(Topic ID: 243173)

eight ball deluxe won't boot

By Matthew2015

4 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

View topic image gallery

IMG_2755 (resized).JPG
IMG_2754 (resized).JPG
IMG_2751 (resized).JPG
IMG_2752 (resized).JPG
Alltek_VCC_Protection.jpg
Untitled8 (resized).jpg
Alltek_U1.jpg
Untitled5 (resized).jpg
Untitled4 (resized).png
IMG_2750 (resized).JPG
IMG_2749 (resized).JPG
IMG_2747 (resized).JPG
IMG_2744 (resized).jpg
IMG_2742 (resized).jpg
IMG_2743 (resized).jpg
Untitled3 (resized).png

You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider Quench.
Click here to go back to viewing the entire thread.

#22 4 years ago

It's time to pull out your multi-meter and measure the voltages on the test points of the rectifier board, then on the solenoid driver board in the back box.

#30 4 years ago

If the voltages on the MPU board measure in spec as you say and the self test LED stays stuck on, then your MPU board is not starting up.

What happens when you press the reset switch on the MPU board?

Measure the voltage at TP5 then TP1 on the solenoid driver board and report the exact readings.

#32 4 years ago
Quoted from Quench:

Measure the voltage at TP5 then TP1 on the solenoid driver board and report the exact readings.

What about the voltage measurements on the solenoid driver board?

#36 4 years ago
Quoted from Matthew2015:

voltages on solenoid board were:
11.5 volts for TP5
4.4 volts for TP1
based on the manual , thats a bit lower than it should be .

Indeed, the 11.5V at TP5 suggests you've likely got a bad connection at (and/or faulty) capacitor C23 on the solenoid driver board. It's the big blue capacitor to the left of the large square heatsink. You should be reading between 14.5V - 16.5V at TP5 (ignore the schematic saying 11.9VDC)

Measure the voltage across the C23 capacitor with the meter leads connected as per the picture below. If you get zero volts, you have a bad connection to the capacitor. Check the two red wires to it and on the back of the board are well soldered - resolder if they look bad/cracked. More likely though it will be a bad connection at the J3 connector pin 10 (red wire) on the solenoid driver board whose whole purpose is to provide ground to that C23 capacitor. You can do a ground mod on the back of the solenoid driver board to overcome this but let's see what you measure first.

If you measure 11.5V across that capacitor (less likely in this case), then that capacitor is faulty (dead).

I went into a discussion on a similar electrical issue with someone else yesterday if you want to read the nitty gritty - that post relates to the high voltage for the displays but same principal here and the voltages listed in the diagram are more relevant to your issue:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/ball-ss-grand-slam-low-voltage-from-power-supply-module-for-displays#post-5009748

SDB_C23_MeasureMeter.jpgSDB_C23_MeasureMeter.jpg

#44 4 years ago

Making progress..
Regarding the displays, 2 things to try:

(1). With the machine off, disconnect connectors J2 and J3 from the MPU board, J4 connector from the lamp driver board and J1 connector from the Auxilliary lamp driver board. Power on the game. Do the displays work?

(2). With the machine off, disconnect all displays except player 1 display. Power on. Does player 1 display look normal? If not, power off, disconnect player 1 display and connect the player 2 display. Power on. Does player 2 display look normal?

#47 4 years ago
Quoted from Matthew2015:

after rebuilding the connections and cleaning them on the boards in the backbox

Exactly which connectors did you rebuild and clean?

Quoted from Matthew2015:

cheeked solenoid board voltages

TP 2 measures 160 volts

TP2 is a little low but I would expect the displays to still come up. The voltage at TP2 can be adjusted on the solenoid driver board but we will come to that next time based on the results of the following:

What voltages do you read at the actual displays? Connect your black multi-meter lead to TP3 on a display board and measure the voltage at TP2 on the same display (should be 5 volts) and TP1 which should read the same as TP2 at the solenoid driver board.

#49 4 years ago
Quoted from Matthew2015:

the voltage on the displays were the same as the solenoid board.

TP 2 = 160 volts

TP 1 = 5 volts

So power connectivity to the displays is ok.
Connect the black meter lead to ground somewhere, connect the red meter lead to either TP2 on the solenoid driver board or TP1 on a display. Adjust the little blue pot on the solenoid driver board with a small flat head screw driver until you get the voltage to around 180 volts.

SDB_HV_Adjust.jpgSDB_HV_Adjust.jpg

#54 4 years ago
Quoted from Matthew2015:

they does flash for a moment when a relay or something clicks at boot then they go off.

