Well that guide is now bookmarked for sure!

That was very helpful, especially for someone who has never attempted to read an electrical diagram before. It pointed me to the right resistor and transistor, which sure enough, were cooked. Replaced them today, did what amounted to a terrible soldering job (only the 2nd time I've even attempted, the first being connecting the coil!), which my neighbor cleaned up and now my knocker works once more!

The only issue I have now is a number of lamps out that are tied to a certain IC chip that I've already ordered and is on the slow boat from China right now. After that, fingers crossed, everything else I want to deal with is purely on a cosmetic level. That amounts to wanting to change out all the finned posts as they're faded, replace all the drop targets as they are currently a mish mash of various other games, replace all the clear (now yellowed) plastic with new pieces I'm having cut, and put in bulbs for the handful that are burned out. I need to also give the mylar covered playfield a real good cleaning, and then wax it for the first time in probably 15 years, if ever. There is some cracking going on with the mylar, especially around the inserts of the balls, but I don't plan on doing anything about that any time soon.

Anyone else have this issue? Drop targets 3,4, and 5 often get stuck too high, which if struck by a pinball can lead to breaking (found that out the hard way).

IMG_2107 (resized).JPG

Happens once every 3 games or so. I don't see anything odd in the mechanism either. Another issue I'm having in this area is that sometimes when able to collect DELUXE, one of the standup targets starts repeatedly triggering. Again I checked, there's space between the contact points, so I don't know. Last thing (in terms of phantom scoring) is sometimes my pop bumpers will fire when I flip or a slingshot activates. That a case of them being too hair trigger?

You might have to add a wire rod across the bank,
in order to prevent the hyperextension of the reset
bar.

This was the only thing I found that worked.

Any chance of a photo to see what you did?

Sorry. Sold the game but there is a round hole on either side of the target bank. I just went to Home Depot and found a rod that fit in there and cut it down to size. What I does is limit the targets' height as they reset. Let's them reset enough to stand back up, but no too much so that the target gets out of its slot. That's what is happening on your game. When they reset they move off the track and can't be dropped down until they are set back into their track.

Okay, here's one that's now driving me nuts.

I have a series of lights that are out. I have run the paths of each one, and it is ever single lamp associated with decoder chip U2 on the lamp driver board. This was the exact conclusion that the repair guy Nick had, he just didn't have any chips on him at the time. I just got some new chips today, and no luck. I looked it up on that Bally Repair link posted earlier, checked all the SCRs in powered down mode, they seem fine. The values are a little higher than listed, like .7 instead of .6, but it is the same on even the ones that aren't giving me issue. The only weird thing is the guide said to reverse the leads and values should be 1.4-1.6, but I got absolutely nothing. Again though, that was the case on one's not giving issue.

Little history...all lamps were working at time I purchased table. A few days later I tried to troubleshoot my lack of sound (fixed now) by unplugging all connectors in the backbox. After reconnecting them, that's when the grouping of lights no longer worked. I have checked all the bulbs, they are fine. When Nick was here, he did something with his DMM and got each lamp to turn on so I know the sockets aren't the issue either, plus like I said they were working at time of purchase. Any other ideas?

BJM-Maxx actually my lowest bumper sometimes activates with the flippers. I've closely look today and found that the little brown diode (1N4148?) has one leg cut and the previous owner soldered a 1N4001 or 1N4004 instead:

IMG_4808 (resized).JPG

Actually 2 bumper switches have these bigger diodes. Should I replace them with new 1N4148?

Also I will replace the capacitors on the bumper switches, we'll see if it's enough or not.

This is a long thread, but this post is a good summary to explain phantom firings. https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/pop-bumper-fires-with-flipper-activity/page/4#post-2401719

As these machines are used, the conductive blakc metallic residue from the coils impregnates the wiring harnesses. Electrical coupling between the power wires and the switch matrix wires keeps getting better and better until misfires happen more frequently. The ideal fix is to wash your wiring harness.

