(Topic ID: 300400)

F You Stern and your price increases

By WeirPinball

31 days ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 1,196 posts
  • 275 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 days ago by underlord
  • Topic is favorited by 25 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

No games have been linked to this topic.

    Topic Gallery

    View topic image gallery

    7E06776A-409F-49F3-A3CB-29E629D7FDC5 (resized).png
    pasted_image (resized).png
    rent-is-too-damn-high-jimmy-mcmillan (resized).jpg
    3F82B49B-15D4-41AA-A8E2-7E6D0C4D1C06.gif
    10E44B61-1E4C-45E9-BBDA-7564B60A38F4.gif
    F3616058-5F66-431E-8798-A832D5BE4CDD (resized).png
    200.gif
    mcribby2 (resized).jpg
    Screen Shot 2021-09-25 at 11.17.18 AM (resized).png
    Screen Shot 2021-09-25 at 11.16.36 AM (resized).png
    C29C7B68-5B04-4F51-8E1A-B14E31D0E25C.gif
    Messages Image(4099927298) (resized).png
    steam-train.gif
    PXL_20210920_055315863 (resized).jpg
    8FAD9293-B096-435D-A693-1E60B7B7DEC1 (resized).png
    godzilla (resized).jpg

    There are 1196 posts in this topic. You are on page 14 of 24.
    -7
    #651 28 days ago
    Quoted from Rarehero:

    What’s laughable is that you don’t understand that tech wasn’t the issue. Stern had 1 or 2 guys doing dot animation. For an LCD you need an animation crew that’s well versed in modern traditional & 3D animation. It costs more & is a different pipeline. To keep on Stern’s schedule, they couldn’t just switch quickly. On top of that, licensors were letting them get away with likenesses & footage on dots that they are sometimes not allowed to do in HD full color.

    I believe you could find 20 2D animators and 20 3D modelers (having experience in said things, they're all over the place) per 1 dot-matrix animator. You really think it's the other way around?

    Perhaps Stern probably just already had the dot-matrix people and was nervous to rock the boat, but 2D animators and 3D modelers are both one of those jobs where the people are plentifully basically begging for work.

    Now that they're doing 3D-modeled graphics (thankfully) which they weren't doing in the earliest games like Aerosmith, obviously that requires yet another set of skills and hands, albeit it seems they are going totally 2D animation or totally 3D animations (GUI always being 2D obviously) so never "both".

    I'd assume it would be way easier and more cost efficient to find a 2D artist or a 3D modeler than some of the dot matrix stuff they were doing, let alone the time it takes.

    Additionally, it seems like most of these people also tend to work alone or with a small group.

    The animation is the easy part and basically the cherry on top of the total game. I wouldn't be surprised if a single skilled animator could crank out all the animations in a game in a week to three weeks. It's not really that big of an undertaking.

    I'm sure dot matrix animation is a way more complicated process than an artist drawing freehand on a tablet and creating different frames of animation (particularly easy in the digital age now that we have virtual tablets, and can save and erase to create minor changes for animation), or a 3D modeler crafting things up in Blender.

    Add pre-recorded pre-existing live action footage (where permitted) that couldn't be done before, with no work whatsoever, to fill in the gaps like The Beatles, and you have a big time and work advantage actually.

    #652 28 days ago
    Quoted from acedanger:

    Dude I have over 20 years experience with animation & creating vector raster artwork I’m no graphic artist more of a designer. That being said in my opinion their animations are relatively simple it does require time; but if your lens was as sharp as mine you would clearly see it doesn’t require a tremendous amount of man hours.

    I have the same amount of experience in the same field. I think you are starting to stray away from my original point. When you are comparing content made for DMDs and LCDs....LCDs have more going on. The original argument is why didn't Stern move to LCDs sooner because they were so cheap. Making content for LCDs is much more expensive than the hardware itself. Compare the amount of content on a DMD to and LCD game.

