally come out

1 month later
#663 9 years ago

I've seen 2 ways of doing these on F14. If you have the channel at the top that fits over the panel a little (like the one at the bottom), then the bezel is just held in under the top/bottom channels. It's a snug enough fit for it to stay in place just fine. I've also seen F14 panels where the bezel was glued to the panel, mine was like that.

Just remembered too that this was discussed some pages back on this very thread

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/f14-tomcat-owners-club-fans-also-welcome/page/5#post-1532720

1 week later
#710 9 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

Before I start hunting all over the internet

Are you specifically looking for new ones, or are you just missing some? I've got a bunch from that F14 playfield I scrapped a while back which you can have for nowt if they're any use. PM me your address and how many you want if they're of interest

-Mark

1 week later
#730 9 years ago

I've noticed this too as I'm sorting out my new playfield. There is a post a while back where someone added in the "missing" ones.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/f14-tomcat-owners-club-fans-also-welcome#post-1170210

Not sure whether to do the same or not....

#735 9 years ago

These any good? I'm putting in a NOS playfield to my F-14 and don't have much on the topside yet. I'm not a great photo taker, but hope these are OK...

DSCN4879.JPGDSCN4879.JPGDSCN4880.JPGDSCN4880.JPGDSCN4881.JPGDSCN4881.JPG

#738 9 years ago

Look good

Just above the first 'i' in Williams on the first one you can see the glare from my window when I took the photo.... maybe you want to edit that out?

#744 9 years ago

In case you're interested, a good font match for the Tomcat logo is "Blackoak Std", although I think it'll be too wide for the card unless you can stretch it a bit. Its the font I have for "SECOND SORTIE" on my custom cab decals.

But regardless of the font, these are cool... Nice work!

#757 9 years ago

I've got a bunch of chevron inserts still in my junk playfield, they're in reasonable condition but would likely need new decals as a minimum. If they're of any use and you need them I could try and get some out.

1 week later
#783 9 years ago
Quoted from koen12344:

I noticed on the score card "TOP SECRET: Multi-Ball special". Is there some super secret multiball mode I am missing out on?

It's not quite as fancy as that. During multiball, if you hit all the TOMCAT targets on the playfield (top and bottom), then the outlane SPECIAL will light. Or at least I'm pretty certain that's what it is.

#801 9 years ago

I've seen this happen if the game is started too quick, before the sound system has booted up properly. Give the machine 10 seconds or so in attract mode before you start the game and I think it'll be fine...

2 weeks later
#808 9 years ago
Quoted from dri:

Please share your horror and success stories!

Curbfeeler has a good thread on his F14 playfield here....

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/curbfeelers-f14-tomcat-restoration-it-begins

#810 9 years ago

Can't say I've ever seen a ball do that. Where is the ball flying off to get that "high"?

1 week later
#837 9 years ago
Quoted from dri:

What is the "right" coil to use in the bumper to get the action required? Is stock good enough?

Yeah, there have been a few discussions in the past about the pop bumper on F14. General consensus is that it's generally not that powerful, although some folks have tried removing around 100 windings from the coil and improved things.

Quoted from dri:

Sometimes when the machine powers up music is missing and I have to turn the machine off and on.

I've seen that from time to time. It's normally because you didn't wait long enough for the sound card to initialize properly before hitting start. Wait 10 seconds before hitting start, that'll likely take care of it.

Quoted from dri:

regarding getting a free lock on first spell of tomcat, what version is that and how do I verify?

I think all ROM versions support that. Take a look in the manual, page 15 which lists some of the feature adjustments. Look at 33,37 and 38 in particular which allow changing how hard the locks are to light.

You can see which version you have by entering going into service mode, see page 5. The display will show you the version.

Welcome to the club

#839 9 years ago

Not sure without checking the manual again. Also, often the manual was printed before the final ROM versions so they don't always tie up. The number of locks from spelling TOMCAT is adjustable though I think, if 2 isn't the default.

#863 9 years ago
Quoted from wayout440:

If I remember correctly, the VUK switch is a "forked" flat copper switch actuator that gets pushed down by the weight of the ball to trip,

Yup, that's right. It's only the tension in that forked strip that keeps the VUK "cup" lifted up. At some point in the past mine broke because it's been welded back together. Works fine now, but means that they can be somewhat breakable I guess.

Switch test, pound the playfield a few times, throw a ball into the VUK , see what happens.

#868 9 years ago

Yeah, I think wayout440 is right. It still thinks the ball is in the VUK, so waits for a second and tries to kick it out again. Something sticky methinks.... Pain in the proverbial to get at though, that switch. Right at the back behind all those cables. Yuck.

#881 9 years ago

Yup, it should join the other green/red wire

#906 9 years ago
Quoted from Hess:

QUESTION: - I have the machine set to max tilt warnings. The phantom tilt kills the ball, but not the entire game. No warning, just an instant tilt. Which one of the 3 (?) tilts would this be? I assume the plum bob(?)

