(Topic ID: 66114)

Eight Ball Deluxe Owner Club & Restorations Guests Welcome As Well

By Hellfire

8 years ago


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#4401 52 days ago

I have a problem with my '84 EBD drop targets.

At the start of a game, only the 1 thru 7 target lights should be lit and go out one by one when each target is hit.
But at game start the 1 ball light is out and the 9 ball light is lit, and the 6 ball light is out and the 14 ball is lit.
When the 1 ball target is hit the 9 ball light stays on. The 2, 3 and 4 balls work fine. When the 5 ball is hit, the 5 ball light goes out along with the 9 ball light. When the 6 ball is hit the 6 ball light comes on and the 14 light stays lit. The 7 target drops when hit but that's all, it's light stays on, no score and the voice says nothing and keeps saying "Shoot the 7 ball".

All DT switches are open when up, closed when down, all diodes test properly, none are loose.
All switches are in the same column, strobe2, as well as the two 30 point rebound switches which don't work either.

The A4 J2 connector that carries the strobes is an IDC style and before I have to replace the whole connector with a Molex, I'm hoping you guys might have some suggestions.

Thanks,

Alan

20211201_164929 (resized).jpg20211201_165135 (resized).jpg20211201_165207 (resized).jpg
#4402 52 days ago

It seems like a logic issue. Perhaps w the lamp driver or even the mpu. Do you extra boards to swap in and test? It's like the game thinks it on player 2 mode instead of player one. Do the correct voice call outs sound when dropping targets?

#4403 52 days ago
Quoted from Lovef2k:

Do the correct voice call outs sound when dropping targets?

Yes and no. On balls 1 through 6 the callout is correct for each ball when it's target is hit. There is no callout for the 7 ball DT.

I do not have a working spare MPU but I see in the schematics that PIA U10 (6821) seems to be the chip that drives the A4 J2-3 wire which is the #2 Strobe.

It is socketed, should I try another?

#4404 52 days ago
Quoted from Alan_L:

I have a problem with my '84 EBD drop targets.

When you knock any of the 7 ball drop targets down, does their respective ball number in the bonus area light up?
Are there any other lamp problems on the playfield?

Are you getting correct switch responses in switch test mode?

#4405 52 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

Are you getting correct switch responses in switch test mode?

Yes.

Quoted from Quench:

Are there any other lamp problems on the playfield?

No.

Quoted from Quench:

When you knock any of the 7 ball drop targets down, does their respective ball number in the bonus area light up?

Yes, but only on the 6 ball. The other lamps are lit prior to being hit as they should be, except 1 and 6 as I mentioned.

#4406 51 days ago
Quoted from Alan_L:

Yes, but only on the 6 ball. The other lamps are lit prior to being hit as they should be, except 1 and 6 as I mentioned.

He means do the correct balls light up in the lower playfield area (just above the flippers), not the balls by the drop targets.

#4407 51 days ago
Quoted from mbeardsley:

e means do the correct balls light up in the lower playfield area (just above the flippers), not the balls by the drop targets.

Update. I replaced both PIAs, U10 and U11, and the MPU U9. PIAs corrected the 7 ball errors.

The ball lights between the flippers are the "rack" lights. Lights by the drop targets are the "target" lights.

When shooting solids (Player 1), hitting the 2, 3, 4 and 7 ball DTs operate properly: their target lights go out and rack lights come on.

Hitting the 1 ball DT lights the 5 rack light, the 9 target light stays on and the 5 target light goes out.
Hitting the 5 ball DT does not light the 5 rack light, but does extinguish the 9 target light
Hitting the 6 ball DT does not light the 6 rack light, but the 6 and 14 target lights stay lit.

When shooting the stripes (Player 2), the same sort of screwy errors occur on the 9, 13 and 14 balls.

I am starting to wonder if the U2 game ROM is corrupt. I would switch it with my other non-working 2518 MPU, but good board has a single 9332 in U2, whereas the other board has two 9316s in U1 and U2 which means that I would have to change jumpers. Rather in getting into all that, should I just order a new game 9332 ROM?

#4408 51 days ago
Quoted from Alan_L:

I am starting to wonder if the U2 game ROM is corrupt.

