I have 7 EMs. 4 Gottlieb, 2 Williams, 1 Bally.

Here's my Williams Triple Action. In excellent condition. Up for sale right now on eBay. I need to make room for another project.

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Here's a few of my others.

Gottlieb Royal Guard. This was a complete restoration.

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Here it is as it was when I bought it.

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Williams Ding Dong. Cabinet repainted and repro backglass

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Gottlieb Top Card. Getting ready to do a playfield swap thanks to Adam Kovalsky

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Top Card PF.JPG

Bally Surfers. First game I ever owned, got it in 1971. Cabinet has some paint starting to flake but other wise still good. Playfield looks like the day it was made.

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I've also got a Big Indian and a Bank A Ball that I need to get some better pictures of.

Vic, do you still have that Hot Line? When I first got that Surfers in 1971, a buddy of mine got a Hot Line. We played the hell out of both games. It's on my "sentimental value" list if I can ever find one nearby.

I'd have thought I died and went to heaven if I ever just got to play that wedgehead collection. Just outstanding.

No, I never have.

I believe we talked back earlier this year when I put the Williams Triple Action up for sale.

I think Gottlieb used those in these games because a lot of them were EM versions of SS games and the coils with the diodes were needed on the SS games and they had them around. Even with the bridge rectifiers, they're not needed on EM games. I have had Williams EM games with bridge rectified DC power and there were no diodes on the coils.

I played Show Boat a lot back in the day. That flipper arrangement took some getting used to.

Here's a few of mine. A Williams River Boat that I just bought from a friend, a Bally Surfers that was the first game I got way back in 1971, and a Gottlieb Pinball Pool I'm in the middle of restoring. I know, not an EM, but those Sys 1 Gottliebs were almost a hybrid game. Plus, it's basically a remake of Hot Shot with some added features that make it a nice player.

In the corner, you can just see a couple of my others-Williams Ding Dong and Gottlieb Top Card. Surfers-RB1-801.jpgSurfers-RB2-581.jpgPP-366.jpg

I had a shot at a Skill Pool, would have needed some resto, but still a really cool game. Got away from me. I really like those reverse wedgeheads, and some really good players in there. Big Daddy is another. Williams games in general, and specifically from the 60s, are some very underrated games.

I previously posted a picture of my extremely nice River Boat that I got from a friend. The only things that needed to be done were a repaint of the front panel, repainting the wooden rails on the playfield, and a general shining up of the front. Recently accomplished all those things. This is such a great game.

Also, my newest purchase, a Williams Triple Strike. bgresto to the rescue on the glass, and a cab repaint is in the future, it's fairly rough. But the playfield is in very nice shape and the game plays well.

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That Bank A Ball looks pretty good...

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A few of the Triple Strike I restored

It was my first try with using the film you clued me in on, boilerman. I could have picked an easier one for the first use of the film. Those constant curves of the pins are just a real dog to do. Impossible to free hand and make them look good.

Our friend Lee suggested that I use French curves and that worked a lot better, but you still have to move the curves around a lot to get the bends correct, or close to correct. I'm pretty happy with it, it's running, just one adjustment needed to get it 100 percent.

Now on to DAC. I'm sure the stencils will be better for that game, seeing as how they were made by an expert instead of by me...

That's a bgresto glass, btw. I'm pretty happy with it. The score reels bulbs show through a bit but other than that, it's pretty darned good. Much better than the trashed glass that was in the game, and that glass will never be screened, I'm sure.

Steve Azzam did a nice job with it. The game is just different from a lot of EM games with the blue base instead of the off white. Pretty nice artwork on it. Fun game to play, there is good strategy to it.

I don't know that it's a forever keeper, but I'll keep it around quite awhile I think.

Nice to live in the Land 'O' Plenty. Nice games.

If one shows up around here, someone will want two grand for it, and it's probably trashed.

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Here's a couple of shots of the Hot Line I got this weekend. It's the third and final game of the games I played most as a kid. Playfield is very good, glass has some minor flaking but has been sealed. I'll try and touch it up, will eventually get a bgresto. Cab will be repainted.

What about originality?

You do wonder why they just used a white base over and over and over again. The games that don't have it stand out.

I've owned a Williams Triple Action and a Bally Odds and Evens that had non white base coats on them. I currently own a Williams Triple Strike that I've done a complete cab repaint on.

