(Topic ID: 300400)

F You Stern and your price increases

By WeirPinball

42 days ago


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    There are 1216 posts in this topic. You are on page 16 of 25.
    #751 38 days ago

    It literally Stern is burning its own bridge by increasing the prices. Anyway prices are always driven by wiling buyers and willing sellers. I can see a lot of wiling buyers in this pinball market.

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    #752 38 days ago

    You have to give Stern credit though: if you are going to raise prices this much all at once, do it in conjunction with your best release in years.

    #753 38 days ago
    Quoted from KingVidiot:

    1. We both know that would be an insane deal with next to zero profit (or likely a loss) for Stern.

    How do you know this?

    Quoted from KingVidiot:

    2. $5000 is literally several months of comfortable living - food, shelter, transportation, entertainment, communication, hobby money, insurance, taxes, etc. in the very best countries in the world. You could literally live years off this money in others.

    Rent in NYC or LA can be upwards of $3k/mo for a small apartment. To some people $5k is a lot of money. To others, it's a drop in the bucket.

    Quoted from KingVidiot:

    As a video game fanatic once said to me “I spend $60 on a game, you spend over $6000 on one. Pinball is the biggest flex in gaming”

    Pins have a huge range of prices; from free all the way up to $25k+ I saw a couple of EM project pins up for sale for $150 today.

    Yes, brand new games are expensive, but that's not the only option available. If you want the latest & greatest or most popular, then yeah, it's going to be somewhat expensive. But those are not the only options out there.

    -3
    #754 38 days ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    How do you know this?

    Just a rough guess, since Spooky sells pins at well above 5K, and we all know how they’re the only pinball maker not in it for profit... right?

    “Rent in NYC or LA can be upwards of $3k/mo for a small apartment. To some people $5k is a lot of money. To others, it's a drop in the bucket.”

    Absolutely. It all depends on where you live and your income. I’ve worked hard for many years in a field I never got into because of the money, so it’s great to both do what you love and get good money. Now I can afford NIB machines at $10K, but if things go south and I can’t splurge $5000+ ON A SINGLE GAME, I won’t cry about it. That’s the definition of excess luxury. I’ll go back to playing video games, like most folks, where $60 can get you months of amazing entertainment.

    I remember when buying a $60 was a splurge, but I guess most of you long forgot that, or have been spoiled since children.

    17
    #755 38 days ago

    Had to eat once every other day as a kid and lived in condemned apartments. Now I own pins. Life is a journey.

    #756 38 days ago
    Quoted from WeirPinball:

    I don't really think there is a "preorder" system with Stern. It's more of a reservation with the distributor to get one of there allocated games. Each distributor will handle it their own way. I had no $$ down but maybe some take $$ up front. The distributors are at the mercy of Stern setting the price for each run of games.

    An excellent point that many new to the hobby miss.

    #757 38 days ago
    Quoted from explosiveegg:

    I'm more annoyed that the thousands of people who had preorders in are now expecting to pay $500-$1000 more for essentially nothing. I think most companies would respect a preorder price. Especially because a lot of those preorders were supposed to be out by now but keep getting delayed.
    I'm in that camp with an EHOH. They're essentially saying, by the way, we didn't make enough last run to get you your preorder, so it's delayed until 2022, and by the way, since we delayed it to 2022, it's going to cost $500 more dollars. To me, that is a shitty thing to do.
    The price increase is expecting. Everything in the US is up in price. We are all aware that the lumber they need, the labor, and the microchips have all gone up significantly in the last year. And that is the stuff we're aware of because it effects other industries. I would be surprised if the other mechs didn't rise as well.
    Not getting political here, as there is good and bad from the situation, but it's interesting to see what adding 20% to the money pool through these stimulus packages on top of a pandemic which stopped manufacturing for a while will do. I think we're just seeing that start of things going up.

    Welcome to 2021, its happening everywhere
    I have had vendors of my business raise prices once they have.already accepted po's

    #758 38 days ago
    Quoted from KingVidiot:

    Just a rough guess, since Spooky sells pins at well above 5K, and we all know how they’re the only pinball maker not in it for profit... right?

