Worst case Aurich is you could drop it off at my house for a few weeks.
As mentioned I usually hand trigger relays until something happens. I have also seen bad connections at the jones plugs on occasion. Once you get them up and running, they are like swiss watches that just keep on ticking.

Yes, try this. Try to simulate your Mr. Pinball Tip startup sequence by hand. If you can get it going then you'll narrow down where the problem is.

Clean all the leaf switches you can. In the backbox too. Sounds like something is dirty.

Sorry Dirt... I have amended my post! That will teach me to post late at night. As you said, if the Ball count unit and play meter etc operate then S must be operating.

It is time to get out one of your best EM tools: An alligator clip jumper wire. This you would use to jumper across each of the items in question to rule it out. As Dirt pointed out, Score motor switch 2C and the Start relay ALSO energize: Ball Count reset, Bonus Reset, and the total play meter. So, if those are energizing when you push the start button, then there is no reason to worry about the two switches. Instead, it must be the path up to the head (the Jones plugs as was also suggested).

It is time to get out one of your best EM tools: An alligator clip jumper wire. This you would use to jumper across each of the items in question to rule it out. But in this case, you can go straight to the head and locate the Black-Red wire on the AX relay coil and then find a Red-Black wire on any of the many things it connects to. By using your jumper, try activating the relay coil to see if it works and trips (or resets).

The odd thing is, most of this really has little to do with serving the ball if the AX relay is in the proper position (reset). The AX serves only 1 purpose here. And that is to reset the score reels. Once all zeroed, the relay changes position and allows the rest of the start up process to continue.

Since it sounds like a lot more is "Dead" besides the AX relay tripping, the next path is through a Break switch on the S Relay (other half of the switch for AX trip and Ball Count reset etc.) and then, a Make Switch on the R (Hold) Relay RED-BLK / RED-GR.

Since it appears AX trip isn't energizing, try putting a 1 on each score reel, increase the ball count position higher than 1, trip the AX relay, and then push the start button to see what actions happen.

Watch which way it normally turns. You can give it a push in that direction and it should take over and move 1/3 turn. DO NOT Try to move it in the reverse direction!!!

You just push the solenoid in by hand, in other words, you're simulating the coil getting voltage. Don't try to turn the wheel itself, you'll break something.

Sorry, read that as Score Motor. Not reel.

As Johninc pointed out, do not try to move it by hand in either direction. In the reverse direction you will bend a small leaf blade that is used to prevent it from backing up with each step.

I'm jumping on Aurichs' band wagon. Went to play ACD tonight, and it didn't want to start. Turn on and it goes straight to tilt. I cussed at the Wizard, then took few steps left and played several awesome games on Strange World (one game was 212340 points). I will look into the ACD on Sunday, no panic tonight.

Pinball a frustratingly fun game!

Hey guys don't feel so bad. I just spent about three hours and the better part of a twelve pack trying to get the 1000 reel on Flipper to hit every time. Finally pulled it off and now the wingnut for the lock down bar is missing. Oh well!!!!!

Hey Aurich, check those fuses and the fuse holders. Just a thought....

So when you press start, does:

- the S relay activate?

Then do any of the following move:
- Subtract Replay unit (this is the credit unit; does it decrement?)
- Reset Ball Count unit (does the Ball Count unit reset to zero?)
- Reset Bonus unit (does the bonus unit reset to zero?)
- Play meter (does it increment?)

Knowing this will really help further isolate.

^^^ What Dirt said

Yes, it's in the lower right side of the backbox. When it's at the Game Over position, its wiper disc is stepped fully to the clockwise position. When the Start relay activates, the coil on top of the Ball Count unit should engage, and the wiper disc should reset all the way back counterclockwise.

The credit unit is also in the backbox, and would need to have a credit on it in order to decrement.

Since the AX relay, Credit Unit, Ball Count unit are all in the backbox, but the Play Meter is on the score motor board and is incrementing, then that suggests the issue lies on the path to the backbox (like the jones plug there). All of those are behind the same two switches (one on S, and score motor 2C). The Play Meter incrementing indicates that those two switches are working, while the rest not working indicate there's an open before reaching there.

Clean and check the jones plugs connector perhaps. A meter is helpful to check if the signal is getting through too.

This might seem simple but have you checked all the tilt switches. I believe on most of the wedge heads they are normally closed. I was used to normaly open ones and opened one on our 2001. Took me forever to figure out I caused the problem of it not starting by opening them.

