(Topic ID: 35888)

EM Pinball machine- NIB

By o-din

11 years ago


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    #1 11 years ago

    No, I don't have one, but after seeing some of the recent offerings from todays manufacturers,I started thinking. What if somebody were to produce a brand new EM machine (complete with score reels, bells, and all the other beautiful things that were left behind in the late 70s). Not a flashy electronic eyesore based on the latest superhero, marketed to buyitnow soccermoms, but a classic with real style. I'd like one with an up-post, rollover buttons, and that spinner that really gets the bells ringing! If it was affordable (by todays market), say under $4000, would you buy it, and what features would you like to see? Detroit has had no problem selling recreations of classic cars, I don't see why pinball should be any different.

    #2 11 years ago

    It's already been done...I think it's King of Diamonds. I'll try to find it

    Then again it's a remake...

    #3 11 years ago

    I think you'd have to come in under $3000 to really sell any volume.....even that might be pushing it.

    Just too many good DMD games in the $1500-$3000 range to be buying a new EM (IMHO).

    #4 11 years ago

    I've wondered the same thing as well o-din. I don't like the modern machines at all. They look great and all but I feel like I'm going to have a seizure when I try to play the modern games with all the lights, mulit-level, multi-ball, excessive electronic noise and game speed that's bordering on ridiculously fast for the average human.

    The remake of King of Diamonds is very cool. But it is a remake.

    I like some of the custom re-themed machines that have been done. This guy does amazing work;
    http://www.gameroompinball.com/

    Saw Whoa Nellie at Michigan Pinball Expo last year, the best looking pin I've ever seen. Greg Freres was their and spoke. He was a long time Bally artist and super nice person;
    http://whizbangpinball.blogspot.com/

    But as you stated how about something new. It has to be cost effective to build and must be a design that wasn't explored in the 1940's-1970's. What theme hasn't been explored already (beyond Hollywood and music)? How cheaply can a game be done? Using an electronics board as the King of Diamonds remake is a smart idea, simplifies and reduces cost versus a full electro-mechanical. But even $4k is expensive. Can it be done for $2k-$3k?

    Would you buy a brand new EM style pin for $2k or would you pick up that gem of an EM you've always wanted from the 60's or 70's that is on Craig's list for $500-$1,000?

    #5 11 years ago
    Quoted from Monster_Bash:

    It's already been done. (Gottlieb King Of Diamonds - remake)

    Yes and No.

    This looks like an EM but is an SS based system which is a very good system by the way, just not EM.

    Also these guys were not truly successful and sold only 100 machines that took a few years to sell and are no longer making these which is sad as if they were successful they certainly would have made more titles which was the closest thing you could get to an EM currently.

    Quoted from o-din:

    If it was affordable (by todays market), say under $4000, would you buy it, and what features would you like to see? Detroit has had no problem selling recreations of classic cars, I don't see why pinball should be any different.

    I think $4000.00 may be feasible for parts alone but I am not current with costs of that type of production. Wiring, Relays, Switches, Bells, and Score Wheels would not be a problem but Steppers,Score Motors, and wiring harnesses might be as they were all set up different. If someone could design a universal Stepper/Score motor/wiring harness then I think that would be the key.

    The hardest part to me would be figuring out the Ruleset of the game and then applying the electrical functionality of it to the game IMO. You need folks who truly understand how to put this together and at the same time make it fun if it is a new title. Also do you use old technology from one of the big 3 manufactures of the EM era or design your own or intertwine the technology?

    An idea to cut costs if someone was to entertain this idea of a NIB EM may be to sell it as a kit to keep costs down which would also appeal to the true pinball project guys such as myself. You assemble the wood cabinet/head, Cabinet Relays would be compete and you just solder the wiring harness to the switches, etc to them. You assemble the Playfield completely as well which would have all artwork and clearcoating done already from the factory.

    If you could work out all of the details on how to put the whole package together it sure would be nice huh? I would like to see it happen but...................................

    The reality is trying to sell it. It will not happen anytime in the near future or maybe not at all because as long as people can buy project EM games for $200-$500 they are not going to pay $4000 for a NIB EM as most pinball folks tend to be frugal in this regard IMO.

    EM's would have to get to the point that it costs $1500.00 or more in the U.S. for a project EM which is most likely 25 years from now or more because of supply (still plenty) and demand (low) and most of the people who are interested and grew up with these types of machines like myself sadly will no longer be around to see it IMHO.

    The bottom line IMO is to enjoy and try to save the EM's we have now from the dumpsters because once they are gone, they may well truly be gone for good.

    Ken

    #6 11 years ago
    Quoted from EM-PINMAN:

    The bottom line IMO is to enjoy and try to save the EM's we have now from the dumpsters because once they are gone, they may well truly be gone for good.

    Well said!

    #7 11 years ago
    Quoted from EM-PINMAN:

    The bottom line IMO is to enjoy and try to save the EM's we have now from the dumpsters because once they are gone, they may well truly be gone for good.