    What is this you say? Did I miss something? Spooky is a non-profit?

    I mean, I know we all love these guys… but huh?

    #759 38 days ago
    Quoted from skink91:

    What is this you say? Did I miss something? Spooky is a non-profit?
    I mean, I know we all love these guys… but huh?

    Standard pinside pablum.

    Stern are greedy globalists, the rest of the industry are modern day Robin Hoods and mother theresas.

    (Stern sells the cheapest games? Irrelevant!)

    #760 38 days ago
    Quoted from KingVidiot:

    Just a rough guess, since Spooky sells pins at well above 5K, and we all know how they’re the only pinball maker not in it for profit... right?.

    #761 38 days ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Standard pinside pablum.
    Stern are greedy globalists, the rest of the industry are modern day Robin Hoods and mother theresas.
    (Stern sells the cheapest games? Irrelevant!)

    I mean lets be honest here. Stern spent a long time just going thru the motions. I've played most all of the games from 2004 to now, and many many of them lack passion and soul (at least that's how I word it). Are they fun? Sure. Are they 6-9k fun? Well...just depends on what you like I guess. The other players coming in did indeed force them to up their game a bit. If you aren't buying them all, then I'm not sure debating price versus other companies matter. People like what they like. I can't even put into words about what I don't like about most Stern games, but it's certainly there. They were the reason I quit even bothering with pinball for so many years. Long before I knew about RPG or Pinside.

    #762 38 days ago
    Quoted from Zablon:

    I mean lets be honest here. Stern spent a long time just going thru the motions. I've played most all of the games from 2004 to now, and many many of them lack passion and soul (at least that's how I word it). Are they fun? Sure. Are they 6-9k fun? Well...just depends on what you like I guess. The other players coming in did indeed force them to up their game a bit. If you aren't buying them all, then I'm not sure debating price versus other companies matter. People like what they like. I can't even put into words about what I don't like about most Stern games, but it's certainly there. They were the reason I quit even bothering with pinball for so many years. Long before I knew about RPG or Pinside.

    I agree with you, but when you make as many games as they do they aren’t all gonna be masterpieces. And most of their true turds came at a time when they were charging $4500 or less
    For games.

    #763 38 days ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    I agree with you, but when you make as many games as they do they aren’t all gonna be masterpieces. And most of their true turds came at a time when they were charging $4500 or less
    For games.

    I'll agree with that, they certainly do consistently put out games. And yeah, that era was kinda rough.

    #764 38 days ago
    Quoted from Zablon:

    I mean lets be honest here. Stern spent a long time just going thru the motions. I've played most all of the games from 2004 to now, and many many of them lack passion and soul (at least that's how I word it). Are they fun? Sure. Are they 6-9k fun? Well...just depends on what you like I guess. The other players coming in did indeed force them to up their game a bit. If you aren't buying them all, then I'm not sure debating price versus other companies matter. People like what they like. I can't even put into words about what I don't like about most Stern games, but it's certainly there. They were the reason I quit even bothering with pinball for so many years. Long before I knew about RPG or Pinside.

    Pinball was dead, it was a miracle stern held out and was making games at all. Pinball was turning around and so were stern games well before jjp was making anything. Things really turned a corner with Simpsons and Lotr. Sure there were duds in between but there was also a steady stream of really good games. It's not not jjp, Spooky, etc have not all had poorly received games.

    #765 38 days ago

    So what were the real turds? 24, CSI, IJ? Do we include Rolling Stones, Avatar, and Monopoly. I actually kinda like those last three.

    #766 38 days ago

    What’s the current shipping price from Stern to anywhere in the USA? Did that go up too? I gotta know. Thx

    #767 38 days ago

    Isn’t Hot Wheels less than Godzilla Pro?

    #768 38 days ago

    Yep more than just price too

    #769 38 days ago

    GZ Pro doesn’t have more than TMNt Pro and that cost $900 less.