The machine will fail to boot up if the ROMs were corrupt. This is by design so corrupt ROMs don't inadvertently cause coils/displays to lock on and burn.

So in switch-test mode when you remove the ball from the outhole and make sure all drop targets are *raised*, the Ball in Play display shows '0', correct?
If you *only* drop the #1 ball drop target, do the player displays show "17"?
When you then raise the #1 drop target and *only* drop the #5 drop target, do the player displays now show "21"?
Ditto with the #6 drop target showing "22"?

Or are you getting different switch numbers reported?

#4409 51 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

The machine will fail to boot up if the ROMs were corrupt. This is by design so corrupt ROMs don't inadvertently cause coils/displays to lock on and burn.

Well that answers that. Good.

Quoted from Quench:

So in switch-test mode when you remove the ball from the outhole and make sure all drop targets are *raised*, the Ball in Play display shows '0', correct?

Yes.

Quoted from Quench:

So in switch-test mode when you remove the ball from the outhole and make sure all drop targets are *raised*, the Ball in Play display shows '0', correct?

Yes.

Quoted from Quench:

If you *only* drop the #1 ball drop target, do the player displays show "17"?

Yes.

Quoted from Quench:

When you then raise the #1 drop target and *only* drop the #5 drop target, do the player displays now show "21"?

Yes.

Quoted from Quench:

Ditto with the #6 drop target showing "22"?

Yes.

Quoted from Quench:

Or are you getting different switch numbers reported?

No.

#4410 50 days ago

Check some of the wiring from the lamp driver board to the playfield lamps:
Target 9 ball is listed as a red-white wire that comes from the lamp driver board at J1 pin 15
Target 14 ball is listed as a blue-white wire that comes from the lamp driver board at J1 pin 6
Target 6 ball is listed as a blue-yellow wire that comes from the lamp driver board at J1 pin 10
Rack 5 ball is listed as a brown wire that comes from the lamp driver board at J1 pin 19
Rack 6 ball is listed as a green-yellow wire that comes from the lamp driver board at J1 pin 9

If the wire colors are all correct, post some clear pictures of the J4 connector at the lamp driver board, the J1 connector of the MPU board and the J1 connector of the Auxiliary lamp driver board clearly showing the wire colors and their positions.

#4411 49 days ago

EBD 81 here. Does anyone know what's up with these lighted areas that look like they should have corresponding artwork/text on the backglass but don't? Like I would expect the artwork in front of these lights to say "game over" or "same player shoots again" or something. But when I search for images online, it looks these are just useless

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#4412 49 days ago
Quoted from EvanDickson:

EBD 81 here. Does anyone know what's up with these lighted areas that look like they should have corresponding artwork/text on the backglass but don't? Like I would expect the artwork in front of these lights to say "game over" or "same player shoots again" or something. But when I search for images online, it looks these are just useless [quoted image][quoted image]

Shoot again tilt and game over. Your backglass seems to be missing them.

#4413 49 days ago
Quoted from EvanDickson:

EBD 81 here. Does anyone know what's up with these lighted areas that look like they should have corresponding artwork/text on the backglass but don't?

Am I right in saying it's not a real backglass, rather it's a translite? has it got any mirroring?
The artwork is also missing the artists name under the player 4 display.

#4414 49 days ago

81 also

20190728_173556 (resized).jpg
#4415 49 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

Am I right in saying it's not a real backglass, rather it's a translite? has it got any mirroring?
The artwork is also missing the artists name under the player 4 display.

It's a translite. And apparently a shitty one. . But also all the Google results have the same thing. I'll need to search for a mirrored bg. Thanks!

#4416 49 days ago
Quoted from EvanDickson:

It's a translite. And apparently a shitty one.
//<![CDATA[
window.__mirage2 = {petok:"8e470b22fa20ee5eb4098de723fb0ea233eb787a-1638684677-1800"};
//]]>

. But also all the Google results have the same thing. I'll need to search for a mirrored bg. Thanks!

Shay amusements

#4417 49 days ago
Quoted from Lovef2k:

Shay amusements

It's actually Shay Arcade Group

I bought 3 of them for restores and I couldn't tell them apart from the NOS.

#4418 48 days ago

I have a new EBD Shay backglass for sale.