    #653 28 days ago
    Quoted from Palmer:

    After Effects is not a 3D animation program...well technically it can do 3D but not really what most animators use for 3D. That isn't the point though. He talks as if the majority of the heavy lifting is done. Also glosses over graphic design and UI. All of these things take time. Just because it is an LCD screen doesn't make content easier to make for it.

    obviously everything is storyboards out & user interface. Easier because most are licensed & they need to adhere to their style guide & libraries.

    #654 28 days ago
    Quoted from Zablon:

    I will agree that all the CGC games I've played feel...more fragile...than others, but that being said, my MBr has been flawless.

    Really? I feel my MBr is quite solid next to my recent Sterns, though I’m not complaining about their lighter-ness; makes’em easier to nudge without killing my wrists. Though nothing else I have compares to my 2002 Stern Playboy - what a tank. Tipped the delivery guy $100 to help get that into the home cause I felt so bad, and he was no lightweight of a man.

    #655 28 days ago
    Quoted from Frax:

    If we ever end up in a tournament together somewhere, and Ghostbusters is an option, I'm definitely picking it just for you. Especially if it's a Premium or LE.

    I don’t play in tournaments, as I find them to be torturous unfun slogs….so, sorry, you won’t be able to double torture me lol

    #656 28 days ago

    Shows like South Park make an episode a week because all of the assets are computerized and the animation is standardized.

    Once you get the characters and worlds 3D modeled, it's smooth sailing from there.

    South Park is animated more like 3D than 2D as well in a program called Maya, and takes any of the drawing out of it.

    With the aesthetics on certain Stern games in the 2D era, I assume this route may be used as well... albeit not in all cases. It's definitely a streamlined process.

    I would consider the amount of animations in a pinball machine to be quite small as well. Very repetitive.

    #657 28 days ago
    Quoted from acedanger:

    What are talking about from all the animations I’ve seen are clearly 2d. It’s not Pixar.

    Also wanted to add...because I think this is important...there is a lot of room for improvement with LCD animation. But I imagine the current state is because of the production schedule of games, the amount of people doing that job (one person?), and just what is allowed to be used based on the IP holder.

    #658 28 days ago
    Quoted from Palmer:

    Also wanted to add...because I think this is important...there is a lot of room for improvement with LCD animation. But I imagine the current stat is because of the production schedule of games, the amount of people doing that job (one person?), and just what is allowed to be used based on the IP holder.

    I was extremely impressed with how they've come from Aerosmith (2D) to Jurassic Park (3D). The 3D-modeled atmosphere was a great touch and something that should've been done from the first place. I guess they're still grasping the capabilities of the LCD.

    You could really tell in the early games that lacked any kind of 3D animation, but looks like they are improving a few years down the road now.

    -2
    #659 28 days ago
    Quoted from WeirPinball:

    Working on modding this for a friend this week
    [quoted image]

    The CGC MB is the worst of the lot. Know quite a few people that moved it really quick.

    #660 28 days ago
    Quoted from Gameseum:

    Now that they're doing 3D-modeled graphics (thankfully) which they weren't doing in the earliest games like Aerosmith, obviously that requires yet another set of skills and hands, albeit it seems they are going totally 2D animation or totally 3D animations (GUI always being 2D obviously) so never "both"

    They were actually doing 3D on DMDs…which was probably a transitional ramp up to LCD. Star Trek had some 3D modeled scenes of the Enterprise (or Vengeance?), Goatf***ers has tons of 3D…the Ecto-1 scenes, for example. It’s just downrez’d & displayed as dots.

    Quoted from Gameseum:

    I believe you could find 20 2D animators and 20 3D modelers (having experience in said things, they're all over the place) per 1 dot-matrix animator. You really think it's the other way around?

    It’s not about finding them. It’s about affording to pay a crew vs. 1 dude & creating a schedule/pipeline that Stern has never done before after doing dots since the 90s.

