(Topic ID: 117276)

Elaut USA, Inc.


By JerseyJack

4 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 512 posts
  • 183 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by vireland
  • Topic is favorited by 16 Pinsiders

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    There are 512 posts in this topic. You are on page 9 of 11.
    #401 3 years ago
    Quoted from Captain_Kirk:

    The biggest problem is that we don't even know if JJP is financially solvent anymore.

    Since he's stock piling parts for Hobbit, I suspect he is.

    LTG : )

    #402 3 years ago
    Quoted from statsdoc:

    With all due respect, commenting is the wrong thing to do even when you are completely innocent. Do a Google search on this. It is clear that comments will do nothing but harm you and can't really help in any way.
    I would suggest that we respect Jack and let this play out in the court rather than create a lynch mob here. Speculation is pretty idiotic when you have no concrete information to speculate from.
    If there is something there, the court will find it; if not, then there is nothing to see.

    Exactly! Same as when you are arrested - your innocence is irrelevant, you don't talk to the cops at all!

    #403 3 years ago
    Quoted from Captain_Kirk:

    The biggest problem is that we don't even know if JJP is financially solvent anymore.

    Before or after!!!

    #404 3 years ago
    Quoted from Captain_Kirk:

    The biggest problem is that we don't even know if JJP is financially solvent anymore.

    We also don't know if Captain_Kirk is solvent. Let's get to the important questions. Sir, do you walk like a duck?

    #405 3 years ago

    Good grief, the last few pages of posts are like beating a dead horse. Nobody knows anything, and until things run their course through the court system, everything is pure just speculation.

    #406 3 years ago
    Quoted from DaveH:

    We also don't know if Captain_Kirk is solvent. Let's get to the important questions. Sir, do you walk like a duck?

    I'm quite solvent. I don't walk like a duck. I can smell bullshit a mile away.

    11
    #407 3 years ago
    Quoted from LTG:

    Since he's stock piling parts for Hobbit, I suspect he is.
    LTG : )

    Is he posting pics of that? He should.

    #408 3 years ago
    Quoted from 2RustyBalls:

    Before or after!!!

    Take your pick!

    #409 3 years ago
    Quoted from Aurich:

    Is he posting pics of that? He should.

    Agreed. Would be happy to see that.

    The silence is deafening. Too many failed boutiques lately. The well is getting poisoned.

    #410 3 years ago

    $1.6M by Christmas!

    #411 3 years ago
    Quoted from Aurich:

    Is he posting pics of that? He should.

    Yeah, should totally take a page from Jared's Stern representation of late.

    #412 3 years ago
    Quoted from Rick432:

    Sour grapes anyone?

    It seems odd that "corporations" would have "feelings" in this respect. What's also odd is usually these things are routinely discovered and they never see the light of day because it doesn't reflect positively on the plaintiff either, that they're so unorganized they could allow such a thing to happen over such a long period of time. And are they suing the accounting firm for malpractice as well?

    I have family who work for major accounting firms. I've seen situations where the auditors discover scary stuff like this and then excuse themselves from the account rather than expose it. There's definitely an inherent conflict of interest in paying a company to certify that your books are legit. I don't know what the solution to that is, but I am under the impression this is very common.

    As others have said, the real issue is whether JJP has the resources to continue. It's a crazy time in this industry with so many producers involved in so many scandals. You can't fault the public for being skeptical or even cynical nowadays. I hope everything turns out ok.

    13
    #413 3 years ago

    Thinning the herd is never a bad thing, assuming that the sick and old are the ones getting picked off. The Skit B's and Zidwares that never produced a thing? Good riddance, in the end. It stings for those with $$$ at stake, but fool me once..... I hate to see a legit producer of pins fall out, though. Slow as they are, JJP has skins on the wall now. If this thing has merit, it will be disastrous for them. I just hope that it isn't equally as draining on their resources if it has no merit. Clearing your name has a price if the other party is intent on riding the thing out for the long haul. There is a lot of dust in the pinball air right now, and it will be interesting to see who is standing when it settles.

    #414 3 years ago
    Quoted from 2RustyBalls:

    The paper trail is what their claims are based? That's how they know the accounting isn't correct. Read the claims, just follow the money trail.

    Have you actually seen the "paper trail" in this case that would allow you to follow the "money trail"? Obviously Elaut will go through the accounting records and emails at trial, and if it's all there in black and white they'll win and Jack and JJP are hosed. But for now you're simply assuming that the claims in the complaint are true without any proof. No different than someone that's assuming Jack is telling the truth in his public statement that it's all a bunch of crap.

    24
    #415 3 years ago
    Quoted from Aurich:

    Is he posting pics of that? He should.

    posted on Pinball Sales facebook about 30 minutes ago.

    "Some 500+ Hobbit glass arriving for inspection."

    11295715_933125670083915_2956989014108070869_n(1).jpg

    #416 3 years ago

    This lawsuit is bullshit, every WoZ going down the line is already sold, and Hobbit parts are rolling in. Nothing to see here, move along.

