(Topic ID: 209957)

Eggheads got my brain scrambled

By Indian40

6 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 14 posts
  • 4 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 6 years ago by Indian40
  • No one calls this topic a favorite

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

View topic image gallery

F0B7BA84-28BC-4DE7-9623-BA4BFE630AE5 (resized).jpeg
Egg Head supply (resized).jpg
Egg Head hold relay (resized).jpg
#1 6 years ago

Hello to all ! New here. This site is quite overwhelming!
I bought my first machine 1961 Egghead. I wanted EM because I collect old stuff and this was a sure fit. I do enjoy tinkering with old stuff. I bought a repair book learning a lot. I’ve learned that this must be a labor of love! Very frustrating!
I won’t give up the bug has bit me ..lol Got all the bulbs for Tic Tac Toe board working then close it up and one fails- fix again and another fails.. anyway,as frustrating as that is ... a new problem has developed that’s worse.. it hasn’t done this in the 2 months I’ve owned this machine. After launching ball, machine doesn’t respond to ball hitting bumpers. On second ball it may or may not work. Unplug, start again it may be fine. No ryme or reason. It may not do it again? The only thing I’ve noticed strange is machine used to only light up upon pushing start button. Now, as of this morning, it’s “lit up” upon plugging in machine, not just after pushing start button.
Anyone in Collinsville, IL area willing to get me on right path? Willing to pay for your time for “hands on” help. Seriously, I’m fairly mechanically inclined.. want to learn.Just need some experienced guidance. I work second shift so ... time for work! Thanks in advance! Kevin

#2 6 years ago

Do you have the schematic?

#3 6 years ago

Yes I do!

#4 6 years ago
Quoted from Indian40:

The only thing I’ve noticed strange is machine used to only light up upon pushing start button. Now, as of this morning, it’s “lit up” upon plugging in machine, not just after pushing start button.

Normally when you push the replay button (circled in red) and there are credits on the game, the button will fire the S/Start relay shown on the right side of the schematic:

Egg Head hold relay (resized).jpgEgg Head hold relay (resized).jpg

When the S/Start relay fires, the Make/Break switch to the left of the Replay button in the schematic (in the big red circle) moves to the other position which sends 120 volts AC from the plug (not shown) into the transformer on the left side. With 120 VAC going into the transformer, 6 VAC and 25 VAC comes out of the other side. The 6 VAC is used by all of the lights and the 25VAC is used by all of the relays and solenoids, including the R/Hold relay shown at the top.

When the R/Hold relay gets 25 VAC, it closes the switch circled in red that keeps 120 VAC supplied to the transformer even after the S/Start relay deactivates and that Make/Break switch opens up.

If you're seeing lights before hitting the replay button, it could be because either the R/Hold relay switch or the W/Extra Chute relay switch is stuck closed, turning the transformer on as soon as you plug in the game.

Notice that most of this part of the schematic is running at 120 VAC so don't go poking around with the game plugged in. Either unplug the game to examine the switches and relays, or lift the playfield, turn the game on and just look to see if the R or W relays are on without touching anything.

/Mark

#5 6 years ago
Quoted from Indian40:

After launching ball, machine doesn’t respond to ball hitting bumpers.

Can you elaborate? Do the kicking rubbers work, or the flippers, or anything else? If most things aren't working it could be any one of the switches on the right side of the schematic that sends 25 VAC up to most of the coils and relays in the rest of the game.
Egg Head supply (resized).jpgEgg Head supply (resized).jpg

There are four switches altogether: Make/Break (MB) switches on the S, TB and DB relays, and a Normally Closed switch on the XB relay. There's a relay index on the left side of your schematic that shows the names of the relays.

/Mark

#6 6 years ago

Mark,
Thanks so much for the detailed explanation! I will check out and learn to read the schematic. When I was doing all the bulb checks I did a lot of plugging / unplugging of the power cord. This is when things started messing up. I hit the replay button and all lights were lit up. I launch the first ball and nothing would work not even the flippers. I launched 2nd ball nothing again. On third ball things started working again. After that game I hit replay button, score goes to zero everything is still lit up looks good. This time it only messed up on the first ball. It was hit or miss like that for a couple more games. I then had to shut it down and go to work. I will see how it acts in the morning. Again, thanks for all your help I have some learning to do!

Kevin

1 week later
#7 6 years ago

Update: The problem I had with lights being on before replay button was pressed resolved itself.
Schematic reading is not coming easy to me but I’m slightly progressing. Faded wire coloring/ replaced wires don’t make it any easier. The hit or miss problem with machine acting like it’s in “tilt mode” is still happening. No ryme or reason.
When it does it I immediately lift play field and it resolves itself EVERYTIME!
In other words, I can’t open play field and poke around while it’s acting dead. Also as a side note: when it’s acting dead a little “Fonzie” hand thump (below right side flipper button) wakes it up. I suspicioned the metal ball trough as it always seems to have a humming sound from the ball release solenoid. Like I said It only does it with the play field down...? Any ideas ? Thanks! Kevin

#8 6 years ago

You may need to give us more detail on what's wrong and what happens when it resolves itself for us to figure out what's going on. Does "tilt mode" mean the tilt light is on? When it resolves itself what happens? Does the game start?