The diode number I don't have handy but will appear in quite a few threads.

Ok thanks BJM-Maxx I'll read that.

When I saw the dishwasher thing I thought that you guys were crazy but after all, if it works, I might try that

Got my clear plastics cut today! My buddy had traced the images I sent into Adobe Illustrator, most importantly making whole the broken tips on two of them. He first used 1/8" sheet of wood to cut test pieces.

IMG_2116 (resized).JPG

From there adjustments were made by comparing to the actual piece. That meant widening a touch here and there, adjusting the hole positions and size.

IMG_2117 (resized).JPG

Back to the laser cutter, this time with 1/8" acrylic. Took all of 5 minutes. Here's all the pieces, original, wood, and new next to each other...

IMG_2118 (resized).JPG

You can see how yellowed my pieces were and how wonderfully clear they'll be now!

IMG_2119 (resized).JPG

Also showing the broken edges compared to the new complete piece.

IMG_2120 (resized).JPG

As I was taking off all the metal bell stand-offs, two of the old pieces broke. Had no idea they were that brittle. Running the bells through a tumbler tonight and then will attach to the new pieces. Can't wait to see how they look and play. On top of that, now I have a file built of these and should anything happen down the road I can just have more cut. Wish my friend knew how to silk screen, cause then I'd have him do a run of the printed plastic pieces too.

I probably wouldn't have used acrylic. Acrylic doesn't really have a high impact strength and tends to break when used in applications like this unless it contains an impact modfier. Polycarbonate would have been better. While acrylic has a little-better clarity and doesn't yellow over time, polycarbonate has far-greater impact strength (15 times greater than acrylic) which is important for these parts.

A few years ago these same EBD playfield pieces made from acrylic were available from the retail pinball parts suppliers and on eBay and I bought a few sets. They didn't last too long. Most of them broke. That's why you don't see them for sale anymore. At least not the acrylic ones.

I have made these same pieces you just made out of polycarbonate (Lexan) and they hold-up well over time. They are basically indestructable and still look good years later too.

Another advantage polycarbonate has over acrylic and PETG is a higher resistance to heat which helps if you are using conventional incandescent lamps in the machine.

Here's what I use to make the pieces you just did. I still have two partial sheets left:

IMG_9434.JPG

Here's a close-up of one of the Lexan lane guides on a fresh EBD playfield swap:

IMG_2816s.jpg

I'm maybe lucky but I just blew the harnesses and the entire playfield (damn those coils were dusty...), replaced the 1N4001 with the little fast switching 1N4148 and replaced the 3 old capacitors with what I had: 0.047uF 100V ceramic cap. No more phantom firing on my bumpers

So now I still have 3 things to fix:

1. Remove the battery. I just got a 3 AA battery holder, I'm still hesitating to put a diode or not.

2. +3000 points each time I activate the flippers, this really sucks.

BJM-Maxx you told me 2 months ago:

The only switches with capacitors that I've found under the playfield are those of the bumpers and the Deluxe Targets. I've replaced the bumpers' but not the targets' where the caps are for sure originals. Anywhere else? I know you guys suggested me to replace ALL capacitors on ALL boards but I'd really like to try to find the issue first.

Nobody else had the same issue with flippers scoring by themselves ?

Also I just did a quote on Big Daddy, that's a lot of money to replace everything. I obviously have several caps to change but if I could avoid 250 desoldering-resoldering I'd be happy. Look at this perfect vintage cap:

Cap (resized).PNG
Yiiikes!

3. I have 3 lamps that don't work on the board close to the Deluxe targets. I've cleaned everything there, contacts on bulb holders, circuit oxidation, blew the headers and lighly brush all pins shiny with Nicovolta's magic brush. Now a close look at the Aux lamp driver and discovered this nightmare:

Aux driver 1 (resized).PNG
Aux driver 2 (resized).PNG
Aux driver 3 (resized).PNG
Aux driver 4 (resized).PNG

This is a AS-2518-52. Does it look bad doctor ?