We can argue the merits of game play all day long, but those games just stood out due to the different color scheme. I'm not sure TA's artwork was all that great, but the artwork on Odds and Evens was beautiful, both the playfield and the cab, and the colors were great. It wasn't a great player but man, it was a great game to just stand and look at. And it had a backglass on it that was just perfect.

Like all of them, there's always a small twinge of regret at selling it, but you can't keep them all...

It should be a pinball rule that you're not allowed to own multiples of the same game. You should be forced to sell to those who are less fortunate...

That game is now at the top of my want list. The only issue is, I'm out of room and have to move something, and I don't know what I'd move. I have an idea, but going to be a tough decision.

I'm not big on multi players but that is one great game.

I've owned them in the past. I had Surf Champ, and I had Big Indian, and I sold them both. I liked them both, but I just decided to concentrate more on single players. I'm usually the only one playing my games, so the allure of multiplayers isn't that great for me. I will say, for multiplayers, I thought both of them were very good games, especially Surf Champ. That one I regret a bit. Big Indian, to me, wasn't as good a player-it wasn't bad, but not great. It was kind of beaten up, backglass was not good, I bought it totally non working and got it going in short order and then got my money out of it, so it was good for that if nothing else.

I do own a multiplayer-Pinball Pool. I know it's SS, but System 1 Gottlieb games are about as close to EM play in an SS that you can find. Outside of the score displays and the beep/boop electronic score sounds, the play is basically EM with DC power. Hell, the early System 1 games even still had the EM chimes.

Top Card could be in the conversation, but there's a major hitch-I just sprung for a playfield restoration for it. I like the game that much. After I do the swap, it's going to be a keeper, for me, for a long time. I'll never get out of it what I've got in it, but that's ok, I rarely get games with the idea of what I can get out of them down the line. It's a hobby, hobbies cost money, it's not a business. If I sell a game and make money, great. If I lose some, that's ok too. It's about the game and the hobby to me.

Triple Strike isn't necessarily the best player of the group, but it's a pretty darned good game, and the features are pretty cool with the extra ball capability and the bonus holdover feature. I need to up the high score levels on mine, it's a bit too easy right now. I put a lot of time and effort into the total restoration of it and that makes it hard, at least for me, to let go real easily.

Thanks for the comments on the games. Surfers is a really fun player, it's fairly rare given that they made less than 1000 of them. The artwork is great, it plays superbly. Someday I might restore the cab on it but for now it's good enough that I'm just leaving it alone. When I finish one of my restores I might store it away for awhile, but it will never leave.

Good luck finding a Surfers. With the low production number they're pretty rare.

The answer to your question is easy. Grand Prix. After that, it's a tossup between Jet Spin and Surf Champ (which as noted I already owned and somewhat regret selling) and after that, maybe a 60s Gottlieb multiplayer.

Question. It doesn't look like it from the picture on Herb's site, but does the game have black spatter on it?

Mine, with the original paint, does. Spatter, and here and there a web or two.

Whoever owned mine prior to me buying it painted a lot of the white on the front of the cab black. The rest is as it came from the factory, minus a touchup or two that I have done. I'm not sure how that happened because I got the game from an operator in 1971. I never met the actual operator, just the guy selling the game.

I used to think I liked all the chrome that Herb does. Then I worked on a game for a guy that had a Herb restored game and I kind of changed my mind. It's just a bit much for me. Too bright. Bright nickel is much better, much warmer. If I replate anything, that's what it gets from me.

Never. If I was ever in dire straits financially is about the only way it would ever happen.

God forbid it ever does, but if it ever happened, I'll let you know you can buy it.

I can't think of a game I want bad enough to let it go. Not for a Grand Prix, Jacks Open or even any of the Williams reverse wedgeheads.

Not because it's such a great player, although I think it's very good. It just has tons of sentimental value to me, along with the fact that I like the play.

Since you're in a Bally mood, here's a few of an Odds and Evens I restored. It was almost a complete playfield repaint, and it was so extensive and taxed my meager skills so much I've sworn off ever doing another playfield repaint. I'm fine with cab repaints and extensive mechanical work, and I'll touch them up, but this one just wore me out. It was cleared with polycrylic. I sold it a couple of years ago. One shot has bit of the Surfers in it. restored apron.jpgOE roulette damage before.jpgOE diamonds after clear.jpgOE roulette full after.jpgOE playfield after.jpgOE left sling before.jpgcenter pf after.jpgcompleted in place.jpgOE odds kickout before 2.jpg

And a plug for Evaporust. This is the upper glass frame piece before it took a bath in Evaporust. I don't have an after, but it came out about like the lockdown bar receiver in the pictures. And the lockdown bar receiver was about as rusty as this was.