Here is pic of my ACD. Power off, and zero credits.
DSCN0536.JPG

Missing that shaft screw for sure! The switch can be disassembled and the blades flattened - if you choose to tackle that, be sure to take notes pics on how it went together. Be careful that you notice if wires fall off due to the old solder as it will happen to you at some point. On the last machine I rebuilt - albeit 20 years older than ACD - I had a dozen or so cold joints fall off.

Aurich,

The half moon credit unit isn't going to effect anything other than the ability for the start button on the door to begin the starting of a game ( energizing the Start relay). Since your game does this, its not related to the credit unit.

Its a unique design. The solenoid nearest the backglass steps the number disc clockwise thereby decrementing the number in the window. The other solenoid (closest to the back door) steps the outer "window" disc clockwise thereby displaying the next highest number on the number disc behind it. When they line up over zero, it changes the position of the switch stack (plastic rod moves in or out a bit).

It almost looks like someone forced it a bit too far, maybe to put it into a freeplay mode instead of just properly adjusting the switch to allow the credit button to always work (or simply add a jumper across it).

A screw (if in place), will limit the max credits to certain values (like 1, 3, 5, 7, or 9). If the screw is removed, the max credits will be 19. How 19 when there are only single digits? 10 is represented with an illuminated 0 as is each value greater than 10 (just like 1 through 9). So, one of those leaf switches controls the light that illuminates the half moon plastics.

Wow CactusJack your last para is just so incisive. I had absolutely no idea this was the case-thks.

Here are some more photos showing the cams. The photo with no gap between the cams is at zero credits. The shot with some space is at 1 credit. There should not be any more space than that unless it has been forced apart.

The last shot shows the two cams after it has reached the max limit screw which on this one is set to 9.

Credit at 0.JPG

Credit at 1 switches.JPG

Credit at 1.JPG

Credits at max 9.JPG

What CactusJack said.

The credit unit might be something to look at later, but it's not involved in the problem of getting the game to start the reset sequence. That needs AX to activate...

Have you tried kicking it yet?

ok, don't act on this, as i don't know my way around ems ... but have you checked that the soldered wires to each of the score reels are intact and correct

warning (it likely has NOTHING to do with your issue and they r likely fine ...) but i seem to recall vaguely having a similar issue with one of my machines that the guys here 'in the know' were helping me on ??

sorry i haven't read the full posts and advice or trouble shooting so far ... and don't want to have you create another problem - so lets let the others comment and officially stay 'no' that won't have anything to do with it ...

just ignorantly putting it out there, as i said, on a couple of my machines the solder had let go to a score reel or two as well .. which was contributing to some similar issues .. possibly .. if i recall ... ...

good luck, Ron

you really need to get Abra going so you can play it properly and let all of us who love it know if you do as well

You are on the right track. Disconnected wires is a given to confirm before you consider anything else on a particular component, score reels in this instance. The hundreds score reel switches are the next place you need to go to. There are three states you are looking for. They are the 9 position, the zero position and 1 to 8 (the switches are all the same here) b

Compare the hundreds switches to the thousands switches. The thousands switches are your guide here. You are looking for adequate wipe when they make and adequate gap when they break. Run a point file across the points to lightly refresh the contact surface.

Should all fire together & each stop when it hits zero.

Okay, a Quick recap of the path of power to cause a score reel to reset towards zero on start up:

After the Start Relay (S) has been energized, it pulls in the AX relay armature to latch with a pulse through score motor switch 2C.

AX contains a switch to keep the score motor running since the S relay will drop out after the first score motor cycle is completed.

With the Score motor running, a pulse is continuously generated by a score motor switch at 1A (BLK-WH and Red-Wh). Since the other score reels are resetting, this part of the circuit is fine so far. This includes any connection through the Jones plugs up to the head.

Then, there are 4 individual switches on the AX relay which route those pulses through to the score reel assemblies. This takes the place of the Player unit switches called out in Steve Fury's reset animation linked to above. They all share a Blk-WH wire (or solid jumper). The other wire colors are as follows:

10's: Gr-Red
100's: Br-Red
1000's: Or-Red
10,000: Bl-Red

The above wires then go to the individual score reels to their "run out" switches. These are the one that are supposed to be normally closed at every position except for 0. Not the switch that closes at 9 and not the switch that is closed only at 0.

The run out switch is directly wired to the score reel step up solenoid.