    #770 38 days ago
    Quoted from LOTR_breath:

    So what were the real turds? 24, CSI, IJ? Do we include Rolling Stones, Avatar, and Monopoly. I actually kinda like those last three.

    I kinda love CSI and RS, but I sold CSI because the rules were abandoned (no wizard mode). Avatar is a rule-breaker of a game, with just 1 ramp. I liked owning that one too but it’s gone. I’d jump on a Rolling Stones for the right price. There’s no modern Stern (2010+) that isn’t worth having for a year.

    #771 38 days ago
    Quoted from Waxx:

    GZ Pro doesn’t have more than TMNt Pro and that cost $900 less.

    Except you'd still feel robbed after playing TMNT...

    #772 38 days ago
    Quoted from Pdxmonkey:

    Every company is raising the prices it’s not just Stern. Spooky CE is 9k without butter. JJP is up there already. Dutch is 12k. Rumor is AP next game is supposed to be affordable but we’ll see what that is. Be an interesting year if some things go through we will hit hyper inflation soon after.

    Good point. My last few Spooky pins have been 9k+when you add the options! Plus the Spooky games do not include the invisiglass. All NIB pins are expensive!

    17
    #773 38 days ago

    I am not crying about the price increase….do I like it….of course not.
    But since some pinsiders want cry here is my take on it…..
    Stern and others are laughing all the way to the bank. For the short time I have been in the hobby I have observed nothing but games shipping with INCOMPLETE CODE and it was accepted/expected updated code would be released later….Wrong mentality. Why would people continue to buy games with incomplete/poor code? And with no guarantee code would be updated. Countless threads of people with diarrhea of the mouth saying they would pay $XXX this theme or feature. Manufacturers have been listening and you are getting what you asked for….numerous dream themes coming your way at absurd prices….updated code/features…you got it but it’s gonna cost ya cause now you have to pay for Stern Connected. Don’t forget your topper LOL!!! This hobby has become more of a sickness……FOMO, gotta be “In” the circle to know the next release and have a solid relationship with a distributor to PREORDER a game that hasn’t been released not even knowing if you like it. I am so glad I can take a step back and not be sucked into this horse shit. I can’t believe people actually sent in videos to Stern to be able to buy a BM66SLE…..how fucking arrogant is that. And Stern won’t spend a little bit of time to complete the code on WoF. People are willing to pay good money for a COMPLETE QUALITY product. Pinheads are willing to pay TOP DOLLAR for an incomplete inferior product. We all hate the cargument but think of it this way….
    Let’s say Stern is like the Ferrari of Pinball would you accept a Ferrari with 3 wheels or a missing hood or brakes that don’t work? Hell no you wouldn’t. If Stern prides themselves on being the top dog then they should be held to that standard and as consumers I don’t think we have done a good job of that. All I hear is pinball is hard and we keep giving them a pass…putting a man on the moon is hard…..With today’s tech more companies/countries are capable but how many have done it…just saying. Regardless the market for games is hot and the price is the price. Stern just narrowed the gap with JJP who charges more. Accept it or quit buying NIB. Simple solution.

    #774 38 days ago
    Quoted from Pickle:

    Countless threads of people with diarrhea of the mouth saying they would pay $XXX this theme or feature.

    Exactly this. How many times have I had to read “Take my money Stern!!” With that tired Fry meme and “I would buy such and such theme sight unseen!” and “If Stern ever makes so and so theme its a must buy for me, Im in on an LE!!”
    What company wouldnt raise prices when they see people say shit like that?

    #775 38 days ago
    Quoted from chuckwurt:

    No it won’t. It could eventually reduce demand, because you know, that’s how economics works. And if that happens, prices will decrease to encourage more demand. Bell curve. Peaks and valleys. That’s how economics and supply and demand work.

    I think you are wrong.
    If you loose people now that gets out of the hobby due to costs, you loose the potential of getting new people into the hobby, since atleast here in sweden it´s the hobbyists that make new people get interested.
    Loose the recruitment officers and you´ll have no new recruits, even if the relative prices drops in the future.