This game looked like it had been in a flood. Every single stepper unit in the backbox has extensive rust all over the frames of each. But they still worked. Perfectly. So much for Bally is crap. This game was abused but it still played when I got it. It had straw and weeds and all kinds of crap inside it, the playfield was a disaster, but still it played. I eventually took them all apart and they got the bath too.

In the Evaporust thread guys claimed that if you didn't treat them after the bath, the rust would return quickly. It never did. Not on this one, on the Royal Guard I finished a couple of years ago, the Pinball Pool I finished last year, none of them.

It's not at all a great player, but I put so much time and effort into doing it (the first restore I did) that it was hard for me to sell it. It's a great looker, not a great player. The glass was almost mint. But I wanted something else and it was time to move it on. I learned a ton doing that game, thoughOE glass frame rust before.jpg

I don't, I'm sorry. I just checked all my cards for Surfer. I didn't think there would be one, that game was before they started stealing games for each quarter, that happened in the 70s. Any card I had for Odds and Evens went with the game.

You might not believe this, but check with PBR. Steve had a complete card set for Surfers. It wasn't cheap but I bought it. It has cards even for games that had the extra ball feature that had to be added on-you had to install an extra relay to have that feature and I don't have it on mine, just straight replay. He might have a card set for Fireball. It was popular enough.

I got it in St. Joe. The cab wasn't that bad, really, but the internals in the head especially were extremely rusty. The stuff in the cab wasn't as bad. I got it around 5 years ago.

I'm just exaggerating, I'm sure it's not the same game, but it was definitely kept somewhere extremely damp. My guess is it sat somewhere in a barn or something, with the back door off, maybe the front door open, who knows. If these games could talk.

The glass was mint though. It had one tiny little scratch on it. The glass is basically why I bought it. I only gave a couple hundred for it and I figured if nothing else, I could get some money out of the glass. Then I dove into that playfield and there was no turning back.

I sold it a couple years ago to a guy up in Nebraska, and I used the money from that to buy a Big Indian.

Where did you get that JO glass?

That's my mistake, it's kind of dim and it didn't look at first like the original glass to me. Sorry about that.

I took a few of the current lineup.

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Ding Dong is totally restored. River Boat is all original except for a repainted front panel.

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Pinball Pool and Surfers have new glasses, and PP's playfield has been touched up and cleared. Cabs are original.

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Royal Guard and Triple Strike are complete restorations, including new backglasses.

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I wish I had more room. Top Card and Hot Line are stored and Drop A Card is undergoing restoration. Here's the score motor before and after cleanup. DAC motor before.jpg

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And a couple for Rat...

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Aye aye, sir...

I've always thought it was a cool glass, and I like that a large portion of it is illuminated. Some backglasses have very limited illuminated parts. Most of this one is.

I had a repro made and I sold the original glass, which had some flaking here and there, to a dude in Norway. He wanted that glass bad. I made a crate to ship it in. Cost about $350 to FedEx it to Norway.

No, I had Surfers reproduced, not the Wiggler. Wasn't by bgresto, they didn't exist at the time.

Hard to believe that game is original. Looks like it just came out of the box.

Here's my Top Card playfield that HSA is doing for me. I'll do the playfield swap when I get it back.

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It's a used playfield that I bought from Adam Kovalski and HSA restored it.

I replaced all the inserts prior to sending it to them. Fun job.

Since I got ridiculous with the score motor I continued on to the ball count unit. I'm working on the trip bank now but not going quite this far.

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Take 'em apart. Only way. On the trip bank I'm only taking off the activator plate that is pulled in by the coil, and the arm that comes down to move the switches. I took the reset arm off, and also removed the coil. You can unscrew the switch stacks but I'm leaving those on, just cleaning those in place with a Dremel tool and wire brush.

The only issue with the score motors is the switch stacks sometimes have those connecting wires between stacks. On the last one I did I broke one, just soldered it back together. I'm pretty sure it's good, I'll know for sure when the game is finished.

To keep this going, here's my finished Drop A Card motor board. Removed all components, sanded the board, disassembled, cleaned and polished the motor, ball count unit, trip bank (partially) and all relays. New labels made. I ever removed and polished up the brackets for the transformer.

And just to prove I'm not totally obsessed, no, I did not put the harness in the washing machine.