So, with the condition you currently get (Reset sequence starts but two score reels don't advance while two others do), get out that trusty Alligator Jumper lead and first jumper across the switch on the AX relay (see wire colors above) and see if one of the dead score reels begins to pulse. If it does not, then move your jumper to the run out switch called out above (same wire colors as the AX relay switches). They actually share the same wire color on both sides of the switch with the one going directly to the score reel solenoid. While a simple swipe with an ignition file and visual inspection for proper gap is all that is normally required, the jumper will definitively rule out or find a malfunctioning switch in this manner.

With all 4 score reels sitting at zero, a series of 4 normally open "reset" switches (also refered to as zero position switch) should be closed and will complete the circuit to trip (relax) the AX relay through a pulse from score motor switch 2B (Or-Wh / Red-Wh). This pulse occurs at the very end of the score motor cycle after the 5 pulses from 1A have been sent to try to step the score reels towards zero. If one or more reels are not at zero (or the switches are not making contact or there is a broken wire or cold solder), the score motor will continue to turn to send more pulses through the AX relay switches. This will go on forever until all four score reels signal they have made it to zero through their reset switches.

Amen, CactusJack. Excellent.

(Think you mean the zero position switches though, not the runout?)

Nope, well, not exactly..... When I can, I try to be as accurate as possible (and that doesn't happen often enough....). In this era, Gottlieb refers to them as both Run Out AND Reset switches (right on the schematic). It is basically the same as a zero position switch. Not sure which is best used when describing them. If I were to say "zero position switch", someone would probably come back and say: "I can't locate a zero position switch on the schematic. Are you sure you even know what you are talking about?" LOL

The Run out is used to control the reset pulses to the score reel solenoid. The Reset switch is used in series to trip the AX relay. So, yes, I was a bit wrong in refering to THOSE, as run out switches.

And yes, Aurich, I am feeling much better today. It seems to be a never ending battle of the kids brining home bugs and I am always the last (lucky) one to come down with them.

BTW, you should get your Schematic today, I popped it in the mail yesterday AM.

Thank you Dirtflipper for pointing out my error . I have edited the original post for clarity.

Stays lit, both sets of roll overs are connected. Does the upper or lower 4 act the same way?

For the half moon credit units I find that a jumper arrangement is easiest over trying to bend the switch closed. Use a set of these to make the jumper connection which then makes it easily reversible. You can get these at Radio Shack.
Jumper Leads.jpg

Number roll overs are often a strange thing on Gottliebs since they typically used a "series" relay to control the points scoring. So, when you look at the schematic, you will find the 4B relay as well as the Q relay coil. The 4B is a trip bank relay coil on the sequence relay bank more than likely mounted under the playfield. The buzzing you hear is more than likely the coil which indicates it IS getting power. Its just not mechanically tripping, or it has tripped but isn't moving enough to change the state of the leaf switches it controls.

The first thing to look at is actually all about how the trip bank is mounted. They are mounted with 2 bolts and 2 wing nuts. This allows you to loosen them and swing them out for service. BUT, if it isn't fully seated in the mounting brakets, the bank can become twisted and the relay armatures don't move correctly. So, before you do anything else, locate the wing nuts, loosen them and then push the bank back fully into the grooves and then tighten down both wing nuts and test again.

You can repeatedly reset the trip bank with the main large coil on the side and then try re-tripping the relays. But be carefull as the sequence bank reset coil, as well as the drop target coils are runing on 120VAC. On a Gottlieb of this era, the plastic insulated wiring is used everywhere there is 120VAC. So be aware of that when adjusting and clean switches with plastic wire other than that used for short jumpers.

On the underside of the playfield there is a "sequence bank". If the one the roll overs is not working then look at the contacts below the said roll over. The sequence bank controls the roll overs and the Bonus Unit. Relay Q may need an adjustment.

CactusJack got there before me, + on CactusJack.

CactusJack said:
"You can repeatedly reset the trip bank with the main large coil on the side and then try re-tripping the relays. But be carefull as the sequence bank reset coil, as well as the drop target coils are running on 120VAC. On a Gottlieb of this era, the plastic insulated wiring is used everywhere there is 120VAC".

It is this type of information CactusJack which is invaluable and never leaves the mind-it is also potentially life saving. Thks for the post.

Its just you. The design worked for God knows how many years until they switched to using wedge base bulbs elsewhere.

Turn the power off, grab a very small allen wrench. Stick it down the side, rotate it 90 degrees and lift up, thereby bending the spring tab upward to increase the tension on the base of the bulb. If you really think it needs it, you can also pinch the sides in a bit to steady the bulb. One of those cleaning sticks may also help but the increased tension usually does it for me.