I see we’ve reached the “bargaining” stage.

Could acceptance be around the corner?!

2000:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/high$20prices$20market$20collapse%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/gzU8ZAOxvUE/qII_fx4klQ0J

2001:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/pricing$20decrease%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/3XZf_itbXjY/QI04T4Qr9UkJ

2002:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/pinball$20price$20bubble%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/8CDhldb5kyw/JxQRQPIGmQwJ

2003:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/pinball$20market$20price$20fall%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/clAO0zIHHfQ/CbExiOZrldIJ

2004:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/pricing$20decrease%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/pXZDb-2V6Yk/GSPWq06-nWsJ

2005:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/pricing$20bubble%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/ACTs0HpQktA/x-C5LZAF180J

2006:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/pinball$20price$20bubble%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/dBrqPnk7mkk/nQYyh65_fewJ

2007:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/pinball$20prices$20fall%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/femnxuH8a1k/oeXzsItDbOQJ

2008:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/high$20prices$20market$20collapse%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/44iMVjwb68o/wXb8-3F9vOIJ

2009:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/pricing$20market%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/JsgTrS05pCc/8pB5t9oUqTAJ

2010:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/pricing$20market%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/hNRZGnOAZ-Y/bs8Js1M7sUAJ

2011:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rec.games.pinball/high$20prices$20market$20collapse%7Csort:date/rec.games.pinball/DlcZoruS0Bo/VO_cueyPCEQJ

2012:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/pinball-price-bubble-think-it-cant-happen-think-again

2013:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/pinball-price-bubble-will-pop

2014:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/this-is-not-a-rebirth-of-pinball-its-a-bubble

2015:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/we-all-want-the-ass-to-drop-out-of-pinball

2016:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/when-will-the-stern-bubble-burst

2017:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/are-we-in-a-pinball-bubble

2018:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/why-i-feel-pinball-prices-are-going-to-plummet

2019:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/will-pinball-prices-come-down-

2020:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/prices-dropping-

2021 (this year has been a fuggin BANNER YEAR for price bubble threads...maybe it's something in the vaccines):
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/pinball-pricing-bubble-due-to-covid-one-nine

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/similarities-with-pinball-market-amp-the-2008-housing-crash

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/next-pinball-depression-

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/how-to-feel-about-these-exorbitant-pinball-prices/page/2#post-6254131

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/pingreed-is-a-cancer-is-there-a-cure

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/prices-of-pinball-machines-today#post-6229413

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/pinflation-or-inflation

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/price-gouging

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/f-you-stern-and-your-price-increases

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/are-pinballs-the-beanie-baby-craze-of-the-2020s

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/we-have-jumped-the-shark

millions dead from a virus

horrible floods and hurricanes killing people and causing untold damage

earthquakes in Haiti

fires out of control

pinball prices up a bit causing slight distress for people who have way too much money

Every game is thousands of peoples’ “dream theme,” that’s the whole point.

So remind me again how this will mean fewer pinball buyers?

I generally just catalogue one price bubble thread per year for posterity’s sake, but 2021 has been absolutely insane.

I don’t understand why everybody is freaking out so much, it’s making this hobby an extremely weird place.

A hobby is supposed to be fun. If pinball prices are making you miserable, find a new, less stressful hobby that you can enjoy.

Operators are playing the same game we are these days.

The games are not a "sunk cost." They know what they are worth, and they know that if they route a game for 4 years and then decide to sell it, they'll get pretty close to what they originally paid for it. So I don't see this as an issue.

Yeah it’s really hard to get attention with a price bitching thread. Somehow you cracked the pinside code! Amazing.

I have my own theories as to why Gary Stern, who is celebrating a holiday tonight, gets an inordinate amount of abuse around here about prices while everybody else who owns a pinball company and charges as high or higher prices gets a pass.

Pm me and I’ll be happy to share!

Correct…except a stern pro is still the cheapest game you can buy. Stern represents the floor, not the ceiling.

We have it so damn good in this hobby, we really do.

But it’s bitch bitch bitch!!

I've got four awesome guitars and never spent more than $3.5k on one. For many here, I'm sure the idea of spending that kind of money on a block of wood and some strings is nuts.