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Thanks! I'm getting closer to pulling out your stencils and giving them a go. Need to finish the cab base painting and get the webbing on, and then I'm off to the races.

Way more than I should. Maybe 10 or so total, possibly more.

Pretty amazing what a flash will do, huh? It's not really that shiny, but it sure looks it in that picture.

It cleaned up pretty nicely, though.

Certainly not original...

Here's the head and cab of the Drop A Card I'm doing. Base coat and webbing done. Graphics will be done hopefully soon.

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Clay's Weiler brush method. I don't have an air gun so that's what I use.

I don't use the full brush. I bend about 4 of the bristles away from the rest. I then put the paint on those, not too heavy, hold the brush very close to the cab, bend those four bristles back, and let it fly. You'll get a touch of spattering here and there, but for the most part, you get the webs. The places where the webbing is a bit darker than other places is where I got a bit too much paint on the bristles. Turning the brush to different angles puts the webbing on at the corresponding angle.

It took me about half an hour or so to do the entire cab.

Just takes some practice.

The paint is plain old Americana black. Nothing fancy.

It took a bit of practice to find the right technique. To be honest, I just lucked onto it. I was standing too far away and it would just blob onto the surface. I just move up close to this piece of cardboard I was practicing with and bingo, I found it.

There are some games though that I'll be working on that are spattered, not webbed, so I've got that technique down too

Double post

I assume these two are for sale?

Probably so. I was just wondering about the propriety of a business using this place as an advertising vehicle, since we aren't allowed to try and sell our own games in regular threads on this board.

You mean like the above

I found out about the sale rule. The problem with the rule is, the marketplace is overfull and games get lost, and the thread linking it to the market can't be replied to and eventually falls off the page.

Opps, misread PBR's website. As Emily Litella would say, "Never mind..."

Bless you, my child...

I never web them at all, and they look fine.

Here's a couple of shots of my Grand Prix I got last weekend. I've cleaned the playfield and did some touchups-Man, this game has a ton of inserts. Need to do some spot clearing and wax it. Will get a new backglass from bgresto. Cab is in pretty decent shape, backbox not quite as good but still not bad. Plays really, really fast.

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What happened to the lockdown bar? Looks like a semi ran over it.

You're right. I blew the picture up and it is duct tape.

It's not that simple. Someone did a really lousy job there of trying to repaint that game. Hopefully you can get it straightened out.

Here's a few shots of my Drop A Card. Complete restoration, someone had sanded off all the paint and stained the cab, I guess to make it look like furniture. Looked like crap instead.

This was a full restoration, including taking it completely apart (including the score motor) and cleaning and polishing the whole thing. Thanks to Boilerman who had already made the stencils, since I had nothing to go on to make my own, and also Ron Webb for an absolutely stunning backglass. And also to PBR for liberating me of way more money than I should have spent on this.

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Here's where it was when I started (had to replace the bottom, it was trashed).

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Ken? Me no Ken.

But thanks anyway!

I've seen that video several times, and I've still yet to figure out what in the world he thinks he's accomplishing with that bizarre plunge shot. Just weird.

For all the cussing and "Thank you very much" bombs that get dropped, the only thing of note in the entire video was that he managed to shake the ball out of the outlane one time.

It takes all kinds to make the world go around and that video is certainly proof of it.

Legend?

Uhh, ok.

I kept playing a few years after, but once the video games came out that was pretty much it for me. I liked the early SS ok, despite the lack of reels and all the other sounds of an EM you grow up on, but I never really got used to them. When they started with all the ramps and the different level playfields and all the other stuff, that was it for me.

I've played a few DMDs, some I like ok, some I don't, but the problem to me is you just can't play one of them for the first time and be able to figure what you need to do. EMs were easy to figure out, but far from easy to conquer.

I thought when the Retro King of Diamonds came out that would be something cool, but then I played it. It was a great idea and they executed it as well as they could, but even though it might look like one, it's not an EM. It doesn't play like one. It doesn't feel like one. It doesn't sound like one.

I haven't played a Whoa Nellie, and unfortunately I'm not sure that even if I had the money/space for it, it would be allowed in the house. I mean, she's far from a prude, but that game is just really in your face with it. I'd love it, she probably would not.

Someone stuck Williams flippers on it.

I'll admit I bought a pair of them off eBay awhile back and put them in a game where they weren't original, but at least it was a Williams 60s pin I did it to.

I once asked Steve Young this very question.