    #661 28 days ago
    Quoted from Gameseum:

    Shows like South Park make an episode a week because all of the assets are computerized and the animation is standardized.
    Once you get the characters and worlds 3D modeled, it's smooth sailing from there.
    South Park is animated more like 3D than 2D as well in a program called Maya, and takes any of the drawing out of it.
    With the aesthetics on certain Stern games in the 2D era, I assume this route may be used as well... albeit not in all cases. It's definitely a streamlined process.
    I would consider the amount of animations in a pinball machine to be quite small as well. Very repetitive.

    South Park is reusing 90% of the same assets week to week. The art direction is simple & hasn’t changed in 20 years, so creating new assets is relatively simple. Every single Stern game has a different style, art direction, rules from the licensor, assets available or lack thereof. I don’t think 1 Stern LCD game has reused anything from another.

    #662 28 days ago
    Quoted from Rarehero:

    They were actually doing 3D on DMDs…which was probably a transitional ramp up to LCD. Star Trek had some 3D modeled scenes of the Enterprise (or Vengeance?), Goatf***ers has tons of 3D…the Ecto-1 scenes, for example. It’s just downrez’d & displayed as dots.

    It’s not about finding them. It’s about affording to pay a crew vs. 1 dude & creating a schedule/pipeline that Stern has never done before after doing dots since the 90s.

    Gary should have taken a page from deeproot and hire an entire studio to do animation

    What about JJP? How many people do they dedicate to screen content?

    #663 28 days ago
    Quoted from Rarehero:

    They were actually doing 3D on DMDs…which was probably a transitional ramp up to LCD. Star Trek had some 3D modeled scenes of the Enterprise (or Vengeance?), Goatf***ers has tons of 3D…the Ecto-1 scenes, for example. It’s just downrez’d & displayed as dots.

    I figured they'd just convert certain videos to dots (and meant to include that in my reply), albeit the results sometimes were a bit odd. It's certainly an easy way to do things, but it got even easier now... now they just dump the real footage in completely untouched. I guess it depends if the license really has stipulations that differ between converted movie footage and just the footage itself in the end, but in the end everything is so much easier on LCD physically - speaking literally rather than how much of a PITA the licensors make it.

    Quoted from Rarehero:

    It's not about finding them. It’s about affording to pay a crew vs. 1 dude & creating a schedule/pipeline that Stern has never done before after doing dots since the 90s.

    I really feel like the 2017-era 2D animations were probably all done by the same dude, and the more recent 3D animations are probably done either by one dude or a very small team.

    I'm not saying it isn't time consuming, I'm just saying it's probably as time consuming (or lack thereof) as DMD animation. Just gotta teach or replace the people. 2D animations are insanely plentiful in the world, and albeit 3D modelers and animations are slightly more niche, it's not by much.

    #664 28 days ago
    Quoted from Palmer:

    I have the same amount of experience in the same field. I think you are starting to stray away from my original point. When you are comparing content made for DMDs and LCDs....LCDs have more going on. The original argument is why didn't Stern move to LCDs sooner because they were so cheap. Making content for LCDs is much more expensive than the hardware itself. Compare the amount of content on a DMD to and LCD game.

    Yes & no. When originally creating dmd animations it was more challenging because there’s only so much real estate. Software wasn’t as sophisticated either. Now lcd more freedom better software. I think once pf is designed you just recycle those assets & variations there of. I’m 1000% confident the majority of animations were rendered out by AE. It’s mostly 2d animations from what I’ve seen. Thanks

    #665 28 days ago
    Quoted from Rarehero:

    South Park is reusing 90% of the same assets week to week. The art direction is simple & hasn’t changed in 20 years, so creating new assets is relatively simple. Every single Stern game has a different style, art direction, rules from the licensor, assets available or lack thereof. I don’t think 1 Stern LCD game has reused anything from another.

    Yes, I took that into account:

    Quoted from Gameseum:

    Once you get the characters and worlds 3D modeled, it's smooth sailing from there.