So I think I should at least replace the 28 MCR-106 SCR, the 30 2K Ohm 1/4 Watt Resistor and maybe something else. Bid Daddy's AS-2518-52 Auxiliary Lamp Driver Kit #1 doesn't provide enough MCR106-1 SCR (only 10) and I'm not sure if I absolutely need the Quad D-Flip Flop and the Decoders...

Any thoughts you pinball gods ?

If you look at the schematic you will be able to tell which SCRs are related to the non-functioning lamps. You don't need to replace them all. Only the ones that aren't working. The semi hack-job you show in the pictures are where some SCRs and resistors were already replaced. The wires were added because the circuit board traces were damaged. It's an ugly fix but it looks like it should have worked.

Which lamps near the deluxe targets are not working? The balls or the saucers? Can you point them out?

You can then look at the schematic and determine exactly which board and the exact components you need to be focused on. It might not be the auxiliary lamp driver board depending on which lamps are out.

I think I have about ten of those auxiliary lamp driver boards laying around if that ends-up being the problem. I'll give you a clean one for free if you want it. You pay the shipping.

I am finally in the club and wanting to restore the example I have.

I am in need of a pf if anyone has a lead

Parts - Wanted

WANTED: 8Ball Deluxe Playfield Archived

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2017-05-10

Madison, WI

Whysnow

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Some things to try, look at the pop bumper firing thread and follow some of the steps for solving the issue. Add caps to the flipper buttons, unbraid the head wiring as much as possible. Pull the lower playfield fuse which disables the coils but leaves flippers alive, does it still score? If it stops it is coupling in the wiring beyond the fuse. Then find the things that score 3000 and then look at the switch matrix to see if there is an area of the harness in common with the issues. Definitely scan around for more switch caps that are old. There are many that are not on the schematic.

It's ball #3 (solid) and ball #12 (stripes).

Also the 14 wasn't working but after I've changed the bulb and bent the contacts to make them tighter, it worked. I did the same for ball 3 and 12 just to be sure it wasn't simply as that but no, they still don't work.

I'm on the schematics right now. I think you're right, the Aux driver doesn't seem handle the "target" balls lamps, neither the "rack" balls lamp (I presumed "target" stands for the lamps close to the drop targets banks and the "rack" stands for the 15 balls between the slingshots).

Target and rack lamps are only mentioned on the A5 Lamp driver. Here's what I've spotted:

schematics1 (resized).PNG

schematics2 (resized).PNG

I supposed that hieroglyph somewhat tells me what components might be faulty right ?

Awesome, thanks @bjm-maxx!! I will do this this afternoon and let you guys know

Yes. All you probably need to replace are those two SCRs. No reason to replace any that are working. Same goes for your solenoid driver board. If it ain't broke... don't fix it (although I might be tempted to replace just the two large electrolytic caps just for good measure).

I would put a voltmeter onto the output pins for the two lamps that aren't working just to make sure you don't have a connector issue before replacing the SCRs.

Send me a PM with your address and I'll send you an Aux lamp board and a couple SCRs. All you pay for is the shipping. I think it will all fit in a small USPS Priority Mail flat-rate box which costs $7.15 to ship.

Gatecrasher, that is very cool of you! Another working EBD makes this world a better place. Kudos to you.

ok Gatecrasher you are awesome. Period.

PM sent

Looking awesome there GC,
Did you buff the edges of the light shields too? They are always a bit ragged from when they were cut in my experience. I agree Lexan is the way to go. Now how can we get a set of those from someone who has the cut file and access to a laser cnc like that!?
I hope to have time to restore my new cosmetically challenged EBD sometime soon.
Bravo

Good to know. If I have any problems with these, I'll make sure the next batch is done with Lexan. I just installed them today, so we'll see how they hold up. I depopulated and gave the table it's first wax in who knows how many years as I doubt the prior owner ever did in the 15 years he owned it. Then I put on the new clear pieces, they look great, as well as all new rubber. Played one game just to make sure everything was lining up as it should, might need to make an adjustment to the flipper guides as I still got some ball hop.