    You will be stuck with a hundred people collecting faberge eggs. Btw how many companies today makes thoose eggs?

    15
    #776 38 days ago
    Quoted from Dr-pin:

    I think you are wrong.
    If you loose people now that gets out of the hobby due to costs, you loose the potential of getting new people into the hobby, since atleast here in sweden it´s the hobbyists that make new people get interested.
    Loose the recruitment officers and you´ll have no new recruits, even if the relative prices drops in the future.
    You will be stuck with a hundred people collecting faberge eggs. Btw how many companies today makes thoose eggs?

    Sorry. I’ll stick with supply and demand and basic economics.

    #777 37 days ago

    LE/Ce whatever. I think the true battleground is now in the pro level. Once Stern was the only player in the entry level market. Now you’ve got Spooky at $6999, American from $6499. Stern used to be the cheapest but now they’re nearing the top end of that group. The Stern pro is not the “bargain” it used to be.

    Having said that they still kill it on theme, pace of releases and reliable production.

    #778 37 days ago
    Quoted from chuckwurt:

    Sorry. I’ll stick with supply and demand and basic economics.

    Yea ok.
    Lets hope homepin and ap makes a couple of success-games, so that competition hardens.

    #779 37 days ago
    Quoted from ChadKeller:

    This is going on in everything. As long as the government keeps giving out free money it creates artificial demand that wouldn't be there without the free government money. When this stops things will settle back a bit I think. Very bad time to buy pinball machines.

    Yeah, but it won’t. This isn’t transitory inflation, once Stern realizes they can get away with these price hikes, because most on this thread will still buy NIB, then they aren’t just going to drop prices in a year.

    #780 37 days ago

    From what I can see, inflation on most things I purchase is up 10-20% .... groceries, eating out, the used van I recently purchased, stuff in general, shipping costs.

    Stern appears to be right in there, percentage-wise, with the current price hikes currently happening pretty much across the board.

    #781 37 days ago
    Quoted from Pinballer67:

    From what I can see, inflation on most things I purchase is up 10-20% .... groceries, eating out, the used van I recently purchased, stuff in general, shipping costs.
    Stern appears to be right in there, percentage-wise, with the current price hikes currently happening pretty much across the board.

    This.

    #782 37 days ago
    Quoted from Pinballer67:

    From what I can see, inflation on most things I purchase is up 10-20% .... groceries, eating out, the used van I recently purchased, stuff in general, shipping costs.
    Stern appears to be right in there, percentage-wise, with the current price hikes currently happening pretty much across the board.

    Exactly. My friend had quite the ordeal trying to find and buy a new enclosed aluminum trailer. Very low supply, very high cost. Price of aluminum had gone up more than 70%

    #784 37 days ago
    Quoted from chuckwurt:

    Sorry. I’ll stick with supply and demand and basic economics.

    I agree Chuck. Word of mouth is a powerful thing. I know 7 other pin collectors. I have personally talked 6 out of GNR’s due to pf issues and craptastic warranty.

    7th hasn’t committed yet. Been months and his FOMO is probably gone over it.

    Multiply this times hobby collectors and non hobbiest friends elsewhere and it adds up. We can’t be a one-off.

    If there’s an army of dumbasses still buying hoping the next will make them rich eventually they’ll move onto easier money. In the meantime my friends and I will enjoy our older Stern’s and JJP’s and will be buying nib CGC, AP, PB, etc.

    #785 37 days ago

    I get the prices. I sell belts and buckles have gone up 40% in a year. USPS and fedex about to raise their rates 75 cents in a few weeks after just raising them. That adds a lot to my costs. Things are expensive. Have to give people bonuses a d higher wages to keep them happy.

    For me I say raise them a fraction more and include better parts that don’t fail and put hd glass on premiums instead. At least give option to upgrade to hd because you can get it shipped in. Better coil stops and important stuff.

    #786 37 days ago

    Like most businesses, Stern is following the market and doesn’t care about any individual like yourself. It does seem to make most humans feel better though to have a little fit and show Stern the “error of their ways for raising prices” because they will be losing YOUR business.