I'll throw-in a complete trim set (new lift channel + matching 3 pc plastic edge trim) with it for $250 + shipping.

#4419 48 days ago
Quoted from Gatecrasher:

I have a new EBD Shay backglass for sale.

1
1981, LE or 1984?

#4420 46 days ago

Has anyone found that their 8-ball target drops voluntarily a lot? I'm guessing even light vibration can cause it to fall. I've removed the assembly, taken it apart, cleaned it in ultrasonic, and reassembled it. It looks like new and it seems to work ok on the desk. But in the machine it drops without actually being hit pretty frequently.

#4421 46 days ago
Quoted from EvanDickson:

Has anyone found that their 8-ball target drops voluntarily a lot? I'm guessing even light vibration can cause it to fall. I've removed the assembly, taken it apart, cleaned it in ultrasonic, and reassembled it. It looks like new and it seems to work ok on the desk. But in the machine it drops without actually being hit pretty frequently.

Nope, that should not happen. Look at the shelf the drop resets on the target itself and make sure it's not worn. You might need to change the spring slightly as it might be too taut. Make sure the drop resets as far forward as it can in the machine.

#4422 45 days ago
Quoted from EvanDickson:

Has anyone found that their 8-ball target drops voluntarily a lot? I'm guessing even light vibration can cause it to fall. I've removed the assembly, taken it apart, cleaned it in ultrasonic, and reassembled it. It looks like new and it seems to work ok on the desk. But in the machine it drops without actually being hit pretty frequently.

Mine does that once in a while, usually when the ball has spent a large amount of time in the pop bumpers. I think the vibrations can slowly move it off of it's "shelf" and it will then fall. Adjusting the spring is probably your best bet.

#4423 45 days ago

Both I and my brother own EBD-LE machines. He recently had a company clean/repair/shop his machine (he's not very knowledgeable about such stuff).

He now has a problem with his upper flipper being weak. I've been trying to help him diagnose the issue, but he lives 2000 miles away from me.

He says the flipper can move freely when he moves it with his hand (like the other flippers do), but that he can definitely feel the difference between them when he activates it against his hand. He did say that the spring feels stronger on the upper flipper than on the lower ones.

How likely would it be for them to have put the wrong spring on it? Wouldn't it have to be a VERY different spring to make the flipper be weak?
Perhaps it's not the spring, and he's got the wrong coil or something. I sort of expected it to be the sleeve, but he says the flipper moves smoothly.

He is supposed to send my some pictures of the mechanism, so hopefully that will show something. Any other ideas of what would cause the flipper to be weak? (He says that there is no way to hit the 8-ball with it, that it can barely hit the ball over to the 7-ball target.

#4424 45 days ago

The first thing I would check is if the wiring at the coil was the issue. Partially broken wire is my first idea. Did they change anything with the upper flipper mech for any reason?

#4425 45 days ago
Quoted from Waderade812:

The first thing I would check is if the wiring at the coil was the issue. Partially broken wire is my first idea. Did they change anything with the upper flipper mech for any reason?

Wouldn't that make it work intermittently? The problem is it is consistently weak, not inconsistently working.

I don't know everything they did, but it was a lot of work. They had to bring it back from the dead, including replacing the MPU board and the lamp driver board. It's likely that they "cleaned" the flippers, but I don't know specifically all that they did.

The work was done in LA, but my brother lives in Bakersfield. They have said that they will look at it "the next time they are up there", but it would likely be a couple of months. I'm hoping that I can help him get the issue fixed before that (or at least identify the actual problem).

#4426 45 days ago
Quoted from mbeardsley:

Wouldn't that make it work intermittently? The problem is it is consistently weak, not inconsistently working.
I don't know everything they did, but it was a lot of work. They had to bring it back from the dead, including replacing the MPU board and the lamp driver board. It's likely that they "cleaned" the flippers, but I don't know specifically all that they did.
The work was done in LA, but my brother lives in Bakersfield. They have said that they will look at it "the next time they are up there", but it would likely be a couple of months. I'm hoping that I can help him get the issue fixed before that (or at least identify the actual problem).

Well I was under the impression it was a working machine before the shop job. Didn't realize is was a back from the dead job. I've had a weak to unresponsive coil when the power supply wire was frayed and it had 4 strands still attached.

