(Topic ID: 300400)

F You Stern and your price increases

By WeirPinball

38 days ago

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  • Latest reply 20 hours ago by kool1
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    #147 37 days ago
    Quoted from Gameseum:

    There's three guys in a room:
    Guy A bought a Twilight Zone for $1,000 and expects $1,000 out of it.
    Guy B bought a Twilight Zone for $1,000 and expects $8,000 out of it.
    Guy C bought a Twilight Zone for $8,000 and expects $8,000 out of it.
    Guy A wins (and sleeps the best at night) whether the market continues to skyrocket, or crashes. I'd say Guy C is the only one at risk, and Guy B is just being a greedy bitch that can't really suffer a loss or a risk rather than one that is perceived, rather than an actual loss considering he only paid a grand for the thing.
    If this hobby focused more on "getting what I paid for it" rather than "value" we'd have a lovely pool of games and a stagnant pricing for everything, but alas that's not the way the world turns.
    This is more focused on the used games but all in all it all affects new game pricing as well

    Good analogy, but I’d modify Guy C
    Guy C bought a Twilight Zone for $8,000 and expects $8,000 out of it, but gets $10k. This is where the market seems to be right now.

    #206 37 days ago
    Quoted from Bud:

    I see a lot of references here saying location pinball is an option if new pricing has closed the home market for some.
    I’m an old operator and recently have been working up a plan to open a large location. These prices are making me think location pinball is not doable for anybody who doesn’t already own the equipment. Even current operators have to be contemplating shutting down operations because the return on investment keeps taking longer to achieve on new equipment. Operating pins requires new equipment coming in or the location gets stagnant.
    In short, if people think there will always be an option for location pinball, think again. Operators have to do more than break even.

    Its one thing if the game isn't earning, but if it earns, how is the math different when NIB prices were lower? The initial outlay of course is larger, but if residual value is the same, does the math really change? You route the game for 2 years, take in $x, which hopefully is unchanged (or maybe higher) from previous titles. You then decide to sell the game. All that should matter is whether that residual value has changed for the worse. Seems as though residual value has been rising so you could potentially route a game for 2 years, earn from it and then sell it at the price you paid for NIB or close to it.

    #234 37 days ago
    Quoted from drypaint:

    A 2 year routed game does not sell for the same as the HUO game that has 100 plays after 2 years. Especially with assholes death saving and rage tilting because they think pinball machines are public property. New Sterns today are averaging $1 per play and often $2/3 plays. Thats $0.67 per game with the bonus credit. I was paying under $6k for a pro just over a year ago. Now over $7k. Price per play has not changed yet.... But I am starting to hear chatter from other locations.
    Breaking even is business is not worth it. Not even close.
    What is the ceiling for throwing quarters into the machines on location before people stop coming in to our places?
    Its sad because the quality of these Stern machines is getting so bad. The new service button assemblies feel like dollar store plastic and don't work half the time. A real nuisance for us operators who need them often. Investing in buckets of coil stops and other basic parts that break prematurely ads to the cost as well.
    But... You have to always have the new stuff. Customers want the new.

    I don't disagree with you, but I didn't say prices of routed games would go for the same as HUO games, just what you paid NIB or close to it. HUO prices have been rising and often sell for more than NIB prices, particularly for games no longer being produced. Similarly, the price of a routed game also has been rising. If you bought a deadpool pro a couple of years ago, say for $5200, you should be able to sell it today routed for around $4500, maybe more if it's not beat to hell. If you bought a metallica pro, a routed game will now go for above what the NIB price was, assuming not beat to hell. If it is beat to hell, odds are you earned a lot from it. If you buy godzilla pro at $6800, what's the residual value after a couple of years?? $6000-6200?? If it's a lot less than $6000, the math would be changing against operators unless they can charge more per game.

    I hear you on the quality and the need for constant repairs definitely would factor into the equation, particularly if things are getting worse.

    #246 37 days ago
    Quoted from sirisles:

    LE buyers should have been Sterns target!
    They are the FLIPPERS!!
    NO price increase for the PRO machines. And a bump for PREMIUMS of $300-$500 would be realistic.
    They could make a killing on LE buyers
    LEAVE us POOR pinheads ALONE!
    Stay safe everyone

    this is how I might have thought about it given that the LEs have sold out it seems. Raise the LEs more to keep the pro and premium more affordable.

    #272 37 days ago
    Quoted from metallik:

    Meanwhile pool chlorine is clocking in at 50-100% more than last year.

    switch to salt, $6 a bag, need maybe three bags a season at most.

    #380 37 days ago
    Quoted from CoreyStup:

    Tell me about it. And go read the pool forums where people complain just as they do on Pinside. "People are hoarding!" "The pool companies are gouging us!" "They know we NEED this stuff!" I mostly use liquid chlorine, although it went up in price significantly as well.

    Some of us have stainless steel paneled pools and can't use salt generators. Never mind SWG's have other cons.

    the amount of salt in a pool will not harm those panels, its less than one tenth of the amount you’d find in the ocean. I see no downsides to salt pools. We’ve literally added nothing but a couple of bags of salt all season and that’s only because we’ve had a ton of rain, levels stay very constant, water is crystal clear, very soft. Highly recommend it.

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