He was emphatic, even for Steve, that double ringing this style of flipper was not correct.

That's been my experience with the flyers also. Between that and Steve, I'm staying with one. Plus, the flipper has one groove.

But it's your game, your choice.

I really doubt you'll see any differences, but it is not going to hurt anything.

Two inch flipper games are a true measuring stick.

I finally got my Atlantis on Wednesday thanks to fellow Pinsider jdoz2. It's in pretty good shape. Backglass is excellent, just one small flake on the fish above the score reels. Playfield has a bit of speckling and just a touch of graining but I think I can clean it up nicely. Needs new plastics and a front door for sure. I'll probably just clean it up and play it awhile, then maybe next summer it will get a restoration. Cab isn't bad but I'd like to really make this one perfect. Due to that, Wade Krause's playfield probably will be going in when it become available.

I'll get some pictures up when I can.

Here's my Atlantis after some playfield cleaning, shop out and touch ups. I'm not quite done with the touchups. I'm going to try and touch up the drops, if it doesn't work, I'll replace those too.

I'll move on now to cleaning up the rest of the game. For now I'm just going to clean it up and play it. A full restoration of the cab might come later this year.

Still have to rebuild the flippers and bumpers and touch up under the mylar platters. Typical wear under there and as you can see the mylar is toast.

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Well, I did say "might."

It's not quite as nice when you see it up close. It's not horrible, and I might be able to get by with some touchups to the cab.

I'm definitely going to do something with the coin door though. It's a wreck. Been kicked and bent or something, but I don't want to put one of Steve's repros on it, because I think it will look out of place. It wouldn't on a full restore, but if I leave the cab alone, well, it would really stand out. I have an older door shell I'm going to try and shine up, but it's the version with the start button in the wrong place.

Anyone have a door shell they want to sell me?

That's LA. You could sell a tent there for $200k. The prices are completely and utterly ridiculous. I love LA, but I'll never live there due to the crazy real estate prices. They're worse than the traffic.

Lately? Lately?

My brother in law moved to LA in 1989. We went out to visit him in 1990. He showed us a house that he looked at. It was literally a concrete block house that probably was 1000 sq ft. They wanted $300k for it. In 1989.

He came home to KC while we were building our house and brought a friend with him. This was again in 1989. They came and looked at our house. It's about 3000 sq ft with the finished basement. His friend thought it was a mansion.

I truly don't know how people can live in LA proper. My bro in law has a great job but not everyone out there does. It's just nuts.

Here's my recently purchased Abra Ca Dabra with my Top Card that I just finished a playfield swap on. I'll get more pictures of both later. The ACD is original, I have to fix the missing chunk of veneer but other than that it's really, really nice. Even the original drop targets are still in fine shape with just a touch of wear.

The TC playfield is an HSA restoration that really came out nice. Game plays fast and smooth with that playfield in it. acd_and_tc_(resized).jpg

Here's a few more. I've removed the incorrect post below the flippers that someone installed. Have to fix that also. I don't know what that white blob is on the playfield picture, it's not on the playfield. I must have put something on the glass when I took that picture.

There were flashers behind the eyes. I thought it might make for a cool effect to have red bulbs there. I've got red 44s that I used and it looks really great. acdplayfield_(resized).jpgacdoverall_(resized).jpgacdhead_(resized).jpg

Yeah, I knew the flashers were correct, but I just thought I'd try it and see how it looks. Easy enough to change back. But I really liked them. I could put flashing red LEDs in there but I really don't want to do that.

I've already removed it, but haven't done the repair yet.

I had a shot at one of these a year or two ago. Would have been a total restoration, but it would have been a nice game. By the time I finally made up my mind I'd missed it.

I've got a River Boat. Great original condition. Those reverse wedgeheads were some great players, and tough to beat. I've got three 60s Williams games and I think they're all really good players.

Vic, how in the world do you ever work on those games if one of them has an issue? Just removing the glass looks like it would be an adventure

Agree on the two inch flipper game.

I'll go with Atlantis on the three inch games.

No such thing as 100 percent wax. Pure carnauba is as hard as a brick. May not have cleaners, but it's not all wax.

Here's my current lineup. The ACD and Atlantis are original but touched up. The Top Card and Royal Guard are restored.

My Williams St games are restored (Ding Dong) and original (River Boat)

The rest are currently stored or undergoing restoration. 20160227_155704_(resized).jpg20160227_155656_(resized).jpg