#4427 45 days ago

Make sure there's some up down play in the flipper and that the end of stroke switch is clean new ones can have a film them. Also make sure it's a high powered one and not a gold plated one.
Since it's the upper flipper the lower flipper switches power to it so the lower normally open switch on that flipper needs to be clean and the right type as well.

#4428 45 days ago

The flipper design is also notoriously difficult to work with and can have mechanical drag if things aren't all aligned perfectly or of anything is worn. Some of the experts recommend a "downgrade" to the previous generation of flippers which don't require the same linear alignment, and have less material, therefore less inertia to overcome on activation.

#4429 45 days ago
Quoted from Alan_L:

I have a problem with my '84 EBD drop targets.

At the start of a game, only the 1 thru 7 target lights should be lit and go out one by one when each target is hit.
But at game start the 1 ball light is out and the 9 ball light is lit, and the 6 ball light is out and the 14 ball is lit.
When the 1 ball target is hit the 9 ball light stays on. The 2, 3 and 4 balls work fine. When the 5 ball is hit, the 5 ball light goes out along with the 9 ball light. When the 6 ball is hit the 6 ball light comes on and the 14 light stays lit. The 7 target drops when hit but that's all, it's light stays on, no score and the voice says nothing and keeps saying "Shoot the 7 ball".

All DT switches are open when up, closed when down, all diodes test properly, none are loose.
All switches are in the same column, strobe2, as well as the two 30 point rebound switches which don't work either.

Found the problem!

The 28-pin connector at A5J1 on the Lamp Driver Board had some wires in the wrong holes. It had been re-pinned before I had it and when I checked it before, I only checked the first three or four wires on each end which were correct. Pin 4 is a NU on the schematic but the guy used it and thereby had pins 4 through 19 one hole off.

Much thanks to all who helped with tis problem>

#4430 43 days ago

Hi all, I picked up an Eight Ball Deluxe 84 earlier this year, previous owner wasn't really a pinball person so not much was done to it but after bringing it home and testing the game out everything seemed to be ok until I knocked down all of the ball drop targets and then I noticed a slingshot was firing when the stand up deluxe targets were hit, pretty soon after I could smell something heating up/burning and found the q7 transistor was burned on the solenoid driver board.

I sent the board to Chris Hibler for service and he mentioned the q4 was shorted and q7 transistor was inoperable, he fixed everything up but I am wondering if it's safe to plug it back in or will it likely happen again. Still new to diagnosing and I'm unsure why the transistors were shorted to begin with.

Any advice is appreciated. Thanks!

#4431 43 days ago
Quoted from Bonk:

Hi all, I picked up an Eight Ball Deluxe 84 earlier this year, previous owner wasn't really a pinball person so not much was done to it but after bringing it home and testing the game out everything seemed to be ok until I knocked down all of the ball drop targets and then I noticed a slingshot was firing when the stand up deluxe targets were hit, pretty soon after I could smell something heating up/burning and found the q7 transistor was burned on the solenoid driver board.
I sent the board to Chris Hibler for service and he mentioned the q4 was shorted and q7 transistor was inoperable, he fixed everything up but I am wondering if it's safe to plug it back in or will it likely happen again. Still new to diagnosing and I'm unsure why the transistors were shorted to begin with.
Any advice is appreciated. Thanks!

If Hibler worked on your board then it should be good to go.

Transistors goes bad, nothing about that is unusual. Age, heat and normal abuse all factor in.

#4432 43 days ago
Quoted from Lovef2k:

If Hibler worked on your board then it should be good to go.
Transistors goes bad, nothing about that is unusual. Age, heat and normal abuse all factor in.

Thanks a lot that's reassuring to hear. Much appreciated!

#4433 43 days ago
Quoted from Bonk:

Thanks a lot that's reassuring to hear. Much appreciated!

The reason for a blown transistor may as well be a bad diode on the coil - so no bad idea to check that, too.

#4434 42 days ago
Quoted from Thunfisch:

The reason for a blown transistor may as well be a bad diode on the coil - so no bad idea to check that, too.

Good idea thanks for the suggestion. I'll be sure to check the diodes just in case.