This is normal - happens somewhere around the fifth LED flash.

Quoted from Matthew2015:

i think it must a communication issue between the mpu and the displays.

Yes, now that you have proper voltage to the displays, the issue is logic on/between the MPU board and the displays.

Have you got a logic probe?

BTW, have you performed a memory clear on the Alltek MPU board? The manual has details of how to do it - it has been known to fix unusual problems with some games.

Quoted from Matthew2015:

J3 connector looks to be in really bad shape.
i don't know how i could rebuild it.
i don't think should have 2 rows of holes on the connector , right?

You should replace it with a crimp style connector.

25 position housing:
https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=22-01-2257

Blocking key for position 2 (only one is needed)
https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=15-04-9209

Crimp terminals (100 bag), but currently out of stock.
https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=08-50-0114-C

For now make sure none of those wires have a chance of shorting to another and carefully put that connector back on paying close attention to how it was originally installed.

#57 4 years ago
Quoted from Matthew2015:

does freezing temperatures affect score displays ?

No, the fact the displays come up for a split second is good.
Conversely, some of the digits show strange non-numeric characters which isn't so good, but hard to say if it's just the split second camera shot doing it. The chip on the display board can only show numbers, not non-numeric characters.

Do this little test for me.

At the player 2 or player 4 display (whichever is easiest to access) lift the connector about 1/8" so you have access to the pins.
Connect a jumper wire to test point TP1 (5 volts) on that display, and carefully touch the other end of the wire to the display connector at pin 15. We are forcing the display to always be enabled.

Does the display come up with (junk - mostly 8's) numbers when booted?
.

If not, this time jumper TP3 (ground) on that display to pin 10 of that display connector. We are forcing the display to not be blanked.

Does the display come up with (junk - mostly 8's) numbers when booted?

#59 4 years ago
Quoted from Matthew2015:

i assume that the pin go left to right , so pin 15 would be this one , right?

Yes that's the one. You can see pin 1 is marked on the board at the very left of the pin header counting to pin 20 marked on the very right of the connector on the board.

#63 4 years ago

The fact that only the millions digit comes on with the jumper test kind of says there may be a problem with the display interrupt generator on the MPU board.
The display interrupt generator is the 8 pin chip at U1. Zooming in on your slightly grainy photo of the MPU board looks like that chip is installed upside down...
Can you post a clear picture of the U1 chip so I can get a better view?

Quoted from Matthew2015:

looks like jumping the tp3 to the did make some zeros come up.

1) You jumpered TP3 to pin 10 right? You didn't say ^^

2) What happened when you jumpered TP1 to pin 15?

3) After the MPU LED flashes 7 times on powerup, does the LED go dim or does it completely switch off?

#65 4 years ago

Yes, your U1 chip is upside down.
What's even worse is it's the wrong chip!

Did you replace this chip at some point?
Did you buy the machine with the Alltek MPU board already in the game?
Or did you buy the Alltek board and it came with the wrong chip fitted?

Alltek_U1.jpgAlltek_U1.jpg

#67 4 years ago
Quoted from Matthew2015:

looks he moved u13 into u1

I see.. yes U13 is missing.
To be honest I would install a new MC3423P at U13. It's job is to sense over voltage on the MPU board and to protect it by creating a short circuit to ground on the 5 volt VCC supply rail (via the SCR1 shown in the schematic below) resulting in the 1.10 amp F1 fuse blowing. This then cuts power to the board but leaves you with a blown soldered on fuse to replace after fixing the over voltage issues.

Alltek_VCC_Protection.jpgAlltek_VCC_Protection.jpg

Promoted items from Pinside Marketplace and Pinside Shops!
$ 25.00
Electronics
Yorktown Arcade Supply
 
$ 30.00
Lighting - Led
Pinballrom
 
Wanted
Machine - Wanted
Forest City, PA
$ 15.00
Hardware
Volcano Pinball
 
From: $ 2.99
$ 69.00
Gameroom - Decorations
Pinball Pimp
 
11,500 (Firm)
Machine - For Sale
Homer Glen, IL
$ 859.00
Flipper Parts
Mircoplayfields
 
$ 179.00
5,000
Machine - For Sale
Mesa, AZ
$ 10.00
$ 69.00
Gameroom - Decorations
Pinball Pimp
 
Hey modders!
Your shop name here

You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider Quench.
Click here to go back to viewing the entire thread.

Reply

Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

Donate to Pinside

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/eight-ball-deluxe-won-t-boot?tu=Quench and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.