No, the plumb bob is the most sensitive, that one uses the tilt warnings. And I think the ball roll tilt too. The one that kills the entire game is the slam tilt which is the one mounted inside the coin door, next to the coin slots. The last tilt is the playfield one (mounted under the playfield), which is again a slam type tilt so probably kills the game too although I haven't tried it out.

#909 9 years ago
Quoted from Jumping-Box:

I know it's armature stuff.. But I was able to replace and align my broken flipper on the my first attempt. Thanks Pinside!

Well done on your repair!! Everyone needs to start somewhere. A pinball machine which is nearly 30 years old is like a car that's almost 30 years old.... there is always something needing fixing!

#917 9 years ago

Yup, if you're getting the message but the slings are actually working then it's the one under the playfield. When the sling fires, the action of the coil plunger activating closes a leaf switch mounted by the pivot. That'll be the one on the switch matrix and will be the one that the game is complaining about.

3 weeks later
#947 9 years ago
Quoted from Lame33:

Is this normally F14 behavior or do I have some kind of repairable intermittent fault?

Try pulling the ribbon cable from the back of the display and putting it back on again. Same with the other end on the MPU board. Sounds like you've got a slightly dirty contact there somewhere and that can cause the effect you're seeing. Also check to see if you have any dry/cracked solder joints on the display board.

2 weeks later
#1038 9 years ago
Quoted from Gorno:

I believe the second switch on the flipper coils is for the lane change/high score initials.

That's correct. If you are rebuilding the flippers, you can just pull the old switch stack apart and transfer over the secondary switch if it's usable.

#1042 9 years ago

FiftyQuid has it right with the first one. According to the F14 manual, the complete kickback assembly is a-11041-1. I found online a manual for something else that uses the same, and the plunger part is A-6306-2

#1047 9 years ago
Quoted from Gorno:

Hey guys, I am having issues with the upper ball gate/spinner switch rods falling off the wire forms.

That's an easy fix I think..... they look like they're upside down. The end you have over the spinner wireform should be hooked into the little hole on the switch under the playfield.

This picture isn't Tomcat one, but the idea is the same....

http://funwithbonus.com/wp-content/uploads/spinner.jpg

3 weeks later
#1165 8 years ago
Quoted from Averell:

Here's my next idea - Target decals for our Tomcats.

Nice

My Tomcat Second Sortie would look cool with those, keep us posted with how you get on!

mfG
Mark

1 week later
#1191 8 years ago
Quoted from agodfrey:

I will be exiting the club this afternoon, you my strip me of my rank......

Pilot, you are dismissed

3 weeks later
#1281 8 years ago
Quoted from wayout440:

Also the upper playfield EOS switches are not registering

The upper flippers do not have anything on the switch matrix, so they wouldn't show up.

#1298 8 years ago
Quoted from wayout440:

Snux had the right idea

Can someone tell me the winning lottery numbers for tonight, so I can retire and finally find some spare pinball time again?

#1304 8 years ago
Quoted from Gorno:

Hey Snux, care to share how you did that moving radar?

It's one of these

https://www.adafruit.com/products/1463

driven by a little Arduino. I'm not sure if you've seen my F-14 "Second Sortie" project, I'm redoing the software with a P-ROC and using an Arduino to control a bunch of RGB lighting including this radar.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/f14-tomcat-second-sortie-information-and-on-going-development

1 month later
#1362 8 years ago
Quoted from kilmarnock1350:

Is the GI one circuit that goes around or multiple that maybe one entire circuit is out? Where is the GI Fuse? back box works 100%. Couldn't find fuse info in the schematics.

I popped the reply in your other thread :

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/f14-gi-out-help#post-2502335

FYI, the picture is one I grabbed from page 39 of the Tomcat manual. There is also a fuse list in there, but it's easy to miss. Bottom of page 32

3 weeks later
#1379 8 years ago
Quoted from kilmarnock1350:

Are all 23-800s the same strength or do the last numbers mean something?

They're all the same strength. The suffix on the end is used to denote things like whether a diode is fitted and if so which way around, placement of the wire lugs. Generally providing you make sure the diode is there if needed and it's connected the right way, you can sub one 23-800 for another. Some more information here :

http://www.pinballmedic.net/coil_chart.html

However that said, the pop bumper on F14 is quite well known for not being very powerful. If you put in a new coil sleeve and get the gap on the switch under the "spoon" as close as you can make it without it firing when it shouldn't, then that's likely as good as you'll get it

1 month later
#1437 8 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

This is pretty much an unused feature for F-14.

That's why on Second Sortie I've brought them much more into gameplay. You have to light 1 thru 6 in order to make a mission available to play. One of the missions involves hitting the moving lit 1-6 target. They are a bit of a waste in the stock code though for sure.

On the subject of Second Sortie, I finally have some vacation coming up. I'm away for most of it, but I'll be taking my laptop and cutting some code offline with a cold beer or three. Let's see how it looks for real when I get back....

