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(Topic ID: 222166)

F-14 Tomcat - player 4 display missing "F" segments

By sixtyfourbits

5 years ago


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Topic Stats

  • 21 posts
  • 3 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 years ago by GRUMPY
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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#1 5 years ago
OP
 
MAT

sixtyfourbits

Pinside member

6y 85,300 1,400 18

Hi Pinside,
I recently picked up a F-14 Tomcat. When I got it home and set up, I noticed that the player 4 display is missing the "f" segment. Its consistent across the one display, and the other segments are nice and bright.
I tried removing the cable and connections from the display and reseating them back on, but it didn't change anything. Later tonight I will try to switch the connections for display 3 and 4 and see if the symptom switches to 3 and if 4 works perfectly. Until then, any advice on what I should be looking at fix the missing f segments? Maybe corrosion on a pin responsible for the f? maybe a poor ribbon cable? I'm pretty new to pinball machines so any help is appreciated.
Thanks!

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#2 5 years ago
OP
 
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sixtyfourbits

Pinside member

6y 85,300 1,400 18

I had the display out to check its pins and board. Everything looks good, so I’m thinking it’s on the driver board maybe?

C2B1018E-737F-4A74-932A-A598DE570A54 (resized).jpegC2B1018E-737F-4A74-932A-A598DE570A54 (resized).jpeg

B527B83E-EF9B-48EC-92BC-BF27CDE1B359 (resized).jpegB527B83E-EF9B-48EC-92BC-BF27CDE1B359 (resized).jpeg

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#3 5 years ago
 
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GRUMPY

Pinside member

10y 95,050 8,703

Is the F segment out in display 3 too? Check the resistance of R-47 on the display driver board.

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#4 5 years ago
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sixtyfourbits

Pinside member

6y 85,300 1,400 18

Quoted from GRUMPY:

Is the F segment out in display 3 too? Check the resistance of R-47 on the display driver board.

Thanks for the response!
Display 3 is working perfectly.
R47 looks good, but I’ll check it’s resistance ASAP.
I was also given the suggestion to give the src resistors a bit of a wiggle, but that didn’t fix the f segments.

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#5 5 years ago
 
DEC

GRUMPY

Pinside member

10y 95,050 8,703

If display #3 is working correctly then you have a bad connection on the display board. This bad connection will be after R-47. After R-47 this signal splits and goes to both #3 and #4. Somewhere after the split there is a poor connection. I would start with reflowing pin 39 on #4 display and then retest it.

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#6 5 years ago
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MAT

sixtyfourbits

Pinside member

6y 85,300 1,400 18

Quoted from GRUMPY:

If display #3 is working correctly then you have a bad connection on the display board. This bad connection will be after R-47. After R-47 this signal splits and goes to both #3 and #4. Somewhere after the split there is a poor connection. I would start with reflowing pin 39 on #4 display and then retest it.

Thanks again Grumpy! I will definitely go in this direction and see what happens.

4 months later
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#7 5 years ago
 
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h8breed01

Inactive member

US Grand Blanc, MI

10y 20,300 16 2

Ok, I have almost the same issue, but both display 3 and 4 are missing "f" if it isnt r47 which I'm checking tonight, what would be the next step to check?

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#8 5 years ago
 
DEC

GRUMPY

Pinside member

10y 95,050 8,703

Quoted from h8breed01:

Ok, I have almost the same issue, but both display 3 and 4 are missing "f"

Since its both displays are missing "F" I would check for the signal at the start. J-5 pin 3 on the display board, check it with a logic probe. There should be pulses when the F segment should be on.

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#9 5 years ago
 
???

h8breed01

Inactive member

US Grand Blanc, MI

10y 20,300 16 2

Grumpy, thank you for your help. I have pulses when f should be on, and the go off when I cycle through and f should be off.

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#10 5 years ago
 
???

h8breed01

Inactive member

US Grand Blanc, MI

10y 20,300 16 2

Quoted from GRUMPY:

Since its both displays are missing "F" I would check for the signal at the start. J-5 pin 3 on the display board, check it with a logic probe. There should be pulses when the F segment should be on.

Going through the schematics, I have a pulse at leg 10 on the 4050 chip and a pulse on leg 16 of the 7180 chip, but it reads completely different like a lot faster.

Post last edited 5 years ago: “Added a detail”

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#11 5 years ago
 
DEC

GRUMPY

Pinside member

10y 95,050 8,703

Quoted from h8breed01:

I have pulses when f should be on, and the go off when I cycle through and f should be off.

And this is at J-5 pin 3, correct. Then repeat the test but check U-11 pin 10 for pulses when the f segment should be on.

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#12 5 years ago
 
DEC

GRUMPY

Pinside member

10y 95,050 8,703

Then you need a new U-9 chip.

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#13 5 years ago
 
???

h8breed01

Inactive member

US Grand Blanc, MI

10y 20,300 16 2

Quoted from GRUMPY:

Then you need a new U-9 chip.

U-9 or u-15? U15 had the weird output.

Thank you so much for your help grumpy!

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#14 5 years ago
 
DEC

GRUMPY

Pinside member

10y 95,050 8,703

Quoted from h8breed01:

but both display 3 and 4 are missing "f"

Since its the lower displays not showing the F segment then it would have to be U-11 or U-9, U-15 would be for the upper displays.

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#15 5 years ago
 
???

h8breed01

Inactive member

US Grand Blanc, MI

10y 20,300 16 2

Quoted from GRUMPY:

Since its the lower displays not showing the F segment then it would have to be U-11 or U-9, U-15 would be for the upper displays.

As I'm waiting in chips, I ordered new cd4050s, which I'm hoping is the replacement for u9, and a new 7180 chip. I realized I didnt check r47... because I cant find it on the system 11a/b display I have. Looks like the highest spot for a resistor is 35 or 37.

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#16 5 years ago
 
DEC

GRUMPY

Pinside member

10y 95,050 8,703

Quoted from h8breed01:

I realized I didnt check r47... because I cant find it on the system 11a/b display I have.

Do you have a early or late display board?

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#17 5 years ago
 
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h8breed01

Inactive member

US Grand Blanc, MI

10y 20,300 16 2

Quoted from GRUMPY:

Do you have a early or late display board?

I have the late board

1 week later
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#18 5 years ago
 
???

h8breed01

Inactive member

US Grand Blanc, MI

10y 20,300 16 2

Quoted from h8breed01:

I have the late board

And now it's fixed. It was cd4050

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#19 5 years ago
 
DEC

GRUMPY

Pinside member

10y 95,050 8,703

Quoted from h8breed01:

It was cd4050

Was this U-11?

1 week later
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#20 5 years ago
 
???

h8breed01

Inactive member

US Grand Blanc, MI

10y 20,300 16 2

Quoted from GRUMPY:

Was this U-11?

U-9, before the 7180. The chip was fluttering fast and I was learning.

Thank you for all the help, couldn't have done it with out you

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#21 5 years ago
 
DEC

GRUMPY

Pinside member

10y 95,050 8,703

Quoted from h8breed01:

U-9

I think there is an error in the schematics or there is more then one revision of the display board.

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