I didn't bother buffing the edges. There are very fine ridges, but not enough to impede the ball rolling smoothly. I might have my friend make small adjustments to make the flipper guides better for version 2.0, but once done if there is always the possibility of me having him do a run for my fellow EBD owners.

It's interesting you are having some of the exact same issues I am having. I have a total of 15 lights out on my table, exactly the 15 that the U2 chip controls. Replaced the chip, but still nothing. Voltage on the related SCRs all seem fine too. It's puzzling and I wonder if it's my board or a connector somewhere else.

I also was having the phantom scoring with the pop bumpers occasionally when I'd flip, but also having the stand-up target for D and maybe E just suddenly firing over and over. Weird thing is there's plenty of space between the contact points. So I'm closely watching what you find out, as it might relate to my issues too.

I am looking for this plastic. I sat the lock bar on the head, went to move the game and it fell and busted the plastic. If you have one let me know what you need for it shipped to Lincoln Ne. Thanks.

IMG_4345 (resized).JPG

Ok this is either a newbie question or a weird thing that you will debate about soon

I was checking the pin headers and noticed they all have what I thought was a burnt pin:

Pin headers (resized).jpg

In fact these dark pins are full of a greenish grease... What is that ? Some "contact" grease maybe ? why ?

And it seems to have a pattern, like pin #9 from the right. Please tell me it's ok and I don't have to replace them all I've tried to clean one with alcohol and an air gun but it's always there...

I always wondered that too. I have seen it on my old Embryon... Originally, I thought that it was a battery corrosion problem - but what I finally found out that is the insulation on the wire breaking down. On the current 1980 Stern Seawitch I'm working on, it happens to be a brown wire with I think yellow stripe. it's nasty stuff too.

You'll probably have a hard time finding just that one piece in decent condition. The entire plastic sets are available though for around $150 I think.

http://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Bally/Stern#So.2C_Just_What_is_this_Green_Slime.3F

Nasty stuff indeed. Repin both sides as soon as you can. The slime will effect the connection which makes it run hotter and builds carbon quicker, etc, etc...

Shawn

You know, I thought about it & I may cut the offending green slime wire back 6" and splice in a new end to crimp to the connector. Keep it from leaching out & causing problems in the future.

To all,

Background sound is fading in and out. Squawk and Talk board was refurbed recently. Voice sounds are ok, no fading on that. Anybody else have this issue? Also, any way to increase or decrease the sound of the background noises vs. the voice?

Plaw

Have you heard any more news about a possible CPR re-run?

There should be two pots on the sq&T board...get a small screwdriver and tweak the knobs till you get the mix you want...

Thanks for the reply. It seems that the pot is item number 81 on the Squawk and Talk Board. (Bottom left of the board, colored in blue and labeled voice and background so there is no guessing.) Better bring your glasses, that was small. I used a very fine knife edge to adjust the volume because the adjustment slot is very very thin. Phillips head will not work on it.

Low and behold, when I adjusted the volume, the fading in and out also stopped. Two birds with one stone. Thanks!

Open question to the group-
Is it easy to install nvram on an original 1981EBD mpu? If so, anyone have a favorite brand or seller? Still have my original rechargeable battery in the board and would like to eliminate the possibility leakage.
Thanks

I did one of those totally unnecessary tweaks to the machine today...added a little extra shine! I replaced all the wood and machine screws with shinier versions, put washers on too for a little extra protection (and bling) of the plastics, and replaced all the plastic and rubber caps with steel.