    Also, just one South Park episode is 30 minutes, a Stern pinball machine probably has 3-4 minutes overall, tops?

    #666 28 days ago

    The LCD graphics on Aerosmith are great. Terrific artwork, and they fit the game perfectly. While I can appreciate that Jurassic Park has more detailed graphics, that didn’t stop me from selling it. And the movie clip approach used on games like Guardians is my least favorite. Led Zeppelin to me is the best compromise - short band clips blended with well-done graphics.

    I also came back to concede a point to the JJP fans: JJP does a much better job with licensing content. You guys get multiple complete albums, while we’re stuck with the 10 songs that were picked for us. LZ would be a much better pin if I could pick any song from Led Zeppelin I-IV.

    #667 28 days ago
    Quoted from swampfire:

    And the movie clip approach used on games like Guardians is my least favorite.

    Yep, it's the same vein of Stern using real pictures for pinball artwork in the late 2000s and early 2010s. Thankfully they went back to the drawn style. Lots of Pinside threads were had over the "cookie cutter" artwork from that period.

    On that note, I really like the stock JP code & amimations, not sure why the movie code is such a hit - feels so tacky and fake too. To each their own I guess. Like you, I'd rather have new animations than old real footage. And that's a mod... when they do it officially it's even more of a shame. Easy way out I suppose.

    #668 28 days ago
    Quoted from Methos:

    The CGC MB is the worst of the lot. Know quite a few people that moved it really quick.

    Not mine - so I didn't make the call

    #669 28 days ago
    Quoted from Gameseum:

    Yep, it's the same vein of Stern using real pictures for pinball artwork in the late 2000s and early 2010s. Thankfully they went back to the drawn style. Lots of Pinside threads were had over the "cookie cutter" artwork from that period.
    On that note, I really like the stock JP code & amimations, not sure why the movie code is such a hit - feels so tacky and fake too. To each their own I guess. Like you, I'd rather have new animations than old real footage. And that's a mod... when they do it officially it's even more of a shame. Easy way out I suppose.

    I hated on the JP LCD when it launched, but now that I have it, I respect the approach & while you’re playing, it fits perfectly. Sure there are a few wonky things, but overall I think they did an excellent job. Now, if I had a TMNT, I’d def change that to the 80s cartoon clips mod lol

    #670 28 days ago
    Quoted from Rarehero:

    I don’t play in tournaments, as I find them to be torturous unfun slogs….so, sorry, you won’t be able to double torture me lol

    league==tournament...whatever.

    #671 28 days ago
    Quoted from Rarehero:

    I hated on the JP LCD when it launched, but now that I have it, I respect the approach & while you’re playing, it fits perfectly. Sure there are a few wonky things, but overall I think they did an excellent job. Now, if I had a TMNT, I’d def change that to the 80s cartoon clips mod lol

    I don't think I've ever loved a game as much as I love my Jurassic Park and it also makes bank like no other lol

    Stern animations could definitely be a little more polished as they look a little 2002 themselves at times but they're definitely heading in the right direction and getting better and better at using the technology.

    Can't say enough great things about JP though

    Now I just scratch my head about why they didn't do perhaps the most simple change ever, create a simple front-end to not still make the operator menu an emulated DMD screen, but whatever Probably has as much to do with operator familiarity as it does with Stern just employing that "If it ain't broke" attitude. Always found that to be odd and hope eventually they utilize the damn screen fully

    Thanks for the interesting discussion

    #672 28 days ago
    Quoted from dsmoke1986:

    It’s not an “employees market”. Stimulus money has caused a lot of the labor issues. How do you expect people to be motivated to go to work when they are making more sitting home in their couch.
    It’s Time for everyone to get back to work.
    Problem is that This inflation isn’t transitory like Powell would want(hope) to believe, the extra stimulus money has caused this inflation and its here to stay.
    Hope you enjoy paying 9k for your Stern Premiums.

    Sounds like the system is broken to me.