To find what fixes it you'll need to raise the playfield slowly and watch/listen for what happens as you lift. See if there any relays that change, or arcing in switch contacts. Or try starting a game with a block of wood keeping the playfield up a bit. It could be that a switch is gapped too close, or its switch stack screws aren't tight. More detail should help us help you narrow it down.

/Mark

#9 6 years ago
Quoted from Indian40:

... When it does it I immediately lift play field and it resolves itself EVERYTIME! ...

rolf_martin_062 recommends hooking up light bulbs to alligator clip wires that run out the front door. Then you can find out what's going on without lifing the playfield.

#10 6 years ago

Thanks for the help Mark and Howard! When the game acts up, all lights are lit,Score zeroes out, balls are released everything looks and sounds normal.
I will keep on trying to listen for something as I lift the play field. I can barely start lifting play field (with one finger) and it starts working.
It might do it once every 10-15 games.. it may do it once every 5 games. I have found no pattern to this. The Tilt light is not illuminated when it does this.
I tried a piece of wood holding play field up,and it won’t fail (at least not yet) . I stick a dowell rod through the slot (that I lifted play field with) to activate the flippers they worked every time. I will keep messing with it and report back. Again thanks for the help! Kevin

#11 6 years ago
Quoted from Indian40:

When the game acts up, all lights are lit,Score zeroes out, balls are released everything looks and sounds normal.

How does it act up? What doesn't work? Pop Bumpers? Rollover buttons? Rebound rubber switches? Targets? Slingshots? Flippers? Try them all one at a time.

The switches in reply #5 could be the issue but knowing what works or doesn't work when it acts up will help.

An image on IPDB (http://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=758&picno=15124) shows a whole lot of relays on the right side of the playfield. It could be that wire from those relays is rubbing against the inside of the cabinet when the playfield is down, causing switches, solder tabs, etc. to open or close or short. Or maybe a relay isn't pinned into the rail as well as it should be. As you lower the playfield can you see anywhere where anything would rub?

It's also possible that the wire bundle got pinched once when the playfield was lowered, damaging one or more wires. The playfield can act like a large pair of scissors against the cabinet if you're not careful. Do you see any signs of wire abrasion or damage under the edges of the playfield?

/Mark

#12 6 years ago

I dont know this era well, but if there are slam tilt switches it sure sounds like you have one falling open or closed- hat would activate the tilt and would resolve by moving playfield.

#13 6 years ago

Thanks again for the help to all. Sorry for the delay...got a day off today.. I’ve been waiting for it to act up again with no luck so far! . Been playing off and on all day.
When it acts up here’s what happens: Push replay button( game is set up for free play) Game zeroes out, Lights come on everything and balls get released .No pop bumpers , no roll overs, no rebound rubber switches, no targets, no slingshots, no flippers, nothing. Everything is lit up but nothing responds.
A couple times when It acted like this I went ahead and launched the ball and let it drift down. Around the third of fourth ball it would start responding. Thanks!

Kevin

2 weeks later
#14 6 years ago

A little( long winded) update for the folks who helped so far. Your help is greatly appreciated! The game started “acting up” ( as previously described) every game. I opened front door and placed my trouble light inside. I would lift playfield while looking inside. The only thing I seen moving were the wires that went to all the Jones plugs. I suspicioned there was the problem in one of the wires.. When I blindly reached in to remove my light I apparently hit the tilt bob because I heard a “short” sound and game displayed tilt. When I pushed replay button nothing happened. I traced the wires and found the anti cheat switch? ( White -Green-Black) wire at front door was “knocked off” soldering post. I re-soldered the wire and have not had a problem with the game ever since? The mystery is..I just don’t know if this wire was barely making contact all that time? or I hit it when I removed my light. All I know is we have played probably 50 plus games with no problems whatsoever??? Any thoughts? Thanks for the help.. still learning! Kevin

F0B7BA84-28BC-4DE7-9623-BA4BFE630AE5 (resized).jpegF0B7BA84-28BC-4DE7-9623-BA4BFE630AE5 (resized).jpeg

Promoted items from Pinside Marketplace and Pinside Shops!
From: $ 5.95
Playfield - Protection
The Pinball Scientist
 
From: $ 5.00
Cabinet Parts
Space Coast Pinball
 
Great pinball charity
Pinball Edu

Reply

Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

Donate to Pinside

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/eggheads-got-my-brain-scrambled and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.