It's all relative baby!

648B1B7D-F81F-4486-8BFC-4ADAD7754F21 (resized).jpeg

CE50D510-1AED-4B9B-8BB9-16A201583237 (resized).jpeg

NEVER!!!

IFPA rewards exists to sell games when there’s plenty of games to sell and demand is low. Kind of like Groupon.

Well, demand is high and supply is low so good luck with that.

Yup. Easiest pop on Pinside. These threads are always huge.

Like Gary’s wallet!!! Am I right folks?!?!

Sometimes it really seems like all anybody wants to talk about. No other hobby I’ve ever dipped my toe into is this obsessed with money/value/bubbles.

The guitar forums are nowhere near this batshit crazy about money and there are guitars that go for millions of dollars.

And the pinball hobby has about a $500 “entry point” if you want to be particular.

Nobody knows how to run Stern better than pinside.

Standard pinside pablum.

Stern are greedy globalists, the rest of the industry are modern day Robin Hoods and mother theresas.

(Stern sells the cheapest games? Irrelevant!)

I agree with you, but when you make as many games as they do they aren’t all gonna be masterpieces. And most of their true turds came at a time when they were charging $4500 or less
For games.

No, this thread is about crybabies with too much money hurling invective at a company (which doesn't have feelings) because pinball machines cost money.

I've pointed out that to me pinball people seem unreasonably obsessed about money, all they want to talk about is prices and money and little else, and now you want to argue about guitars.

It seems like pinball people take this all way too seriously and personally and I don't understand it. This thread is bizarre. If you are getting your feelings hurt by pinball prices, or find yourself getting lathered into a boiling rage once a year when pinball prices go up, you should either find a new hobby or try to get some perspective.

If you are buying NIB games, it seems odd to be this obsessed and angry about prices, as you obviously have more money than about 90 percent of the people on the planet.

I mean, "F U STERN?" For 17 pages?

Seriously? Are we all in 6th grade?

I don’t see nonsense like this on the guitar forums. People complain but it’s never at such a visceral, juvenile level.

“I can afford a $5500 pinball machine but I can’t afford a $6500 pinball machine” doesn’t sound like the rhapsody of someone with money problems.

Yeah, but why does "F U STERN!" have 17 pages and "Stern's price increases may push me out of the hobby" only have 7, when they are identical, expressing the exact same misplaced privileged rage and hashing out all the exact same points?

F U sells!

The most pointless of all posts. Could say that to any of the 500 people in this thread about anything.

I mean it's silly circular firing squad logic. If my F'n posts bother you so f'n much, who f'n cares? Just ignore my posts and move on with your life if they bother you that much

Inflation is so bad I'm already using $20 bills as toilet paper around here.

LMAO

They are going to be making and selling Godzillas FOR YEARS. I'm hearing there's unprecedented pre-orders and demand on this title.

What are you basing your fantasy that somehow prices have "reached a tipping point" on?

Was it this "F U Stern" thread? I know it's pretty convincing!

Is this just going to affect Stern, or do you think we are we looking at a general "bubble bursting" across the entire industry and hobby?

is it finally happening?!?!?!

Well, people have been saying this for over 20 years but maybe this time we nailed it.

I will keep abreast of the situation.

In the meantime, F U Pinball!!! Be lower priced!

Tower to gravity:

F U!

I just wish someone could compare pinball to something that the layman can easily understand...toasters?

Camels?

Coats?

It's on the tip of my tongue!

This argument has been made hundreds of times over the years. There's no indication you are correct this time beyond "a feeling," so I'm gonna go with: no. It doesn't feel like it's getting a little crowded. It's a tiny niche hobby with a TON of room for growth, and new people continue to enter it every day. I wonder how many people read the massive national press about the Banning auction and thought "Gee, may be cool to buy a pinball machine;" I know I personally got a bunch of inquiries (noticeably more than usual) in the immediate aftermath of that.

In case you need a refresher, here is a small sampling of the times that the "bubble is bursting" argument has been made over the past 20 years, and in 2021...

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/f-you-stern-and-your-price-increases/page/4#post-6498563

I’m just pissed off at everybody and everything these days.