    To me, it is an employee's market for those who are "hunters" and not "hopers" or people to lazy to go to work. For those looking to work and give back, this is a great time to do so. Your focus is on the "lazy and unmotivated". Mine is on the go-getters and those who see opportunity while the uninitiated and unmotivated sit at home.

    I am in agreement with you on your points. I genuinely do agree. We see things differently.

    As far as a labor shortage, there are some industries that are WELL known for the "hey, you want to quiet, fine, I got a list of 25 people ready to take your job." I remember hearing that and being told that before going active duty, and I resented that crap. That's not how you keep people. You keep people by mentoring, taking care of, and looking after them. Happy people are encouraged, and encouraged people are productive. There are some national employers that definitely don't do that.

    I am saying that in some cases, people are fed up being treated lowly to the point of nearly sub-human, and they are realizing that can better themselves and progress in their lifestyles and careers with the extra money.

    For those who want to view it as everyone "sitting at home watching TV and playing on their cell phones" - well - that's your right. I'm going to view it in a more positive light.

    #673 28 days ago
    Quoted from Palmer:

    Gary should have taken a page from deeproot and hire an entire studio to do animation
    What about JJP? How many people do they dedicate to screen content?

    I don't know, but JJP and American Pinball have some awesome LCD presentations. Playing JJP games and looking at the screen is amazing and Houdini has great animations and back glass.

    #674 28 days ago
    Quoted from Haymaker:

    Gonna need to see a pic of said 90 footer for proof. I used to huck ATV's a lot and I was pretty darn good at it. 90 foot is a big jump even on a dirt bike.
    Also check out the yamaha wave blaster if you want a dirt bike experience on water

    We have what we call an old man track, not one double all table tops and the long ones have that perfect long downhill landing ramp you can land 70-100 with zero issue heck probably the only bad landing area is at about the 35' mark other than that short or long no worries. Nice straight launching ramps. I want him to build a supercross finish line jump where you are never off the ground more than 2 feet, he said it will look like a big ta ta!

    It is a long way and I hate the thought of not being able to do it much longer as I am getting older.

    Yeah the wave blasters are fun, but I think the Kawi Jet skis are the most like a dirt bike.

    #675 28 days ago

    Most importantly, the guy at Sega who made the little DMD icons for the operator menu better be getting royalty checks from Stern! (I kid, I kid.) 20+ years of service!

    20210917_142906 (resized).jpg

    20210917_143649 (resized).jpg
    #676 28 days ago
    Quoted from metallik:

    So if you understand this: wages going up, costs going up, why are you always complaining about the resulting price increases?

    Soon as my salary goes up roughly 15%, mid-year, due to inflation, I'll be square.

    pasted_image (resized).png

    #677 28 days ago
    Quoted from Gameseum:

    Now I just scratch my head about why they didn't do perhaps the most simple change ever, create a simple front-end to not still make the operator menu an emulated DMD screen, but whatever

    I’m sure it’s been in the works, and eventually all the LCD games will get a menu update across the board.

    #678 28 days ago

    That shit menu is a disgrace
    They've had more than enough time to update it

    #679 28 days ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    That shit menu is a disgrace
    They've had more than enough time to update it

    Lol. The whole thing needs replaced of course, but it's funny to see how exact it still is from day 1.

    Even the "fire knocker" icon still has a plunger...
    not only does the 2021-built game not have a real knocker, neither does the 1999 one. Both digital.

    So many levels deep in the outdated wormhole

    #680 28 days ago
    Quoted from Gameseum:

    Even the "fire knocker" icon still has a plunger...
    not only does the 2021-built game not have a real knocker, neither does the 1999 one. Both digital.

    All of my Sterns right up to and including 2021 have real knockers and I'm glad the menu is there to enable and test them.

    #681 28 days ago
    Quoted from Gameseum:

    I wouldn't be surprised if operators and collectors both lean towards JJP more now that the prices are so close.

