You will not find the exact value, because there are too many opinions out there, same as there are too many boards out there with different resistors.

The peak voltage is stored over the diode into the capacitor and then slowly "disposed" by resistor R1. Therefore, the exact value is not so critical.

Only a "three-digit" ohms resistor makes sense.

Take a 150 Ohms / 2 Watt resitor

- Ingo

I appears that there is a 150 Ohm resistor on the snubber board for on page 59 of the manual. However, Millionaire manual shows 100 Ohm. Isn't there only one snubber board for F-14?

Have you considering upgrading to the aftermarket snubber board? $25 + S&H at MAD Amusements

http://mad-amusements.com/product.php?id_product=1837

Are all 6 of the snubber boards driven by Q7?

Does anyone have a link to a schematic for the snubber boards?

Seems like common consensus is 150 ohm 1 or 2 watt resistor.

What size capacitor is used? Seeing as this machine is 25 years old and the electrolytic capacitors are well past their useful life, I would like to replace them as well as the resistors.

The capacitor is 100uF/100V.

- Ingo

There is no schematic out there, if you need one, you wanna me draw one for you?

- Ingo

Hey Ingo, I signed up for access to your German pinball site and was able to download the schematic they have up there. Thanks for the link!

An additional question: Why do some snubber boards have 100 uf caps while others have 2.2 uf caps? In my F-14, 3 are 100uf and 3 are 2.2 uf while others have no caps...

I have one C-11232-1 under my F-14 playfield without caps (relay board). The rest of the boards are labeled C-11232 and have mixed caps....

Here are pictures of the C-11232-1 and C-11232-2 boards.

C-11232-1 Relay board.jpg

C-11232-2 relay board.jpg

Oops, now I remember, that a great expert in our german forum made a schematic.

But you must read his excellent explainations:

"... When WMS designed their boards, at this time, they used as a switching transistor for coils only the transistor-type TIP122.

For power-coils, that operate with +50V, this transistor is too weak. Therefore they set a relay between, which is switched on by the TIP122. Then the current for the power coil flows over the working contacts of the relay.

The 3 components in paralell to the working contacts of the relay (obviously D2, R1 and C1) are probably used to serve as a spark supressor, a more adventurous and not just cheap approach.

Later these 3 compontents were let off and replaced with a spark suppressor capacitor.

And still later, WMS introduced the AUX-Power-Driver-Board, that was equipped with powerful transistors of the type TIP36C for switching the power coils, so that the relay boards were no longer necessary for this purpose. ..."

When I now see the different pictures, I am a bit confused. In the fotos showing C-11232-1, there are no components for spark supression, what makes absoluty no sense to my opinion, mightbe, someone desoldered this components for what reason ever.

To my opinion, the boards C-11232 and C-11232-1 are identical.

Im am unsure, what the exact value of C1 in version C-11232-2 is, I suppose, it is a 0,1uF 100V ceramic disk capacitor, mightbe some can verify this.

I made 2 grafics, that are attached, so that we have the schematics finally documented for the eternity . I will update them, when we have the correct values.

- Ingo

C-11232.JPG

C-11232-2.JPG

In the F-14 manual on page 28 is sort of a schematic of the board.

F-14 manual page 28.JPG

Ingo,

You have that mixed up...

C-11232 - has a resistor and capacitor on the board. I have 2 different versions of this same part number in my early F-14. One version has the 100uf/100v cap and an unknown 1/2 watt resistor (might be a 1/4 watt, can't tell for sure because they are all burned up) and the other has a 2.2uf/250v cap and a 150 ohm 1/4 or 1/2 watt resistor that are not burned. Both boards have the same part number. There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason around which capacitor size is used for which function. For example, one of the center ball ejectors has a snubber with a 100uf and the other has a snubber with a 2.2uf.

C-11232-1 - is the one without a resistor and without a capacitor and is called a Relay Board. In the F-14 one is in the backbox and is used to switch on/off the GI and another is used to switch between the A and C solenoids (the circuit Ken references above).

C-11232-2 - I do not have any of these in my F-14, must have been used in other machines.

The thing I don't get is why Williams simply didn't use lower voltage coils on all the solenoids as opposed to putting these relays/snubbers everywhere. They could have used 50 volts for the flippers (switched with switches, not solenoid outputs) and had all the transistor controlled coils run on 28v.

Look what I found in the papers that came with my F-14...

According to this document, 11232-2 does not have D2, the capacitor value is .1 uf and the resistor is zero ohms...

It does not list the value of the resistor or capacitor on the regular 11232 Snubber board (which I believe are .2 uf or 100uf and 150 ohm)

Thanks for the feedback. NETHERTHELESS - Swaggs inputs are correct - I am confused now

- Ingo

Sorry the attachment didn't appear, pinside does not like my .pdf files. This is the F14 snubber and other special circuits page I found in .jpg format.

F14 Snubber and other circuit info.jpg

I just realized that the scaled down version of the schematics is hard to read... Here it is in high resolution (1MB file):

F14 Snubber and other circuit info hi-res.jpg

I am new to the forum and clearly not as good with electronics as you all. I have had an f-14 for a few years and the center left eject solenoid has stopped firing. The solenoid appears good. How do I test the snubber board? What else could it be? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. -marty

All this information should be put on the PinWiki.
Along with schematics and the use for every board in the right location.

First try the exchange the coil and see if this works.
Next exchange the snubber board with one you know works.

I just confirmed the burned resistors on my C-11232 snubber board were 150 ohm (I measured the burned resistors I replaced them with 2 watt flame proof resistors installed 1/4" above the circuit board).