IMG_2128 (resized).JPG

IMG_2131 (resized).JPG

IMG_2132 (resized).JPG

I also fixed my drop target issue where they'd over extend and get stuck. Bought a brass rod, cut it to 10", used e clips to hold in place.

IMG_2130 (resized).JPG

IMG_2129 (resized).JPG

Wanted to take care of that as I'm having a yard sale tomorrow and wanna make the table available for play. See if I can't earn a little extra so I can buy more parts!

shutyertrap
On your Eightball Deluxe, I made the lamp sockets service
-- friendly by having the common braid on the backside of
-- each lamp socket all you need is a 1/4 socket wrench
-- and unscrew the lamp socket in order to change the bulb.
-- The idea was to prevent the dreaded yank-back that many
-- operators do when changing the lamp socket, thus saving
-- the delicate spot welds that are used to fasten the assembly.

As easy as changing out a chip.

http://nvram.weebly.com/

Thanks,
so I can just snip off the old battery then? Sorry for a newbie question, but this is only my second solid state game.

My Blackout would require soldering in a new chip as I understand it.

Yup. Just snip it off, remove your U-8 chip and plug in the NVRAM. If your boards chip socket looks a little iffy and you have the equipment it is not a bad idea to replace the socket. If it looks okay, don't worry about it. And everybody here was new at some point.

Shawn
IMG_9157 (resized).JPG
IMG_9158 (resized).JPG

Finally took a look at the bookkeeping numbers on my machine. What a whore. Hahaha, kidding. Sorta. Anyway, trying to make sense of some of these as the numbers are all over the place...

Total Plays: 400,377
Total Replays: 2,000,028 (!)
Game Percentage: 100
Ttl Hi Score t/d beat: 2004
Coins Chute 1: 21,102
Coins Chute 2: 8,000,080 (wtf!)
Coins Chute 3: 101,120
Specials From Panel: 200,016
# Minutes Game Play: 2621 (44 hours)

I'm sure some of these have been reset during it's history, but some of these just seem crazy! When I got the machine, the game gave out a free credit at 6000 points and another at 10,000 presumably so you never had to enter credits for free play. Funny thing is, someone installed a credit button in the window of the right coin slot so kinda redundant, no? And if this machine really has had over 8 million coins dropped in the middle chute, I'd say it paid for itself many times over. Am I correct in that chute 1 is the one on the left? And then what are the 'specials from panel'? Is that from collecting DELUXE?

Wish I knew how accurate any of this actually is, as I'd love to know the history of it. All I know is the previous owner had it for 15 years and didn't play it much.

Ok before asking you guys the stupid question of polarity of the EOS...

the 2.2uF I did receive seem to be polarized and I'm not sure if it's the one I need for my EOS switch. Can you confirm?

image (resized).jpeg

Thanks

I would normally use a ceramic disc style cap to avoid issues, they are non polarized. You can use the one you have just measure the voltage on the switch to get it the right way around.

I see you this issue fixed for now. Those pots should have been replaced when the board was refurbed? The original pots have an open design that lets in dirt and oxidation. and will most likely give you more trouble in the futer. The newer style has a sealed enclosure and are very cheap and easy to replace. Check GPE for them.

sorry for the typo

There's no way these are accurate. I would suspect that your RAM has gotten corrupted at some point in time and has garbage in it. A dead battery (or nearly dead) means the RAM went all squirrely.

In particular, your game probably has no center coin chute 2. 8,000,080 means that just two bits have been corrupted if the number is stored in binary-coded decimal. That number should be 0, but isn't. (I'm guessing based on my somewhat limited experience with Bally software and other RAM issues I've seen on other games from the early '80s.)

I see this board has no U7 6810 chip. What am I missing here?

Cool, thanks. I'm just gonna reset all of these. Like zeroing out an odometer!

It is not in actual use at this time. It's part of a setup to finish the layout for my next product - Bally back box interconnect harnesses.

IMG_9163 (resized).JPG