1 week later
#4435 35 days ago

What the heck! 2nd time that’s happened.

41840AF8-C016-4658-9C9D-73A23BB899B6 (resized).jpeg
#4436 35 days ago
Quoted from phillyfan64:

What the heck! 2nd time that’s happened.
[quoted image]

What?

#4437 35 days ago

Ball got stuck between a rollover guide and the glass. Really wedged in there. Had to remove the glass to free it up. I’m wondering if it’s just a freak rebound off the pop bumpers that caused it to go airborne or if something needs adjustment.

#4438 34 days ago

I see it now. I'm guessing the pop bumper pushed it up there? Or was this from a flipper shot?

#4439 34 days ago
Quoted from Lovef2k:

I see it now. I'm guessing the pop bumper pushed it up there? Or was this from a flipper shot?

Pop bumper.

#4440 34 days ago

Make sure the correct size posts were used under the plastic lane guides. They should be the taller ones.

No adjustments can be made on the pop bumpers as you know. Maybe coils are too strong, should be AN 26 1200.

#4441 34 days ago
Quoted from Lovef2k:

Make sure the correct size posts were used under the plastic lane guides. They should be the taller ones.
No adjustments can be made on the pop bumpers as you know. Maybe coils are too strong, should be AN 26 1200.

I checked. It has the correct taller posts and coils. The only thing I could do is maybe add clear washers under the posts to raise them a bit but I really don’t want to do that unless it keeps happening. I had to do that for the sling shot posts to cut down on air balls.

1 week later
#4442 23 days ago

Ball got stuck there again. Can’t shake it loose. Have to remove the glass whenever it happens. I really need to take a closer look at this. Something needs to be tweaked.

#4443 20 days ago

Anybody have the part numbers for the lower left flipper stack handy? Don't see it in the manual.

Need the EOS (maybe ASW-A20-340) and the upper flipper switch.

THX.

#4444 20 days ago
Quoted from Black_Knight:

Anybody have the part numbers for the lower left flipper stack handy? Don't see it in the manual.
Need the EOS (maybe ASW-A20-340) and the upper flipper switch.
THX.

http://www.pbresource.com/KT-BFLIP04.html

Scroll down on this page. You have to put together your own stack with the 2 separate switches. ASWA2034 and ASWA1045. Email Jimmy at PBR and tell him what game you have. He’ll make a custom order for the 3 flippers switches.

#4447 19 days ago

Finally have my project EED7163 going back together after a lot more cabinet work than I expected. New bottom, back, and neck. But base coats are on and hardtop is installed. Wow that is much easier than a playfield swap.

Anyway I am missing a few key drop target parts and wanted to see if anyone had a source for these.

Archived after 18 days
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Parts - Wanted
Wanted! “Need 3 each of the Yoke and the Pivot stud for the inline drop target for my project Eight Ball Deluxe. Shoot me a PM if you have any or know where to find them”
2022-01-03
Littleton, CO
Wanted

I am looking for 3 of the yoke and pivot studs for the inline bank and for the 7 bank I need 2 of the links that attaches the drop target to the reset link with a clip ring on each side.

I have emailed marco to see if some of the stuff they have might work but thought I would try here.

PM if you have any leads or know of a work around.

Kenny

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#4448 19 days ago

Also

Quoted from KJL:

Finally have my project EED7163 going back together

I noticed for the first time while working on the 7 bank that the first 2 memory coils (1,9 and 2,10) are 3 terminal coils with 2 diodes CV-31-2000 and are wired different than I have seen before while the other 5 memory coils are the 2 terminal coils CJ-31-2000 I have wired before and are all hooked the same with the power terminals jumped together. Any idea what the first 2 coils do differently that require different wiring ?

In the picture the green coil is a CN-31-2000 with the middle terminal broken off so trying to figure out if I can still use that or just need a new CV prefix coil

Thanks for any clue.

Kenny

IMG_5711 (resized).jpg
#4449 19 days ago
Quoted from KJL:

Any idea what the first 2 coils do differently that require different wiring ?

They're on the solenoid expanded side so they require the two diodes.

#4450 19 days ago

KJL, Marco has the stud. If you haven’t already, check Pinball Resource for the yoke.

https://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/S-458-32

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