    16
    #417 3 years ago

    all I've seen evidence of, concerning jack, is that he and his cronies got together and built a wildly popular pinball machine based on a timeless film, from scratch, and it's making players and operators happy. I know this because it's sitting in front of me as I type this. FACT. everything else is bullshit speculation that none of us are actually privy to. it's beautiful outside people! get off your keyboard and get some air.

    #418 3 years ago
    Quoted from Xerico:

    The key word in your entire warning is "claims". There is a "claim" that Jack did something wrong. There is no proof, as of yet.
    If these "claims" become "truth", then JJP would be in trouble. Until then, it's all drama.
    Marcus

    There were and there are a lot of claims with the Predator game and Jpop games

    #419 3 years ago
    Quoted from ek77:

    There were and there are a lot of claims with the Predator game and Jpop games

    Ringo! Drum kit is in the back. Have at it!

    -4
    #420 3 years ago
    Quoted from KingPinGames:

    posted on Pinball Sales facebook about 30 minutes ago.
    "Some 500+ Hobbit glass arriving for inspection."
    11295715_933125670083915_2956989014108070869_n(1).jpg (Click image to enlarge)

    Doesn't Pinball Sales already sell glass? How is this new?

    #421 3 years ago
    Quoted from Captain_Kirk:

    Doesn't Pinball Sales already sell glass? How is this new?

    I assume that's backglass for The Hobbit (unless The Hobbit has a tiny playfield a la Safe Cracker).

    -18
    #422 3 years ago

    Not much in the photo's! You actually have no proof when those photo's were taken. Elaut want's their money back so get those game moving down the line. Where's the photo of the production line running? Anyone there?

    -17
    #423 3 years ago

    Go look at Stern FB if you want to see a factory.

    #424 3 years ago
    Quoted from Captain_Kirk:

    Doesn't Pinball Sales already sell glass? How is this new?

    glass.jpg

    -1
    #425 3 years ago

    Something to keep in mind is that if Jack were to ever do what he's accused of doing to Elaut to the JJP company, rather than a single business owner being on the hook it will be a lot of preorder $. Just sayin.

    #426 3 years ago
    Quoted from YKpinballer:

    Something to keep in mind is that if Jack were to ever do what he's accused of doing to Elaut to the JJP company, rather than a single business owner being on the hook it will be a lot of preorder $. Just sayin.

    Just sayin'? More like just stirin'.

    #427 3 years ago
    Quoted from fosaisu:

    Just sayin'? More like just stirin'.

    In all fairness many people were chastised for warning about skit-b and jpop. So, while I agree it's best to let the court run it's course it's certainly reasonable to bring this point up.

    #428 3 years ago

    Jack could secretly be a communist, using hidden technology inside his dastardly pinballs as part of a plot to contaminate America's precious bodily fluids. Just sayin.

    -1
    #429 3 years ago
    Quoted from Captain_Kirk:

    Doesn't Pinball Sales already sell glass? How is this new?

    Creating the backglass could be part of the plot to deceive.

    Discuss!

    #430 3 years ago
    Quoted from Aurich:

    Jack could secretly be a communist, using hidden technology inside his dastardly pinballs as part of a plot to contaminate America's precious bodily fluids. Just sayin.

    Fluoride...

    #431 3 years ago
    Quoted from PinballHelp:

    It's a crazy time in this industry with so many producers involved in so many scandals.

    I think these companies (or in the case of Skit-B "people") go into pinball production with the best of intentions. They completely underestimate how difficult it is to mass produce a large scale electro-mechanical device. Building a one-off isn't easy ... building a couple hundred is a daunting task for a startup. Over 1,000 would be a nightmare w/o someone experienced in these matters.

    I have a lot of experience developing and, to some extent, shipping fairly complex products ... even I'd get a bit queasy if I were tasked with the production of a pinball machine .

    It only becomes a scandal when they handle their failure to produce using dubious methods and assorted nonsense.

    Quite frankly, I'm kind of glad the down payment model is pretty much dead for now. If you have a game worthy of production, I am pretty confident investors would line up to help. Those investors would act as a check/balance against those people that design a one-off and think that manufacturing and shipping machines even on a small scale is easy.

    The other sane approach is to do what Multimorphic is doing ... not asking for one red dime until their product is produced and self-funding. I'm really interested to see how their system turns out in the long run.

    BTW, people should be commending Spooky Pinball for what they did ... it's impressive to say the least. I'm looking forward to their next game. I'd pre-order with them in a heartbeat if it's a theme I'd like .

    #432 3 years ago

    Haha they just admitted that the fluoride thing was true all along. http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2011/02/05/breaking-news-us-finally-admits-too-much-fluoride-in-the-water.aspx

    Jack certainly deserves the benefit of the doubt and I think his products are great. I'm glad he's done so well with WOZ, and I'm very excited for Hobbit. However, at this stage it would be very foolish for a community whose already shown itself to be endlessly optimistic and trusting to >completely< disregard the Elaut case. No, I do not believe in judging someone guilty based on accusations.