    Yes, I definitely have a couple of DMDs that I won't mind replacing with a few more EMs, Just finding nice ones around here is a challenge. Anybody got a Bingo Bango?

    #8 11 years ago

    You are correct EM-Pinman, someone needs to come up with a "Save the EM's" t-shirt.

    True EM games with score motors and relay logic will never be made again as the cost to manufacture and assemble is way to high when compared to an electronics board.

    #9 11 years ago

    Breakshot was a modern interpretation of EM game play. I'm not sure you could get much closer to true EM for a reasonable price. I would guess that most of the hardware to run an EM would be specialty at this point, and therefore expensive. But I think a game like Breakshot could come in under $3000 today, especially if you skipped the DMD.

    #10 11 years ago
    Quoted from rancegt:

    Breakshot was a modern interpretation of EM game play.

    You know, I was going to mention Breakshot in my original post. Have that game, love that game, so retro. Back to the days when you only needed a couple of inches between the playfield and the glass.

    #11 11 years ago

    I'd like to own a Breakshot, it's just a little too mature for my house. I always look when they're for sale and think about it though. With so few specialty parts, it shouldn't be too big a project to make a similar game new. I think the challenging thing would be finding a good reason to spend money on a new EM when there are so many old EM's around.

    #12 11 years ago
    Quoted from rancegt:

    it shouldn't be too big a project to make a similar game new.

    That would work for me, a simple machine with style and a lot of the features that EM owners have grown to love, without the pricetag and flash of some of these other machines today.

    #13 11 years ago
    Quoted from Monster_Bash:

    It's already been done...I think it's King of Diamonds.

    Not really the same Its kinda like a Camaro throwback Looks similar outside but lift the hood Light years apart.

    Would actually prefer a Heathkit type w/real old school internal guts would be the ticket plus the leaf switching is not a big deal if done today. Cheaper to build IMO

    I would buy one if that were the case but if done like the KOD No thanks!

    #14 11 years ago
    Quoted from EM-PINMAN:

    This looks like an EM but is an SS based system which is a very good system by the way, just not EM.

    Well put Exactly the same thinking as me.

    #15 11 years ago
    Quoted from Pin-it:

    Would actually prefer a Heathkit type w/real old school internal guts would be the ticket

    It would be a rewarding project!

    #16 11 years ago

    I hate to say this but if the more expensive parts were made overseas I bet you could make a kit made inexpensively with the option of upgrading some parts that are made in the USA (maybe PBR)
    A water applied decal for the playfield ,lay some clear over it ,for the backglass a high quality paper in between a pair of thin glass.

    Pre-made harness w/quick connects for easy hook-up(bottom of playfield w/ schematic type map written right on it for the parts desc/wire termination, basically color coded /numbered for a non complicated project , except if you want to do more on your end maybe assemble the connectors?
    But it must utilize leaf switches/relays all the mechanical traits of old.
    Of course well written directions not interpeted by a foreign country is a +.

    Quoted from o-din:

    It would be a rewarding project!

    Absolutely^^^^

    #17 11 years ago

    the good thing about EMs are the durability factors
    you dont need a diode to pertect everthing,
    good for far off places with limited resources
    of electronic replacement parts etc.

    I like the idea of a modern EM as long as it stays true to form
    Stepper motors, open air relays/SWs ,analog score reels, etc etc
    Keep the ICs & transistors out of them

    #18 11 years ago
    Quoted from Monster_Bash:

    It's already been done...I think it's King of Diamonds. I'll try to find it
    » YouTube video
    Then again it's a remake...

    I actually came across a new KOD in the wild at Broncos in Omaha. Back in November. I was so excited to play it until I actually played it. It didn't feel EM at all. I like the modern "reliability" added to the game and how it can be a four player game with only one set of score reels, but that is about it. The score reels are practically silent and the Roto-Target is equally silent. I immediately felt like I was playing it on the PinballArcade platform. Everything felt digital even though it looked analog. THE BIGGEST TURN OFF BY FAR WAS THIS...the quality of the game was not at all what I expected. The playfield art is actually a decal (much to my surprise) and it was buckling up badly. So badly in fact that the ball would hang up on it to the point where I had to shake the game to the point of tilting in one instance. Needless to say, I was very disappointed with my first impression of this reincarnation of KOD.

    IMO a NIB EM would have to be a true EM and not just look like it. Love the idea. Hope someone figures it out someday.

    #19 11 years ago
    Quoted from o-din:

    If it was affordable (by todays market), say under $4000, would you buy it, and what features would you like to see?

    I'd pass. I've wondered the same thing, though.

    Quoted from o-din:

    Just finding nice ones around here is a challenge.

    That's for sure. I rarely find a game where the playfield, backglass and cabinet are all in good shape. My games with great playfields have flaking backglasses and vice versa. My latest project machine has a water damaged cabinet and some peeling on the playfield, but the backglass is flawless.... weird.

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