    Not unless JJP gets its act together and fixes the atrocious playfield situation.

    I’ve been patiently waiting for Toy Story LE/CE but not willing to spend current prices to play Russian Roulette with playfield quality.

    #682 28 days ago
    Quoted from John_I:

    All of my Sterns right up to and including 2021 have real knockers and I'm glad the menu is there to enable and test them.

    you just need buy one an wire it up

    #683 28 days ago
    Quoted from Rarehero:

    I’m sure it’s been in the works, and eventually all the LCD games will get a menu update across the board.

    at the very lest use the old BIG DMD menus that make use of the bigger size.

    #684 28 days ago
    Quoted from JohnTTwo:

    We have what we call an old man track, not one double all table tops and the long ones have that perfect long downhill landing ramp you can land 70-100 with zero issue heck probably the only bad landing area is at about the 35' mark other than that short or long no worries. Nice straight launching ramps. I want him to build a supercross finish line jump where you are never off the ground more than 2 feet, he said it will look like a big ta ta!
    It is a long way and I hate the thought of not being able to do it much longer as I am getting older.
    Yeah the wave blasters are fun, but I think the Kawi Jet skis are the most like a dirt bike.

    Ah long rollers and tabletops...I guess that makes a little more sense. Heres a pic of me in my younger days. This was maybe 55-60 foot so thats why I was questioning you a bit

    As for the jet ski's are you talking about the x2 or a stand up? Kawi stand ups suck compared to the yamahas and the x2 is cool but has nothing on the waveblaster. WB is way more a dirtbike experience than a standup too. Unfortunately WB prices have skyrocketed lately too

    1914707_1053474672994_4797677_n (resized).jpg
    #685 28 days ago
    Quoted from Gameseum:

    Most importantly, the guy at Sega who made the little DMD icons for the operator menu better be getting royalty checks from Stern! (I kid, I kid.) 20+ years of service!
    [quoted image][quoted image]

    I can hear Gary Stern yelling "If it ain't broke don't fix it!" lol

    #686 28 days ago
    Quoted from Haymaker:

    Ah long rollers and tabletops...I guess that makes a little more sense. Heres a pic of me in my younger days. This was maybe 55-60 foot so thats why I was questioning you a bit
    As for the jet ski's are you talking about the x2 or a stand up? Kawi stand ups suck compared to the yamahas and the x2 is cool but has nothing on the waveblaster. WB is way more a dirtbike experience than a standup too. Unfortunately WB prices have skyrocketed lately too
    [quoted image]

    Wow that’s awesome, I was to scared to jump a wheeler. Just never seemed like I could control it in the air like a bike. There is no better feeling to me then zero G’s and flying. Better then cracking a nut. The only double I really do now is Millville in the back and that’s only cuz I don’t wanna be landed on.

    #687 28 days ago
    Quoted from Gameseum:

    Most importantly, the guy at Sega who made the little DMD icons for the operator menu better be getting royalty checks from Stern! (I kid, I kid.) 20+ years of service!
    [quoted image][quoted image]

    Hah! That's some funny stuff.

    #688 28 days ago

    'No Politics' is supposedly the rule here, however the "Capitalism is GREEDY and BAD" crowd always seems to get a pass on that one.

    #689 28 days ago
    Quoted from Gribbs:

    'No Politics' is supposedly the rule here, however the "Capitalism is GREEDY and BAD" crowd always seems to get a pass on that one.

    You have that wrong. Capitalism isn't bad. The way people abuse capitalism and then complain about those 'damn poor lazy people abusing the system' is bad. Yep we get it, don't make enough, go find another job...so what are you going to do when no one wants to do your minimum wage jobs? Oh...wait...