#1440 8 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

Snux I hope this becomes a kit someday

It's more complicated than the BOP from a components point of view though. In addition to the P-ROC, to run a Sys11 you also need one of the combo interface/driver boards and the only source for those at the moment is me and it takes me 3 hours or so to solder them up and test. There's then the additional auto-launch, plus the RGB inserts and GI, that's a fairly major rewiring job.

That's why I'm posting everything in the public domain - if anyone wants to come along for the ride with no obligations from me, feel free to buy a P-ROC, a driver board and a bunch of other stuff and join in.

I understand what you mean about stock F-14. But I love that it's not too deep - if you're back home from a crap day at work and just need an adrenaline rush then it's perfect. That's why it's cool that my solution also allows the original code to be played - I wouldn't want Second Sortie all the time - sometimes I just need to thrash the hell (or try to) out of the original.

1 month later
#1500 8 years ago

I'm with Mr Wayout

Unplug J11 and then you should be able to get in with the logic probe without making anything toasty. I'd swap Q33 again and Q29. Also pay attention to that resistor array SR7 - they do fail. Use your meter on that from pin 1 to each of the other pins - although testing in circuit isn't great, you should at least find if one of the pins is open or dead shorted.

Off the MPU, check that the diode on the kicker coil is OK (assuming it has one). The other diode for this coil is on that big board under the playfield at the back with 16 diodes on. Grab a DMM and check that they all measure the same. Also try measuring the resistance of the coil with the meter and compare it to another coil with the same numbering.

#1502 8 years ago

Yup, SR7 is a 10pin SIP package, in the middle of this pic (I had a spare MPU lying around!)

DSCN5539.JPGDSCN5539.JPG

#1504 8 years ago

Your link doesn't work for me, but I think you have the wrong value. Your list has a 4.7k SIP, but the schematic snippet you posted shows a 2.7k. I don't have my meter handy to confirm (and it probably wouldn't test in circuit very well anyway) but I think 2.7 is correct

#1509 8 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

SR for series resistors and SRC for series resistors and capacitors correct?

Yup, correct, mistake I made once too Your part number is good.

The SRC are almost impossible to find these days. Clay's guides mentioned you can do without the cap side of it, just use a resistor SIP for the correct value, I've done that before and all has been well.

1 week later
#1560 8 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

I am only getting back to this now, but I have seemingly good news...

Well done getting this fixed up, I suspect the pop bumper will be a simpler fix

2 weeks later
#1624 8 years ago

When bench testing things like this, I use the solenoid output testers from Siegecraft

http://www.siegecraft.us/presta/index.php?id_product=10&controller=product&id_lang=1

It just clips onto the connector that would normally go to the solenoids, the croc clip goes on a power line (5v is fine) then the LEDs will light when an output is driven.

I know you can test with a DMM or LED/resistor to get the same thing, but for $8 it's a great little item to have in the spares box. I like to use it as a quick way of determining if a problem is on the MPU or not.

Hans has a bunch of other low cost things useful for the toolbox too :

http://www.siegecraft.us/presta/index.php?id_category=12&controller=category&id_lang=1

Mark

#1628 8 years ago
Quoted from Fifty:

In short, it was a short

I see what you did there....

1 month later
#1737 8 years ago
Quoted from heni1977:

This should be on its way soon.

Be careful when drilling all the holes you need. Double check and triple check. Here's a link to my F14 playfield arriving and then some pics I took of drilling the holes....

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/f14-tomcat-second-sortie-information-and-on-going-development/page/3#post-2002256

1 month later
#1771 8 years ago
Quoted from tonyhoff1:

Even better would be all high res pics from under the playfield.

I zipped up a whole bunch of pictures I took of the underneath of my playfield before I stripped it down. Hope they're of use

https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/pinside/Tomcat+Refurb.zip

2 months later
#1849 7 years ago

Somebody did do a "divide by 10" ROM for this, that would mean you'd need to play for 10 times as long to roll it over

2 years later
#3586 5 years ago
Quoted from GoneFishinLvMsg:

It still starts a new game after the previous game ends. What happens is it will start the match sequence, but restart before it completes. Any locked balls are not ejected. It just sorta forgets about them until you do a reset. It does not do a reset on its own; it just starts a new game.

This kinda sounds like your start button is triggering somehow. This behaviour is what happens I think if you press start during game play after things are on ball 2 or later. It just starts all over, with any locked balls being left where they are. I'd also suggest running through all your switches, also try putting it in switch test and thumping the machine around a little and see if anything unexpected activates.

8 months later
1 year later
#4706 3 years ago

That's my dust-catcher of a project. All kinds of things have taken me away from it over the last few years.... Someday I'll get back to it....

2 years later
#5493 7 months ago
Quoted from Cariba:

The ball diverter black plastic looks brand new, is it new or did you paint/restore the original?

Replacements are available, you can even get a clear one...

https://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/C-11356

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