    However, business is business.

    Something like a clean audit opinion would do a lot to allay people's (very understandible) concerns these days, and also bolster consumer confidence for the future.

    #433 3 years ago
    Quoted from Aurich:

    Jack could secretly be a communist, using hidden technology inside his dastardly pinballs as part of a plot to contaminate America's precious bodily fluids. Just sayin.

    That's why I drink only distilled water, or rainwater, and only pure grain alcohol.

    #434 3 years ago
    Quoted from Skins:

    For sure. I blew through $25k defending myself (successfully) from a bullshit claim. What did I get to show for proving I was right, a $25k lawyer bill.

    One difference in this case is that the contract at issue contains a provision where the losing party is liable for attorney fees. That alone raises the stakes in this case, especially since there are many billable hours involved with the accounting that will need to take place by expert witnesses.

    #435 3 years ago
    Quoted from RobT:

    One difference in this case is that the contract at issue contains a provision where the losing party is liable for attorney fees. That alone raises the stakes in this case, especially since there are many billable hours involved with the accounting that will need to take place by expert witnesses.

    At least the attorney's will get paid...

    #436 3 years ago
    Quoted from dantebean:

    I only got to page 6 but spotted "cronies" 3 times. You would think a lawyer would keep out that type of verbiage.

    Ha just saw this unrelated headline "CRONY CRACKDOWN: 14 World Soccer Figures Charged."

    Crony new buzzword of 2015!

    #437 3 years ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    Crony new buzzword of 2015!

    Crony-Six-Pack-No-Li.jpg

    #438 3 years ago
    Quoted from starbase:

    After dealing with Jack I see no reason not believe he is capable of loading a company with his cronies and funneling money.

    Nepotism or employing friends is not illegal or immoral IF they can perform the job task at a competent & professional level. In the case of letting "other" employees go and bringing friends or family in I would hope those people have a resume or experience in the job role they were placed in.

    If not it looks bad and not aid in your defense.

    #439 3 years ago

    Fuhgeddaboudit!

    #440 3 years ago
    Quoted from ecurtz:

    That's why I drink only distilled water, or rainwater, and only pure grain alcohol.

    Damn you guys! Now I have to blow the dust off my copy and watch it tonight...

    strangelove.jpg

    #441 3 years ago
    Quoted from chessiv:

    Damn you guys! Now I have to blow the dust off my copy and watch it tonight...
    strangelove.jpg (Click image to enlarge)

    Toe-to-toe with the Ruskies!

    #442 3 years ago

    They say there's 2 sides to every story & the truth is somewhere in the middle.

    Or something like that

    So is $800K the middle of $1.6MM?

    #443 3 years ago
    Quoted from PW79:

    They say there's 2 sides to every story & the truth is somewhere in the middle.
    Or something like that
    So is $800K the middle of $1.6MM?

    But possession is 9/10th of the law; therefore Jack can keep $1.44M.
    -internet lawdog

    #444 3 years ago
    Quoted from o-din:

    At least the attorney's will get paid...

    Bingo, they will be the ones with all the money in the end...

    #445 3 years ago
    Quoted from Mike:

    Bingo, they will be the ones with all the money in the end...

    And I will be the one that learns how to spell...maybe...

    #446 3 years ago
    Quoted from PW79:

    They say there's 2 sides to every story & the truth is somewhere in the middle.
    Or something like that

    "The middle truth!"

    -Kevin Kulek

    #447 3 years ago
    Quoted from Captain_Kirk:

    That's still not the way you go to get your money back.

    No, a criminal case is often much more effective for collecting stolen funds because what it usually comes down to is that reimbursing the victim = less jail time. In most cases that is the best motivator to get somebody to pay a debt. It's also free to the victim. The other advantage to a criminal case is that the victim may get the advantage of using law enforcement's forensic accountants (depending on the resources of law enforcement: FBI and Homeland Security often having way more resources than local or State authorities).

    Without knowing more about the underlying facts here it's very difficult to jump to conclusions about a criminal case but the absence of one is not something to brush off. Under any normal circumstance, any victim in their right mind who has the ability to use the criminal system to help collect the debt would, at least, use the criminal system along with the civil suit. In an ideal situation they would not file the civil suit unless they had to, after the criminal angle failed. The other absence to note here is some type of attachment proceeding to attempt to freeze funds while the suit is pending.

    #448 3 years ago
    Quoted from chessiv:

    Damn you guys! Now I have to blow the dust off my copy and watch it tonight...
    strangelove.jpg (Click image to enlarge)

    I'll see your dr. strangelove and raise you with 'distant early warning' (which is much shorter, but still to the point

    #449 3 years ago
    Quoted from PW79:

    They say there's 2 sides to every story & the truth is somewhere in the middle.
    Or something like that

    "There are three sides to every story: Your side, my side, and the truth. And no one is lying."
    ---Robert Evans

    #450 3 years ago
    Quoted from Captain_Kirk:

    I can smell bullshit a mile away.

    So have you been reading your posts? Or RustyBalls'?

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