So the correct values are:

C-11232 (Relay Snubber Board)
C1 = 100 uf 100v, R1 = 150 ohms
or
C1 = 2.2 uf 250v, R1 = 150 ohms.

C-11232-1 (Relay Board)
C1, R1 and D2 omitted.

C-11232-2 (Relay Snubber Board)
C1 = 0.1 uf, R1 = 0 ohms, D2 omitted.

Just A noob question, can i just power up the coils without the snubber boards?...will they work just as well?

Without a snubber board, the coil will not work.
Look up in this tread....

"... When WMS designed their boards, at this time, they used as a switching transistor for coils only the transistor-type TIP122.

For power-coils, that operate with +50V, this transistor is too weak. Therefore they set a relay between, which is switched on by the TIP122. Then the current for the power coil flows over the working contacts of the relay.

The 3 components in paralell to the working contacts of the relay (obviously D2, R1 and C1) are probably used to serve as a spark supressor, a more adventurous and not just cheap approach.

Later these 3 compontents were let off and replaced with a spark suppressor capacitor.

And still later, WMS introduced the AUX-Power-Driver-Board, that was equipped with powerful transistors of the type TIP36C for switching the power coils, so that the relay boards were no longer necessary for this purpose. ..."

When I now see the different pictures, I am a bit confused. In the fotos showing C-11232-1, there are no components for spark supression, what makes absoluty no sense to my opinion, mightbe, someone desoldered this components for what reason ever.

To my opinion, the boards C-11232 and C-11232-1 are identical.

Im am unsure, what the exact value of C1 in version C-11232-2 is, I suppose, it is a 0,1uF 100V ceramic disk capacitor, mightbe some can verify this.

I made 2 grafics, that are attached, so that we have the schematics finally documented for the eternity . I will update them, when we have the correct values.

- Ingo

Sorry to revive this old thread but I'm having issue with my snubber board on Pinbot. My ramp UP coil is acting up on game start and I can hear the relay clicking every time it fires.

My capacitor get super hot and starts to leak within 5 minutes. I replaced the capacitor with same result. What could be wrong for the capacitor to fail like that? Could it be the relay that have failed. It's been replaced in it's life.

About the capacitor, would I have more luck with the 2.2uf/250v than the 100uf/100v?

About that relay, what would be the correct replacement for the original?

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/pinbot-ramp-up-firing-constantly-at-game-start

IMG_6567 (resized).JPG

C1 is 0.1 ufd, R1 is 0 ohms, when specificially used as a C-11232-2 board.

beacon-08 (resized).jpg

Most likely cause of an electrolytic capacitor getting hot and leaking is reverse voltage across it. Are you sure the wires haven't been switched and that the cap is installed in the proper polarity?

Yes I'm positive

pasted_image (resized).png

This is the wrong application of this board. As an A/C relay board, you are putting positive voltage on the negative side of the cap. There is no cap installed on the A/C relay, just a relay and diode.

sys11_1 (resized).jpg

96c2bdd0aa873eb4ffb6826d59565128cb6abc2b (resized).jpg

577e4d57faafcbc0ef419436fb39a2467130f3c3 (resized).png

Sorry to bring this thread back to life, but I really need help here to bring my F-14 back to life. I was off topic somewhere else so let me throw this out for comment. Two types of snubbers used on F-14. C-11232 and C-11232-1. Going to rebuild all snubbers as resistors fried on two of the C-11232 boards. Found two C-11232 boards with no resistors, but heat marks on the board showed one was there.

Here is my recap of the whole thing. All C-11232 boards HAD resistors, so this is a problem. Two burned resistors on two different C-11232 boards is a problem.

Here is my parts list: 2, 1N4004 diodes
1, 150 ohm 1/4 watt resistor, what about 1/2 watt?
1, 100uF / 100volt capacitor
not going to replace the relay, should I? Has anyone had a problem with the relay?
This is for the C-11232 board.

The C-11232-1 just has a 1N4004 diode and relay. I'm going to replace the diodes on these.

I'll post some pictures here. Any help or comment would be great, Thanks.

snubber1 (resized).jpg

snubber3 (resized).jpg

I think every one of the resistors was burnt on the game I have, I replaced them all with 1/2 watts as a safety net though I have no idea what caused them to burn in the first place. The game worked fine without them though. I wouldn't replace the relays unless you have one that doesn't work.

I think the 1/2 watt resistors would be a good idea. Not going to worry about the relays unless I have too. Found some 3000hrs, 100uF/100volt caps. Thinking of going with those.
Having other problems, but these need to be rebuilt before moving on.

It all depends on what the snubber boards are used for.
In some cases all the parts are gone and one jumper added in place of the resistor.

Williams F-14 Tomcat AC-Solenoid Circuit.pdf

I haven't done anything yet. Had to walk away and regroup. I believe I overheated the caps. When I replaced them. Didn't use a heat sink so I'm going back and replace the caps. again, but making sure I don't overheat and use a heat sink. Also found bad resistors on some of the # C-11233 boards. Someone did a crap repair job here too. Having to repair someone else's crap repairs before moving has slowed things.

pin repair 1 (resized).jpg

The relay on these boards is Williams # 5580-09555-01 (Marco Specialties stocks it). Specs are 24vdc, 13 amp contacts, DPDT, PCB mounting terminals. This relay is also used on the Aux Power Driver boards.

It crosses to these other relays:

Guardian Electric # 1395 PVS-2C-24D

Potter & Brumfield # K10P-11D55-24

Omron # LY2-0-US-DC24

Mouser Electronics # 653-LY2-0-DC24

ECG # RLY2343P

NTE # R14-11D10-24P

They burned because they were way under-powered for the job. I use a 2 watt rated resistor to replace the burnt ones.