F U World!!!

U R crushing my dreams daily!!!!!!

The “parts lying around” theory is one of my favorite in all of pinball.

These manufacturers just have a pile of “parts lying around” and this affects all of their future marketing and production decisions!

That’s how companies work in 2021! It makes so much sense!

A new LE game with trim in a color they used once before 5 years ago?

Parts lying around!!

Pinball company rerunning a game that isn’t the game everybody here is clamoring for?

Gotta be parts lying around!! They have big meetings every Monday morning where they sift through the big parts pile and try to plan all their decisions for the next 2 years based upon what they find in there.

I’m hoping stern stumbles upon an old drum of troll dolls, forcing them to remake RCT.

That doesn’t even make any sense.

They had parts lying around to build 100 extra GOTs, but weren’t planning on building them?

Then why have parts lying around for 100 GOTs? It costs money to make those parts. It costs money to store those parts. So why would they exist if not to end up as completed GOT games?

I’m gonna have to corner Dwight on this and obnoxiously berate him till he explains himself! That’s what pinball shows are for I believe.

This also makes no sense.

They used the AP cabinet because that’s what AP cabinets look like. I mean if they hated that design (which also makes little sense as the design is about 3 years old; why’d they change their mind?) surely they’d have used all the ones “lying around” for Oktoberfest right?

Look I’m just throwing my cards on the table here;

I doubt the veracity of the “parts lying around” theory, and the provided “examples” have yet to sway my thinking!

Are the parts laying or lying?

This alone probable deserves its own thread!

The bubble will burst.

And we are all just sitting around licking our chops waiting for that magic moment!

Hopefully Dwight does a better job of explaining this all to me than you did.

Why are we arguing about this?

I just want to be friends with Dwight.

I’ll admit we are kind of talking about different things.

God forbid stern makes a game with gold rails any time over the next 10 years. It’ll be “Beatles parts lying around.”

All I know is the guy who said stern was pushing him out of the hobby with their cruel price increases is still turboposting here, so I’d guess at least one guy has joined the F ME club.

I mean…JJp announced a new run of $11k wonka LEs last week so kinda makes sense that’s their standard LE price now, right?

I wouldn’t take this personally. He’s just pointing out that saying the issues are magically over doesn’t actually make it so.

I honestly believe the "F U Stern" thread is the final knife into the heart of this pinball bubble.

It's power has resonated far beyond Pinside, causing an unprecedented soul-searching reckoning that is squeezing the life out of the pinball price bubble!!!

Listen carefully...do you hear it?

You must hear it.

That unmistakable sound...

"HISSSSSssssssssssssssssssssss....ssssss..."

I am already considering my 2022 options: Do I buy a Williams IJ for $3,000? Or hold our for a Zep Premium for $4,000?

Thank you F U thread for showing us the way!

Can we stop pretending smart phones are some kind of a province of the rich that nobody else is entitled to in 2021?

Try getting a job without a smart phone. I know there’s a few crusty old here who claim they can live their best life without one but it’s pretty Much a basic neccesity in most walks of life these days, rich or poor. It’s not some luxury item where ownership somehow proves you are “gaming the system.”

It’s basically the same thing as a phone phone for you true geezers out here. Even poor people
Had a phone back in the day, right?

Look at the bright side...the time to buy Stern games before the NEXT price increase is right now.

Buy them before the F U 2 thread!

People been saying the bubble will burst since before you were alive. Literally.

Sorry man. Not happening.

Good call!

Nobody has whined about the scanner yet.

At this point it’s “F you everybody for raising prices,” right?

We aren’t still blaming this all on Stern are we? Their pros seem like bargains now.

F You OP and your price increases!!

Is he really scalping games now? That’s rich.

Ah…so it’s ok for Weir to sell NIB stern pros for $7500, but when Stern sells them for $6700 they are monsters who have “crossed the line” and need to be told F You.

Classic.

It’s amazing how many people in this hobby have their heads up their own.

Really puts this post in perspective doesn’t it?

He’s still trying to figure out how to disconnect a QR reader.

This gif is about half
Of America now.