    How will Stern even stay in business having lost your single sale? They do it with the f’n line up down then f’n block of other buyers willing to pay even more.

    Next time you see Gary at a show, go tell him “I’m taking my business elsewhere” and maybe even stomp your foot on the ground in front of him (it will feel good in your body).

    Then watch to see if Gary can stop himself from laughing.

    #787 37 days ago

    For this much money I am feeling 100% CONFIDENT the fucked playfield issues are fixed. Right guys???

    #788 37 days ago
    Quoted from spinal:

    Like most businesses, Stern is following the market and doesn’t care about any individual like yourself. It does seem to make most humans feel better though to have a little fit and show Stern the “error of their ways for raising prices” because they will be losing YOUR business.
    How will Stern even stay in business having lost your single sale? They do it with the f’n line up down then f’n block of other buyers willing to pay even more.
    Next time you see Gary at a show, go tell him “I’m taking my business elsewhere” and maybe even stomp your foot on the ground in front of him (it will feel good in your body).
    Then watch to see if Gary can stop himself from laughing.

    Next time you see him, you should ask if you can lick his boots.

    #789 37 days ago

    Gary said he lived in an apartment. Maybe owned a huge apt or condo? Think he would have a nice place.

    11
    #790 37 days ago

    After reading some of these comments I'm waiting for the "Thank you Stern for raising prices" thread.

    #791 37 days ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    After reading some of these comments I'm waiting for the "Thank you Stern for raising prices" thread.

    I don't think anyone is happy about it, its just that some of us realize that a big portion of it is just it being an unavoidable evil.

    #792 37 days ago

    6613EAF8-3F82-49BE-BE3E-86F8447C2944.gif

    #793 37 days ago
    Quoted from Haymaker:

    I don't think anyone is happy about it, its just that some of us realize that a big portion of it is just it being an unavoidable evil.

    All the MMs and TZs that I've seen for sale lately are much much more than they were a few years ago too.
    Nobody has started a thread called "F You Resellers and Your Price Increases!".
    Nothing changes. If a game looks like it's worth the price, buy it. If it doesn't, then don't.
    After seeing the Deadflip stream Godzilla release I'm stoked to be in on an LE.
    Doesn't mean I'll pay the same amount for any future release if it doesn't look as good.

    #794 37 days ago
    Quoted from Haymaker:

    I don't think anyone is happy about it, its just that some of us realize that a big portion of it is just it being an unavoidable evil.

    Let's not try to bring reason or civility to a thread titled "F You Stern". Just go along with the blind negativity and be a curmudgeon like the rest of them.

    #795 37 days ago

    76186848-B2FC-4ED6-B767-E1514F092F9B.gif

    #796 37 days ago
    Quoted from underlord:

    Had to eat once every other day as a kid and lived in condemned apartments. Now I own pins. Life is a journey.

    At least there are 2 of us on this site

    #797 37 days ago
    Quoted from JohnTTwo:

    At least there are 2 of us on this site

    More than you realize John.
    It’s pinball after all.
    They may not post much but quite a few here are self made and still want value for their dollar.

    #798 37 days ago
    Quoted from Vino:

    More than you realize John.
    It’s pinball after all.
    They may not post much but quite a few here are self made and still want value for their dollar.

    I beat my body up to buy these things while filling my 2 kids college funds (more important obviously ).I figure when it’s time to hang it up at least my fingers will be working just will need a nice rolling chair

    #799 37 days ago
    Quoted from Kkoss24:

    I beat my body up to buy these things while filling my 2 kids college funds

    Send them to trade school.

    #800 37 days ago
    Quoted from Vino:

    More than you realize John.
    It’s pinball after all.
    They may not post much but quite a few here are self made and still want value for their dollar.

    I was just dwelling on this today. I sold a pin today and as I went to the bank to deposit a wad of cash and was thinking I remember when a video game used to be a big purchase. It’s always nice to reflect on how far one has come on this journey from time to time.

    There are 1216 posts in this topic. You are on page 16 of 25.

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