    #690 28 days ago
    Quoted from swampfire:

    The LCD graphics on Aerosmith are great. Terrific artwork, and they fit the game perfectly. While I can appreciate that Jurassic Park has more detailed graphics, that didn’t stop me from selling it. And the movie clip approach used on games like Guardians is my least favorite. Led Zeppelin to me is the best compromise - short band clips blended with well-done graphics.
    I also came back to concede a point to the JJP fans: JJP does a much better job with licensing content. You guys get multiple complete albums, while we’re stuck with the 10 songs that were picked for us. LZ would be a much better pin if I could pick any song from Led Zeppelin I-IV.

    LZ Clips are too short and too much distortion on them for my taste. I think they could have improved a lot on the presentation but I'm too busy watching the PF to really pay attention anyway!

    #691 28 days ago
    Quoted from Zablon:

    You have that wrong. Capitalism isn't bad. The way people abuse capitalism and then complain about those 'damn poor lazy people abusing the system' is bad. Yep we get it, don't make enough, go find another job...so what are you going to do when no one wants to do your minimum wage jobs? Oh...wait...

    ...making my point.

    #692 28 days ago
    Quoted from Gribbs:

    ...making my point.

    Oh I know, but we're talking prices, which is about wages and capitalism, started by the ones saying things like 'what they can't make money?' etc. It is what it is. IMO if you don't complain about price hikes for the sake of complaining, you got way too much money

    #693 28 days ago
    Quoted from Zablon:

    Oh I know, but we're talking prices, which is about wages and capitalism, started by the ones saying things like 'what they can't make money?' etc. It is what it is. IMO if you don't complain about price hikes for the sake of complaining, you got way too much money

    My point is that from previous experience here I KNOW: If I reply to a comment coming from a Liberal viewpoint with a Conservative concept, *I* will get my hand slapped by the moderators for 'NO POLITICAL DISCUSSIONS'. The original comments do not seem to be a problem, however.

    #694 28 days ago
    Quoted from Gribbs:

    'No Politics' is supposedly the rule here, however the "Capitalism is GREEDY and BAD" crowd always seems to get a pass on that one.

    "Politics" is a pretty subjective and fuzzy line, but I agree it should be kept out entirely. It does go both ways though that thread about the Chinese manufactured pinball machines had guys making blatantly racist jokes to no moderation.

    #695 28 days ago

    There is something annoyingly wrong about charging more, partly due to introducing features like the goofy internet connected QR code reader that no one wants. Especially when that stupid "feature" paves the road for DLC content in pinball...which obviously will fleece people even more in the future.

    I'm out if I have to pay for updates I used to get for "free". Or even worse, have to pay some kind of subscription fee.

    11
    #696 28 days ago
    Quoted from John-Floyd:

    Went to McDonald’s yesterday (bad choice I know) Big Mac value combo = $9.80. I remember paying around $7.00 ish a few years back. It’s all relative - life has just gotten more expensive.

    F you Mcdonalds and your price increases!

    #697 28 days ago

    Do we know if the prices are increasing on machines like Mando, TMNT, etc. to the new Godzilla pricing? Or will all those be the same besides the Stern Insider mark up? (ex: will Mando still be $6,199 or is it moving to $6,899)?

    #698 28 days ago

    It’s been said a few times - everything going to GZ pricing January 1 2022

    Quoted from outlanewiz:

    Do we know if the prices are increasing on machines like Mando, TMNT, etc. to the new Godzilla pricing? Or will all those be the same besides the Stern Insider mark up? (ex: will Mando still be $6,199 or is it moving to $6,899)?

    -1
    #699 28 days ago
    Quoted from PanzerFreak:

    Keep being angry and only favoring one pinball company, I'll be enjoying my Stern and JJP pins in the meantime

    No anger. No favoring. Just calling u out on ur bullshit.

    #700 28 days ago
    Quoted from djsolzs:

    It’s been said a few times - everything going to GZ pricing January 1 2022

    Gotcha, thank you!

    There are 1196 posts in this topic. You are on page 14 of 24.

    Hey there! Got a moment?

    Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run thanks to donations from our visitors? Please donate to Pinside, support the site and get anext to your username to show for it! Donate to Pinside